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Bard207
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 Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 12:13 am Post subject: Re: Hmmmm....Well, Maybe we're formulating into somewhat of a clone like spinoff of Golden State..Hear me out |
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| LakerFan1977 wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | LakeShowSince84 wrote: | Of course D-Lo and Clarkson are not the shooters Curry and Klay are...99% of the population aren't...But....
D-Lo - A play maker, descent ball handler, 6'5, can score multiple ways...great passer...young of course,..a descent shooter... more of a slasher than Curry
Clarkson- A descent shooter, 6'5ish..slasher..can create just as good if not better than Klay...scorer
Ingram- More athletic than Barnes, probably a better ashooter...Potentially even a better offensive threat...Also can be a better defender..Better offensive arsenal
Zubac- 7'1ish...could be a good to great rebounder and a rim protector... tons of potential on offense...
Randle- Can handle the ball solidly for a 4 man...mid range game is getting there...still needs work on outside shot...can see him being able to knock down the 3 ball eventually....
I'm not drinking the homerism (well, I'm from Michigan, so technically not a homer,..but could be bias I guess) kool-aid....but...Anyone else see's maybe a little itty bitty sprinkle of comparable Golden State blue print with what we have thus far? Thoughts |
I think some people will project a Warriors blueprint simply because we hired Luke as our coach from them. If we had hired another coach, I doubt anyone would be comparing this roster to Golden State. In terms of style of play, weaknesses and strength, I don't see that our guys are similar to Golden State's players. |
Its going to be a young defensive team that will have an influx of veteran talent and leadership, there is no ceiling for this team |
They were the worst team in the league on defense this past season.
Even without Kobe, they still have to put in some work to be considered average. A bit too soon to label them a young defensive team. |
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oldlakerfan
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Joined: 15 May 2001
Posts: 2146
Location: Tega Cay, South Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 3:41 am Post subject: |
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| Sina wrote: | Vs Golden State:
Zubac vs Bogut
Randle vs Green
Brown vs Barnes
Ingram vs Thompson
Russell vs Curry
Nance vs Speights
Clarkson vs Livingston
Vs OKC
Zubac vs Adams
Randle vs Sabonis
Ingram vs KD
Brown vs Roberson
Russell vs Westbrook
Nance vs IIyasova
Clarkson vs Oladipo
Vs Timberwolves
Zubac vs Towns
Randle vs Dieng
Ingram vs Wiggins
Clarkson vs LaVine
Russell vs Dunn
Interesting comparison. |
I love what the Lakers have in terms of a base of young players that can play multiple positions offensively and defensively. I also love what I have heard from Luke as coach what a difference he is going to make. We have a smart front office lets hope we play the salary cap dollars smartly. Love Zubac think he will be a cult hero who can really play.
Gotta say Minny sure looks to have a great core of player and will be a future top contender. Towns, Dunn and Wiggins can play some defense and Wiggins and Town look like offensive stars. The Market and coach will give us the edge to potentially to attract and keep free agents though we may not see that this year.
Anyway the future looks bright and I have hope that defensively we are going to be good. I don't see why Ingram, Russell, Nance, Randle, Brown and JC can be good defensive players. Zubac too. We just need to add the right pieces to the mix via free agency over the next couple of years. We may need to do stuff like add a Gasol or Noah for 2 years if we strike out on Hortford or Whiteside. Most important we need to add guys that will fit in help lead the development of our young guys by teaching them to win and work as a team. |
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unleasHell
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Joined: 16 Apr 2001
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:13 am Post subject: |
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Our goal should not be clone anything, our goal should be to at least double last years wins (34)!
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Last edited by unleasHell on Sat Jun 25, 2016 11:23 am; edited 1 time in total |
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KBH
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Posts: 12171
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 5:59 am Post subject: |
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| The only similarities are D'Lo-Curry (which is minimal, imo) and Randle-Green. And there's no parallel for Ingram at all. We may employ similar philosophies, but we won't be a clone. |
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Dave20
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Posts: 11333
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 6:12 am Post subject: |
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| OX1947 wrote: | | Closer to OKC. GS backcourt cant be replicated. |
I agree with this. |
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governator
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 6:15 am Post subject: |
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This 'clone' idea been around since before I started following bball, 3 decades+ and counting. There's a reason the NBA is called the copy cat league. I remember Pat Riley bringing Knicks type defensive style to south beach in the 90s which is a copy cat of 80s Pistons. Rockets pairing TMac with Yao to copy Shaq/Kobe in the 2000s. The Heat assembled a big 3 after Boston won with a big 3
Nothing wrong with borrowing a blueprint then catering it to the strength of your players |
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Car54
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Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 6:42 am Post subject: |
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| Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013?
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Car54
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Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 6:52 am Post subject: Re: Hmmmm....Well, Maybe we're formulating into somewhat of a clone like spinoff of Golden State..Hear me out |
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| activeverb wrote: | | LakeShowSince84 wrote: | Of course D-Lo and Clarkson are not the shooters Curry and Klay are...99% of the population aren't...But....
D-Lo - A play maker, descent ball handler, 6'5, can score multiple ways...great passer...young of course,..a descent shooter... more of a slasher than Curry
Clarkson- A descent shooter, 6'5ish..slasher..can create just as good if not better than Klay...scorer
Ingram- More athletic than Barnes, probably a better ashooter...Potentially even a better offensive threat...Also can be a better defender..Better offensive arsenal
Zubac- 7'1ish...could be a good to great rebounder and a rim protector... tons of potential on offense...
Randle- Can handle the ball solidly for a 4 man...mid range game is getting there...still needs work on outside shot...can see him being able to knock down the 3 ball eventually....
I'm not drinking the homerism (well, I'm from Michigan, so technically not a homer,..but could be bias I guess) kool-aid....but...Anyone else see's maybe a little itty bitty sprinkle of comparable Golden State blue print with what we have thus far? Thoughts |
I think some people will project a Warriors blueprint simply because we hired Luke as our coach from them. If we had hired another coach, I doubt anyone would be comparing this roster to Golden State. In terms of style of play, weaknesses and strength, I don't see that our guys are similar to Golden State's players. |
You don't see the comparison? Not
That DLO is curry but he's curry like with his scoring ability from
3 pt and passing ability. Neither guy is seen as athletic both take a lot of 3s both are comfortable playing off the ball and able to still get assist.
Randle is Draymond like. Both can rebound and start the fast break. Both are capable of staying with guards on the perimeter. Both guys can Pass.
Clarkson is more Westbrook than he is Barbosa but that comparison can be made.
Ingram is a 3 and Defense player who can play the roles of Klay and Livingston.
No russle isn't as good at shooting the 3 as curry and Ingram may not be as good as Klay at shooting the 3 but both can and most likely will be better defenders.
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Car54
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 6:59 am Post subject: |
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| Plaza234 wrote: | | Andre2K wrote: | Closer to 2004 Detroit Pistons depending on if we get Horford and Whiteside. As is, yeah they remind me of a mesh of both GSW and OKC. We got poor man's Curry, Durant, Green, Bogut and a very very poor man's Westbrook according to Dave 20  |
Honestly, some of these Laker fans bringing the hype to this collection of young players remind of Clipper fans back in the early 2000s when they hyped up Miles, Brand, Odom, Maggette, Richardson, Livingston. Those Clipper teams, while entertaining, won nothing and were generally bad because the Clippers never got enough solid veterans around them.
This collection of Lakers is a 20 win team right now if they do nothing. They absolutely need to hit a home run in free agency. Our roster last year had way too many guys that didn't even belong in the league, especially on the bench. |
What are you willing to wager that even if
We don't get an Allstar free agent that hey win more than 20 games? I got a 100
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RG73
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 7:20 am Post subject: |
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Luke is going to incorporate pieces of everything he has learned over his career, from Olson to Jackson to Kerr. And while he will bring in concepts from how he ran the Warriors, since he's an actual coach and not an armchair one, I would suspect that he'll mold the system to the talent at hand. Since we have no idea who the Lakers will land in free agency, you cannot really project what it will look like on the floor. The veteran signings will dictate the team identity as much as the young talent. If, for example, on the 0.0000001% chance Lebron bails from Cleveland and signs here, the system would be "give Lebron the ball and let him do his thing." You're not going to try to mold Lebron into a lesser Draymond Green version of himself. If you get a more iso-dependent, mid-range guy like DeRozan, maybe he plays more of the Livingston role, but that role gets more usage, thus skewing the style of the team. Or, perhaps internal development swings the pendulum: Zubac develops quickly and he runs more Triangle principles and rebels against the modern style with a more post up heavy offense.
Until the roster is filled out and until the younger players have some time to grow into their own identities, these projections are kind of pointless. We can be certain that Luke will institute an offense that involves all the players--even if we have guys who are good iso players, that will be used with moderation, not every play like with Scott. And we can be reasonably sure he will get the team to commit to defense--and, as with offense, it'll be a team defense with lots of switching and positional versatility (as this is pretty much a necessity in the NBA now). Beyond that, it's an unknown and will remain so at least until the roster is close to set. |
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tox
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 9:30 am Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
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Car54
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Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:14 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson
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tox
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:31 am Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson |
'10-'11 was the last season before him. #26 defensively. |
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Car54
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 10:39 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson |
'10-'11 was the last season before him. #26 defensively. |
Right about where we was last year. So
I don't know why people think we can't improve.
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Coach Vogel, Kidd, Hollins
Max slot : Kawhi |
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kobeandgary
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Posts: 6339
Location: Virginia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson |
'10-'11 was the last season before him. #26 defensively. |
Right about where we was last year. So
I don't know why people think we can't improve. |
We still have a serious lack of talent on this team. |
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bonkers
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Joined: 25 Apr 2013
Posts: 6071
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 11:59 am Post subject: |
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Clearly we're the next OKC!
Clarkson - Westbrook
Russell - Harden
Ingram - Durant
Nance - Ibaka
Zubac - Adams
Lou Will - Reggie Jackson
Brown - Roberson that can shoot
Randle - Better Jeff Green
 |
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kobe_4_mvp
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Joined: 13 Apr 2008
Posts: 3798
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| sad days in lakerland when theres folks excited about cloning some gutter rat franchise like the warriors. |
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Plaza234
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Joined: 13 Jul 2014
Posts: 1626
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
GSW team defensive rankings:
2012-13: 15th
2013-14: 4th
2014-15: 1st
2015-16: 8th
https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/defensive-efficiency?date=2015-06-16 |
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Plaza234
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| kobeandgary wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson |
'10-'11 was the last season before him. #26 defensively. |
Right about where we was last year. So
I don't know why people think we can't improve. |
We still have a serious lack of talent on this team. |
Right. The 2010-11 Golden State Warriors did not have Bogut, Iguodala and Green on their team. They added new players, and got better.
The 2016-17 Lakers is for the most part the same group of guys that finished dead last in defense in 2015-16. So I don't see alot of room for improvement unless we bring in better players. Our existing guys are not good defensive players, and I doubt they mold into them. |
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KobeRe-Loaded
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Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Posts: 14944
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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We're at least 3 years away .... barring TONS OF LUCK!
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activeverb
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| Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: Hmmmm....Well, Maybe we're formulating into somewhat of a clone like spinoff of Golden State..Hear me out |
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| LakerFan1977 wrote: | | activeverb wrote: | | LakeShowSince84 wrote: | Of course D-Lo and Clarkson are not the shooters Curry and Klay are...99% of the population aren't...But....
D-Lo - A play maker, descent ball handler, 6'5, can score multiple ways...great passer...young of course,..a descent shooter... more of a slasher than Curry
Clarkson- A descent shooter, 6'5ish..slasher..can create just as good if not better than Klay...scorer
Ingram- More athletic than Barnes, probably a better ashooter...Potentially even a better offensive threat...Also can be a better defender..Better offensive arsenal
Zubac- 7'1ish...could be a good to great rebounder and a rim protector... tons of potential on offense...
Randle- Can handle the ball solidly for a 4 man...mid range game is getting there...still needs work on outside shot...can see him being able to knock down the 3 ball eventually....
I'm not drinking the homerism (well, I'm from Michigan, so technically not a homer,..but could be bias I guess) kool-aid....but...Anyone else see's maybe a little itty bitty sprinkle of comparable Golden State blue print with what we have thus far? Thoughts |
I think some people will project a Warriors blueprint simply because we hired Luke as our coach from them. If we had hired another coach, I doubt anyone would be comparing this roster to Golden State. In terms of style of play, weaknesses and strength, I don't see that our guys are similar to Golden State's players. |
Its going to be a young defensive team that will have an influx of veteran talent and leadership, there is no ceiling for this team |
You lost me at "defensive team." |
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Lakers_Jester
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Joined: 17 Sep 2012
Posts: 5366
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| I actually think we can be better than gsw in cretain aspects. What we have right now in our players is versatility. Cavs showed as well as thunder to an extent that when gsw was forced to create one on one or simply just play physical and attack the defense via creation, dribble drive, or post up, the gsw jump shot over reliance bit them in the butt a bit. Our players actually have a pretty good inside outside game, aside from randle (so far). Russell as a bigger guard will have np absorbing contact and physicality as he gets stronger. Jc loves to drive. Ingram is another triple threat. Randle needs to work on his shot but if he does you have another triple threat. Nance already shows flashes of the midrange. I can see the future team being difficult to stop as a unit. |
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Car54
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Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 14424
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| Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2016 5:27 am Post subject: |
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| kobeandgary wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | tox wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | Plaza234 wrote: | Team Defensive Efficiency 2015-16:
#8. Golden State
#30. LA Lakers
So no, there's not really any comparison between the two teams. Klay, Bogut, Green, Iguodala can all D up. Lakers have nobody except Nance to do that. |
Where was GSW in 2013? |
#14 in '12-'13.
Jackson was a good defensive coach, if nothing else |
I got the years wrong I'm trying to see prior to Jackson |
'10-'11 was the last season before him. #26 defensively. |
Right about where we was last year. So
I don't know why people think we can't improve. |
We still have a serious lack of talent on this team. |
That argument is getting very old Gary. Yes we can use more talent but we're by no means as bad as our record was.
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Max slot : Kawhi |
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