+++ Lakers vs Jazz ++++ Preseason Game #4 10/16/14 7:00PT
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brunel
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:41 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Lakers_Jester wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
My only problem was Pau's $19m contract.

At $7m, IMO, he's a better player than Boozer. Wouldn't have minded him on the Lakers at that price tag, but he left for a much better team and a new start.


Quite honestly, only way I'd even consider pau would be at Boozer's price, and even then I'd take boozer because I think he's just better suited for a pick n roll/pop nba (unless I'm the knicks). Paus game to me just reeks of erectile dysfunction.


Just wait until you see Boozer mid-year. He is what he is. Shoots 15-18 footers, doesn't get back on defense (doesn't play any).

At least he screams more than Pau I suppose.

Pau is worth more than $3m b/c he can play center. And centers with skills like that aren't cheap.

Again, Pau at $19m, not great. Pau at $7m, no brainer. He decided to leave more $ on the table to play with a better team.


Yeah, Boozer is not pretty to watch. There's a reason why he never played the 4Q for Thibs. The problem is we have no alternatives. Move Davis into the starting lineup and Hill to PF? That's going to allow his man to clog the paint and mess up the spacing even more. Play Randle? Don't trust him at this point. He's still so raw and looks confused.
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Lakers_Jester
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:46 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Lakers_Jester wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
My only problem was Pau's $19m contract.

At $7m, IMO, he's a better player than Boozer. Wouldn't have minded him on the Lakers at that price tag, but he left for a much better team and a new start.


Quite honestly, only way I'd even consider pau would be at Boozer's price, and even then I'd take boozer because I think he's just better suited for a pick n roll/pop nba (unless I'm the knicks). Paus game to me just reeks of erectile dysfunction.


Just wait until you see Boozer mid-year. He is what he is. Shoots 15-18 footers, doesn't get back on defense (doesn't play any).

At least he screams more than Pau I suppose.

Pau is worth more than $3m b/c he can play center. And centers with skills like that aren't cheap.

Again, Pau at $19m, not great. Pau at $7m, no brainer. He decided to leave more $ on the table to play with a better team.


You're right 7m is palatable but I honestly can't stand his mobility. You say he can play center but i say he can do so only on one side of the court. The 19m really made a diff but having seen how pau plays at 19m and the plethora of excuses, lack of motivation, lack of energy, injury proneness, lack of toughness, cowardice, softness. That's what I wouldn't want on my team and that's the biggest issue. Dude looks like a man just cruising through pay checks, like he just can't wait to go home put on his slippers and read a book. Mentally checked out. I don't want that on my team. To me aside from injury proneness, those are character flaws, and within ones control imo. I wouldn't want anyone on my team with those problems because to me that means it's not that they can't do it, its that they wont. That's inexcusable.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:48 am    Post subject:

I understand why Pau wanted a fresh start. Probably saw that this team wasn't going to be a contender, and knew he had just a few years left. No sense to stay on a rebuilding team and remain the scapegoat.
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ghostowl
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:57 am    Post subject:

angus wrote:
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you do realize that Lin's strength is penetrating to get to the rim, and he can't do that if our system doesn't believe in "3's" and the lane becomes crowded right?


Do you really believe after the farce-disaster of the past week Scott is going to stick with that ridiculous plan? They'll spread out some the moribund offense of the past week. Admittedly we'll be a poor 3 pt shooting team however you look at it (Lin excepted) but Boozer and Hill will not be as immobile and lane clogging energized by a PG who will feed them well also and when there's some life to an offense that isn't down 20 points. If Lin shows up as I'm predicting, the offense will adapt and create plays to allow for this, and Lin often does well feeding big men after penetrating in the crowd.


A coach doesn't change his system that fast. It almost takes a firing of a coach for their offensive philosophy /system to change. If Scott saw Lin as CP3's level (which he doesn't), then there's a slight chance he might change the system to tailor to the PG, but that isn't the case. We also don't have any 3 pt specialists on our team either.

Lin has to prove to be an elite penetrating guard BEFORE they change the system for him. And that can't happen when an offensive philosophy only changes after a new coach.

You're not seeing reality here.
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fiendishoc
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:22 am    Post subject:

If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.
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catman2u
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 10:20 am    Post subject: We need Lins driving and to minimize long 2's, they are deadly to the offense.

Lin actually is a very good penetrating guard and excellent in transition. However if the system and players don't spread the spacing, driving up the middle it will be a disaster. It doesn't help that they have no other 3 point shooter so the defense can collapse. This is what coaches are paid for, to figure it out. I'm waiting.
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cheesysapien
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 11:48 am    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


Good to know. I agree Lin need to asserts himself for the team to be good. I could also foresee that Byron and Kobe would encourage him doing that. Let's wait and see. For whatever reasons, I still anticipate the team will do better than predicted ...
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LoyalLakerfan44
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:55 pm    Post subject:

cheesysapien wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


Good to know. I agree Lin need to asserts himself for the team to be good. I could also foresee that Byron and Kobe would encourage him doing that. Let's wait and see. For whatever reasons, I still anticipate the team will do better than predicted ...


Hope Lin steps up, but I doubt it. Lin is not even playing his style of basketball which is basically run and shoot. Lin would have been perfect for MDA honestly.
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cheesysapien
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 4:30 pm    Post subject:

LoyalLakerfan44 wrote:
cheesysapien wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


Good to know. I agree Lin need to asserts himself for the team to be good. I could also foresee that Byron and Kobe would encourage him doing that. Let's wait and see. For whatever reasons, I still anticipate the team will do better than predicted ...


Hope Lin steps up, but I doubt it. Lin is not even playing his style of basketball which is basically run and shoot. Lin would have been perfect for MDA honestly.


I hope so too. I have not follow Lin's career closely after he went to Rockets. Yesterday I watched his highlights in game 5 against Trail Blazers in 2013, he was so good. He just need to play his style of facilitating and attacking b ball. Yes, he would be perfert for MDA, but I know Byron is a fan of him. I think there is a difference in having a coach who trust you and a coach who does not. I don't think McHale trust Lin enough to let him play through mistakes. I think he will have that trust from Byron. It would be interesting to see how he develop in LA. I predict that he will flourish under the tutelage of Byron, Bryant and Nash, but there are so many factors involve. He is already facing one of them, injuries, though they are minor for now. Knock on the wood ...

What are your sources of doubt?
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lukewaltonsdad
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2014 7:43 pm    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


I've seen your detailed breakdown of our offense on each of out preseason games, and I seen your concern about the offense or the lack thereof that Scott is installing; question, though, if Lin is allowed to call his own number and give Lin the reign to run the offense, can it improve at all if we're running a read/react type system? For instance, I'll use this example; a quarterback seeing something on the defense he could take advantage off and audibles to a different play; if Lin is given that flexibility, can our offense improve any? Become more versatile? Would that give us a chance to become respectable on that end?
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fiendishoc
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2014 9:37 pm    Post subject:

lukewaltonsdad wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


I've seen your detailed breakdown of our offense on each of out preseason games, and I seen your concern about the offense or the lack thereof that Scott is installing; question, though, if Lin is allowed to call his own number and give Lin the reign to run the offense, can it improve at all if we're running a read/react type system? For instance, I'll use this example; a quarterback seeing something on the defense he could take advantage off and audibles to a different play; if Lin is given that flexibility, can our offense improve any? Become more versatile? Would that give us a chance to become respectable on that end?


More often than not on Byron's teams, it seems that calling the audible means breaking off from the offense completely to exploit something that works, whether it's CP3's high pick and roll or Kyrie's isos. I think the difference in success on offense between Byron's various teams is how well his superstars take advantage of this freedom. So far for this team it's meant Kobe getting as many isos on the block as he wants. But hopefully, in the future you will see the team give some space for Lin / Davis screen rolls.

Here are Byron's Hornets in the playoffs vs the Spurs. This is definitely not the Princeton offense (no matter what Dave Miller says).

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cheesysapien
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2014 10:17 pm    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
lukewaltonsdad wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


I've seen your detailed breakdown of our offense on each of out preseason games, and I seen your concern about the offense or the lack thereof that Scott is installing; question, though, if Lin is allowed to call his own number and give Lin the reign to run the offense, can it improve at all if we're running a read/react type system? For instance, I'll use this example; a quarterback seeing something on the defense he could take advantage off and audibles to a different play; if Lin is given that flexibility, can our offense improve any? Become more versatile? Would that give us a chance to become respectable on that end?


More often than not on Byron's teams, it seems that calling the audible means breaking off from the offense completely to exploit something that works, whether it's CP3's high pick and roll or Kyrie's isos. I think the difference in success on offense between Byron's various teams is how well his superstars take advantage of this freedom. So far for this team it's meant Kobe getting as many isos on the block as he wants. But hopefully, in the future you will see the team give some space for Lin / Davis screen rolls.

Here are Byron's Hornets in the playoffs vs the Spurs. This is definitely not the Princeton offense (no matter what Dave Miller says).



Thanks for the post. This gives us some insight into Byron's coaching philosophy. It is good to know the flexibility of the system. I hope to see more pick and roll/pop. Lin - Davis was definitely fun to watch
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lukewaltonsdad
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2014 11:00 pm    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
lukewaltonsdad wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
If Lin asserts himself and makes the call to spread the floor and call his own number, I think Byron would let him, as he's known for keeping the reins loose. It's important for him not to just defer to Kobe or the 'system'.


I've seen your detailed breakdown of our offense on each of out preseason games, and I seen your concern about the offense or the lack thereof that Scott is installing; question, though, if Lin is allowed to call his own number and give Lin the reign to run the offense, can it improve at all if we're running a read/react type system? For instance, I'll use this example; a quarterback seeing something on the defense he could take advantage off and audibles to a different play; if Lin is given that flexibility, can our offense improve any? Become more versatile? Would that give us a chance to become respectable on that end?


More often than not on Byron's teams, it seems that calling the audible means breaking off from the offense completely to exploit something that works, whether it's CP3's high pick and roll or Kyrie's isos. I think the difference in success on offense between Byron's various teams is how well his superstars take advantage of this freedom. So far for this team it's meant Kobe getting as many isos on the block as he wants. But hopefully, in the future you will see the team give some space for Lin / Davis screen rolls.

Here are Byron's Hornets in the playoffs vs the Spurs. This is definitely not the Princeton offense (no matter what Dave Miller says).



Thank you. Great stuff.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2014 11:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Linsanity

[quote="catman2u"]
angus wrote:
ghostowl wrote:


you do realize that Lin's strength is penetrating to get to the rim, and he can't do that if our system doesn't believe in "3's" and the lane becomes crowded right?


In NY Lin had Tyson Chandler to feed for easy baskets, Amare Stoudemire as well. JR Smith for 3's. Davis could be Chandler, Boozer could be Stoudemire but who can he dish to for 3's? Also it was D'Antoni's running system. Unfortunately when ball hog half court player Carmelo Anthony came back from injury it all ended.


I'm a huge Lin fan, but unfortunately the hallmark of Lin's NY teams was defense, along with unselfish play, and this Lakers team does not have the defenders that the Knicks had. Chandler was a bigger version of Davis who played far heavier minutes, so he had a bigger defensive impact by virtue of his size, playing time, experience, and influence. Other players like Jeffries, Shumpert and even guys like Fields, Balkman, Walker, and Toney Douglas were all above average to very good defensive players who understood both individual and team defense. Other than Davis, only Wes seems to fit that mold as far as I have seen, and possibly Hill to some extent but only if he can quickly improve his team defensive awareness.

On the flip side, Lin is a better player now than he was, and Kobe is a smarter player than Carmelo was (although Carmelo was closer to his prime).

Regardless, I hope you're right. I just ordered League Pass and can't wait to watch the season unfold.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 12:36 pm    Post subject:

Mark Medina ‏@MarkG_Medina, 3:07 PM - 19 Oct 2014

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You can't make this up. Byron Scott said Ryan Kelly out tonight after injuring his right hamstring
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chazz
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 19, 2014 6:58 pm    Post subject:

I think that Linsanity will happen like it did in New York for those few weeks......Lin will be the talk of the town and will have a 3/4 season of Linsanity ...You can book that !!!!!
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