| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
999
Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 20266
|
 Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:39 am Post subject: Phil Jackson proving the Lakers have been wrong |
|
|
With a 4th pick in the draft he drafted a player that many Knicks fans booed jeered and called for Phil resignation. Porzingis is turning out to be a damn fine player took down 29 and 11 last night and rocked the raptors
With the 2nd pick in the drafts we get Russell who is not turning out like the player we want him to be. He's leaning more towards being a bust than an impact player. Great players find a way to perform even with a bad coach. Magic did it. Kobe and shaq did it. Lebron did it. Etc. dlo is not doing it we are making more excuses for him about offense that Scott draws up than his actual performance on the court. I don't think he will be an impact player he will be more of a role player
Many fans including myself thought that Phil is a great coach but will be a horrible GM. Maybe that's not the case maybe Phil can handle both positions and we blew our chance to keep him in 2012-2013.
I use to have a lot of faith in jim buss but with the horrible coaching hires and bad draft selections and now we have players on the team that are barely mediocre. This is a worst rebuild than I thought.
Last edited by 999 on Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:44 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
nash
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001
Posts: 8194
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Phil is just a luck guy. Luck to win 11 rings, luck to draft 4th. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
All this after 11 games? Shouldn't a GM be evaluated on more than 1 season and 11 games?
I agree it took major guts to select Porky, but he also has an aging superstar in Melo who will take up nearly 25% of the cap (even when it goes up). They don't have a pick this year, and their cap space for next season isn't tremendous.
Better than the Lakers for now, sure. Better over 5 years? I think we are actually in a better position cap wise and assets wise.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29286
Location: La La Land
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | All this after 11 games? Shouldn't a GM be evaluated on more than 1 season and 11 games?
I agree it took major guts to select Porky, but he also has an aging superstar in Melo who will take up nearly 25% of the cap (even when it goes up). They don't have a pick this year, and their cap space for next season isn't tremendous.
Better than the Lakers for now, sure. Better over 5 years? I think we are actually in a better position cap wise and assets wise. |
Cap and assets are nice.
Going from bottom dweller to a .500 team after running things for just 1 season is nicer.
We've had cap for multiple offseason now. Hasn't produced wins.
I'll give Jim and Mitch credit though...if/when we turn things around.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
AllorNothing
Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Oct 2001
Posts: 18448
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
| This should go in the general discussion. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | All this after 11 games? Shouldn't a GM be evaluated on more than 1 season and 11 games?
I agree it took major guts to select Porky, but he also has an aging superstar in Melo who will take up nearly 25% of the cap (even when it goes up). They don't have a pick this year, and their cap space for next season isn't tremendous.
Better than the Lakers for now, sure. Better over 5 years? I think we are actually in a better position cap wise and assets wise. |
Cap and assets are nice.
Going from bottom dweller to a .500 team after running things for just 1 season is nicer.
We've had cap for multiple offseason now. Hasn't produced wins.
I'll give Jim and Mitch credit though...if/when we turn things around. |
So with a 31 year old Melo (turning 32 next season) making over 25m/year and whose body is clearly breaking down (and he has a no trade clause), plus no draft pick this year, what is their end game? Just to make the playoffs?
I don't see a championship contender being built with Melo as the centerpiece. I think Porky will be a very good player, but certainly not within Melo's timeframe to get a ring.
I mean isn't that the final goal? Winning a championship? Do you see the Knicks prospects as being better in that regard?
Lakers have 3 young assets, 2 on cost-controlled deals. 60m in cap space, so basically possibility of adding 3 max players in their respective primes (age 27-29) in 2016-18 while Melo turns 33-35 on his contract.
I'm not saying that we're THERE by any means, but to say the Knicks have accomplished something is a bit premature. If Melo goes out with injury they are screwed (and he is now venturing into injury prone territory).
But hey, the Knicks fans are so accustomed to losing that just having a "buzz" is enough for them. (I live out here so I'm well aware of that). 
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fiendishoc
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 8488
Location: The (real) short corner
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
| He was the one who turned them into a bottom dweller in the first place. And starting first ten games at .500 doesn't mean they're going to be a .500 team. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakersNewEra
Star Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2014
Posts: 1526
Location: Vancouver BC
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
In before lock. Need more posts to be improve my reputation around here lol.
Anyhow, Phil is awesome. I'm a huge supporter of Phil and definitely hope he turns things around for the Knicks. I also want D Fish to succeed.
They're two guys that are proven winners, they will figure it out. Winning breeds more winning, losing breeds losing. It's how it is. And no, by saying that I'm most definitely not endorsing Donald Trump.
Everyone knows I'm huge on Porzingis and I wanted us to draft him but I disagree that Russell is turning out to be a bust. He is really young, his body isn't fully developed, he's playing a difficult position under a bad coach.
Russell will be a good player. Anyhow, it is how it is. Porzingis is a Knick. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
andree
Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 May 2014
Posts: 519
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
I'm not sure Yinoma. Porzingis shows all the premises to be an all Star.
Randle, Russell and Clarkson not so sure. If they will be only good players, NY will be in a much better position than us.
Stars want to play with stars. If we would have one, the next will come more easily. But we have none. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakersMDGurl
Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 18015
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
Oh stop it!!!!! The Knicks are playing their rookie, ours is seeing 20 mins a game, how can he improve or make impact? The other day Porzingis (sp?) had a 4/15 shooting night, he wasn't benched, Fish played him again last night. It's all about the trust the player gets. Look at Mudiya, all these TOs he gets during games, 5 points 9 TOs or whatever, but he still PLAYS!!!! Byron is stunting Russell's growth!!!!!
_________________
New Beginings |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29286
Location: La La Land
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| fiendishoc wrote: | | He was the one who turned them into a bottom dweller in the first place. And starting first ten games at .500 doesn't mean they're going to be a .500 team. |
He hasn't lost multiple all stars like us.
Using the same level of criticism, I would have to say our FO created a bottom dweller too.
And they haven't hit a .500 record for multiple seasons since creating it.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
LakersNewEra
Star Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2014
Posts: 1526
Location: Vancouver BC
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LakersMDGurl wrote: | | Oh stop it!!!!! The Knicks are playing their rookie, ours is seeing 20 mins a game, how can he improve or make impact? The other day Porzingis (sp?) had a 4/15 shooting night, he wasn't benched, Fish played him again last night. It's all about the trust the player gets. Look at Mudiya, all these TOs he gets during games, 5 points 9 TOs or whatever, but he still PLAYS!!!! Byron is stunting Russell's growth!!!!! |
Actually what I mind almost as much as Russell over Porzingis was hiring Byron over Fisher. This FO has stupid criteria most of the time. They passed on Fisher for his lack of experience yet they hired a coach with a losing record. Fisher was the coach on the floor for many years. Obviously he had what it takes. It's ridiculous we didn't give him the chance to grow as a coach for the Lakers.
More posts. Yay. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kobeslaker
Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 573
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
Lakers FO are wrong about many things, you don’t have to bring Phil to prove it.
I can prove it to you all the time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29286
Location: La La Land
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | All this after 11 games? Shouldn't a GM be evaluated on more than 1 season and 11 games?
I agree it took major guts to select Porky, but he also has an aging superstar in Melo who will take up nearly 25% of the cap (even when it goes up). They don't have a pick this year, and their cap space for next season isn't tremendous.
Better than the Lakers for now, sure. Better over 5 years? I think we are actually in a better position cap wise and assets wise. |
Cap and assets are nice.
Going from bottom dweller to a .500 team after running things for just 1 season is nicer.
We've had cap for multiple offseason now. Hasn't produced wins.
I'll give Jim and Mitch credit though...if/when we turn things around. |
So with a 31 year old Melo (turning 32 next season) making over 25m/year and whose body is clearly breaking down (and he has a no trade clause), plus no draft pick this year, what is their end game? Just to make the playoffs?
I don't see a championship contender being built with Melo as the centerpiece. I think Porky will be a very good player, but certainly not within Melo's timeframe to get a ring.
I mean isn't that the final goal? Winning a championship? Do you see the Knicks prospects as being better in that regard?
Lakers have 3 young assets, 2 on cost-controlled deals. 60m in cap space, so basically possibility of adding 3 max players in their respective primes (age 27-29) in 2016-18 while Melo turns 33-35 on his contract.
I'm not saying that we're THERE by any means, but to say the Knicks have accomplished something is a bit premature. If Melo goes out with injury they are screwed (and he is now venturing into injury prone territory).
But hey, the Knicks fans are so accustomed to losing that just having a "buzz" is enough for them. (I live out here so I'm well aware of that). |
If any teams star player gets hurt, they're screwed.
Maxing out a top tier scorer BEFORE the cap goes up isn't a bad thing.
Especially when we went after THE SAME GUY.
You aren't high on Melo. Fine. But I don't understand giving us credit for whiffing on signing a guy we really want but some think isn't worth it.
Kudos to Phil for retaining his star player. Drafting a great prospect who fits in his system. And for bringing wins to NY in his second season running things
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nash
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001
Posts: 8194
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
| LakersMDGurl wrote: | | Oh stop it!!!!! The Knicks are playing their rookie, ours is seeing 20 mins a game, how can he improve or make impact? The other day Porzingis (sp?) had a 4/15 shooting night, he wasn't benched, Fish played him again last night. It's all about the trust the player gets. Look at Mudiya, all these TOs he gets during games, 5 points 9 TOs or whatever, but he still PLAYS!!!! Byron is stunting Russell's growth!!!!! |
Randle is also a rookie and he is getting playing time. Russel must show he desserves it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Megaton
Retired Number
Joined: 18 Feb 2015
Posts: 25636
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
What a stupid thread after 11 games in the regular season.
Talk to me at least when Byron is fired and we see the young core play a full season of that.
Literally no player we would have drafted instead would play well here under that (bleep) moron.
_________________
Darvin Scam: https://media.tenor.com/images/3c15249955860a4b16b59e8ae035fb75/tenor.gif |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| kikanga wrote: | | fiendishoc wrote: | | He was the one who turned them into a bottom dweller in the first place. And starting first ten games at .500 doesn't mean they're going to be a .500 team. |
He hasn't lost multiple all stars like us.
Using the same level of criticism, I would have to say our FO created a bottom dweller too.
And they haven't hit a .500 record for multiple seasons since creating it. |
So keeping Melo from ages 31-35 (with contract increasing each year) was a revelatory "victory?"
WE "LOST OUR STARS" AFTER WE WENT TO 3 CONSECUTIVE NBA FINALS, WINNING 2 IN A ROW.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kikanga
Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29286
Location: La La Land
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| yinoma2001 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | fiendishoc wrote: | | He was the one who turned them into a bottom dweller in the first place. And starting first ten games at .500 doesn't mean they're going to be a .500 team. |
He hasn't lost multiple all stars like us.
Using the same level of criticism, I would have to say our FO created a bottom dweller too.
And they haven't hit a .500 record for multiple seasons since creating it. |
So keeping Melo from ages 31-35 (with contract increasing each year) was a revelatory "victory?"
WE "LOST OUR STARS" AFTER WE WENT TO 3 CONSECUTIVE NBA FINALS, WINNING 2 IN A ROW. |
Lol. We won those with Phils legendary coaching.
Phils been there less than two seasons.
And signing Melo at 20 something mill when the rising salary cap will mean 30+ mill max is a good thing.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
MyKRo
Star Player
Joined: 15 Jun 2003
Posts: 5750
Location: Los Angeles
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:04 am Post subject: |
|
|
Phil was high on Russell. He went to see him live, and had multiple meetings with him. He even took a FINE, because he complimented Russell.
Porzingis doesn't have Byron inhibiting his growth. That's the biggest difference. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001
Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
| kikanga wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | | fiendishoc wrote: | | He was the one who turned them into a bottom dweller in the first place. And starting first ten games at .500 doesn't mean they're going to be a .500 team. |
He hasn't lost multiple all stars like us.
Using the same level of criticism, I would have to say our FO created a bottom dweller too.
And they haven't hit a .500 record for multiple seasons since creating it. |
So keeping Melo from ages 31-35 (with contract increasing each year) was a revelatory "victory?"
WE "LOST OUR STARS" AFTER WE WENT TO 3 CONSECUTIVE NBA FINALS, WINNING 2 IN A ROW. |
Lol. We won those with Phils legendary coaching.
Phils been there less than two seasons.
And signing Melo at 20 something mill when the rising salary cap will mean 30+ mill max is a good thing. |
No, I find it hilarious that one is lauding the franchise that hasn't won a ring in 40 years, and celebrating as if they've accomplished something. Now, if they win a ring, sure, this is a legit post.
Phil was the coach. Who hired him and acquired Pau/Odom, drafted Bynum, got Ariza/MWP?
Y'all sound like the Israelites who wanted to go back to Egypt.
_________________
From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
