| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
|
 Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 10:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
| fiendishoc wrote: | Jodie Meeks out several months with a stress reaction in his back.
If he were still a Laker, how crazy would the whining be at this point? |
He's a product of Gary Vitti. This is to be expected round here. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ibitegirls
Star Player
Joined: 29 Dec 2011
Posts: 4204
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 10:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| fiendishoc wrote: | Jodie Meeks out several months with a stress reaction in his back.
If he were still a Laker, how crazy would the whining be at this point? |
I heard Detroit fans complaining about Gary Vitti  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ch3cky0selff00
Star Player
Joined: 29 Dec 2009
Posts: 4392
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 10:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ringfinger wrote: | | fiendishoc wrote: | Jodie Meeks out several months with a stress reaction in his back.
If he were still a Laker, how crazy would the whining be at this point? |
He's a product of Gary Vitti. This is to be expected round here. |
Meeks missed like.. 6 games last season in a season ravaged by injuries. He was one of the more healthier players lol. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 10:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ch3cky0selff00 wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | fiendishoc wrote: | Jodie Meeks out several months with a stress reaction in his back.
If he were still a Laker, how crazy would the whining be at this point? |
He's a product of Gary Vitti. This is to be expected round here. |
Meeks missed like.. 6 games last season in a season ravaged by injuries. He was one of the more healthier players lol. |
Rumor has it Meeks avoided Vitti.
Then, when he decided to sign elsewhere, he gave Vitti a hug. That's when Vitti punched him in the back, causing the stress reaction.
This is what Vitti does, and has been doing for 3 decades now. How does this man still have a job? Darn "medical staff"! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakerbaker89
Rookie
Joined: 13 Oct 2014
Posts: 17
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Bard207 wrote: | I understand about pushing players to expand their conditioning - endurance, but I also think it is possible that Scott is overdoing it.
NBA INNOVATING INJURY PREVENTION |
First post just made a account, long long time lurker of the site. Just wanted to say thanks for posting this article i found it extremely interesting to say the absolute least. Obviously injuries can never be stopped as the article states, but minimizing their chances of happening, or preventing their severity, seems to me to be a worthwhile investment. Especially with the millions of dollars invested in the players, and the affect one injury to a key player can have on a teams season or seasons if it alters who the player is at his core. I also found the stuff on the former Lakers trainer Alex McKechnie very intriguing. Seems in hindsight he really should have been kept. Cant say he would have prevented any of the injuries we have had the last few seasons but his track record looks marvelous. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67625
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| lakerbaker89 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | I understand about pushing players to expand their conditioning - endurance, but I also think it is possible that Scott is overdoing it.
NBA INNOVATING INJURY PREVENTION |
First post just made a account, long long time lurker of the site. Just wanted to say thanks for posting this article i found it extremely interesting to say the absolute least. Obviously injuries can never be stopped as the article states, but minimizing their chances of happening, or preventing their severity, seems to me to be a worthwhile investment. Especially with the millions of dollars invested in the players, and the affect one injury to a key player can have on a teams season or seasons if it alters who the player is at his core. I also found the stuff on the former Lakers trainer Alex McKechnie very intriguing. Seems in hindsight he really should have been kept. Cant say he would have prevented any of the injuries we have had the last few seasons but his track record looks marvelous. |
Welcome aboard the best sports site on the net. 
The Spurs have had the best Catapult Sports aid for years. It's called Gregg Charles Popovich. He has old coots who every year are called too old yet they make the playoffs and win ships.
Pop accepts fines and critisizm about the way he treats his players. Sent star players home on SouthWest Airlines while they were on the road to rest them.
I've read he treats Duncan the same way he treats Tiago Splitter and other lesser players.
San Antonio should be the template for staying healthy.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
NYClakerguy
Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Jul 2014
Posts: 522
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Suns medical staff>Lakers medical staff
Byron needs to reassess his training regimen. It's wearing down the team. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67625
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| NYClakerguy wrote: | Suns medical staff>Lakers medical staff
Byron needs to reassess his training regimen. It's wearing down the team. |
Can you say New Jersey Nets, New Orleans Hornets. His regimens did not sit well with those teams. I thought he changed his ways when he went to Cleveland, I guess not.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26309
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| NYClakerguy wrote: | Suns medical staff>Lakers medical staff
Byron needs to reassess his training regimen. It's wearing down the team. |
you must have missed this post on the last page. I'll post it again
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pjiddy
Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005
Posts: 29060
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 12:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Reflexx wrote: | | The Showtime Lakers had it tougher. In the regular season, they played back to back to back games. They had crappy hotels compared to today. They didn't fly in a private jet. They didn't have the health science we have now. Yet those guys could run run run all season long. They practiced hard in the preseason. They were intense. When Byron first got there they beat him up during scrimmage. Elbows and hard fouls. Etc... He thought they were nuts. |
I think you're conflating Byron's career with Stu's playing-day anecdotes. Byron never played in back-to-back-to-backs. That was abolished before his time.
He also had a much easier minute load. Byron's mpg only crept over 35 twice in his entire career. After he turned 31, he never played over 30 minutes a game. In his final 4 seasons, ages 31-35, his mpg averages were 18, 19, 23, 18.
Since becoming a starter, Kobe has averaged less than 35 minutes only once in his career (not counting the 6-game season last year), mostly thanks to playing in an era of horrifically shallow depth.
Those Showtime Lakers had Rambis, Mychal Thompson and Michael Cooper coming off the bench at one point. Those guys would be starting in today's post-expansion NBA. Meanwhile, you could count on one hand the number of Lakers on last year's team that would've even made a 1988 NBA roster. Hell, Kobe and Pau are the only guys off our 2010 championship team that would've cracked the 1988 Lakers rotation. Lamar would've been a 10th man at best.
Also, according to Jeff Pearlman's Showtime (a great read btw) the team's travel accommodations weren't too shabby:
| Quote: | | Thanks to the generosity of Jerry Buss, the team’s owner, the Lakers traveled on the luxurious MGM Grand plane, which featured individual staterooms. |
Also, it'd be ironic if Byron was using Riley as his model/mentor since he and the players hated Riley by the end of his final season there, when his practices had grown into their now-legendary extended length and gruel. In the book, John Black recalls Magic, Cooper and Byron pulling him aside at a hotel and just lashing out on Riley and how much they hated him and his increasingly controlling, overexertive and disciplinarian philosophy. Notice that he stepped down the following season, after winning 63 games, Coach of the Year...and getting upset by the Suns in the 2nd Round. He knew the guys weren't responding to him anymore. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26309
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 1:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Don't forget pjdiddy. They held their loss against Detroit against Riley because they were undefeated in the playoffs and destroying teams and then Riley ran them ragged in the weeks off they had and they went on to get injured and face the Pistons with an injured roster with their legs gone.
Despite that they only lost by an average of 6 points a game against that Pistons team.
I think we can assume if Riley had just kept doing what he did instead of ramping things up so much at the end that we would/could have three-peated. The team knew it too and THAT is what they held against Riley after that year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ringfinger
Retired Number
Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| pjiddy wrote: | | Reflexx wrote: | | The Showtime Lakers had it tougher. In the regular season, they played back to back to back games. They had crappy hotels compared to today. They didn't fly in a private jet. They didn't have the health science we have now. Yet those guys could run run run all season long. They practiced hard in the preseason. They were intense. When Byron first got there they beat him up during scrimmage. Elbows and hard fouls. Etc... He thought they were nuts. |
I think you're conflating Byron's career with Stu's playing-day anecdotes. Byron never played in back-to-back-to-backs. That was abolished before his time.
He also had a much easier minute load. Byron's mpg only crept over 35 twice in his entire career. After he turned 31, he never played over 30 minutes a game. In his final 4 seasons, ages 31-35, his mpg averages were 18, 19, 23, 18.
Since becoming a starter, Kobe has averaged less than 35 minutes only once in his career (not counting the 6-game season last year), mostly thanks to playing in an era of horrifically shallow depth.
Those Showtime Lakers had Rambis, Mychal Thompson and Michael Cooper coming off the bench at one point. Those guys would be starting in today's post-expansion NBA. Meanwhile, you could count on one hand the number of Lakers on last year's team that would've even made a 1988 NBA roster. Hell, Kobe and Pau are the only guys off our 2010 championship team that would've cracked the 1988 Lakers rotation. Lamar would've been a 10th man at best.
Also, according to Jeff Pearlman's Showtime (a great read btw) the team's travel accommodations weren't too shabby:
| Quote: | | Thanks to the generosity of Jerry Buss, the team’s owner, the Lakers traveled on the luxurious MGM Grand plane, which featured individual staterooms. |
Also, it'd be ironic if Byron was using Riley as his model/mentor since he and the players hated Riley by the end of his final season there, when his practices had grown into their now-legendary extended length and gruel. In the book, John Black recalls Magic, Cooper and Byron pulling him aside at a hotel and just lashing out on Riley and how much they hated him and his increasingly controlling, overexertive and disciplinarian philosophy. Notice that he stepped down the following season, after winning 63 games, Coach of the Year...and getting upset by the Suns in the 2nd Round. He knew the guys weren't responding to him anymore. |
Sure, the Showtime Lakers DID have it tougher. They all had it tougher back then.
That's why NBA careers were much shorter in the 80s than they are today. It's just about what's more important.
Is it more important to say you walked a mile in the snow, or to walk 5 miles? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
pjiddy
Retired Number
Joined: 12 Dec 2005
Posts: 29060
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| MJST wrote: | Don't forget pjdiddy. They held their loss against Detroit against Riley because they were undefeated in the playoffs and destroying teams and then Riley ran them ragged in the weeks off they had and they went on to get injured and face the Pistons with an injured roster with their legs gone.
Despite that they only lost by an average of 6 points a game against that Pistons team.
I think we can assume if Riley had just kept doing what he did instead of ramping things up so much at the end that we would/could have three-peated. The team knew it too and THAT is what they held against Riley after that year. |
God, that's right. Byron pulled his hamstring in practice before Game 1. Wonder if they were doing running drills... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BigEvil
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 1755
Location: Whittier
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 2:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The conditioning will help on D. Scott is pushing these players so they can push themselves on the court. I also feel that this team will be more receptive to his style of coaching because of Kobe busting his ass and leading by example. Surely seeing old man Kobe grind like a champ will motivate some of the youngsters.
As for the 3-shot restrictions. We did lose our FIVE BEST shooters. I'd cut back on those shots too! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26309
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| pjiddy wrote: | | MJST wrote: | Don't forget pjdiddy. They held their loss against Detroit against Riley because they were undefeated in the playoffs and destroying teams and then Riley ran them ragged in the weeks off they had and they went on to get injured and face the Pistons with an injured roster with their legs gone.
Despite that they only lost by an average of 6 points a game against that Pistons team.
I think we can assume if Riley had just kept doing what he did instead of ramping things up so much at the end that we would/could have three-peated. The team knew it too and THAT is what they held against Riley after that year. |
God, that's right. Byron pulled his hamstring in practice before Game 1. Wonder if they were doing running drills... |
yeah that was probably the straw that did it.
Because I don't think the Lakers really had a HUGE issue with Riley while they were winning after the 'sit down' a few seasons in and if Riley had just kept doing what he'd been doing the Lakers probably become the first 3-peat and not the Bulls. But it backfired on him cause he was so focused on three-peating he ran them harder and harder and harder when he didn't have to.
I think that's ultimately what spelled the end for Riley as the Lakers coach. I don't think the players had issues with running hard and stuff. But I think they had an issue with Riley overdoing it before the finals during their time off which essentially ruined their chances before the game even happened.
What Byron is doing in the pre-season to just test guys and see who wants it, which is a great place to do it. Is what Riley did to them before that Finals... and it cost them dearly. And it wasn't that the Pistons blew them out every game and were the better team. The Lakers only lost by 6 points a game without a healthy Byron and eventually without Magic. I think they beat Detroit two times in a row. I think Isaiah still gets a ring the next year, but I think the Lakers would have beat them that season probably in 5 or 6 games. I think that eats away every main Laker that was on that team to this day, so I can only imagine what it did to them back then.
I think Byron scaling back practices a bit after the Golden State game shows that he did it just to serve that purpose early on and they're where he wants them to be for the most part now and it's about getting healthy and getting fresh.
I won't be surprised if he does it again at some point this pre-season when our lineups are set just to see how they handle it. But at least he's doing it in pre-season and scaling back which is what the opposite of what Riley did that year.
Had Riley not ran them into the ground through their entire time out before the finals against the Pistons, I think the Lakers three-peat and Riley is never fired. Then Magic would have 6 rings and Kareem would have 7 and probably universally be seen as the GOAT. But of course that didn't happen. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jonnybravo
Retired Number
Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 30680
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| pjiddy wrote: | | MJST wrote: | Don't forget pjdiddy. They held their loss against Detroit against Riley because they were undefeated in the playoffs and destroying teams and then Riley ran them ragged in the weeks off they had and they went on to get injured and face the Pistons with an injured roster with their legs gone.
Despite that they only lost by an average of 6 points a game against that Pistons team.
I think we can assume if Riley had just kept doing what he did instead of ramping things up so much at the end that we would/could have three-peated. The team knew it too and THAT is what they held against Riley after that year. |
God, that's right. Byron pulled his hamstring in practice before Game 1. Wonder if they were doing running drills... |
They were. Confirmed. They actually talked about it in the roundtable on TimeSports. Not saying it had to do with the hamstring but they definitely were running drills before G1. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Cancun Van Exel
Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Oct 2014
Posts: 203
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi guys. First post. Been a fan since 1979 (of Lakers, not LG  )
I'm thinking all this talk of intense conditioning causing the lakers to play poorly may be a smokescreen/people in denial. The roster isn't all that great and the coach is career under .500. I'm not buying the conditioning excuse but time will indeed tell. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cheesysapien
Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Oct 2014
Posts: 357
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mhan00
Retired Number
Joined: 13 Apr 2001
Posts: 32059
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 1:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
| lakerbaker89 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | I understand about pushing players to expand their conditioning - endurance, but I also think it is possible that Scott is overdoing it.
NBA INNOVATING INJURY PREVENTION |
First post just made a account, long long time lurker of the site. Just wanted to say thanks for posting this article i found it extremely interesting to say the absolute least. Obviously injuries can never be stopped as the article states, but minimizing their chances of happening, or preventing their severity, seems to me to be a worthwhile investment. Especially with the millions of dollars invested in the players, and the affect one injury to a key player can have on a teams season or seasons if it alters who the player is at his core. I also found the stuff on the former Lakers trainer Alex McKechnie very intriguing. Seems in hindsight he really should have been kept. Cant say he would have prevented any of the injuries we have had the last few seasons but his track record looks marvelous. |
Wow, insanely depressing we let Alex McKechnie go. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Birmingham
Starting Rotation
Joined: 04 Apr 2013
Posts: 224
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | | NYClakerguy wrote: | Suns medical staff>Lakers medical staff
Byron needs to reassess his training regimen. It's wearing down the team. |
Can you say New Jersey Nets, New Orleans Hornets. His regimens did not sit well with those teams. I thought he changed his ways when he went to Cleveland, I guess not. |
Old Riles habits die hard. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 5:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
We have been hit with injuries, guys looking tired, etc. But by the 4th game of preseason, I was hoping to see some improving offense and defense. None so far. They really need to step it up. Come regular season, cannot blame it on injuries, hard training camp, learning offense, etc., there is simply no room for error in the West.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
cheesysapien
Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Oct 2014
Posts: 357
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 11:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mhan00 wrote: | | lakerbaker89 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | I understand about pushing players to expand their conditioning - endurance, but I also think it is possible that Scott is overdoing it.
NBA INNOVATING INJURY PREVENTION |
First post just made a account, long long time lurker of the site. Just wanted to say thanks for posting this article i found it extremely interesting to say the absolute least. Obviously injuries can never be stopped as the article states, but minimizing their chances of happening, or preventing their severity, seems to me to be a worthwhile investment. Especially with the millions of dollars invested in the players, and the affect one injury to a key player can have on a teams season or seasons if it alters who the player is at his core. I also found the stuff on the former Lakers trainer Alex McKechnie very intriguing. Seems in hindsight he really should have been kept. Cant say he would have prevented any of the injuries we have had the last few seasons but his track record looks marvelous. |
Wow, insanely depressing we let Alex McKechnie go. |
I agree. Alex McKechnie would be a good person to have around the team. But I think it also depends on how receptive the FO and coaches are for modern technologies.
Very interesting article Bard207. Thanks for posting it! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
