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70sdude Star Player
Joined: 05 Feb 2009 Posts: 4567
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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I'm exceedingly dissatisfied with the Laker roster, from the core through the peripherals. There's one player which I think represents a positive future here, Randle. |
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lakurluv Star Player
Joined: 17 May 2010 Posts: 2529
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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I have no choice but to be happy with this roster. I actually think us not having a true starting center will be fine and center by committee with Hill and Davis will get us through the season, play the one that plays the best.
No one wants to hear this but it is the right time and season for the Lakers to take a chance on Beasley. He would be the final piece in this years crazy puzzle and who knows he could turn everything around we are talking about the 2nd overall pick in the draft. Somethings got to be said about that. |
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Dumhead Star Player
Joined: 01 May 2006 Posts: 3286 Location: Low Post Rate
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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Not satisfied with it, but resigned to it. _________________ "We got a new universe coming and he's going to control all our universes. We're going to put our universes together" - Metta World Peace |
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NYClakerguy Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Jul 2014 Posts: 522
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:30 pm Post subject: |
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lakurluv wrote: | I have no choice but to be happy with this roster. I actually think us not having a true starting center will be fine and center by committee with Hill and Davis will get us through the season, play the one that plays the best.
No one wants to hear this but it is the right time and season for the Lakers to take a chance on Beasley. He would be the final piece in this years crazy puzzle and who knows he could turn everything around we are talking about the 2nd overall pick in the draft. Somethings got to be said about that. |
kwame brown was the number one pick |
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TheSource666 Sixth Man
Joined: 20 May 2014 Posts: 91
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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Randle is the only core piece on this team with any future whatsoever and any positive value. |
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RusselDoeee01 Star Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2014 Posts: 1072
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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I honestly love this team. We kept everyone i loved from last year and dumped everyone i didnt like.
IF kobe is healthy, this team will do some damage. |
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fadeaway3 Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Jul 2014 Posts: 345
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Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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Current roster is decent under the circumstances. |
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sidestep Sixth Man
Joined: 14 Dec 2012 Posts: 88
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:28 am Post subject: |
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The roster that the FO put together is impressive considering that Kobe is occupying a third of the cap, and Nash is using up 9 mil which could have gotten a quality starter, but instead is a burden on the cap.
Boozer, while past his prime, is a huge discount at 3.2 mil. Really lucked out (or schemed well) to be able to get Randle with this year's pick, since his rumored surgery dropped his perceived ranking. Ed Davis -- who I think will surprise ppl this year -- was a 13th overall pick that was signed at the minimum salary. That's equivalent to getting a good first rounder on a rookie salary -- except for free, since it didn't require using a pick to get Davis. (Apparently Clippers were also after Davis, but he chose to sign with Lakers. Prolly cuz he'd get more PT and opportunities.)
There is really nice value on this roster, considering the cap restraints that the FO had to work with.
Last edited by sidestep on Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:34 am; edited 2 times in total |
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moonwalker8701 Starting Rotation
Joined: 20 May 2010 Posts: 581
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:30 am Post subject: |
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I'm not sure if this is a great core, as so much a great future bench mob.
When the front office can bring in 1 or 2 stars (maybe next year), and retain the current depth, we'll be set up nicely. _________________ There can be only One. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:37 am Post subject: |
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sidestep wrote: | The roster that the FO put together is impressive considering that Kobe is occupying a third of the cap, and Nash is using up 9 mil which could have gotten a quality starter, but instead is a burden on the cap.
Boozer, while past his prime, is a huge discount at 3.2 mil. Really lucked out (or schemed well) to be able to get Randle with this year's pick, since his rumored surgery dropped his perceived ranking. Ed Davis -- who I think will surprise ppl this year -- was a 13th overall pick that was signed at the minimum salary. That's equivalent to getting a good first rounder on a rookie salary -- except for free, since it didn't require using a pick to get Davis. (Apparently Clippers were also after Davis, but he chose to sign with Lakers. Prolly cuz he'd get more PT and opportunities.)
There is really nice value on this roster, considering the cap restraints that the FO had to work with. |
I think this is a good approach to analyzing the moves. You have to separate it.
The Kobe/Nash contracts were terrible salary cap moves. No way to get around that.
The FO missed out on its stated targets: Melo, LBJ this summer. That was a fail.
But they picked themselves up and did very well with the Lin move, and got some underrated assets at bargain basement prices, while saving assets to move at the trade deadline/keep flexibility next season. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Chronicle Retired Number
Joined: 21 Jul 2012 Posts: 31930 Location: Manhattan
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:48 am Post subject: |
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The Kobe contract was not a terrible salary cap move. It was a terrific salary cap move. He could have taken about 35m but took only 23. That's one hell of a paycut when outside of the salary cap he is easily worth 100m a year.
When are you going to stop beating a dead horse? It's not even old anymore. It's getting ancient.
The Nash contract was terrible in hindsight. But who knows how it would have been if he hadn't gotten injured. _________________ Kobe |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 5:56 am Post subject: |
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Chronicle wrote: | The Kobe contract was not a terrible salary cap move. It was a terrific salary cap move. He could have taken about 35m but took only 23. That's one hell of a paycut when outside of the salary cap he is easily worth 100m a year.
When are you going to stop beating a dead horse? It's not even old anymore. It's getting ancient.
The Nash contract was terrible in hindsight. But who knows how it would have been if he hadn't gotten injured. |
Ha ha. Ok. You're not even arguing in terms of salary cap, but that's not even a big point for me. If you read it carefully, I said you have to see this offseason in pieces, and they failed in one part but did reasonably well in recovering. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Kava Star Player
Joined: 10 Mar 2010 Posts: 2173
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:15 am Post subject: |
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The one thing I like about the roster is that some of these guys have been undervalued or under-appreciated and that may mean they play with a serious chip on their shoulder.
I like how all these guys have something to prove:
Lin - Is he ready for a starting gig and to finally run a team?
Kobe - Can he come back to form and stay healthy for a full season? Can he be a team player and lead the young guys?
Boozer - Getting amnestied must feel like getting tossed to the side...this guy may have an excellent year.
Nash - Always hurt he's got to feel like he's stolen money at this point from the Lakers organization. Everyone is counting him out. Including me.
Hill - Is he really worth all the dough?
Clarkson - He's gotta feel disrespected for taken so late in the draft considering his skill set.
Randall - Can he live up to the hype?
Wes/Xavier/Swaggy - All 3 with tremendous 'UPSIDE' never fully realized. Is this the year?
Davis - He's hungry to play. Had a nice role for Toronto and got lost in Memphis.
As a fan I am satisfied at what could be. During the rebuilding process, competing for the 7th/8th seed is exactly where we should be.
There are no guarantees. We've seen that with Payton/Malone experiment as well as with the Dwight debacle.
I just want to see a Laker team compete - That may seem like too much to ask - but I can't stand watching a game and see guys dog it on the defensive end.
Everyone on this team has something to play for including the coach. Should be fun to watch. |
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SuperboyReformed Star Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2012 Posts: 4083
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:37 am Post subject: |
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Lin
I think he's fine. He's smart and is probably willing to learn, which is always a positive on the Lakers. We should be happy with his play.
Kobe
He's fine guys. He may not dunk on people as much, but he's totally fine. If nothing else, he will be a great spot up and post shooter.
Boozer
He should be really good. The only thing I worry about is he might get called for a lot of fouls that he is not used to (the new Laker experience). He's one of these guys that has gotten away with pushes in the back for rebounds, and he won't be able to do it as much here. But he's a good shooter and plays bigger than he is.
Nash
He's not going to have much of an impact.
Hill
He's going to be good. Good hustle, good defense, even a decent shot. We liked him before, we'll like him more.
Clarkson
I have no idea.
Randall
NO idea. Looks really great if his power play translates to the NBA.
Wes/Xavier/Swaggy
I like all of them, they all bring good value to the team.
Davis
No idea. |
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Vancouver Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Apr 2006 Posts: 17740
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:47 am Post subject: |
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I'm fine with everything that transpired this off season. The "future" core hasn't been established yet so I'm waiting to see what happens the next couple of seasons. _________________ Music is my medicine |
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KobeDunk Retired Number
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 26849
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:55 am Post subject: |
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hell no! This core has no future except for Randle on top of that they got Boozer who wants to start which would stunt Randle's growth. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:03 am Post subject: |
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KobeDunk wrote: | hell no! This core has no future except for Randle on top of that they got Boozer who wants to start which would stunt Randle's growth. |
I think Boozer will actually help Randle in the long-term. If Randle isn't starting, he'll be gunning for Boozer every day in practice, trying to get better. Boozer will show him the ropes and by next season, Randle will be ready to go. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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MickMgl Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013 Posts: 1987
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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LakersMDGurl wrote: | We have a core? |
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MickMgl Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013 Posts: 1987
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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Please define "satisfied" as it is being used in this thread. Also please define "core" the way it is being applied in this thread. |
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stewjoe Starting Rotation
Joined: 17 Dec 2013 Posts: 105
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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I would think it would be hard to be satisfied when we really only have one player who would definitively start on a championship contender.
For that matter, other than Kobe, only Boozer really deserves to start on any playoff team (and that is pretty questionable as he was getting benched in the 4th).
Randle should start on a non-playoff team that is not too far away.
The rest are really bench players for anything other than one of the league's worst teams.
As everyone else has noted, satisfied is a little vague as it allows for consideration of future moves. however, if we are just talking about the current roster, I find it hard to believe that anyone is satisfied (including Mitch and the Busses).
This team, particularly in targeting Lin and Swaggy (although I liked the Lin trade), looks like it was constructed with ratings in mind as much as basketball. Lots of offense. Interesting players. Still the promise of more in the future.
Based on the comments on LG, it seems to be working for about 50% of the posters.
I will support the team as I have for 35 years, but I noticed in the 2nd half last year, I wasn't killing myself to make the Friday night games. I would expect this year to be better in some ways: 1) hopefully more of a plan on D; although with only one above-average defender on the roster, a plan will only go so far (no pun intended as there are several players who would be really good LA D-fenders); 2) hopefully more health; 3) a chance to watch Kobe for perhaps the last time.
But at the same time, there are legitimately 10-13 teams that are better than us in the west. For those predicting playoffs, please find even 6 teams in the west that we are better than.
Utah, maybe Sac (although they had more than a 4 point advantage on us in point differential last year), Minnesota (if they trade Love). Denver (a possibility, but they had just as many injury problems as we did last year and are deeper).
That's about all I've got.
The Pelicans are going to be way better this year.
The rest of the playoff teams stayed the same or got better, except Houston, but they are not going to fall far enough for us to be competitive.
Because of my love for Kobe, I don't want to ever see him on another team. But if it was just basketball talent at issue, I would trade our 2014-15 roster for the year with about 20 other teams in a heartbeat.
If you disagree, then please be specific. Tell us which 8 western teams will have a worse record than us this year. |
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TripleJump Sixth Man
Joined: 13 Jul 2014 Posts: 43
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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lakurluv wrote: | I have no choice but to be happy with this roster. I actually think us not having a true starting center will be fine and center by committee with Hill and Davis will get us through the season, play the one that plays the best.
No one wants to hear this but it is the right time and season for the Lakers to take a chance on Beasley. He would be the final piece in this years crazy puzzle and who knows he could turn everything around we are talking about the 2nd overall pick in the draft. Somethings got to be said about that. |
Yep, I made the same suggestion in the Optimism thread: http://forums.lakersground.net/viewtopic.php?p=5927600#5927600
My suggestion was to get Beasley not for what he is now, but for what he could become while playing with Lin. Jeremy has greatly helped a long list of players, such as Novak, Fields, and probably Parsons and Asik. Beasley would be an ideal reclamation project; he's young (25) and his potential's still enormous.
EDIT: fixed the URL |
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Cool426 Sixth Man
Joined: 02 Jun 2013 Posts: 80
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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With no expectation, I'll just sit back and enjoy the ride. Those who have higher expectations, you will just have to wait after Kobe retires. |
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dcarter4kobe Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2005 Posts: 17656
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Posted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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Our future core should of been J.Randle/L.Stephenson/E.Bledsoe with Ed Davis, X.Henry,Kelly, and Clarkson
Right now the only player I really consider apart of core is Randle _________________ "He's a Zen master, so he can speak to you, and he doesn't need a microphone; you can hear him in your head, 'Ron, don't shoot, don't shoot.' Whatever, pow, three. I love the Zen, though." |
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swishing Rookie
Joined: 25 Jul 2014 Posts: 2
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Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 1:37 am Post subject: |
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stewjoe wrote: |
If you disagree, then please be specific. Tell us which 8 western teams will have a worse record than us this year. |
I think the first 15 games of this coming season would pretty much set the Lakers'' ceiling. On paper, you are probably right that Lakers don't have a prayers chance given how strong the West has become. The positive I see is that there are a lot of unknowns here in the roster. If this roster was a caricature of last year without Gasol, even with a recovered Kobe, it is hard to imagine it gaining additional 20-25 games necessary to make the playoffs..
But Lakers has the surprised factor. Oddsmakers tend to be conservative when dealing with unknowns.
I believe there are enough unknown to make Lakers the dark horse.
It's hard for me to believe, like some here do, that we are in tanking mode and just waiting for Kobe to live out his twilight years and clear his cap before starting a new chapter.
Because the more I learn about this roster, the more I believe tanking is out of the question for this group. This group seem to have a very clear goal.
The most dangerous man is one that has nothing to lose.. Seems, this is literally do or die from coach Scottie to many players
Last season felt like everyone is just going thru the motions, there is really nothing to prove for veterans like Gasol and Nash as they pretty much gave up on the season and their coach. With no Kobe in sight, the rookies were more in experimenting mode and had no clear sense of direction or goal.
It just feels like this roster, everyone has something to prove and seems everyone is willing to put in 110% effort to do it. You also have extremely hard workers and veterans with leadership steering this ship....
Don't discount that Lakers were just contenders 2 seasons ago. Yes we lost Gasol and D12. But even then, the urgency and focus is different. Given their talent, the chemistry wasn't there to maximize it. But they still won enough games for the playoffs.
I know some of you may think it is stupid to compare to a roster that had D12. But I'm just saying we don't need to be that talented if enough effort and urgency/focus is in place. With the West being so competitive, you don't have to win 50 games, you just have to win more games. With luck, we can steal an eighth seed if they top teams beat each other up enough and lower the overall winning ratio required. We just have to make sure we beat the East enough time to keep us competitive and let teams like Rockets lose to many bad teams they should beat (they did this many times last season).
Remember Kobe was #10 in PER (Higher than Harden) and still one of the best in his position just 2 seasons ago. I guess what I'm trying to say is that Kobe had ample time to recover and there is high probability that barring no other injuries, even at his age, he can still be one of the top threats in the West.
Then we have Boozer who can kind of make up for Gasol. He may not be as good as him but given how Gasol had on-court issues with MD and his production wasn't exactly stellar, I'll take a next best thing in a starving Boozer on a well focused team.
Seems like there are no ego issues getting in the way.
Swaggy and Hill can only improve...
Then there is Randle. Possibly the X factor. Depending how fast he learn the ropes with Clarkson. But they looked pretty good in the SL. It's not inconceivable that they will fill any holes that is required to make Lakers as much a competitive team as 2 seasons ago.
Finally there is the Lin factor. Lin has shown he doesn't need superstars to help his team win. Everyone knows the NYC story, but there were also numerous games in HOU that Lin was very capable of carrying the point (with Harden injured) to a well-fought win.
So I think if Lakers plays team basketball and play it the best they can, and given a little bit of luck, teams in the West may just shoot themselves in the foot and give us the #8 seed on a silver platter..
Remember 2 seasons ago when Lakers almost didn't make the 8th seed until series of bad loses by our competing teams.. |
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Cup-of-noodles Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2010 Posts: 1696
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Posted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:19 am Post subject: |
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oh you said core not hore....sorry
but neither is much good... |
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