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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90299 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 12:10 am Post subject: |
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Fallout wrote: | https://twitter.com/phampel/status/520395884752670720/photo/1
Chanting they want the cop dead.
Flag burning.
Sometimes they make it hard for people to feel sympathy. |
Especially folks who had none to begin with... _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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C M B Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Nov 2006 Posts: 19854 Location: Prarie & Manchester, high above the western sideline
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:06 am Post subject: |
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24 wrote: | Fallout wrote: | https://twitter.com/phampel/status/520395884752670720/photo/1
Chanting they want the cop dead.
Flag burning.
Sometimes they make it hard for people to feel sympathy. |
Especially folks who had none to begin with... |
☐ not rekt
☑ rekt
☑ tyrannosaurus rekt _________________ http://chickhearn.ytmnd.com/
Sister Golden Hair wrote: | LAMAR ODOM is an anagram for ... DOOM ALARM
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Tark the Shark Star Player
Joined: 07 May 2006 Posts: 3510
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 7:27 am Post subject: |
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jodeke wrote: | LINK
Another side of the shooting. This one hasn't presented any evidence. I don't see anything saying it was a sandwich. Ferguson is about to explode. |
I heard about this on the radio this morning. They found the suspect's gun which was a Ruger 9mm. At least three shots were fired in the direction of the officer before the gun malfunctioned. They found some of the bullets and casings.
Cousins who weren't there say the guy had a sandwich and the cop planted the gun in its place. No sandwich was recovered.
The guy was also wearing a court ordered ankle bracelet due to another gun charge. His attorney says he was a respectful, quiet young man. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 8:12 am Post subject: |
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Tark the Shark wrote: | jodeke wrote: | LINK
Another side of the shooting. This one hasn't presented any evidence. I don't see anything saying it was a sandwich. Ferguson is about to explode. |
I heard about this on the radio this morning. They found the suspect's gun which was a Ruger 9mm. At least three shots were fired in the direction of the officer before the gun malfunctioned. They found some of the bullets and casings.
Cousins who weren't there say the guy had a sandwich and the cop planted the gun in its place. No sandwich was recovered.
The guy was also wearing a court ordered ankle bracelet due to another gun charge. His attorney says he was a respectful, quiet young man. |
This is a conflict that can be easily resolved by forensics.
If Myers fired a gun he'll have residue on his person. Proper police work definitely calls for a GSR analysis. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 11:08 am Post subject: |
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jodeke wrote: | Missouri Police Plan For Possible Riots If Darren Wilson Not Charged
LINK
Gun sales are up in the city. Brown most likely be the only fatality, Black shot by White. Quote: | Adam Weinstein, co-owner of County Guns, said sales were up 50 percent since Brown's shooting, mostly among white residents fearful of riots who are buying Glock, Springfield and Smith & Wesson handguns, and shotguns. "They are afraid the city is going to explode," Weinstein said, a former member of the U.S. Navy and St. Louis firefighter with heavily tattooed arms
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It may be to late for a special prosecutor and I don't think McCullock will recuse himself.
All hell is going to break lose in Ferguson and that will only be the flash point. |
Gotta love the biased press. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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St. Louis Protesters Clash With Police Ahead Of 'Ferguson October'
LINK
I'm confused and dumbfounded. It's something that could be cured with scientific evidence. Why don't those in authority do the right thing?
It causes me to wonder, did he have a gun? Did he shoot at the officer? Quote: | It was the second night in a row that protesters came out following the Wednesday shooting death of Vonderrit Myers Jr., an 18-year-old who was facing weapons charges and wearing an ankle monitor. St. Louis Police Chief Sam Dotson has said that investigators found a gun on the scene and evidence that at least three shots had been fired in the direction of the officer. | Who fired the shots? _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2014 8:23 am Post subject: |
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'Ferguson October' Brings Hundreds Of Protesters To The Streets
LINK
The Fergurson Grand Jury is under a lot of pressure to indict Wilson. This case has gone viral.
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ST LOUIS -- Over a thousand protesters from as far away as Palestine marched in St. Louis on Saturday in support of an 18-year-old killed by a police officer in the nearby suburb of Ferguson and the broader issue of police brutality. |
The grand jury consists of six white men, three white women, two black women and one black man. Nine votes are needed to indict. I don't see that happening.
Will the voting results be made public? _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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OregonLakerGuy Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Feb 2005 Posts: 13207 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 11:22 am Post subject: |
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jodeke wrote: | Tark the Shark wrote: | jodeke wrote: | LINK
Another side of the shooting. This one hasn't presented any evidence. I don't see anything saying it was a sandwich. Ferguson is about to explode. |
I heard about this on the radio this morning. They found the suspect's gun which was a Ruger 9mm. At least three shots were fired in the direction of the officer before the gun malfunctioned. They found some of the bullets and casings.
Cousins who weren't there say the guy had a sandwich and the cop planted the gun in its place. No sandwich was recovered.
The guy was also wearing a court ordered ankle bracelet due to another gun charge. His attorney says he was a respectful, quiet young man. |
This is a conflict that can be easily resolved by forensics.
If Myers fired a gun he'll have residue on his person. Proper police work definitely calls for a GSR analysis. |
You asked about GSR.
Lab Results |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2014 11:54 am Post subject: |
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OregonLakerGuy wrote: | jodeke wrote: | Tark the Shark wrote: | jodeke wrote: | LINK
Another side of the shooting. This one hasn't presented any evidence. I don't see anything saying it was a sandwich. Ferguson is about to explode. |
I heard about this on the radio this morning. They found the suspect's gun which was a Ruger 9mm. At least three shots were fired in the direction of the officer before the gun malfunctioned. They found some of the bullets and casings.
Cousins who weren't there say the guy had a sandwich and the cop planted the gun in its place. No sandwich was recovered.
The guy was also wearing a court ordered ankle bracelet due to another gun charge. His attorney says he was a respectful, quiet young man. |
This is a conflict that can be easily resolved by forensics.
If Myers fired a gun he'll have residue on his person. Proper police work definitely calls for a GSR analysis. |
You asked about GSR.
Lab Results |
Good find OLG.
As I posted, this is a conflict that can easily be resolved. These findings, to me, are concrete evidence Myers fired at the officer.
If the people of Ferguson and the mother of Myers don't accept the findings and recant, their motives will not be in the best interest of Michael Brown. Especially if they continue to pillage. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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Fallout Star Player
Joined: 03 Jun 2002 Posts: 7626
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vanexelent Retired Number
Joined: 17 May 2005 Posts: 30081
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 6:07 am Post subject: |
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Fallout wrote: | http://news.yahoo.com/autopsy-slain-missouri-teen-shows-close-range-gunshot-124136577.html
Autopsy of slain Missouri teen shows close-range gunshot: report
The Brown trial is going to be interesting. |
Quote: | The county autopsy largely squared with a private one requested by the Brown family as far as the number and location of his wounds. But the private report concluded none of the wounds were likely made at close range due to a lack of gunpowder on the body. |
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Fallout Star Player
Joined: 03 Jun 2002 Posts: 7626
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Posted: Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:24 am Post subject: |
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vanexelent wrote: | Fallout wrote: | http://news.yahoo.com/autopsy-slain-missouri-teen-shows-close-range-gunshot-124136577.html
Autopsy of slain Missouri teen shows close-range gunshot: report
The Brown trial is going to be interesting. |
Quote: | The county autopsy largely squared with a private one requested by the Brown family as far as the number and location of his wounds. But the private report concluded none of the wounds were likely made at close range due to a lack of gunpowder on the body. |
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Think there's also the federal autopsy. If it has the same result as the county I see it hard to convict the cop. _________________ The journey to 17 begins... |
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ribeye Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2001 Posts: 12612
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Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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So, I received an email this morning from a friend and unless there is an angle we haven't thought of, this case could get R-E-A-L I-N-T-E-R-E-S-T-I-N-G.
I do hope our LG attorneys among us read this--Aeneas Hunter, you lurking?
This this what I received:
Quote: | "Until seeing this in the Amnesty International article this morning I was not aware of this:
Amnesty cited a Missouri statute that says a police officer may use deadly force 'in effecting an arrest or in preventing an escape from custody" when that officer "reasonably believes that such use of deadly force is immediately necessary to effect the arrest and also reasonably believes that the person to be arrested ... has committed or attempted to commit a felony.'" |
He went on quite a bit, but added that it doesn't appear there is evidence for a Federal Civil Rights violation. I was familiar with the Missouri statue, but felt, as I responded to him:
Quote: | "But then there is Tennessee v. Garner which would trump this. From wiki:
. . .a case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that under the Fourth Amendment, when a law enforcement officer is pursuing a fleeing suspect, he or she may use deadly force to prevent escape only if the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others." |
Which, as I thought about some weeks back, meant the Missouri law would be unconstitutional. He then responded:
Quote: | "I am not sure that is the case, actually. It is first in the realm of criminal indictment v. civil lawsuit distinctions. Tennessee v. Garner is principally a finding on a civil matter arising from a suit filed by the dead boy's father. While a higher court can conceivably reverse a criminal conviction by a state, it cannot leap over double-jeopardy and indict someone for a crime for which they have been acquitted by the state, 5th amendment wise." |
In other words, though the Missouri law would likely be declared unconstitutional, as it mirrors one so declared in Tennessee, since the particular law from Missouri has not been affirmatively declared so by the Supreme Court, it is not really unconstitutional until tested.
There could be a lot of legal mumbo jumbo to this argument with the Brown family watching and the world, and assuming the officer did shoot at a fleeing Brown, he would be in the clear by Missouri law, technically legal, but with the contents of the law being unconstitutional.
This could get r-e-a-l ugly. _________________ "A metronome keeps time by using a Ringo" |
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Fallout Star Player
Joined: 03 Jun 2002 Posts: 7626
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Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2014 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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ribeye wrote: | So, I received an email this morning from a friend and unless there is an angle we haven't thought of, this case could get R-E-A-L I-N-T-E-R-E-S-T-I-N-G.
I do hope our LG attorneys among us read this--Aeneas Hunter, you lurking?
This this what I received:
Quote: | "Until seeing this in the Amnesty International article this morning I was not aware of this:
Amnesty cited a Missouri statute that says a police officer may use deadly force 'in effecting an arrest or in preventing an escape from custody" when that officer "reasonably believes that such use of deadly force is immediately necessary to effect the arrest and also reasonably believes that the person to be arrested ... has committed or attempted to commit a felony.'" |
He went on quite a bit, but added that it doesn't appear there is evidence for a Federal Civil Rights violation. I was familiar with the Missouri statue, but felt, as I responded to him:
Quote: | "But then there is Tennessee v. Garner which would trump this. From wiki:
. . .a case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that under the Fourth Amendment, when a law enforcement officer is pursuing a fleeing suspect, he or she may use deadly force to prevent escape only if the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others." |
Which, as I thought about some weeks back, meant the Missouri law would be unconstitutional. He then responded:
Quote: | "I am not sure that is the case, actually. It is first in the realm of criminal indictment v. civil lawsuit distinctions. Tennessee v. Garner is principally a finding on a civil matter arising from a suit filed by the dead boy's father. While a higher court can conceivably reverse a criminal conviction by a state, it cannot leap over double-jeopardy and indict someone for a crime for which they have been acquitted by the state, 5th amendment wise." |
In other words, though the Missouri law would likely be declared unconstitutional, as it mirrors one so declared in Tennessee, since the particular law from Missouri has not been affirmatively declared so by the Supreme Court, it is not really unconstitutional until tested.
There could be a lot of legal mumbo jumbo to this argument with the Brown family watching and the world, and assuming the officer did shoot at a fleeing Brown, he would be in the clear by Missouri law, technically legal, but with the contents of the law being unconstitutional.
This could get r-e-a-l ugly. |
They don't want another LA riots. Police in militirized gear will be out in force the day of the verdict. _________________ The journey to 17 begins... |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:56 am Post subject: |
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ribeye wrote: | So, I received an email this morning from a friend and unless there is an angle we haven't thought of, this case could get R-E-A-L I-N-T-E-R-E-S-T-I-N-G.
I do hope our LG attorneys among us read this--Aeneas Hunter, you lurking?
This this what I received:
Quote: | "Until seeing this in the Amnesty International article this morning I was not aware of this:
Amnesty cited a Missouri statute that says a police officer may use deadly force 'in effecting an arrest or in preventing an escape from custody" when that officer "reasonably believes that such use of deadly force is immediately necessary to effect the arrest and also reasonably believes that the person to be arrested ... has committed or attempted to commit a felony.'" |
He went on quite a bit, but added that it doesn't appear there is evidence for a Federal Civil Rights violation. I was familiar with the Missouri statue, but felt, as I responded to him:
Quote: | "But then there is Tennessee v. Garner which would trump this. From wiki:
. . .a case in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that under the Fourth Amendment, when a law enforcement officer is pursuing a fleeing suspect, he or she may use deadly force to prevent escape only if the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others." |
Which, as I thought about some weeks back, meant the Missouri law would be unconstitutional. He then responded:
Quote: | "I am not sure that is the case, actually. It is first in the realm of criminal indictment v. civil lawsuit distinctions. Tennessee v. Garner is principally a finding on a civil matter arising from a suit filed by the dead boy's father. While a higher court can conceivably reverse a criminal conviction by a state, it cannot leap over double-jeopardy and indict someone for a crime for which they have been acquitted by the state, 5th amendment wise." |
In other words, though the Missouri law would likely be declared unconstitutional, as it mirrors one so declared in Tennessee, since the particular law from Missouri has not been affirmatively declared so by the Supreme Court, it is not really unconstitutional until tested.
There could be a lot of legal mumbo jumbo to this argument with the Brown family watching and the world, and assuming the officer did shoot at a fleeing Brown, he would be in the clear by Missouri law, technically legal, but with the contents of the law being unconstitutional.
This could get r-e-a-l ugly. |
Under the legal principles of ex post facto, can't hold that against the cop IMO.
Quote: | Latin for "from a thing done afterward." Ex post facto is most typically used to refer to a criminal law that applies retroactively, thereby criminalizing conduct that was legal when originally performed. Two clauses in the US Constitution prohibit ex post facto laws: Art 1, § 9 and Art. 1 § 10. see, e.g. Collins v. Youngblood, 497 US 37 (1990) and California Dep't of Corrections v. Morales, 514 US 499 (1995). |
_________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Fan0Bynum17 Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 8:25 am Post subject: |
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So it seems the forensic evidence is supporting the officer's story, right? |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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Darren Wilson’s lawyer speaks out on leaked Brown autopsy
LINK
Quote: | The private autopsy, conducted by renowned forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden, found that Brown’s wounds, including a wound to his right hand, suggested Wilson had been one foot to 30 feet away when he shot Brown – a distance not considered close range. |
Quote: | “I’m not saying that Brown going for the gun is the only explanation. I’m saying the officer said he was going for the gun and the right thumb wound supports that,” she said. “I have limited information. It could also be consistent with other scenarios. That’s the important thing. That’s why the witnesses need to speak to the grand jury and the grand jury needs to hear all the unbiased testimony and compare those statements to the physical evidence.” |
Quote: | Melinek added that the only statement she compared to the forensic evidence was that made by Wilson and that a number of other scenarios could also be possible, including Brown trying to protect himself or his hands for whatever reason being near the muzzle of Wilson’s gun. |
_________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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In_your_Eye Star Player
Joined: 21 Aug 2009 Posts: 1047
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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I'm anxious to see how the DOJ's autopsy reads, what it reveals. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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ribeye Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2001 Posts: 12612
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Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 11:19 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001, yes, I've made the same argument--I can't attach your quote as it comes up blank (???). But, I have then two other questions:
These are quotes from Marbury v. Madison:
"No provision of the Constitution is designed to be without effect," "Anything that is in conflict is null and void of law", "Clearly, for a secondary law to come in conflict with the supreme Law was illogical, for certainly, the supreme Law would prevail over all other laws and certainly our forefathers had intended that the supreme Law would be the bases of all law and for any law to come in conflict would be null and void of law, it would bare no power to enforce, in would bare no obligation to obey, it would purport to settle as if it had never existed, for unconstitutionality would date from the enactment of such a law, not from the date so branded in an open court of law, no courts are bound to uphold it, and no Citizens are bound to obey it. It operates as a near nullity or a fiction of law."
1) Do I read this correctly, that an unconstitutional law is as if it never existed? If it never existed then does ex post facto apply?
2) Though I doubt this would play, what if it was argued he was unaware of the law? It is ex post facto if he acted on an unconstitutional law (which is said to then to not have ever existed) that he was unaware of? I know you don't have to be aware of a law to be convicted of it, but can you use a law as a defense if you were not aware of it?
Either way, this will likely then put the Ferguson PD, and the state of Missouri and anyone else associated right square in the cross hair of a major civil law suit. _________________ "A metronome keeps time by using a Ringo" |
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shansen008 Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 3568
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Fallout Star Player
Joined: 03 Jun 2002 Posts: 7626
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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^^^^^ This is a mother in denial as was the mother of Vonderrit Myers. The article said the officer didn't give chase.
I don't know the parent or the teenager killed. Judging from what I read in the article this was a youngster possibly out of control or hanging out with the wrong crowd.
Maybe the mother should take a look at the person in the mirror. If she has other children I hope she sees this a an opportunity to learn and teach. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Wed Oct 29, 2014 6:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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shansen008 Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 3568
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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Well this thread sure got quiet.....any new news? Seems like the media doesnt want to touch this one any more. |
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jodeke Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67317 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:18 am Post subject: |
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^^^^^
In a sense the non news is good news. It allows tempers to calm and possibly promote rational thinking. I don't know if this has been posted it's dated 10/16/2014
New Claims Made by Grand Jury Witness Who Says He Saw Shooting of Michael Brown in Ferguson From Start to Finish
LINK _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
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