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| Would you trade Bynum and George forArtest? |
| Yes |
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| No |
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| Total Votes : 93 |
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LakersRGolden
Star Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2002
Posts: 7922
Location: Lake Forest
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 Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| KA_2 wrote: |
I do. We will make it out of the first round with Artest. Unless we face the Spurs.
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And I know Bynum will be much better than Campbell.
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And based on what I've seen Mihm and Kwame haven't done anything noteworthy in their careers, so trading them for a DPOY who happens to also be able to score 18-20 ppg consistently is a pretty easy choice. |
Wrong Thread. I'd be Ok with it too if we got a big along with him.
I just don't want to sacrifice the Laker's future on a LONGSHOT at a championship. If we knew Kwame would bust out and we'd be an even match for the Spurs / Detroit than I would be ok with this trade but Bynum ending up a serious defensive presence inside has a higher probability. |
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Colby Briant
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Joined: 14 Aug 2002
Posts: 2940
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:44 am Post subject: |
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| I do this trade and never look back. I like Bynum but if im the lakers and have a chance to improve now, i do it. Bynum may turn out the be a beast but he may also turn out to be the next olowakandi. but likely will just be a serviceable center for the rest of his career. |
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Leon
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Joined: 14 Dec 2005
Posts: 183
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:27 am Post subject: |
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| MikeLG says that he feels Bynum will eventually develop into a 14 and 10 player. I think that Kwame can definitely average that (he averaged 11 and 7 two seasons ago), along with Mihm who will average around 10 and 6. |
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Dude
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Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 822
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:24 am Post subject: |
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| THe Lakers would become an instant dynasty if this trade were to happen. We'd be arguably the best defensive team in the league with unparalleled firepower. |
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LakerJosh
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 995
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| KA_2 wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | No, I'd rather see 15 years of Bynum than WCF exits in '07 and '08 |
15 years of Elden Campbell would be OK then? Because Bynum may not be any better than Campbell, no one here knows otherwise. Artest on the other hand is a sure-thing. |
A sure thing on the basketball court, but he's no sure thing off the court and in the locker room. Let's make that clear right now. |
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sodapoppenski
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Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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Location: Washington, DC
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| Leon wrote: | | MikeLG says that he feels Bynum will eventually develop into a 14 and 10 player. I think that Kwame can definitely average that (he averaged 11 and 7 two seasons ago), along with Mihm who will average around 10 and 6. |
I think Bynum, at least if you're talking upside, could be a 16/12 guy. He's a very natural rebounder from what I've seen. His rebounding per/48 minutes a few weeks ago was looking real good.
More importantly, I think he has a chance to be an All-NBA type shot-blocker. Above all, that's what I've been most impressed with when I've seen him on the floor. His timing on blocks is obscene for an 18-year old who never even got the midland collegiate game to bridge him into the NBA.
I think it's gone down a bit now, but about 10 days or so ago I looked it up and Bynum was averaging 5.48 blocks per 48 mins.
Anywho, he's got plenty of upside - just a matter of how long that development takes and how that correlates with the surrounding roster, coaching, etc. |
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LakerJosh
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:12 am Post subject: |
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| sodapoppenski wrote: | | Leon wrote: | | MikeLG says that he feels Bynum will eventually develop into a 14 and 10 player. I think that Kwame can definitely average that (he averaged 11 and 7 two seasons ago), along with Mihm who will average around 10 and 6. |
I think Bynum, at least if you're talking upside, could be a 16/12 guy. He's a very natural rebounder from what I've seen. His rebounding per/48 minutes a few weeks ago was looking real good.
More importantly, I think he has a chance to be an All-NBA type shot-blocker. Above all, that's what I've been most impressed with when I've seen him on the floor. His timing on blocks is obscene for an 18-year old who never even got the midland collegiate game to bridge him into the NBA.
I think it's gone down a bit now, but about 10 days or so ago I looked it up and Bynum was averaging 5.48 blocks per 48 mins.
Anywho, he's got plenty of upside - just a matter of how long that development takes and how that correlates with the surrounding roster, coaching, etc. |
Lest we not forget who is personally tutoring him to become an NBA star. |
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cook43
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:39 am Post subject: |
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| I'd rather send Kwame and George (maybe Walton or Cook as well) for Artest and whoever they want to throw in to make it work financially. Bynum has lots of potential, and Kwame has really proved nothing in his NBA career. |
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In the paint
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Joined: 21 Aug 2004
Posts: 1371
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 7:43 am Post subject: |
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| I would make this trade for an opportunity to contend right now. However, I don't think Indiana would be willing. They need more value this year to compete against Detroit. |
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CabinCreek44
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Joined: 16 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 7:54 am Post subject: |
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Again, I don't think Indiana is getting a lot of attractive offers for Artest.
There's several reasons, but his personality is the main one. And the last time we took a risk like this one, we got punked by Dennis Rodman, which anyone with common sense at the time could see coming long before The Worm was even under contract with us.
Anyone want to go thru that again, with a fragile team that is trying to grow? |
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eniq 0x00
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Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 2724
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:02 am Post subject: Re: Would you trade Bynum and George for Artest? |
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| JediRekal wrote: | I would! I know Bynum has the "P" word, but still has about 3 years to develop. Kobe is not getting younger. Imagine a line-up of...
Mihm
Kwame
Odom
Kobe
Artest
Who the hell is Tony Parker or Steve Nash gonna guard? |
You're assuming that the team will always be Kobe's. This team has to look out for itself as well; and Bynum is going to be one of those future pieces for the benefit of our team. Besides, there's no way I'm trading away an adequate role player, and a rookie center with good upside for a guy who's commitment to the game is questionable. It's not as if we have the luxury of giving away frontcourt players anyway. You people who want this trade need to learn patience; (bleep).
_________________
"In essence, the trade was: Shaq, Rick Fox and Gary Payton for Odom, Kwame, Mihm, Profit, 2nd round picks, a 1st round pick and 30 million in luxury tax saviings." - LakerJam
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eniq 0x00
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Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 2724
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:03 am Post subject: |
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| KA_2 wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | No, I'd rather see 15 years of Bynum than WCF exits in '07 and '08 |
15 years of Elden Campbell would be OK then? Because Bynum may not be any better than Campbell, no one here knows otherwise. Artest on the other hand is a sure-thing. |
:roll:
Just like Artest playing the last season was a sure thing? What drives you to make the comparison of Bynum to Campbell? Oh that's right, you're trying to make a negative comparison to better support your case. You hang on the fact that Bynum is an unproven rookie, and try to use Artest being a veteran as some kind of a pro for Artest. The fact is, we don't know just how good he will be for us (given how he crashed and burned in Indiana-because of his attitude, not talent) which is why you're cautious in trading away young talent in this scenario. Artest right now is a question mark because of his various distractions. I don't care how talented he may be on the floor right now, I wouldn't trade away a good kid with upside for a potential headcase.
_________________
"In essence, the trade was: Shaq, Rick Fox and Gary Payton for Odom, Kwame, Mihm, Profit, 2nd round picks, a 1st round pick and 30 million in luxury tax saviings." - LakerJam
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LALfan4life
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Joined: 11 Jul 2004
Posts: 1266
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:12 am Post subject: |
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NO!!!
Bynum is the future and Artest is unstable. |
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AV
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Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 606
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| No way, Bynum has shown a lot so far, and you don't let go guys who will be legit centers in this league who will actually make an impact...he still has to develop but all indications point to Bynum being a pretty nice player.....I'll keep our 7'1 - 7'2 center, in fact I would trade Odom before Bynum for a multitude of reasons, after Kobe I think Andrew is the next most untouchable player on the Lakers roster |
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re4ee
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Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 12237
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:05 am Post subject: |
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| LakerJosh wrote: | | KA_2 wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | No, I'd rather see 15 years of Bynum than WCF exits in '07 and '08 |
15 years of Elden Campbell would be OK then? Because Bynum may not be any better than Campbell, no one here knows otherwise. Artest on the other hand is a sure-thing. |
A sure thing on the basketball court, but he's no sure thing off the court and in the locker room. Let's make that clear right now. |
I don't know about that, his 73 game suspension, which resulted from an in-game meltdown. The only sure-thing about Artest is that you can't be sure at all of what he might do... at any given time.
Offer Slava, Devin Green, and a pick, that way the risk factor is mitigated. |
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RashardA
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Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 1378
Location: Santa Monica
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:22 am Post subject: |
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As great of a defender that Artest is and as great of an all around talent he is, I wouldnt do this trade.
You dont trade a 7'1, 18 year old big man who's yet to finish growing for a SF who's comittment to the game and his team can change in an instant.
Artest has far too many question marks for the Lakers risk what they have started to develop with this young team.
Why is it that the Nets could get an unhappy Vince Carter for scraps?
Why is it that the Warriors could get an unhappy BD for an old, decling player like Dale Davis?
However, when the Lakers are targeting an allstar who's demanded to be traded they have to give up young players with a boatload of potential?
That's crazy.
If im Mitch, the ONLY players who would be available are George, Slava,Cook,Sasha,Green,Mckie and Profit along with draft picks.
That's it. I would not give up Bynum,Kwame,Mihm,Walton or Smush.
LO and KB go without saying.
Those other teams got all star players without giving up much of anything.
The Lakers should do the same. |
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cirehawk
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Joined: 08 Jun 2005
Posts: 5529
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:31 am Post subject: |
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| KA_2 wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | No, I'd rather see 15 years of Bynum than WCF exits in '07 and '08 |
15 years of Elden Campbell would be OK then? Because Bynum may not be any better than Campbell, no one here knows otherwise. Artest on the other hand is a sure-thing. |
Well, what we DO know is Artest can lose it at anytime. And if he does, then we are screwed now AND we have lost a possible long term star in Bynum. I don't know how good he'll become, but I've seen enough of Bynum to want to hold on to him for a while. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:39 am Post subject: |
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| KA_2 wrote: | | Sister Golden Hair wrote: | | How do you fugire the team could contend? Who would guard the PFs? Who would guard Duncan, KG, Amare, etc. |
This is only Bynum (totally unproven) and George (easily replacable) for Artest. Easy decision. Maybe the Lakers have a lot of faith in Bynum, but a lineup of Parker/Kobe/Artest/Odom/Kwame is easily a title contender. That's great defense 4 out of 5 positions. Kwame switches from 5 on offense to 4 on defense, and Odom guards the centers.
Based on what they did on the recent roadtrip adding Artest makes them a contender. And not just a contender this year but for at least the next 3 years, and possibly as long 6 or 7 years if they resign Artest and Odom. That's far more certain than taking a chance on Bynum. |
The Lakers don't have the inside game to be serious contenders. Mihm and Kwame aren't going to get it done against the best teams in the league, even with Artest. It will take Bynum some time to develop, but likely no more time that it will take Kwame. And Bynum will be a more valuable player than Kwame.
What if the Lakers had traded Kobe his rookie year for someone like Glen Rice? It would have made the team better at the time, but screwed them for the future. The fact is, a good big man is much, much more valuable than a good perimeter player in this league. No way I would trade Bynum at this point. Face it, 7'+ players with good footwork, long reach, great timing and anticipation, and a good work ethic aren't easily found. And when you do find them, you don't trade them for a perimeter player. That is the reason you would never trade a Duncan-type player for a Kobe-type player.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Ko8e8ryant
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Joined: 24 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:43 am Post subject: |
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No, Artest is too much of a gamble and is unreliable.
I am afraid too see what would happen with him and Kobe on the same team. |
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:46 am Post subject: |
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| the_natural05 wrote: | I don't wanna see Kobe's prime years being wasted with goals of the 7th or 8th seed
( |
How about a lineup in a couple of years of Smush, Kobe, Lebron, Bosh, and Bynum? Wouldn't that be worth a few years of early playoff exits? It would for me. And we are talking about the Laker's future here, not Kobe's future. I know many here find this hard to grasp, but the Lakers will go on after Kobe is beyond his prime.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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insidepresence
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Posts: 3901
Location: Ca
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:19 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | the_natural05 wrote: | I don't wanna see Kobe's prime years being wasted with goals of the 7th or 8th seed
( |
How about a lineup in a couple of years of Smush, Kobe, Lebron, Bosh, and Bynum? Wouldn't that be worth a few years of early playoff exits? It would for me. And we are talking about the Laker's future here, not Kobe's future. I know many here find this hard to grasp, but the Lakers will go on after Kobe is beyond his prime. |
I really don't think Lebron will sign here, thats just my opinion however. As for Artest, am I the only one thinking that the Pacers aren't getting the offers that have been advertised? Come on! If they got offered Al Harrington and Josh Childress that would have jumped on that, or the New York offer of Marbury and whoever...seriously, I think a lot of this is Pacer's management trying to get the teams they are negotiating with to up the anty... |
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LakersRGolden
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Joined: 13 Jan 2002
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Location: Lake Forest
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| insidepresence wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | the_natural05 wrote: | I don't wanna see Kobe's prime years being wasted with goals of the 7th or 8th seed
( |
How about a lineup in a couple of years of Smush, Kobe, Lebron, Bosh, and Bynum? Wouldn't that be worth a few years of early playoff exits? It would for me. And we are talking about the Laker's future here, not Kobe's future. I know many here find this hard to grasp, but the Lakers will go on after Kobe is beyond his prime. |
I really don't think Lebron will sign here, thats just my opinion however. As for Artest, am I the only one thinking that the Pacers aren't getting the offers that have been advertised? Come on! If they got offered Al Harrington and Josh Childress that would have jumped on that, or the New York offer of Marbury and whoever...seriously, I think a lot of this is Pacer's management trying to get the teams they are negotiating with to up the anty... |
Agreed this is Shaq pt 2 - mini me. Everyone was jumping up and down for a top 5 player for Shaq, but the offers were not there. I'd bet Artest is going to go for less than the rumors we've been hearing. Even if he does go for more, I hope it's not the lakers who over pay. |
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re4ee
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Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 12237
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| the_natural05 wrote: | I'm torn about this. I don't wanna see Kobe's prime years being wasted with goals of the 7th or 8th seed, but Bynum is definitely something you don't want to regret later on. IDK man, I'd do it.  |
Not in a million years would I let Bynum slip away, and especially for a headcase who has already stated that if he's traded to a WC team, he's gone after two seasons. At this point I wouldn't even entertain a trade involving Andrew for Duncan or Garnett, nope, this is about the future, there is not ONE single player in the league, not KG, not 'Bron, not Amare, that would bring a Larry O'Brien trophy. More wins, yeah, but what you'd have to give upwould put you back in rebuild mode anyway, without the capspace to address it. Besides, we don't even know if Kobe has reached his prime yet. |
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showtime1308
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Joined: 05 Dec 2005
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Do you think they would take Kwame Devean Slava and this years miami pick for Artest Gill (throw-in) and Croshere? |
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