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bws94
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:30 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Thx again DB, missed Kobe in the 4th. Young Kobe or old Kobe, he's our only clutch guy.

Otherwise, up until the Lilliard tear, the team played hard.


Believe it or not, Kobe isn't the only clutch guy. Lin is clutch too, he's just not really his clutch self as a Laker but he's quite capable of having his own 4th quarter eruptions and making big shots and play in the last 3 minutes of games. He's not Kobe, but he has some clutch in him. I also think Nick can be clutch and Boozer.


No one else has proved himself to be clutch on this team other than Kobe. I'm not gonna fantasize, hope, dream, wish upon a star for someone to step up. We will be losing for a long time if management thinks for one minute we already have a superstar on this team other than Kobe. No one is stopping any of these players from stepping up and being a leader.


Even then Kobe has been clutch like 1 or 2 games out of last 20 attempts. Everybody is calling him clutch since he came through in his last outing (what have you done for me lately principal) but looking at the big picture Kobe hasn't exactly been Mr. Clutch either.


No way he's been clutch. Sure he takes 10 shots and one or two game winners finally go in. That's not clutch. Those days may be over.


Again, clutch is not just about offense. It's about consistently changing the outcome of the game, be it your offense, defense, or team play when the game is on the line. It's more about consistently leading your team, especially when they need you, if you ask me. Of course, being clutch has nothing to do with being perfect. It's just another one of those things we label as an intangibles. More intangibles on a team brings in more wins and ultimately gets you to the playoffs.


And again, Lin at least has done this with defensive plays. In a game against Portland last year he broke up a lob in the last play of regulation to force OT. He's done it against Portland in the playoffs by diving for a ball Harden lost and then getting up and making an assist to Daniels that was a game winner, by getting strategic steals against the Pelicans late in a Houston game, by taking offensive charges late in games, not only by scoring, and also with assists and lobs on the offensive end. I've said repeatedly I'm not saying Lin or Young or whoever's clutchness equates with anyone elses but it is absolutely not true to say a Lin or Young aren't capable of changing momentum or can't be clutch.

Maybe it is all your opinion vs. others on intangibles, in fact I think Lin has them. That's why some people are big on him. He's frustrating at times, but he has them.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:06 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
Let's be objective:

Did we need someone to step up last game?

Did someone step up last game?

If a certain someone was playing last game, would they have most likely stepped up in some way last game?

That is my definition of clutch: Consistently rising to the occasion to meet a challenge when the chips are down to impose your team's success.

Kobe, Mr. Clutch...enough said.



Exactly, you can't be clutch if you're not on the floor. Enough said
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:16 pm    Post subject:

Thanks DB
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:52 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
Let's be objective:

Did we need someone to step up last game?

Did someone step up last game?

If a certain someone was playing last game, would they have most likely stepped up in some way last game?

That is my definition of clutch: Consistently rising to the occasion to meet a challenge when the chips are down to impose your team's success.

Kobe, Mr. Clutch...enough said.



What's the point of arguing the definition of clutch? Your post is irrelevant to the thread.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:13 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Thx again DB, missed Kobe in the 4th. Young Kobe or old Kobe, he's our only clutch guy.

Otherwise, up until the Lilliard tear, the team played hard.


Believe it or not, Kobe isn't the only clutch guy. Lin is clutch too, he's just not really his clutch self as a Laker but he's quite capable of having his own 4th quarter eruptions and making big shots and play in the last 3 minutes of games. He's not Kobe, but he has some clutch in him. I also think Nick can be clutch and Boozer.


No one else has proved himself to be clutch on this team other than Kobe. I'm not gonna fantasize, hope, dream, wish upon a star for someone to step up. We will be losing for a long time if management thinks for one minute we already have a superstar on this team other than Kobe. No one is stopping any of these players from stepping up and being a leader.


Even then Kobe has been clutch like 1 or 2 games out of last 20 attempts. Everybody is calling him clutch since he came through in his last outing (what have you done for me lately principal) but looking at the big picture Kobe hasn't exactly been Mr. Clutch either.


No way he's been clutch. Sure he takes 10 shots and one or two game winners finally go in. That's not clutch. Those days may be over.


Again, clutch is not just about offense. It's about consistently changing the outcome of the game, be it your offense, defense, or team play when the game is on the line. It's more about consistently leading your team, especially when they need you, if you ask me. Of course, being clutch has nothing to do with being perfect. It's just another one of those things we label as an intangibles. More intangibles on a team brings in more wins and ultimately gets you to the playoffs.


By these standards, Kobe hasn't been clutch this year either, spare a few games. What is the point of this again?
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nshid
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:30 pm    Post subject:

13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:
catman2u wrote:
13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Thx again DB, missed Kobe in the 4th. Young Kobe or old Kobe, he's our only clutch guy.

Otherwise, up until the Lilliard tear, the team played hard.


Believe it or not, Kobe isn't the only clutch guy. Lin is clutch too, he's just not really his clutch self as a Laker but he's quite capable of having his own 4th quarter eruptions and making big shots and play in the last 3 minutes of games. He's not Kobe, but he has some clutch in him. I also think Nick can be clutch and Boozer.


No one else has proved himself to be clutch on this team other than Kobe. I'm not gonna fantasize, hope, dream, wish upon a star for someone to step up. We will be losing for a long time if management thinks for one minute we already have a superstar on this team other than Kobe. No one is stopping any of these players from stepping up and being a leader.


Even then Kobe has been clutch like 1 or 2 games out of last 20 attempts. Everybody is calling him clutch since he came through in his last outing (what have you done for me lately principal) but looking at the big picture Kobe hasn't exactly been Mr. Clutch either.


No way he's been clutch. Sure he takes 10 shots and one or two game winners finally go in. That's not clutch. Those days may be over.


Again, clutch is not just about offense. It's about consistently changing the outcome of the game, be it your offense, defense, or team play when the game is on the line. It's more about consistently leading your team, especially when they need you, if you ask me. Of course, being clutch has nothing to do with being perfect. It's just another one of those things we label as an intangibles. More intangibles on a team brings in more wins and ultimately gets you to the playoffs.


By these standards, Kobe hasn't been clutch this year either, spare a few games. What is the point of this again?


nshid wrote:
bws94 wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Thx again DB, missed Kobe in the 4th. Young Kobe or old Kobe, he's our only clutch guy.

Otherwise, up until the Lilliard tear, the team played hard.


Believe it or not, Kobe isn't the only clutch guy. Lin is clutch too, he's just not really his clutch self as a Laker but he's quite capable of having his own 4th quarter eruptions and making big shots and play in the last 3 minutes of games. He's not Kobe, but he has some clutch in him. I also think Nick can be clutch and Boozer.


No one else has proved himself to be clutch on this team other than Kobe. I'm not gonna fantasize, hope, dream, wish upon a star for someone to step up. We will be losing for a long time if management thinks for one minute we already have a superstar on this team other than Kobe. No one is stopping any of these players from stepping up and being a leader.


You all need to keep up with the discussion. This is basically a sparked off conversation debating whether Lin and some of our other players are clutch or not. Myself and other user said Kobe only clutch guy on the team and we needed him last game.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:35 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:

You all need to keep up with the discussion. This is basically a sparked off conversation debating whether Lin and some of our other players are clutch or not. Myself and other user said Kobe only clutch guy on the team and we needed him last game.



Which I still stand by my opinion that Kobe hasn't been clutch for the most part this season. He was clutch in his last outing but that's one game amongst many 4th quarter stinkers this year.

When you lose games, you always need somebody else that would have changed things, doesn't mean it would've made a difference. When Lillard went off the 1st game, Byron Scott said "We really missed Ronnie Price tonight". Look what happened when he got his wish?
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 8:44 pm    Post subject:

13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:

You all need to keep up with the discussion. This is basically a sparked off conversation debating whether Lin and some of our other players are clutch or not. Myself and other user said Kobe only clutch guy on the team and we needed him last game.



Which I still stand by my opinion that Kobe hasn't been clutch for the most part this season. He was clutch in his last outing but that's one game amongst many 4th quarter stinkers this year.

When you lose games, you always need somebody else that would have changed things, doesn't mean it would've made a difference. When Lillard went off the 1st game, Byron Scott said "We really missed Ronnie Price tonight". Look what happened when he got his wish?


At the end of the day, Kobe is still the leader and better than anyone on this team. If anyone on the team can be called clutch, logically it would be Kobe. The truth is no one stepped up last game and Lillard beat us single-handedly. I would take a struggling non-clutch-this-season Kobe over last night's 4th quarter efforts.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:01 pm    Post subject:

nshid wrote:
13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:

You all need to keep up with the discussion. This is basically a sparked off conversation debating whether Lin and some of our other players are clutch or not. Myself and other user said Kobe only clutch guy on the team and we needed him last game.
Which I still stand by my opinion that Kobe hasn't been clutch for the most part this season. He was clutch in his last outing but that's one game amongst many 4th quarter stinkers this year.

When you lose games, you always need somebody else that would have changed things, doesn't mean it would've made a difference. When Lillard went off the 1st game, Byron Scott said "We really missed Ronnie Price tonight". Look what happened when he got his wish?
At the end of the day, Kobe is still the leader and better than anyone on this team. If anyone on the team can be called clutch, logically it would be Kobe. The truth is no one stepped up last game and Lillard beat us single-handedly. I would take a struggling non-clutch-this-season Kobe over last night's 4th quarter efforts.
The players not named Kobe have not consistently shown the ability to be at their best when the best is needed (thanks given to John Wooden's Principals of Success). Every game is yet another confirmation that these talented players do not have this quality.

Kobe is the only player that demands a double team hence more effective than any other player

Price has shown more consistent effort on D and growing offensive abilities that have made an impact on the game than JLin. Both have not shown the ability and production to be starting

Only Black and Davis have shown the rim protecting ability to be starting - potentially. RKelly is showing signs to be a valuable bench player
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 10:42 pm    Post subject:

13th Man wrote:
nshid wrote:

You all need to keep up with the discussion. This is basically a sparked off conversation debating whether Lin and some of our other players are clutch or not. Myself and other user said Kobe only clutch guy on the team and we needed him last game.



Which I still stand by my opinion that Kobe hasn't been clutch for the most part this season. He was clutch in his last outing but that's one game amongst many 4th quarter stinkers this year.

When you lose games, you always need somebody else that would have changed things, doesn't mean it would've made a difference. When Lillard went off the 1st game, Byron Scott said "We really missed Ronnie Price tonight". Look what happened when he got his wish?


The players played in the fourth quarter at the first Trail Blazers game certainly played much better, and had a close game than the players played in the fourth quarter at this second Trail Blazers game.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2015 11:02 pm    Post subject:

We need a new game. We've made a mess out of DB's excellent thread. Sorry, DB, the thread deserves better. I'm guilty as anyone making this another all roads lead to the same discussion thread.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 2:08 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Seth Partnow ‏@SethPartnow 3h3 hours ago
LaMarcus Aldridge has an eFG of 37.6% when shooting after receiving pass from Damian Lillard lowest among any passer-receiver combo >100 FGA


Now, why didn't we double Lillard again?
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 9:47 am    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
Quote:
Seth Partnow ‏@SethPartnow 3h3 hours ago
LaMarcus Aldridge has an eFG of 37.6% when shooting after receiving pass from Damian Lillard lowest among any passer-receiver combo >100 FGA


Now, why didn't we double Lillard again?


because we probably don't watch a whole lot of film on how other teams play our opponents (orlando contained lillard really well the night before we played them), and we don't care about statistics.
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bws94
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:25 am    Post subject:

tirebiter wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
Quote:
Seth Partnow ‏@SethPartnow 3h3 hours ago
LaMarcus Aldridge has an eFG of 37.6% when shooting after receiving pass from Damian Lillard lowest among any passer-receiver combo >100 FGA


Now, why didn't we double Lillard again?


because we probably don't watch a whole lot of film on how other teams play our opponents (orlando contained lillard really well the night before we played them), and we don't care about statistics.


That's a coaching failure unless Lillard was just cold or something. If L. is contained then the coaches should have at least reviewed defensive schemes in that game. That's what I would have done. Found games when L. was contained and look at ways to do it not just stick a PG on him and hope for the best. But L. also scored on the bigs.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:49 am    Post subject:

bws94 wrote:
tirebiter wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
Quote:
Seth Partnow ‏@SethPartnow 3h3 hours ago
LaMarcus Aldridge has an eFG of 37.6% when shooting after receiving pass from Damian Lillard lowest among any passer-receiver combo >100 FGA


Now, why didn't we double Lillard again?


because we probably don't watch a whole lot of film on how other teams play our opponents (orlando contained lillard really well the night before we played them), and we don't care about statistics.


That's a coaching failure unless Lillard was just cold or something. If L. is contained then the coaches should have at least reviewed defensive schemes in that game. That's what I would have done. Found games when L. was contained and look at ways to do it not just stick a PG on him and hope for the best. But L. also scored on the bigs.

BS just has overconfidence of head of snake!
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 1:52 pm    Post subject:

bws94 wrote:
tirebiter wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
Quote:
Seth Partnow ‏@SethPartnow 3h3 hours ago
LaMarcus Aldridge has an eFG of 37.6% when shooting after receiving pass from Damian Lillard lowest among any passer-receiver combo >100 FGA
Now, why didn't we double Lillard again?
because we probably don't watch a whole lot of film on how other teams play our opponents (orlando contained lillard really well the night before we played them), and we don't care about statistics.
That's a coaching failure unless Lillard was just cold or something. If L. is contained then the coaches should have at least reviewed defensive schemes in that game. That's what I would have done. Found games when L. was contained and look at ways to do it not just stick a PG on him and hope for the best. But L. also scored on the bigs.
It appears that execution was a far greater issue. When the bigs are not calling out the coverages, it leaves the guards on an island where nothing good can happen.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 13, 2015 7:04 pm    Post subject:

Lillard's highlights from the game:


The only thing they could have done that might have worked was to get the ball out of his hands by doubling in the 4th quarter.
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