Some Clarification on Kwame's Contract?
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Savory Griddles
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 11:53 am    Post subject:

LarryCoon wrote:
Luke wrote:
So, Kwame ' s contract couldn't have the option ?


If it's true , the entire discussion is pointless , and the 2007 plan was already dead when we signed Kwame, on 08/02/2005...

No, no -- A sign-and-trade cannot have an option in the first three seasons. However, it can have non-guaranteed salary. Let me quote the full rule, which includes that part (emphasis mine):

Quote:
(1) A Veteran Free Agent and his Prior Team may enter into a Player Contract pursuant to an agreement between the Prior Team and another Team concerning the signing and subsequent trade of such Contract, but only if (i) the Contract is for three (3) or more Seasons (excluding any Option Year), (ii) the Contract is not signed pursuant to the Mid-Level Salary Exception or the Disabled Player Exception, (iii) the first Season of the Contract is fully protected for lack of skill, and (iv) the acquiring Team has Room for the player’s Salary plus any Unlikely Bonuses provided for in the first Season of the Contract.

"Protected for lack of skill" refers to the contract guarantee (there are other things that the contract can be protected for, such as death and injury/illness, but the "lack of skill" provision is the one that lets teams waive an otherwise healthy and able player).

So the first year of a sign-and-trade contract must be guaranteed, but the remaining two years don't have to be. The reason they wrote the rule this way is because it prevents teams from gaining Bird rights in less than three years, since the three-year minimum (even non-guaranteed) means the team has to waive the player to make him a free agent, and waiving a player resets his Bird clock.

In Kwame's case, 05-06 and 06-07 were originally guaranteed, but not 07-08. So let's say Stoudemire hadn't signed an extension and wanted to sign with LA in 2007. With 07-08 not guaranteed, they would simply waive Kwame, and he would come off the cap immediately. This would clear the room for them to sign Stoudemire. (And since Kwame's Bird clock would be reset, they couldn't then re-sign Kwame using the Bird exception, which was the point of the rule.)

My point is, if Matt "Money" Smith knew "for sure," he wouldn't have said it was a *&$^%& team option.


That's not true. This whole thing seems to be an agrument in semantics. The don't have "an option" on the 3rd year but they have "the option" to have him back. Matt Smith may just be confused on the exact CBA lingo.
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raffi
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 11:59 am    Post subject:

LarryCoon wrote:
I can think of one very good reason why they would want to pick up the guarantee: Because they needed to promise to do so in order to do the original sign-and-trade deal with Washington. Like I said in other threads, a sign-and-trade requires the player's cooperation (along with the other team's). Kwame's agent could have asked for all three years to be guaranteed, while the Lakers were offering two years so that they could potentially go after Yao or Stoudemire in 2007. The compromise could have been no guarantee for 07-08, with a promise to pick up the guarantee if those two players signed extensions. The timing of them picking up the guarantee suggests that this is plausible.

I can see two reasons for them to want to hide the fact that they did so:

1. Such a promise constitutes an under-the-table agreement, for which the league punishes teams severely (think Minnesota and Joe Smith). [Note: However, I have no direct knowledge that they made an agreement which they did not disclose to the league.]

2. The Lakers have been pushing a "be patient, we have a 2007 plan" on the public. Guaranteeing Kwame officially pushes it back to 2008 (if the fact that there will be no premier UFAs to chase didn't do so already). It's one thing to ask the public to be patient until 2007. It's another thing to tell them they'll have to keep being patient for an additional year on top of that.


Larry - appreciate the insight. I've maintained since day 1 that the 07 plan was about 2 guys - Mitch told me as much last year.

However, I recall that the reason we offered Kwame so much in years 1 & 2, was to compensate him as if he had signed for 3 years at the lower salary he was then looking for. Why would we then agree to this type of "conditional" guarantee?
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Savory Griddles
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 12:00 pm    Post subject:

raffi wrote:
LarryCoon wrote:
I can think of one very good reason why they would want to pick up the guarantee: Because they needed to promise to do so in order to do the original sign-and-trade deal with Washington. Like I said in other threads, a sign-and-trade requires the player's cooperation (along with the other team's). Kwame's agent could have asked for all three years to be guaranteed, while the Lakers were offering two years so that they could potentially go after Yao or Stoudemire in 2007. The compromise could have been no guarantee for 07-08, with a promise to pick up the guarantee if those two players signed extensions. The timing of them picking up the guarantee suggests that this is plausible.

I can see two reasons for them to want to hide the fact that they did so:

1. Such a promise constitutes an under-the-table agreement, for which the league punishes teams severely (think Minnesota and Joe Smith). [Note: However, I have no direct knowledge that they made an agreement which they did not disclose to the league.]

2. The Lakers have been pushing a "be patient, we have a 2007 plan" on the public. Guaranteeing Kwame officially pushes it back to 2008 (if the fact that there will be no premier UFAs to chase didn't do so already). It's one thing to ask the public to be patient until 2007. It's another thing to tell them they'll have to keep being patient for an additional year on top of that.


Larry - appreciate the insight. I've maintained since day 1 that the 07 plan was about 2 guys - Mitch told me as much last year.

However, I recall that the reason we offered Kwame so much in years 1 & 2, was to compensate him as if he had signed for 3 years at the lower salary he was then looking for. Why would we then agree to this type of "conditional" guarantee?


That's what I thouht as well.
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showtime1308
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 12:01 pm    Post subject:

Just because they guaranteed Kwame and his agent that they would give him his third year if Yao and Amare resigned doesn't mean they have to. People lie all the time. There isn't a gun to anyones head. He probably promised he would work hard to improve and catch easy passes. That didn't happen. Who cares if they lie to him.
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baller
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 12:44 pm    Post subject:

No offense to the posters that claim they have inside knowledge and/or talked to someone in our organization or other organizations, but their usually wrong. Kwame's contract was originally non-guaranteed for the third year. The lakers want cap room. It makes no sense from an organizational standpoint to guarantee his contract now. That would eliminate the very options they wanted in the first place. There's no proof right now other than what a few posters said and thats not good enough for me, untill I see actual proof I believe its still non-guaranteed.
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angel
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:46 am    Post subject:

It does put less pressure on Kwame to be signed for the length of his contract. The kid is practicing hard. He's making an effort.
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Addicus
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 5:33 am    Post subject:

The guy thinks too much. He may be worth the money in the end, but now, there is no way.

I believe this was designed to take the pressure off of him, but his problem is his sensitivity. He wants to please so much, but lacks the confidence it takes to work through the expectations everyone has for him.

In the Utah game - he couldn't hold the ball for anything. It was as if his hands were concrete. Yet on one play, he blocks the ball, it hits the backboard at full speed. He instinctly put up his left hand, which the ball bounces off (due to it's velocity) and snags it with his right. This all happened in a 1 second span, proving if he does not over think, he does not fail.

I've seen this from him a lot and I guess the Lakers have seen even more of it in practice. It's just frustrating to watch him fumble the ball away so much. He was really brought in to be our low post presence on offense and allow Lamar to get everyone involved. His lack of success has led a majority of fans to put the onus of the team's woes on Lamar.

This is the domino effect. Hopefully he'll man up in the 2nd half of the season, or we may need to trade him for Boozer.

Call Jack Haley - he's waiting to break the story.
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