Kobe Volt: Curry made the MVP runner-up look bad, but Kobe...
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irielight
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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2015 6:21 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
irielight wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
irielight wrote:
The weird thing about this thread is that it seems to imply that Harden didn't play well. On the contrary, he had a great game. If it wasn't for his excellence, the Rockets aren't even in the game. That last play ended badly for them, but I blame McHale as much as anyone - should've called a timeout. I'm rooting for Golden State as well, and certainly Harden is no Kobe, but after that game, it seems like an odd time to pick on Harden, since he was brilliant for 47 min and 50 sec...


When there were 4.9 sec left, OBH had created separation and had the chance to pull up for an open 20 footer. Instead he passed to D12 who was 23 feet from the basket. That decision sealed his fate. It was an extremely poor decision in a critical moment in their season. It was definitely anti-clutch by any measure unless your name is Henry Abbott.


Okay, yeah, sure... The end of the game wasn't his greatest moment, but so what. He's had plenty of clutch moments. He screwed up and he knew it.

Also, how about some credit to GS defense on that play - Steph and Klay trapped him perfectly.

I just don't understand this thread. Harden was amazing that game. Period. This just feels like hating to me...

This thread is basically just for fun. It was what someone that I know would call a "momentous moment" lol.

It's rare to have important plays involving the MVP and runner up, so it was just interesting, poetic, etc.

Harden in this series has shown that he is amazing, but he hasn't yet fully delivered in the end. And Curry has. So that's all! Sorry Harden! I like it because I just prefer the way Curry plays.

Harden almost had an amazing 4th quarter in game 1, but he made too many mistakes the last half of the quarter. If he ended the way he started, it would have been a historical moment. Sorry!! lol!!!

he knows it too. He knows he botched the last two games. If Houston won the first two games, and Harden made those 5 shots in game one to close out the game, and he delivered on that last play in game 2, he would be a legend right now. Sorry!!!! I am loving it, though.


Fair enough... I'm on board now.

Somehow I found myself defending the Rockets who I've hated since Ralph Sampson made that ridiculous shot against the Lakers in the 80s. Weird...

Good news - the Rockets and Harden look like ass so far tonight. Ha!
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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2015 8:40 pm    Post subject:

Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.
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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2015 8:40 pm    Post subject:

thuringer wrote:
some hilarious replies in this thread. james harden is playing like the MVP of the league.

lol
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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2015 8:45 pm    Post subject:

Steph's an evolved Ray Allen, but ya... he's no prime Kobe.
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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2015 11:32 pm    Post subject:

KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 5:36 am    Post subject:

Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.



Seriously?







Please stop while you're just being lapped once.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 8:43 am    Post subject:

KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.



Seriously?







Please stop while you're just being lapped once.


Playoff Averages

Average/game FG% 3-point% Assists Reb Stl
Kobe 25 .448 33% 4.7 5.1 1.4
Curry 26 .453 45% 7.6 4.3 1.7

"Seriously"
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hoopla
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 9:13 am    Post subject:

Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.



Seriously?







Please stop while you're just being lapped once.


Playoff Averages

Average/game FG% 3-point% Assists Reb Stl
Kobe 25 .448 33% 4.7 5.1 1.4
Curry 26 .453 45% 7.6 4.3 1.7

"Seriously"
'slow down guys. both of you are right and wrong at the same time.

dwarf you are wrong by posting the stats above. that means zilch. I said this in an earlier post in this very thread. you almost cant compare guy's scoring ability from this era with those of the last era. The rules have changed so much to the point where a perimeter player can score much easier. You can't shut anyone down defensively due to those rules and the fact that every single team in the nba is running picks all game long. This was not the case in prime kobe's era. Kobe can dismantle any defender ever without a screen. Same with jordan. Not so with lebron, not so with steph, not so with harden, not so with durant.

What i will say is this because of steph's footwork, handles, shooting ability, quick release, and his no fear mentality. He's up there with kobe, jordan. Yep, KBCB i've gone mad. The thing about curry that separates him from his own era is that he can literally shoot from anywhere on the floor. I'm really talking anywhere. You need to pick him up right before the half court line. But this is where it gets tricky trying to show his stats Fg%'s vs kobe's era or other older eras. In kobe's era being guarded like kobe has been guarded(guys all over him legally and illegally). Curry would still be a monster. he would not shrink under the pressure. But he would also have a lower FG% because of this. You take away the constant screens and the touch fouls called in todays game along the perimeter. It would mess with the guys efficiency.

Same thing for lebron, durant, harden.

One more thing, the other reason you can just jump curry with two defenders is because he has reggie miller as his teammate in Klay thompson. You jump curry and klay drops 40. Kobe has never had another perimeter teammate with that skill. Glen rice but rice was old by then. If prime kobe would've played next to prime rice. Oh my. See its one thing to throw it into shaq. but that can only happen if shaq's man comes to double which usually wont happen. It's usually the PF and a Small doing it or a small and the SF/SG. Prime example was fish being wide open when we use to kill the spurs. As much as i love fish. Fish did not have klay's skill set or size. So the same fear was not there when coming up with a defense to guard fish.
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Dwarf Nebula
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 9:37 am    Post subject:

hoopla wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.



Seriously?







Please stop while you're just being lapped once.


Playoff Averages

Average/game FG% 3-point% Assists Reb Stl
Kobe 25 .448 33% 4.7 5.1 1.4
Curry 26 .453 45% 7.6 4.3 1.7

"Seriously"
'slow down guys. both of you are right and wrong at the same time.

dwarf you are wrong by posting the stats above. that means zilch. I said this in an earlier post in this very thread. you almost cant compare guy's scoring ability from this era with those of the last era. The rules have changed so much to the point where a perimeter player can score much easier. You can't shut anyone down defensively due to those rules and the fact that every single team in the nba is running picks all game long. This was not the case in prime kobe's era. Kobe can dismantle any defender ever without a screen. Same with jordan. Not so with lebron, not so with steph, not so with harden, not so with durant.

What i will say is this because of steph's footwork, handles, shooting ability, quick release, and his no fear mentality. He's up there with kobe, jordan. Yep, KBCB i've gone mad. The thing about curry that separates him from his own era is that he can literally shoot from anywhere on the floor. I'm really talking anywhere. You need to pick him up right before the half court line. But this is where it gets tricky trying to show his stats Fg%'s vs kobe's era or other older eras. In kobe's era being guarded like kobe has been guarded(guys all over him legally and illegally). Curry would still be a monster. he would not shrink under the pressure. But he would also have a lower FG% because of this. You take away the constant screens and the touch fouls called in todays game along the perimeter. It would mess with the guys efficiency.

Same thing for lebron, durant, harden.

One more thing, the other reason you can just jump curry with two defenders is because he has reggie miller as his teammate in Klay thompson. You jump curry and klay drops 40. Kobe has never had another perimeter teammate with that skill. Glen rice but rice was old by then. If prime kobe would've played next to prime rice. Oh my. See its one thing to throw it into shaq. but that can only happen if shaq's man comes to double which usually wont happen. It's usually the PF and a Small doing it or a small and the SF/SG. Prime example was fish being wide open when we use to kill the spurs. As much as i love fish. Fish did not have klay's skill set or size. So the same fear was not there when coming up with a defense to guard fish.


A well reasoned response, but personally I don't agree that Curry needs screens to get off his shot ... he needs to be open for a split second before that jumper is off. He also has a magic touch on his drives to the basket as he displayed in last night's game when he routinely floated incredibly difficult shots (with both hands) over D. Howard's extended arms.

The only reason that I posted the stats is because of of those who respond by saying Curry is not a shot maker. This statement is laughable at best. Then a poster responds by saying "seriously." Yes, stats can be misconstrued, but when you are dealing with the close-minded, it unfortunately becomes necessary. My whole point was that Curry is an incredibly unique talent and, if he keeps this up, which barring injury, I believe he will, he will be in the discussion. I also think he'll win both an NBA title and attain an MVP quicker than either Kobe or MJ, and Curry was drafted to a team void of talent. So it will be worthy of discussion when the time comes. When discussing eras, you are correct but then if we take your reasoning further, you need to inflate Jerry West's stats because the NBA was closer to the NFL back then ... and there was no 3-point shot.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 11:31 am    Post subject:

hoopla wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
KobeBryantCliffordBrown wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
Dwarf Nebula wrote:
I'm a huge Kobe fan but if Curry keeps playing like he did this year, he will enter the discussion as the best 2 guard in history. He's already the best shooter I have ever seen ... by far. Yes, he lacks the athleticism of Kobe or MJ but his offensive skills, while different, are uniquely on par with those 2. I drooled over him when he was in college and haven't seen anything like him until I watched Russell this year. I hope we don't regret passing on him. I know this is blasphemous to state on a Laker forum but I calls em like I sees em. Now let the attacks begin.


I still don't think he shoots as well as Kobe. I think if you limit the discussion to 3 pointers, yes, he is better. But overall shooting, I don't think so. We'll see how it goes with Curry, but he is not on Kobe level yet for all around shooting. Curry still needs a lot of screens and stuff to get him the room, he is nowhere near Kobe's level in terms of being able to get those looks without the screens.

The most impressive thing about Curry is that if he sets his feet and can get his mechanics going, he is deadly. But if he can't and has to do something more creative on the fly, he isn't the deadly shooter we think he is. Kobe has shown that he will make crazy shots while contorting and he just has more ways to score.

Right now, Curry is closer to Ray Allen than Kobe. We'll see what happens.


First off, I said if he keeps it up and I said I was specifically referring to his offensive skills. I also totally disagree with you on his shot making ability. He is unguardable like the greats. He has the quickest release perhaps in the history of the NBA. He is by far the best shooter I have ever seen and no, Kobe is not close in this regard. Take a look at Steph's statistics ... they are ungodley and have NEVER been matched.. Sure he is not as good as MJ and Kobe defensively but his shot making ability is off the charts. He has already demolished all records for 3 point shooting in the playoffs and he is still quite young. Anyone who laughs is either a complete homer or not paying attention.



I don't think you have been paying attention to Kobe's shot making ability to write what you did. Yes, Steph is a better pure shooter than Kobe, but that's it. Kobe is a shot maker. And he has every single shot in the book. Putting Steph in Kobe's league is just ridiculous.


I don't think you read my post carefully, because if you did, you wouldn't be posting this ... especially after tonight's game. Curry is un-guardable and can make every shot in the book. His touch is beyond human. The stats also back me up, so trust me when I say you don't want to go there.

I never said that he is better than Kobe or MJ. He obviously hasn't played long enough yet; he's not as athletic and his D is not in their league yet. He has a totally different and skill set ... one that we have never seen before. If he keeps this up then yes, he will be in the discussion. Stats don't lie and if he keeps this up there will be no denying his greatness or his place amongst the all time greats. Please keep in mind that I am as big a Laker fan than you are ever likely to come across. I probably saw 90% of all Laker games since 1979 and attended most of the Showtime Finals games. I'm just able to appreciate great basketball when I see it and don't let my homer glasses obscure reality.



Seriously?







Please stop while you're just being lapped once.


Playoff Averages

Average/game FG% 3-point% Assists Reb Stl
Kobe 25 .448 33% 4.7 5.1 1.4
Curry 26 .453 45% 7.6 4.3 1.7

"Seriously"
'slow down guys. both of you are right and wrong at the same time.

dwarf you are wrong by posting the stats above. that means zilch. I said this in an earlier post in this very thread. you almost cant compare guy's scoring ability from this era with those of the last era. The rules have changed so much to the point where a perimeter player can score much easier. You can't shut anyone down defensively due to those rules and the fact that every single team in the nba is running picks all game long. This was not the case in prime kobe's era. Kobe can dismantle any defender ever without a screen. Same with jordan. Not so with lebron, not so with steph, not so with harden, not so with durant.

What i will say is this because of steph's footwork, handles, shooting ability, quick release, and his no fear mentality. He's up there with kobe, jordan. Yep, KBCB i've gone mad. The thing about curry that separates him from his own era is that he can literally shoot from anywhere on the floor. I'm really talking anywhere. You need to pick him up right before the half court line. But this is where it gets tricky trying to show his stats Fg%'s vs kobe's era or other older eras. In kobe's era being guarded like kobe has been guarded(guys all over him legally and illegally). Curry would still be a monster. he would not shrink under the pressure. But he would also have a lower FG% because of this. You take away the constant screens and the touch fouls called in todays game along the perimeter. It would mess with the guys efficiency.

Same thing for lebron, durant, harden.

One more thing, the other reason you can just jump curry with two defenders is because he has reggie miller as his teammate in Klay thompson. You jump curry and klay drops 40. Kobe has never had another perimeter teammate with that skill. Glen rice but rice was old by then. If prime kobe would've played next to prime rice. Oh my. See its one thing to throw it into shaq. but that can only happen if shaq's man comes to double which usually wont happen. It's usually the PF and a Small doing it or a small and the SF/SG. Prime example was fish being wide open when we use to kill the spurs. As much as i love fish. Fish did not have klay's skill set or size. So the same fear was not there when coming up with a defense to guard fish.



I could hook you up with meds for that condition.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 12:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Kobe Volt: Curry made the MVP runner-up look bad, but Kobe...

hoopla wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
It was great to see the MVP and MVP runner-up involved in a last second tussle during a competitive playoff game. And it was fascinating to see the MVP get the better of the runner up, when Curry and Thompson stole the ball from Harden. It was very poetic and all that, and fitting. I'm much more of a Curry fan than Harden, because he relies more on skill than gimmicks such as flopping and creating contact.

But, it also reminded me of sort of the opposite situation a few years ago. When Kobe was having his great 35 ppg scoring year, he lost the controversial MVP to the winner Steve Nash. And a few days after the MVP was revealed (the day after, i think), Kobe dunked (lipton tea-B style) on Nash. And it was remarkable and freaking awesome, a signature moment. There was the MVP getting dunked ON by the runner up. I remember at the time thinking that I can't remember such a dramatic moment like that between the top two MVP candidates.

And it just goes to show again....Kobe is the best I've ever seen. No matter what the stats say, or the awards, he will make that statement on the court. And that's pure skill and tenacity. No gimmicks, no shortcuts.

So just reminiscing. it was a great moment yesterday, and it reminded me of one of the most unique moments I've ever seen in the Kobe/Nash play.

Here's Harden showing why he's the runner up:


Here's Harden getting mad about it. he knows that was a special moment:



And here's Kobe doing what Harden wished he did:



I hope GS makes it to the Finals, and I hope Curry does the same to Lebron if he's there. Bam!
funny stuff. harden tearing up the stuff backstage. lol ...hee hee. thats what you get mr flops.

But what i noticed watching the vids above is, that neither curry nor harden are being guarded like kobe use to be guarded back in say 2006.

This is the biggest difference when they attempt to compare anyone from this era to anyone from that kobe era or prior. There's no comparison. Now i do believe super curry would be fantastic in any era due to his superior footwork, shooting ability, and "I aint scared" attitude. The reason harden was "cookin" is because you are afraid to breath on the guy, this makes defenders guard him differently then any other player. even down the stretch. you're afraid of sending him to the line with a touch foul. Imagine if he didnt get most of those bad calls. Harden would still be a darn good player with the same handles, step back. but when he makes that move more guys would be closer to him due to the fact they would not be afraid of getting hit with a fake foul. That could change if harden's jumper goes in or not. You've seen the times when he doesnt get that call. He looks like a mere mortal out there. Harden's super power is inside of bogus fouls. Where as kobe's in within his skills. But that can be said for a lot of this era guys. Not saying they are not very very good. Just stating the facts.

Yes. This is very accurate, and probably my main point in this thread. I still feel that over the course of a career, these things become more and more evident. Right now, we are caught up in the primes of some of these guys and their hype...Harden,Lebron, Curry, etc. They are the current superstars. But after the years are over, we will be able to tell which moments, which plays, which career was more impressive. I guess it's about perseverance. Kobe has persevered through a lot of different things. Lebron, not so much. Lebron is very "business smart"...he will bolt for a better situation before his weaknesses get exposed publicly. And that's fine, but all these things will be evident when the career is over.
Harden, the same it seems. Although I think I like Harden more than Lebron, not sure. Still, without his thing that he does when he draws fouls, I'm not so sure he would be an elite player.
One thing guys like me recognize is that a lot of fans do place a certain amount of credit for a 'smart" player that can draw the calls, trick the refs, etc. Horry did stuff like that, Rodman was a master. It's like the New England fans attitude towards brady and the Patriots...sort of "Hey, don't be mad that we got away with it and you didn't think of it first! haha!!!"

anyway, this play is still funny and great to me! Harden has been exposed, and i don't think he can recover from this this year. He will have to wait until next year to make up for this huge blow to his reputation. But it's been done before. Remember, young Kobe airballing vs Utah. Kobe turned that around with an exclamation by hitting that buzzer beater of the Suns, and then proceeded to impress extensively afterwards. So that's what Harden has got to do now.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 1:05 pm    Post subject:

Harden took a huge blow to his reputation by dropping 30/11/9 on 59% shooting in games 1 and 2, guys. (And only took 16 free throws, since apparently they don't count)

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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 1:19 pm    Post subject:

There's always the same well disguised trolls in these threads trying to prove that Kobe isn't one of the GOATs
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 1:33 pm    Post subject:

PhoenixForce wrote:
There's always the same well disguised trolls in these threads trying to prove that Kobe isn't one of the GOATs

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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 1:39 pm    Post subject:

thuringer wrote:
Harden took a huge blow to his reputation by dropping 30/11/9 on 59% shooting in games 1 and 2, guys. (And only took 16 free throws, since apparently they don't count)


I'd rather he just not lose the ball when the game is on the line. I'd rather he make 5 shots in a row to close out the 4th and win, rather than make them in the beginning, then brick and lose.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 1:59 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
thuringer wrote:
Harden took a huge blow to his reputation by dropping 30/11/9 on 59% shooting in games 1 and 2, guys. (And only took 16 free throws, since apparently they don't count)


I'd rather he just not lose the ball when the game is on the line. I'd rather he make 5 shots in a row to close out the 4th and win, rather than make them in the beginning, then brick and lose.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 2:07 pm    Post subject:

McHale should have called a timeout anyway.

So he didn't get a shot off. It's one play. One. Freaking. Play. The timing was unfortunate.

And make 5 shots in a row? What??? lmao how can that even be expected of anyone?!! Harden was on fire in the 2nd half of game 1 and the entire game 2 anyway, lmao.

He didn't even miss a shot in the 4th quarter of game 2, wow, i can't stop laughing at the blanks being fired ITT. harden's great. get over it.


Last edited by thuringer on Sun May 24, 2015 3:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 2:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Kobe Volt: Curry made the MVP runner-up look bad, but Kobe...

SuperboyReformed wrote:
It was great to see the MVP and MVP runner-up involved in a last second tussle during a competitive playoff game. And it was fascinating to see the MVP get the better of the runner up, when Curry and Thompson stole the ball from Harden. It was very poetic and all that, and fitting. I'm much more of a Curry fan than Harden, because he relies more on skill than gimmicks such as flopping and creating contact.

But, it also reminded me of sort of the opposite situation a few years ago. When Kobe was having his great 35 ppg scoring year, he lost the controversial MVP to the winner Steve Nash. And a few days after the MVP was revealed (the day after, i think), Kobe dunked (lipton tea-B style) on Nash. And it was remarkable and freaking awesome, a signature moment. There was the MVP getting dunked ON by the runner up. I remember at the time thinking that I can't remember such a dramatic moment like that between the top two MVP candidates.

And it just goes to show again....Kobe is the best I've ever seen. No matter what the stats say, or the awards, he will make that statement on the court. And that's pure skill and tenacity. No gimmicks, no shortcuts.

So just reminiscing. it was a great moment yesterday, and it reminded me of one of the most unique moments I've ever seen in the Kobe/Nash play.

Here's Harden showing why he's the runner up:


Here's Harden getting mad about it. he knows that was a special moment:



And here's Kobe doing what Harden wished he did:



I hope GS makes it to the Finals, and I hope Curry does the same to Lebron if he's there. Bam!


Ok. So awards and stats mean nothing. LOL
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 3:29 pm    Post subject:

PhoenixForce wrote:
There's always the same well disguised trolls in these threads trying to prove that Kobe isn't one of the GOATs


Kobe IS one of the GOATs. You really need to refrain from throwing out the "troll" word for no reason. Get a life.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 6:20 pm    Post subject:

LandsbergerRules wrote:
LOL at that comment on Kobe's vid from 7 years ago:
kobe without shaq = 0 championships



Kobe without Fish=0 championships
Clearly, they needed each other
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 6:26 pm    Post subject:

silkwilkes wrote:
You can't win the MVP unless your team has either the best or second best record in conference.... it's always been like this or else MJ would have won tons of MVPs in the late 80s when he was scoring 30+ every season on 50%+ shooting every season. Heck, his best statistical season was 1986-1987 when he averaged 37,1 points per game. But the Bulls were just an average playoff team back then and not true contenders...

So Kobe not winning it in the years the Lakers were mediocre is absolutely understandable. He shouldn't have. He was the best individual player in the game without a doubt. But the MVP is as much about team achievement as it is individual achievement.


He wasnt going to win "tons" of MVPs.

His competition was Magic in his prime.
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 6:34 pm    Post subject:

Dwarf Nebula wrote:
PhoenixForce wrote:
There's always the same well disguised trolls in these threads trying to prove that Kobe isn't one of the GOATs


Kobe IS one of the GOATs. You really need to refrain from throwing out the "troll" word for no reason. Get a life.


If the warty nose fits.....
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 6:37 pm    Post subject:

Kobe is top 5 all time, one of the GOATs.. anybody who says otherwise is a hater
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2015 6:50 pm    Post subject:

On a side note, Dwight Howard is supposed to be the man, right?
funny as hell that he wouldn't be the second doggy behind Kobe in LA and now has not choice but become a supporting cast of Harden.

I mean this should have been about Superman and MVP Curry.

Something is wrong.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2015 1:38 pm    Post subject:

So i was considering the arguments here in the thread. Fortunately, on youtube they have things like all of Curry's threes for 2013-14, etc. So you can get a really good idea of what's going on.

Almost 90% of his threes are off screens, and set shots where he's open. Before people get defensive, I'm not criticizing him, I'm just stating the kinds of shots he gets. He's great, truly.
But what it means is that he's not in the same class as Kobe, who makes his threes off his own shots and hardly off of screens. This is not an argument about who is selfish or anything, this is just what happens.

My conclusion is that Kobe is a better overall 3 point shooter. He can rise above his defender or multiple defenders and do it. And he does do it, which is the more important point. Curry doesn't. Maybe he can, but that's not the strategy of the team. Most likely he can't, you can tell from his form. This is fine, it's totally fine...remember it's a team game and teams will use their strengths.

The point is, Curry needs the more help from his teammates to be in the position to hit the three. In Kobe's case, his team is free to do other things because he'll be able to get whatever shot he wants. This is important...this is why a lot of transient players who come to play on the Lakers do really well, like Ariza. If Ariza was Curry's teammate, he'd have screening responsibilities, which would take away from his own scoring. Kobe makes his teammates better by being a better player. I don't know how this gets turned into the opposite statement...that he's a ballhog selfish. You can spin these things so many different ways.
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