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greenfrog
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Joined: 02 Jan 2011
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 Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Patiently waiting for Calipari to get busted for illegal player recruitment ($) like in his previous college coaching stops.
That "superpower" he has for recruiting talent may not be as effective in the pros.
In terms of x's and o's I think he's good (but not great) when compared relatively to the rest of the coaches in the NBA. |
you'll know when he's about to get busted when he starts entertaining these NBA offers seriously. his timing for leaving a program right before the sanctions come down is impeccable.
hey, maybe the lakers can get jim boeheim. |
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44TheLogo
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Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Patiently waiting for Calipari to get busted for illegal player recruitment ($) like in his previous college coaching stops.
That "superpower" he has for recruiting talent may not be as effective in the pros.
In terms of x's and o's I think he's good (but not great) when compared relatively to the rest of the coaches in the NBA. |
He never got busted for illegal player recruitment.
UMass had to vacate wins because Marcus Camby accepted money from an agent while he was still playing in the NCAA, forfeiting his amateur status.
Memphis had to vacate because Derrick Rose had someone else take his SAT for him and was academically ineligible.
Neither case implicated Calipari. He obviously plays fast and loose with the rules in order to win at all costs considering these situations took place under his watch, but at least get the facts right. |
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greenfrog
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Patiently waiting for Calipari to get busted for illegal player recruitment ($) like in his previous college coaching stops.
That "superpower" he has for recruiting talent may not be as effective in the pros.
In terms of x's and o's I think he's good (but not great) when compared relatively to the rest of the coaches in the NBA. |
He never got busted for illegal player recruitment.
UMass had to vacate wins because Marcus Camby accepted money from an agent while he was still playing in the NCAA, forfeiting his amateur status.
Memphis had to vacate because Derrick Rose had someone else take his SAT for him and was academically ineligible.
Neither case implicated Calipari. |
The coach is always protected. Same as with Syracuse, they let the underlings take the blame. |
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kobe_luver
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Joined: 08 Feb 2008
Posts: 11644
Location: LA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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| kwase wrote: | | I just read somewhere that Calipari is keeping his eyes on Cleveland. So, again, great coaches have no desire to come here until we have a team that can contend. I think we're all putting the cart before the horse. |
Link please?
I know Cleveland offered Cal 60M last summer and he refused....but that was before they got LBJ back. I think it'd be between them and us. I remember it was reported we waited so long to hire BS because it took Cal that long to decide he wasn't coming here this season.
If we draft one of his boys...Towns or WCS to pair up with Randle I think that'd help our chances a lot. Cal loves Randle and REALLY wanted him to come to the Lakers. He was at the draft w/ Randle celebrating when we picked him. I believe that was what helped tempt him to come here last summer. If we add another of his players (heck draft a Harrison twin or two, too) along with Randle....plus the opportunity to come here and be a hero turning us back into a super team in one of the 2 biggest markets in the NBA along with a huge salary that'd do it.
My biggest worry is Jeannie letting BS go after 1 year....she hated to let Fisher go when he was beyond done. She's very sentimental. Mitch and Jim would have to do it anyway. |
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kikanga
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Location: La La Land
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Patiently waiting for Calipari to get busted for illegal player recruitment ($) like in his previous college coaching stops.
That "superpower" he has for recruiting talent may not be as effective in the pros.
In terms of x's and o's I think he's good (but not great) when compared relatively to the rest of the coaches in the NBA. |
He never got busted for illegal player recruitment.
UMass had to vacate wins because Marcus Camby accepted money from an agent while he was still playing in the NCAA, forfeiting his amateur status.
Memphis had to vacate because Derrick Rose had someone else take his SAT for him and was academically ineligible.
Neither case implicated Calipari. He obviously plays fast and loose with the rules in order to win at all costs considering these situations took place under his watch, but at least get the facts right. |
Got my facts from ESPN radio. My bad.
FWIW, I still hold Calipari culpable in either case. For every 1 violation that is caught, many more aren't.
Not trying to pick on Calipari. Just saying he's one of the many NCAA basketball and football coaches from top-tier programs who find a way to get their "student athletes" paid under the table.
Personally, I think the student athletes should be paid. But rules are rules.
It won't be an issue in the NBA.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:15 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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44TheLogo
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Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
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lukewaltonsdad
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| I like Calipari, but I'd rather pursue Ollie if/when we get rid of Scott; shortly after we hired Byron, Ollie was on sports nation and Max asked him about the his potential interest in the Lakers job and his response was, 'just not the right timing.' They just extended him, he was coming off a national championship, and so on...nevertheless, I'd think he entertain making the jump in a couple of years... |
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44TheLogo
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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| lukewaltonsdad wrote: | | I like Calipari, but I'd rather pursue Ollie if/when we get rid of Scott; shortly after we hired Byron, Ollie was on sports nation and Max asked him about the his potential interest in the Lakers job and his response was, 'just not the right timing.' They just extended him, he was coming off a national championship, and so on...nevertheless, I'd think he entertain making the jump in a couple of years... |
I don't think Ollie is ready to coach a team with Kobe on it. If Kobe were gone, then I'd give the keys to Ollie and let him build, but right now with Kobe on the roster I think we need a more established coach with more "political capital" if you will |
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jonnybravo
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/25/report-john-calipari-desperately-wants-to-coach-in-the-nba-again/
alright. Now I want Scott gone. |
The Lakers would be a perfect fit for him. He returned Kentucky to its NCAA glory, imagine if he did the same with the Lakers. Supposedly there was some discussion last offseason. And he is a big enough name to make the long time Laker fans forget we dumped Byron after one season. Hell, I would even draft an Harrison if it meant he would come here. |
I entirely agree that Cal is a perfect fit for the Lakers. To me, there are two perfect coaches for the Lakers that fit the fraynchise. Cal or Coach K, and K is not leaving Duke for anything. |
Why do you think he'd be a perfect fit?
I'm not saying you're wrong. I just want to know your reasoning. |
There are a couple of non-basketball related things that I would highlight as far as Calipari being a perfect fit.
There are a few things that I think NBA coaches have to succeed at to be successful, and I've laid them out here.
1. Team ethos: We are a showtime, slick, entertainment focused team - it's showbusiness. Phil was beloved here because he won championships, but his persona didn't quite fit the established culture of the Lakers organization. Both the fans and Jerry Buss overlooked that because we won. John Calipari is the definition of a slick, entertaining coach - and he knows how to work the media. He is accustomed to being in the limelight and having the crosshairs pointed at him, as the LA media and fanbase will for the Lakers HC. Take for example a Tom Izzo - excellent coach in his own right, but the blue collar, grit and grind ethos doesn't resonate with the Lakers quite as much as an up and down, finesse/skill based approach does.
2. Cult of personality: Our HC needs to have a strong personality to overcome the cult of personality/dominant presence that Kobe exudes in the Lakers organization. Byron can get away with not having that because he has such a longstanding relationship with Kobe and the rest of the Lakers greats that he's not going to be put on the hot seat as quickly as MDA was. Calipari has that bigger than life personality that can deal with the "politics" of being the coach of the Lakers.
Then, as far as basketball goes, another two things.
3. Ego Management: I don't think there is a coach in the game better at ego management than Cal. Getting 1 and dones every year and managing to construct a team out of the strong egos that highly touted high school basketball players have is a testament to how he is able to get his players to buy in to the team concept. This is critical to being a successful head coach, and Calipari is clearly a master motivator and ego manager.
4. Game Planning: Going to have to admit that I have not studied UK closely enough to have a good say in this regard, the only college team I follow closely is Duke. I'll rely on Cal's history of success as evidence that his game planning is sufficient.
5. In Game Adjustments: Same as 4
6. Rotation Management: Same as 4 |
For #4/5 , I think Cal at this point in his career is secure enough that he'd have no problems hiring elite assistants (Doc Rivers in Boston, Larry Bird in Indiana) while he can focus on #1-3 and #6.
Last edited by jonnybravo on Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:21 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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lukewaltonsdad
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Joined: 09 Jul 2014
Posts: 2983
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | lukewaltonsdad wrote: | | I like Calipari, but I'd rather pursue Ollie if/when we get rid of Scott; shortly after we hired Byron, Ollie was on sports nation and Max asked him about the his potential interest in the Lakers job and his response was, 'just not the right timing.' They just extended him, he was coming off a national championship, and so on...nevertheless, I'd think he entertain making the jump in a couple of years... |
I don't think Ollie is ready to coach a team with Kobe on it. If Kobe were gone, then I'd give the keys to Ollie and let him build, but right now with Kobe on the roster I think we need a more established coach with more "political capital" if you will |
It's my opinion that Byron will be here the next 2 years; at that point, we have a team option on his contract that we won't pick up and Kobe will be retired by that time. |
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jonnybravo
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Patiently waiting for Calipari to get busted for illegal player recruitment ($) like in his previous college coaching stops.
That "superpower" he has for recruiting talent may not be as effective in the pros.
In terms of x's and o's I think he's good (but not great) when compared relatively to the rest of the coaches in the NBA. |
He never got busted for illegal player recruitment.
UMass had to vacate wins because Marcus Camby accepted money from an agent while he was still playing in the NCAA, forfeiting his amateur status.
Memphis had to vacate because Derrick Rose had someone else take his SAT for him and was academically ineligible.
Neither case implicated Calipari. He obviously plays fast and loose with the rules in order to win at all costs considering these situations took place under his watch, but at least get the facts right. |
Got my facts from ESPN radio. My bad.
FWIW, I still hold Calipari culpable in either case. For every 1 violation that is caught, many more aren't.
Not trying to pick on Calipari. Just saying he's one of the many NCAA basketball and football coaches from top-tier programs who find a way to get their "student athletes" paid under the table.
Personally, I think the student athletes should be paid. But rules are rules.
It won't be an issue in the NBA. |
I'd be okay with that. I'm not sure the extent to which Pete Carroll's USC engaged in shenanigans (simmer down USC fans), but I'd be pretty ecstatic if Cal would come here and achieved the success Pete has in Seattle. |
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Dave20
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Joined: 15 Jun 2013
Posts: 11333
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| Posted: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:50 pm Post subject: |
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| After Kobe retires and I would rather have a younger coach then Calipari. I think Fred Hoiberg would be a great hire. |
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greenfrog
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
If you know who Alex Poythress is then you can stop feeling sorry for Cal losing his best players. That's part of the scam that brings in new talent each year to his NBA tryout program. He encourages players to leave, and when they stick around they get punished.
Out with the old, in with the new... |
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Lakers#1Team
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Location: Nomad
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Don't see them firing Scott right before Kobe's last year. If Kobe retires after next season all bets are off. |
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44TheLogo
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Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:58 am Post subject: |
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| greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
If you know who Alex Poythress is then you can stop feeling sorry for Cal losing his best players. That's part of the scam that brings in new talent each year to his NBA tryout program. He encourages players to leave, and when they stick around they get punished.
Out with the old, in with the new... |
I don't feel sorry for Cal at all. Just providing the other angle.
And what about Alex's situation makes you think that he's been punished by Calipari? wtf? |
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greenfrog
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Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:25 am Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
If you know who Alex Poythress is then you can stop feeling sorry for Cal losing his best players. That's part of the scam that brings in new talent each year to his NBA tryout program. He encourages players to leave, and when they stick around they get punished.
Out with the old, in with the new... |
I don't feel sorry for Cal at all. Just providing the other angle.
And what about Alex's situation makes you think that he's been punished by Calipari? what the heck? |
He was his best player. Cal encouraged him to leave after his freshman season. He didn't comply and was buried on the bench to clear room for Randle. |
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44TheLogo
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Joined: 21 Feb 2009
Posts: 6364
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:54 am Post subject: |
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| greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
If you know who Alex Poythress is then you can stop feeling sorry for Cal losing his best players. That's part of the scam that brings in new talent each year to his NBA tryout program. He encourages players to leave, and when they stick around they get punished.
Out with the old, in with the new... |
I don't feel sorry for Cal at all. Just providing the other angle.
And what about Alex's situation makes you think that he's been punished by Calipari? what the heck? |
He was his best player. Cal encouraged him to leave after his freshman season. He didn't comply and was buried on the bench to clear room for Randle. |
How's that any different from any blue blood D1 basketball institution? Players get buried on the bench when better players at the same position come into the program, and the options are either stay on the bench, transfer, or go to the NBA. Happens at every program. |
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greenfrog
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Posts: 36081
Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 11:09 am Post subject: |
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| 44TheLogo wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | 44TheLogo wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | greenfrog wrote: | | Unless recruiting kids to play for free becomes relevant in the NBA, I don't understand the obsession with highly successful college coaches. |
Coach Cal: "Wait, I can't get 7 of the top players to join my team every offseason? F this..." |
Or
Coach Cal: "Wait, the best player in the country doesn't leave my team every year? I can keep the same superstar for longer than 1 season? That sounds easy..." |
If you know who Alex Poythress is then you can stop feeling sorry for Cal losing his best players. That's part of the scam that brings in new talent each year to his NBA tryout program. He encourages players to leave, and when they stick around they get punished.
Out with the old, in with the new... |
I don't feel sorry for Cal at all. Just providing the other angle.
And what about Alex's situation makes you think that he's been punished by Calipari? what the heck? |
He was his best player. Cal encouraged him to leave after his freshman season. He didn't comply and was buried on the bench to clear room for Randle. |
How's that any different from any blue blood D1 basketball institution? Players get buried on the bench when better players at the same position come into the program, and the options are either stay on the bench, transfer, or go to the NBA. Happens at every program. |
It may happen but I don't think it's the business model. |
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Cutheon
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Joined: 10 Jul 2009
Posts: 12182
Location: Bay Area
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 11:49 am Post subject: |
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| Cal is essentially a God in Kentucky. Why would he leave? |
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greenfrog
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Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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| Posted: Fri Mar 27, 2015 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| Cutheon wrote: | | Cal is essentially a God in Kentucky. Why would he leave? |
More violations on the way (inevitable given all the free tickets he gives to agents)... a better payday in Cleveland. |
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