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Laker7
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Joined: 24 Feb 2003
Posts: 6414
Location: Past left field
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 Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 9:24 am Post subject: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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As most of you know, I am not a big fan of Mitch. I feel he is an average GM, which is not good enough for the Lakers. But I made myself a promise to sit down at the end of the season and dispassionately assess this last season and grade Mitch’s impact on the team (just this last years moves, not gonna go back further than that).
1. Traded Caron Butler and Chuck Atkins for Kwame Brown and Laron Profit.
Brown; Ranked 21st C in the league, 151st best player in the league by CBSportsline. 7.4 PPG and 6.6 RPG. Brought solid low post defense down low when playing C. Looked lost and was foul prone when playing PF.
Profit – Got injured early and was waived. Had the best success of anyone on the roster filling in for Kobe at the SG position. Brought defense and tenacity off the bench.
Atkins – Ranked 42nd PG in the league and 168 best player in the league. 9.5 PPG and 2.8 APG. Was not the answer for loosing Larry Hughes and was cut by the Wizards prior to the trading deadline.
Butler – Ranked 9th SF in the league and 38th best player in the league. 17.6 PPG and 6.2 RPG. Provided offensive punch to the Wizards to make up for the loss of Larry Hughes. While we gave up a really good SF, he was playing behind a better SF and was therefore expendable.
While statistically (points and rebounds), this trade favored the Wizards, the bottom line is the Lakers improved by 11 wins over last season while the Wizards lost 3 more games than they did the previous year. Grade B+.
2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
While Parker wound up as our starting PG and Luke as one of our starting forwards, Green failed to get any significant playing time. Jackson and McKie were brought in to back up Kobe and failed miserably (McKie due to lack of offense and injury, Jackson due to the fact he is an SF, not a SG, and the fact his jumper is gone).
IMO resigning Luke (which I criticized) was the biggest reasons we made the playoffs. By starting Luke and putting him in the facilitator role, it allowed Odom to focus more on scoring which lead to more wins down the stretch. While we give up a bit on the defensive end when Luke is out there, the gain on the offensive end more that offsets the loss.
Smush was a good pickup but it remains to be seen whether he can regain his confidence (and that of the organization) on both ends of the court. Smush is sort of in the position Lindsey Hunter was in with the Lakers a couple of years ago. Brought in to back up Fisher, would up starting a lot when Fish went down due to injuries and did OK during the regular season but lost his offensive game in the playoffs. Got traded after the playoffs were over.
Grade C-.
3. Drafted Andrew Bynum, Ronny Turaif and Von Wafer.
Bynum 7.3 MPG, 1.6 PPG and 1.7 RPG.
Turaif 7 MPG, 2.0 PPG and 1.6 RPG
Wafer 4.6 MPG and 1.3 PPG.
Mitch’s best draft IMO. Baring a trade, I look for Turaif to be the first PF off the bench next year. Brings energy and toughness in a hurry. Did well in the playoffs when Brown got in foul trouble with 3.7 PPG, 2.3 RPG in 8.3 MPG against the Suns. Going to work with Kobe during the off season.
Bynum showed flashes of brilliance against Shaq (the spin move and dunk) and the New York Knicks (16 points in 12 minutes) and why he is not ready against the Queens and Bucks (total of 6 fouls in 18 total minutes). He should get more playing time next year (kind of like Sasha did in his 2nd year) so we have to wait and see.
Wafer was a good high-risk, high reward type pick which Mitch has shied away from in the past. I applaud taking a chance every once in a while. Can be explosive offensively but didn’t seem to pick up the triangle very well (which Phil values more than offensive ability). I look for him to be kept this year but let go after than if he does not do better with the triangle.
Grade B
Outlook – Both Mitch and Phil have stated they are not looking to overhaul the roster. Given that the roster is young and now has some playoff experience (Odom, Luke and Brown with 2 years / Smush, Sasha, and Ronny with 1 year), that makes the most sense to me. I look for Rush to be signed for the vet minimum / LLE to back up Kobe and a PG to be signed with the MLE but I am not sure who. Cassell and Banks seem the most likely (Cassell wants a ring and to learn some coaching from Phil / Mitch has coveted Banks for a while) but I could be wrong. Jackson, Green and George will likely be gone. Profit will likely be signed to a vets minimum contract as well. If Mitch can pull off Cassell, Rush and Profit, he will get an A- in my grade book. Banks instead of Cassell only gets him a B.
Laker7
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LakersInFour
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Joined: 16 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:29 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
While Parker wound up as our starting PG and Luke as one of our starting forwards, Green failed to get any significant playing time. Jackson and McKie were brought in to back up Kobe and failed miserably (McKie due to lack of offense and injury, Jackson due to the fact he is an SF, not a SG, and the fact his jumper is gone).
IMO resigning Luke (which I criticized) was the biggest reasons we made the playoffs. By starting Luke and putting him in the facilitator role, it allowed Odom to focus more on scoring which lead to more wins down the stretch. While we give up a bit on the defensive end when Luke is out there, the gain on the offensive end more that offsets the loss.
Smush was a good pickup but it remains to be seen whether he can regain his confidence (and that of the organization) on both ends of the court. Smush is sort of in the position Lindsey Hunter was in with the Lakers a couple of years ago. Brought in to back up Fisher, would up starting a lot when Fish went down due to injuries and did OK during the regular season but lost his offensive game in the playoffs. Got traded after the playoffs were over.
Grade C-. |
I'd actually give this one a B- overall. Smush started all 82 games for us, in addition to 7 in the playoffs. Luke Walton stepped up and became a solid starter for us. Seeing how he grew into his role and improved in the last half of the season and the playoffs, I think that the potential is there for him to be a solid starter for us.
Aaron McKie and Jim Jackson turned out to be D- in my book. Not a total failure because Aaron was (supposedly) key in helping Smush along, so the veteran tutelage earns him a D. Jim Jackson was an F, he contributed basically nothing. Deven Green gets a D+, he's got some potential but he has NO NBA level jumpshot of any semblance.
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lionballer7
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Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 1684
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:44 am Post subject: |
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Like you said, Mitch is an average GM, not good enough for the Lakers.
Compare Mitch to San Antonio's GM or other top of the line franchises. |
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Panthas
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:46 am Post subject: |
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Mitch Report card:
Drafts: B-
Extensions: B
Sign-ons: D
Trades:B
Overall=D+
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Laker7
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Joined: 24 Feb 2003
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Location: Past left field
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| Panthas wrote: | Mitch Report card:
Drafts: B-
Extensions: B
Sign-ons: D
Trades:B
Overall=D+ |
How you you give Mitch 3 B's, 1 D equalling D for overall?
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Dennis_D
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Joined: 12 Apr 2001
Posts: 2017
Location: North Dallas
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:13 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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Good post
| Laker7 wrote: | 1. Traded Caron Butler and Chuck Atkins for Kwame Brown and Laron Profit.
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Grade B+. |
The grade could increase if Kwame works hard this off-season
| Laker7 wrote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
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Grade C-. |
What GM had better luck with free agents? San Antonio, but Finley and Van Exel were drawn by closeness to home and the likelyhood of rings. I think you have to rate him higher, like a B/B+.
| Laker7 wrote: | 3. Drafted Andrew Bynum, Ronny Turaif and Von Wafer.
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Grade B |
I would give him an incomplete as it is really too early to judge any of those players.
| Laker7 wrote: | | Outlook – Both Mitch and Phil have stated they are not looking to overhaul the roster. Given that the roster is young and now has some playoff experience (Odom, Luke and Brown with 2 years / Smush, Sasha, and Ronny with 1 year), that makes the most sense to me. I look for Rush to be signed for the vet minimum / LLE to back up Kobe and a PG to be signed with the MLE but I am not sure who. Cassell and Banks seem the most likely (Cassell wants a ring and to learn some coaching from Phil / Mitch has coveted Banks for a while) but I could be wrong. Jackson, Green and George will likely be gone. Profit will likely be signed to a vets minimum contract as well. If Mitch can pull off Cassell, Rush and Profit, he will get an A- in my grade book. Banks instead of Cassell only gets him a B. |
I don't know what Mitch will do this off-season. Last off-season, he said that he was going after a former lottery pick who had been a disappointment so far. Everyone raise their hands who guessed Kwame Brown. I sure didn't.
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Laker7
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Joined: 24 Feb 2003
Posts: 6414
Location: Past left field
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Dennis_D wrote: | Good post
| Laker7 wrote: | 1. Traded Caron Butler and Chuck Atkins for Kwame Brown and Laron Profit.
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Grade B+. |
The grade could increase if Kwame works hard this off-season
| Laker7 wrote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
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Grade C-. |
What GM had better luck with free agents? San Antonio, but Finley and Van Exel were drawn by closeness to home and the likelyhood of rings. I think you have to rate him higher, like a B/B+.
| Laker7 wrote: | 3. Drafted Andrew Bynum, Ronny Turaif and Von Wafer.
:
Grade B |
I would give him an incomplete as it is really too early to judge any of those players.
| Laker7 wrote: | | Outlook – Both Mitch and Phil have stated they are not looking to overhaul the roster. Given that the roster is young and now has some playoff experience (Odom, Luke and Brown with 2 years / Smush, Sasha, and Ronny with 1 year), that makes the most sense to me. I look for Rush to be signed for the vet minimum / LLE to back up Kobe and a PG to be signed with the MLE but I am not sure who. Cassell and Banks seem the most likely (Cassell wants a ring and to learn some coaching from Phil / Mitch has coveted Banks for a while) but I could be wrong. Jackson, Green and George will likely be gone. Profit will likely be signed to a vets minimum contract as well. If Mitch can pull off Cassell, Rush and Profit, he will get an A- in my grade book. Banks instead of Cassell only gets him a B. |
I don't know what Mitch will do this off-season. Last off-season, he said that he was going after a former lottery pick who had been a disappointment so far. Everyone raise their hands who guessed Kwame Brown. I sure didn't. |
I will stick with the free agent grade. While Finley and Nick did go to be close to home, there are a lot of marketing opportunities in LA Mitch was not able to convice players to come and take advantage of them.
I did guess Kwame Brown last year by the way.
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Walter Sobchak
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Joined: 14 May 2003
Posts: 4520
Location: Hollywood, Ca.
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:27 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Laker7 wrote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
Grade C-.
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No offense, but this kinda destroys your credibility on this, IMO. Signing Smush Parker as a FA was like pulling a rabbit out of a hat this year, and Luke Walton really produced as well and I think you can see he should have a decent future with this team. Those two players together this year cost the Lakers $2 million. Jim Jackson, McKie & Green cost the Lakers about $3 million combined for the year (with McKie getting most of that). So basically the Lakers spent $5 million for these five players and ended up with two guys who were decent starters for a playoff team. On the other hand, none of these players are signed beyond next season so none of them were long-term gambles for the Lakers. Talk about making something out of nothing. On the other hand the Lakers could have spent more on just one player for one year (Antonio Daniels) and been stuck with his contract for the next 4 seasons. That would have been a bad move. I don't think you should grade down Mitch just for using roster spots on guys like McKie, Jackson and Green because who else were those spots gonna go to? Give him credit for spending very little money on a group of guys and finding a couple diamonds in the rough without leveraging the team's future to do so. I'd give him an A or an A- for this group.
Also, it's too early to know if Mitch drafted well last year. We'll know in a couple years.
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Just a reminder folks: "a lot" is two words. So is "no one". |
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Fallout
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Joined: 03 Jun 2002
Posts: 7626
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| lionballer7 wrote: | Like you said, Mitch is an average GM, not good enough for the Lakers.
Compare Mitch to San Antonio's GM or other top of the line franchises. |
I'm not a big fan of Mitch either, but really, 'top' GMs aren't exactly easy to get. Getting another GM does not guarantee he'll do a better job then Mitch. That being said, if a top GM is available, bye bye Mitch. |
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THE_SHOES
Retired Number
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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Wwwwwwwwwwwhhhhhhhhhhhhooooooooooo!!!!
KKKKKKKkkAAAABBBOOOOMMMM!!!!
Easy Walter Sobchak! Easy, don't hurt him!!!
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THE_SHOES
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Location: Taiwan
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallout wrote: | | lionballer7 wrote: | Like you said, Mitch is an average GM, not good enough for the Lakers.
Compare Mitch to San Antonio's GM or other top of the line franchises. |
I'm not a big fan of Mitch either, but really, 'top' GMs aren't exactly easy to get. Getting another GM does not guarantee he'll do a better job then Mitch. That being said, if a top GM is available, bye bye Mitch. |
NO, not Kiki either!
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nomoreshaq
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Joined: 21 Jun 2004
Posts: 5170
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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hm..cassell, rush and profit. i could definitely live with that.
there'd be some holes left to fill IMO.
kwame/bynum/?
?/turiaf/cook
odom/walton/profit
kobe/rush/wafer
cassell/smush/sasha
-backcourt-
cassell is no defensive player, but i guarantee we win 5+ games w/ i am sam. sam can shoot and is clutch.
smush, rush and sasha off the bench is young, but that is potentially lethal. i hope smush can morph into a barbosa like role off the bench, rush can be our 3 pt shooter/defender and sasha to bring energy and sharshooting. keep wafer around for garbage time.
-sf-
odom, walton, profit. that is very very solid.
-bigs-
kwame, bynum, turiaf, & cook is a solid start. we need a legit PF and a veteran c for the vet's min to help groom bynum.
---
so the biggest question is..who can we get for mckie+mihm in terms of a PF? |
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md8
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Posts: 1851
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:46 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Walter Sobchak wrote: | | Laker7 wrote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
Grade C-.
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No offense, but this kinda destroys your credibility on this, IMO. Signing Smush Parker as a FA was like pulling a rabbit out of a hat this year, and Luke Walton really produced as well and I think you can see he should have a decent future with this team. Those two players together this year cost the Lakers $2 million. Jim Jackson, McKie & Green cost the Lakers about $3 million combined for the year (with McKie getting most of that). So basically the Lakers spent $5 million for these five players and ended up with two guys who were decent starters for a playoff team. On the other hand, none of these players are signed beyond next season so none of them were long-term gambles for the Lakers. Talk about making something out of nothing. On the other hand the Lakers could have spent more on just one player for one year (Antonio Daniels) and been stuck with his contract for the next 4 seasons. That would have been a bad move. I don't think you should grade down Mitch just for using roster spots on guys like McKie, Jackson and Green because who else were those spots gonna go to? Give him credit for spending very little money on a group of guys and finding a couple diamonds in the rough without leveraging the team's future to do so. I'd give him an A or an A- for this group.
Also, it's too early to know if Mitch drafted well last year. We'll know in a couple years. |
The problem is that mitch didn't get more. Yeah Smush was decent, but he's not starting material. Its unacceptable that on opening day our starting point guard was a player that couldn't even make the bench on another team. |
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Len
Starting Rotation
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Mitch gets extra credit for waiving Slava. |
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Dennis_D
LG Contributor
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Posts: 2017
Location: North Dallas
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 12:51 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| md8 wrote: | | The problem is that mitch didn't get more. Yeah Smush was decent, but he's not starting material. Its unacceptable that on opening day our starting point guard was a player that couldn't even make the bench on another team. |
All Mitch had was the MLE. With that, he could have gotten Watson, Daniels or Swift. Were any of those three better than Smush?
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Rick12322
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 19164
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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I can't evaluate Mitch's performance because I don't know to what extent the choices are actually his. I think the choices go something like this:
.................... Jerry Buss
................../........|...... \
...Jim Buss .....Phill....Mitch
Rick |
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Walter Sobchak
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Joined: 14 May 2003
Posts: 4520
Location: Hollywood, Ca.
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 1:26 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Dennis_D wrote: | | md8 wrote: | | The problem is that mitch didn't get more. Yeah Smush was decent, but he's not starting material. Its unacceptable that on opening day our starting point guard was a player that couldn't even make the bench on another team. |
All Mitch had was the MLE. With that, he could have gotten Watson, Daniels or Swift. Were any of those three better than Smush? |
Exactly. Also, who cares if Smush couldn't stay on the bench for other teams prior to this season. You must not have been watching this year if you don't think that Smush clearly belongs in the league (albeit not starting, at least not yet). IMO people who gripe about how the Lakers didn't get more like this are either uninformed or are just not realistic. You have to realize that Michael Finley and Van Exel and guys like that weren't interested in joining the Lakers last year.
Also, the whole "there is more endorsement money in LA" argument is totally flawed. Did you see a bunch of Lamar Odom commercials this year? I didn't, and he's the second best player on the team. Did Chris Mihm get a big shoe deal? The people in the league who are getting endorsement deals are the superstars, and they're not available for the MLE or LLE. Sure Rick Fox got some local Toyota commercials here, but the guy was an actor before he joined the Lakers and was married to Vanessa Williams so he was known for more than just his basketball. I don't think someone like Antonio Daniels or even Michael Finley would suddenly be plastered everywhere just for signing with the Lakers.
LA has to present either money or a shot at a championship for players to want to come here, and last year the Lakers had neither to offer. Mitch is playing the hand he's got well though, and is saving up for a time when he'll have both to offer players. Just be patient, good things come to those who wait. LA couldn't have won the title this year (even if they had Michael Finley and NVE), so the Lakers did the next best thing: they threw out there a respectable roster and didn't sacrifice the future to do it.
And the people who want to bring in Kiki are crazy. The Kenyon Martin deal he made is far worse than anything Mitch ever did. That's the kind of deal that will hamstring that organization for years to come.
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NoHarmNoFoul
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Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Posts: 1656
Location: Shanghai, China
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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The same people who bashed Kupchak before, who now say he is "average," will be the same ones praising him.
Just because you cant see his moves paying off YET doesnt mean they werent good moves.
btw see sig 
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Panthas
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Posts: 1262
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Laker7 wrote: | | Panthas wrote: | Mitch Report card:
Drafts: B-
Extensions: B
Sign-ons: D
Trades:B
Overall=D+ |
How you you give Mitch 3 B's, 1 D equalling D for overall? |
A=4
A-=3.5
B=3
B-=2.5
C=2
C-=1.5
D=1
D-=.5
F=0
Now do the Math and divied by 4, thats why he got a D
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Laker7
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Panthas wrote: | | Laker7 wrote: | | Panthas wrote: | Mitch Report card:
Drafts: B-
Extensions: B
Sign-ons: D
Trades:B
Overall=D+ |
How you you give Mitch 3 B's, 1 D equalling D for overall? |
A=4
A-=3.5
B=3
B-=2.5
C=2
C-=1.5
D=1
D-=.5
F=0
Now do the Math and divied by 4, thats why he got a D |
(B) 3 + (B) 3 + (B-) 2.5 + (D-) .5 = 9 divided by 4 = 2.25 or C?
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Annihilator
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Panthas wrote: | | Laker7 wrote: | | Panthas wrote: | Mitch Report card:
Drafts: B-
Extensions: B
Sign-ons: D
Trades:B
Overall=D+ |
How you you give Mitch 3 B's, 1 D equalling D for overall? |
A=4
A-=3.5
B=3
B-=2.5
C=2
C-=1.5
D=1
D-=.5
F=0
Now do the Math and divied by 4, thats why he got a D |
Not only is your math wrong, but your scale isn't correct either.
Typically,
A=4
A-=3.66
B+=3.33
B=3
B-=2.66
C+=2.33
C=2
C-=1.66
D+=1.33
D=1
D-=.66
F=0
That would be closer to a C+.
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Laker7
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Walter Sobchak wrote: | | LA couldn't have won the title this year (even if they had Michael Finley and NVE) |
Bull (bleep). Finley starting at PG and NVE off the bench would have gotten us to at least the Western Conference Finals.
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Panthas
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Fine I was being a bit harsh
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Walter Sobchak
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Joined: 14 May 2003
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Location: Hollywood, Ca.
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:58 pm Post subject: Re: Review of Mitch's last season moves and grades (long). |
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| Laker7 wrote: | | Walter Sobchak wrote: | | LA couldn't have won the title this year (even if they had Michael Finley and NVE) |
Bull (bleep). Finley starting at PG and NVE off the bench would have gotten us to at least the Western Conference Finals. |
Getting to the WCF is not the same as winning the title. In any event, there was ZERO chance of getting Finley and NVE to come here, and that isn't because Mitch couldn't pull it off. Those guys went to the Spurs because the Spurs were the world champs. The Lakers were a lottery team. If you were those guys, which would you have picked? I still say those guys on this year's Laker team wouldn't be enough to get past Detroit, and it probably wouldn't be enough to get past the Spurs, even without those guys on their squad.
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cardinal_red
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Posts: 146
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| Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersInFour wrote: | | Quote: | 2. Signed Aaron McKie, Luke Walton, Devin Green, Smush Parker and Jim Jackson as free agents.
While Parker wound up as our starting PG and Luke as one of our starting forwards, Green failed to get any significant playing time. Jackson and McKie were brought in to back up Kobe and failed miserably (McKie due to lack of offense and injury, Jackson due to the fact he is an SF, not a SG, and the fact his jumper is gone).
IMO resigning Luke (which I criticized) was the biggest reasons we made the playoffs. By starting Luke and putting him in the facilitator role, it allowed Odom to focus more on scoring which lead to more wins down the stretch. While we give up a bit on the defensive end when Luke is out there, the gain on the offensive end more that offsets the loss.
Smush was a good pickup but it remains to be seen whether he can regain his confidence (and that of the organization) on both ends of the court. Smush is sort of in the position Lindsey Hunter was in with the Lakers a couple of years ago. Brought in to back up Fisher, would up starting a lot when Fish went down due to injuries and did OK during the regular season but lost his offensive game in the playoffs. Got traded after the playoffs were over.
Grade C-. |
I'd actually give this one a B- overall. Smush started all 82 games for us, in addition to 7 in the playoffs. |
I don't see how Smush's starting validates Mitch's decision being a great one. IMO he started out of necessity, not because of competence. In other words, he didn't "earn" the spot because he was a good PG; he was simply the only one available and so he was picked. Using a bad analogy, it's like the land of blind people where the one-eyed man becomes the navigator. Doesn't mean the guy was good, just meant he was only one available.
One could argue then why didn't Sasha start, which I tend to question actually. I really think Sasha should have played more, particularly in the playoffs. That could've help to check Smush's hubris and bring him back down to earth, and realize that respect has to be earned, not demanded. |
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