2013 NBA Draft List Ranked in Order. Edited 6/25
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

 
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> NBA Draft Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Atticus
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 11 Nov 2011
Posts: 1900

PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 11:23 am    Post subject:

SHAQ/KOBE=#1 wrote:
^
Len should be in that discussion as well.


I think Len will be a nice player on the right team but if we trade up to the #4 with Pau I'm going to assume we have Dwight locked up and won't need a center.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Wed May 22, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject:

Atticus wrote:
Mike with the speculation that the Bobcats are looking to trade away their pick, let's say hypothetically we got the #4 in some Pau deal? Who do you take at 4?

My guess is the top 3 will roll out like:
1 - Cleveland - Nerlens Noel. They don't need a 1 (Kyrie) or a 2 (Waiters) and their glaring weakness is size.

2 - Orlando - Ben Mclemore. They need everything and Mclemore could potentially be a franchise 2 guard in this league.

3 - Washington - Otto Porter. They have Wall and Beal and they have some bigs (Nene, Okafor) and Porter is gaining a lot of hype and went to Georgetown.

If we ended up with the 4, would you take Trey Burke or Victor Oladipo or even someone else? On the one hand Burke could be a legit starting 1 in this league for the next 10 years. On the other hand I'm just so intrigued by Oladipo. Like others have mentioned in this thread, I see a little Wade in him. I feel like Oladipo could end up being the best player in this draft if he ends up on the right team. What would you do with #4?


Crossing the names off the list, leaves Burke. Bennett, Oladipo, Len are all equally just as legit. Burke, at least, is a solid playmaking/shot creator, if, average defensively.

I'd still rather trade down for any combination of Schroeder/Green and Caldwell-Pope/Rice/Franklin.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ElginBaylor
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 05 Nov 2005
Posts: 9426
Location: Hoosier Nation

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:54 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
SHAQ/KOBE=#1 wrote:
Porter seems to be missing.

Interesting that you have Zeller so high. I know he tested out well, but he doesn't seem to use it in the actual games.


That's one of the things I didn't like. The hardest part about making the list is, "do I think the all of the players above are better than the next name I put down?"

It's not a mock at all. I even left out a few international players that are projected to be picked before the Lakers pick. I don't like how low I ranked Erick Green and a few other names. I just think they're underrated.


I thought you had Zeller kind of low. Interesting that had he come out after his freshman season he would have been a top 5. I still think he's going to a solid NBA player, but then I'm an IU guy so I may be biased.
_________________
Not the real Elgin Baylor
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
KobeRe-Loaded
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Posts: 14944

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 7:06 am    Post subject:

Really like Erick Green, especially if Lakers can trade for a late 1st round pick.
_________________
#11/08/16 America became GREAT again
#Avatar-gate
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 8:19 am    Post subject:

ElginBaylor wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
SHAQ/KOBE=#1 wrote:
Porter seems to be missing.

Interesting that you have Zeller so high. I know he tested out well, but he doesn't seem to use it in the actual games.


That's one of the things I didn't like. The hardest part about making the list is, "do I think the all of the players above are better than the next name I put down?"

It's not a mock at all. I even left out a few international players that are projected to be picked before the Lakers pick. I don't like how low I ranked Erick Green and a few other names. I just think they're underrated.


I thought you had Zeller kind of low. Interesting that had he come out after his freshman season he would have been a top 5. I still think he's going to a solid NBA player, but then I'm an IU guy so I may be biased.


Solid, I would expect. Just think he has stellar athleticism, but an equal wingspan of some small forwards and shooting guards. Exclusiveness is there in transition and when open, not really in traffic. Almost the same idea comes to mind for Plumlee, who has even least skills. Both will get pushed around a bit next level, it'll take awhile.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 8:21 am    Post subject:

KobeRe-Loaded wrote:
Really like Erick Green, especially if Lakers can trade for a late 1st round pick.


Me too. Self made, underrated shot Creator. Worst case Pargo. Best case Devin Harris, someone he patterns his game after.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lkjhf
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 1157

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 9:52 am    Post subject:

too much stock being put into something as subjective and eye test-based as "shot creation." what is shot creation? the ability to play on your own without a team?

is it a coincidence that "shot creators" like jamal crawford, russell westbrook, monta ellis, JR smith, etc. tend to be chuckers?

i'll take someone who isn't a "shot creator" but shoots extremely efficiently and doesn't chuck like oladipo(imagine that, being dependent on the rest of your team to get you open/smart shots), over a guy that crosses you over a few times then clanks a contested step-back long two
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Chronicle
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 21 Jul 2012
Posts: 30103
Location: Holland

PostPosted: Fri May 24, 2013 10:03 am    Post subject:

I notice you have otto porter a lot lower than other mock drafts I've seen.

Thoughts on him?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Lakers_Jester
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 5127

PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 1:56 pm    Post subject:

Glen Rice Jr is a guy I'm liking. The fact that he's already pretty much at NBA size, super athletic, shooter, and has NBA court simulated experience through the DLeague gives him a huge edge imo.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:34 pm    Post subject:

lkjhf wrote:
too much stock being put into something as subjective and eye test-based as "shot creation." what is shot creation? the ability to play on your own without a team?

is it a coincidence that "shot creators" like jamal crawford, russell westbrook, monta ellis, JR smith, etc. tend to be chuckers?

i'll take someone who isn't a "shot creator" but shoots extremely efficiently and doesn't chuck like oladipo(imagine that, being dependent on the rest of your team to get you open/smart shots), over a guy that crosses you over a few times then clanks a contested step-back long two


Before a player is able to create a shot for someone else, they need to be able to set one for themselves.

Mj, Pippen, Magic, Kobe, LeBron.... do you consider them chuckers too? How about Nash or Stockton?
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:35 pm    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
I notice you have otto porter a lot lower than other mock drafts I've seen.

Thoughts on him?


I think he's overrated. High hoop IQ, great midrange shot, motor, defense. Not an elite level athlete, not a great shot creator.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 9:37 pm    Post subject:

Lakers_Jester wrote:
Glen Rice Jr is a guy I'm liking. The fact that he's already pretty much at NBA size, super athletic, shooter, and has NBA court simulated experience through the DLeague gives him a huge edge imo.


I disagree about super athletic. He's an average athlete in an elitely athletic draft. Speed, vert., lateral quickness; he can just eep up.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Lakers_Jester
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 5127

PostPosted: Mon May 27, 2013 10:11 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Lakers_Jester wrote:
Glen Rice Jr is a guy I'm liking. The fact that he's already pretty much at NBA size, super athletic, shooter, and has NBA court simulated experience through the DLeague gives him a huge edge imo.


I disagree about super athletic. He's an average athlete in an elitely athletic draft. Speed, vert., lateral quickness; he can just eep up.


u right. Comparing overall he's just average athletically. Watching this season's Lakers can mess up one's athleticism meter .
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
30
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 20 Feb 2012
Posts: 4960

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 4:23 pm    Post subject:

Ricky Ledo? I am warming up to this guy, his stroke is identical to Kevin Durant and they play the same way too.
_________________
Ingram, Ball, George, and Randle are ready to take the torch, with Luke leading the way!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lkjhf
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 1157

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 5:45 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Before a player is able to create a shot for someone else, they need to be able to set one for themselves.

Mj, Pippen, Magic, Kobe, LeBron.... do you consider them chuckers too? How about Nash or Stockton?


that first part is a bit of a platitude

and i think everyone(including GMs/draft coverage websites) would know if there was a MJ/pippen/magic/kobe/bron level talent in this draft. "shot creation" is impressive if you can score efficienctly with your shots you create, like nash(in his prime, at least). otherwise it's a red flag for a chucker/bad shot-taker. a good example in this draft would be brandon paul
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:17 pm    Post subject:

I think I was right in that Hardaway Jr. is a workout warrior. The latest vid on him on DX shows why I didn't like him much as a prospect.

Quote:

and i think everyone(including GMs/draft coverage websites) would know if there was a MJ/pippen/magic/kobe/bron level talent in this draft. "shot creation" is impressive if you can score efficienctly with your shots you create, like nash(in his prime, at least). otherwise it's a red flag for a chucker/bad shot-taker. a good example in this draft would be brandon paul


Kobe was a chucker with poor shot selection out of HS. You could argue MJ was the same out of UNC with how much he forced action under the hoop because his midrange game was inconsistent.

As for the shot creation definition? Of course it looks great when a player can score efficiently.

That's why I think CJ McCollum is the best shot creator in the draft. He's excellent across the board. Pull up, off the dribble, layups, midrange, 3pt, transition. Anything above 40% outside of 12' is great. Well, he's 45% across the board and 52% behind the arc. So, what's the issue?

Shot creation isn't subjective, when it's broken down into specific details.

Big difference in a catch and shoot situation, as opposed to Erick Green or CJ McCollum taking shots in Iso situations.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:18 pm    Post subject:

I think I was right in that Hardaway Jr. is a workout warrior. The latest vid on him on DX shows why I didn't like him much as a prospect.

Quote:

and i think everyone(including GMs/draft coverage websites) would know if there was a MJ/pippen/magic/kobe/bron level talent in this draft. "shot creation" is impressive if you can score efficienctly with your shots you create, like nash(in his prime, at least). otherwise it's a red flag for a chucker/bad shot-taker. a good example in this draft would be brandon paul


Kobe was a chucker with poor shot selection out of HS. You could argue MJ was the same out of UNC with how much he forced action under the hoop because his midrange game was inconsistent.

As for the shot creation definition? Of course it looks great when a player can score efficiently.

That's why I think CJ McCollum is the best shot creator in the draft. He's excellent across the board. Pull up, off the dribble, layups, midrange, 3pt, transition. Anything above 40% outside of 12' is great. Well, he's 45% across the board and 52% behind the arc. So, what's the issue?

Shot creation isn't subjective, when it's broken down into specific details.

Big difference in a catch and shoot situation, as opposed to Erick Green or CJ McCollum taking shots in Iso situations.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lkjhf
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 1157

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject:

^i agree that mccollum is very impressive with his .628 TS%(edit:small sample size for that senior season. i believe that he really is that good, though). i've watched some of his footage and it shows that he's an exception. most guys who are labeled as shot creators don't have that vaunted 60%+ TS-level efficiency.

hopefully he doesn't have that drop off in efficiency from his senior year to his nba rookie year that a similar player like lillard did
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 9:56 pm    Post subject:

lkjhf wrote:
^i agree that mccollum is very impressive with his .628 TS%(edit:small sample size for that senior season. i believe that he really is that good, though). i've watched some of his footage and it shows that he's an exception. most guys who are labeled as shot creators don't have that vaunted 60%+ TS-level efficiency.

hopefully he doesn't have that drop off in efficiency from his senior year to his nba rookie year that a similar player like lillard did


He's going to. He's coming off of injury, and the NBA is taller, longer, faster, quicker. That's why anything above 40% outside of 12' is a big deal. At least you know with McCollum, he's comfortable in creating his own shot in multiple ways at a high %.

Green just likes to pull up from 20' after a side dribble or down in transition. It's still creating a shot within his abilities.

But, Noel? Oladipo? McLemore? They can't do that yet.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
lkjhf
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 01 Jun 2012
Posts: 1157

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 10:12 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
But, Noel? Oladipo? McLemore? They can't do that yet.


if i'm a GM i take that though, because those three are exceptional enough at what they do that i'm okay with their limited shot-creating abilities, especially if i have a decent pg on my roster to take care of that for me
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2013 10:16 pm    Post subject:

lkjhf wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
But, Noel? Oladipo? McLemore? They can't do that yet.


if i'm a GM i take that though, because those three are exceptional enough at what they do that i'm okay with their limited shot-creating abilities, especially if i have a decent pg on my roster to take care of that for me


It definitely depends on the situation.

This is the new wave NBA. The best athletes used to be the best/most skilled players.

Now, the best athletes are the role players, and the skill players are average athletically.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 96031
Location: Do you believe in Magic?

PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 5:50 am    Post subject:

Just watching the Heat/Pacers/Spurs/Grizz, it's almost impossible today to get away with having no jump shot if you're a perimeter player. Just look at Tony Allen/Prince, and how the Spurs just packed it in.

Look at guys like DJ Augustin/Young who were so scared to shoot yesterday.
_________________
Lakers most hated list: 1) Celtics; 2) Mintz.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 6:41 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Just watching the Heat/Pacers/Spurs/Grizz, it's almost impossible today to get away with having no jump shot if you're a perimeter player. Just look at Tony Allen/Prince, and how the Spurs just packed it in.

Look at guys like DJ Augustin/Young who were so scared to shoot yesterday.


But then you watch Danny Green and Kawhi Leonard who developed a jumpshot behind the arc in a catch/shoot situation for San Antonio.

Parker, Ginobili, Duncan are the shot creators drawing defensive attention. Leonard and Green are killing teams with defense and 3pt. shooting.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 96031
Location: Do you believe in Magic?

PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 7:13 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Just watching the Heat/Pacers/Spurs/Grizz, it's almost impossible today to get away with having no jump shot if you're a perimeter player. Just look at Tony Allen/Prince, and how the Spurs just packed it in.

Look at guys like DJ Augustin/Young who were so scared to shoot yesterday.


But then you watch Danny Green and Kawhi Leonard who developed a jumpshot behind the arc in a catch/shoot situation for San Antonio.

Parker, Ginobili, Duncan are the shot creators drawing defensive attention. Leonard and Green are killing teams with defense and 3pt. shooting.


Right. True, Leonard was def not a 3 point shooter in college. But then again, Spurs also have the best shooting coach IMO.

Green/Leonard are not afraid to shoot. Maybe that's what I'm getting at, the tentativeness will kill you in games that actually matter.

Augustin/Young looked scared out there last night and it hurt the Pacers.
_________________
Lakers most hated list: 1) Celtics; 2) Mintz.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Mike@LG
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 10 Apr 2001
Posts: 60303
Location: Orange County, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 31, 2013 8:20 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Just watching the Heat/Pacers/Spurs/Grizz, it's almost impossible today to get away with having no jump shot if you're a perimeter player. Just look at Tony Allen/Prince, and how the Spurs just packed it in.

Look at guys like DJ Augustin/Young who were so scared to shoot yesterday.


But then you watch Danny Green and Kawhi Leonard who developed a jumpshot behind the arc in a catch/shoot situation for San Antonio.

Parker, Ginobili, Duncan are the shot creators drawing defensive attention. Leonard and Green are killing teams with defense and 3pt. shooting.


Right. True, Leonard was def not a 3 point shooter in college. But then again, Spurs also have the best shooting coach IMO.

Green/Leonard are not afraid to shoot. Maybe that's what I'm getting at, the tentativeness will kill you in games that actually matter.

Augustin/Young looked scared out there last night and it hurt the Pacers.


Shooting is the easiest to learn. Athletic abilities, defensive instinctiveness, motor... can't teach.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Jarrett Culver, Ky Bowman, Jontay Porter, Bruno Fernando, Shamorie Ponds, Miye Oni, Jalen Hudson, Lindell Wigginton, PJ Washington, Matisse Thybulle, Cam Johnson, Carson Edwards, Lugentz Dort, Admiral Schofield @bball-index
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> NBA Draft All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Page 2 of 7
Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum






Graphics by uberzev
© 1995-2018 LakersGround.net. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Use.
LakersGround is an unofficial news source serving the fan community since 1995.
We are in no way associated with the Los Angeles Lakers or the National Basketball Association.


Powered by phpBB