I grimace just thinking about how we could have fleeced Brooklyn in a Dwight deal. Celtics made off like bandits for the corpses of KG and Pierce. And Portland ended up with Lillard for the corpse of Gerald Wallace.
I don't think we could realistically flip Dwight at the deadline for a number of reasons. Not the least of which would have been Kobe going all Keyser Soze had we traded Dwight for long term assets rather than someone who'd have given us a better chance to win a title that year.
"Hey Kobe, yeah ummm, we just traded Dwight for an unprotected 1st Round pick and some expiring contracts."
Should Mitch really be our GM if he doesn't have the balls to make a move that would benefit our team long term because Kobe would get all pissy?
And I don't even think Kobe would have been all that mad. Dwight was walking around the locker room waving a printed box score around and being a clown, Kobe Cleary did not like that man. It's Pau he really cared about.
The writing was on the wall, and it's not like we were in any kind of championship contention at the time.I don't think it had anything to do with pissing off Kobe, they just got cocky. They created an atmosphere that Dwight cleary was not happy in and then didn't even attempt to trade him because they bought into their own (bleep). We're the Lakers, who's going to leave us?
I truly believe that if they did not have that attitude, Dwight would have been gone. We weren't contending for a championship, we weren't even in the playoffs, they hired a coach he didn't like and KNEW they were going to keep, and you didn't have to be a mind reader or read between the lines to see that him and Kobe didn't get along.
It's just hubris. The front office is chock full of it. That's why they thought Durant would sign on to a 17 win team.
They didn't trade him when they should have, they made a mistake, you don't need to give them excuses. It's okay to admit they messed up.
Thank God the lotto balls bounced our way because we could easily have nothing, and the decision not to trade him would have been all the worse. We could be Brooklyn right now. _________________ A banana is killed every time a terrible thread or post is made. Save the bananas. Stop creating terrible posts!
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Posts: 22853 Location: La Jolla, San Diego
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:14 pm Post subject:
USCandLakers wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
USCandLakers wrote:
I grimace just thinking about how we could have fleeced Brooklyn in a Dwight deal. Celtics made off like bandits for the corpses of KG and Pierce. And Portland ended up with Lillard for the corpse of Gerald Wallace.
I don't think we could realistically flip Dwight at the deadline for a number of reasons. Not the least of which would have been Kobe going all Keyser Soze had we traded Dwight for long term assets rather than someone who'd have given us a better chance to win a title that year.
"Hey Kobe, yeah ummm, we just traded Dwight for an unprotected 1st Round pick and some expiring contracts."
Should Mitch really be our GM if he doesn't have the balls to make a move that would benefit our team long term because Kobe would get all pissy?
And I don't even think Kobe would have been all that mad. Dwight was walking around the locker room waving a printed box score around and being a clown, Kobe Cleary did not like that man. It's Pau he really cared about.
The writing was on the wall, and it's not like we were in any kind of championship contention at the time.I don't think it had anything to do with pissing off Kobe, they just got cocky. They created an atmosphere that Dwight cleary was not happy in and then didn't even attempt to trade him because they bought into their own (bleep). We're the Lakers, who's going to leave us?
I truly believe that if they did not have that attitude, Dwight would have been gone. We weren't contending for a championship, we weren't even in the playoffs, they hired a coach he didn't like and KNEW they were going to keep, and you didn't have to be a mind reader or read between the lines to see that him and Kobe didn't get along.
It's just hubris. The front office is chock full of it. That's why they thought Durant would sign on to a 17 win team.
They didn't trade him when they should have, they made a mistake, you don't need to give them excuses. It's okay to admit they messed up.
Thank God the lotto balls bounced our way because we could easily have nothing, and the decision not to trade him would have been all the worse. We could be Brooklyn right now.
Bottom line, we now have Russell, Ingram, Nance, Zublocka, Randle, and Clarkson to build upon. Just a little more patience, and we're back.
Whenever people second guess moves in the past, I feel they do it without thinking about how the current roster, history, timeline, reality.. everything would have changed. For better, or worse, we don't know. I used to be really upset with Jerry West for not flipping any of the Showtime players. Worthy played till he had no legs, AC walked, Byron walked, Coop retired. But if West did blow up quickly after Magic, then maybe Lake-Show wouldn't have happened, Shaq wouldn't have came, no Kobe, etc. But I do feel West got lucky how things turned out. We could have easily not landed Shaq, maybe a team in the top 12 says eff you Kobe, we're drafting you no matter what you say. Then our history would have been completely different, and I think West would then get more heat for not doing anything with the showtime assets.
So I don't dwell too much on the past. That's why I don't get all these fans who can't let go of their guy not being drafted by the Lakers, and so they have this vendetta against Russell. I like where we're at and all the young talent we have today, and I wouldn't change anything that the Lakers have been through because I don't know what that other reality is like. But I can sort of guess that life with Carmelo or LaMarcus would be very mediocre in the West. Not at the top, and not at the bottom, so we don't even get players like Ingram or Russell.
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29338 Location: La La Land
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 7:35 pm Post subject:
I think Jaylen Brown could be something special. Might have a Jimmy Butler - like career path. Take him 3-4 years before blooming.
He's a jumpshot away. In the meantime, he'll rack up alot of FT attempts. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
The front office has done a pretty bang up job in the draft. The last 7 players are either meeting or exceeding initial projections. We can argue about how well they handled KFT or their coaching search, but I think after the Nash/Dantoni reunion didn't work out, they understood that they were in rebuild, so I don't really blame them for Byron or Brown since they were here to tread water. Passing on Phil was a huge mistake and we simply lost on our gamble for Nash. Overall though, I'd say Mitch has done a pretty good job considering how nuts the circumstances have been-- CP3 veto, Dr. Buss' death, and KFT. That's a lot of upheaval for any franchise.
The Lakers didn't trade Dwight because they didn't think he'd leave the money on the table that summer and would sign long-term. They felt once they turned the season around he would stay. What they didn't anticipate was that by the end of the season Kobe would have blown his achilles, and Nash would be unable to go, resulting in a first round sweep at the hands of the Spurs.
Should Mitch really be our GM if he doesn't have the balls to make a move that would benefit our team long term because Kobe would get all pissy?
And I don't even think Kobe would have been all that mad. Dwight was walking around the locker room waving a printed box score around and being a clown, Kobe Cleary did not like that man. It's Pau he really cared about.
The writing was on the wall, and it's not like we were in any kind of championship contention at the time.I don't think it had anything to do with pissing off Kobe, they just got cocky. They created an atmosphere that Dwight cleary was not happy in and then didn't even attempt to trade him because they bought into their own (bleep). We're the Lakers, who's going to leave us?
I truly believe that if they did not have that attitude, Dwight would have been gone. We weren't contending for a championship, we weren't even in the playoffs, they hired a coach he didn't like and KNEW they were going to keep, and you didn't have to be a mind reader or read between the lines to see that him and Kobe didn't get along.
It's just hubris. The front office is chock full of it. That's why they thought Durant would sign on to a 17 win team.
They didn't trade him when they should have, they made a mistake, you don't need to give them excuses. It's okay to admit they messed up.
Thank God the lotto balls bounced our way because we could easily have nothing, and the decision not to trade him would have been all the worse. We could be Brooklyn right now.
Well that escalated into an unrelated rant on the FO rather quickly. I think you're ignoring the human element and surrounding context way too much, even beyond just Kobe.
-Dr. Buss...who really hoped that the 2012-13 team could win one more title as his health started to fail him...died 3 days before the trade deadline.
-You had a team with championship aspirations finally starting to play well under the coach that you brought in 5 games into the regular season. They were close to .700 ball over the previous month.
-Not just Kobe would have been pissed off. That was a team of all vets that you'd be telling that you were waving the white flag to. And the fans would have been livid.
-What kind of haul did you exactly expect to get for 3 months of Dwight Howard...even from the Nets?
The guy that they screwed up in not trading was Pau the following year, not Howard in '13. Trading him wasn't a tenable solution at all at the time. It's not a matter of making excuses for them, it's a matter of understanding what was going on at the time and not applying hindsight to my reasoning.
Should Mitch really be our GM if he doesn't have the balls to make a move that would benefit our team long term because Kobe would get all pissy?
Lets stop pretending that there was a GM or coach or owner around who was going to reign in Kobe's power over the organization. That is about as realistic as expecting Lebron to cede power. At the end of the day, franchise talents rule the league. You piss them off at your own risk--see Shaq, Lebron, Durant, and, oh yeah, the times Kobe flirted with leaving and/or demanded a trade.
Beyond that, you had a fanbase that still thought we had a shot at that point--they would have rioted had the Lakers just thrown in the towel and started a rebuild. In a vacuum, sure, that would have been a good move. However, front offices rarely operate in a vacuum.
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29338 Location: La La Land
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2016 9:55 pm Post subject:
GoldenThroat wrote:
kikanga wrote:
I think Jaylen Brown could be something special. Might have a Jimmy Butler - like career path. Take him 3-4 years before blooming.
He's a jumpshot away. In the meantime, he'll rack up alot of FT attempts.
He's a jump shot and the ability to finish around the rim away.
We'll see how effectively he draws fouls on his drives. IMO, his ceiling as a slasher is higher than Stanley Johnson's (who I like as a player as well) and Winslow's. Johnson has a polish to his offensive in-between game that is impressive. Just think Brown's athleticism and knack for slashing will make him the best finisher out of the bunch (Brown, Johnson, Winslow) eventually. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144473 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:53 am Post subject:
cKPayasoLoco wrote:
Truck Turner wrote:
AY2043 wrote:
kikanga wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
focus wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
If the purpose of Summer League is to see flashes of what your young guys can be, I'd say that this year was a rousing success. Russell, Nance, Ingram, & Zubac all showed glimpses of what they might be, and often much more than that. The only guy who disappointed IMO was Brown.
Special shout out to Ryan West and the Scouting Department. Clarkson (#46), Nance (#27), & Zubac (#32) in 3 straight years? Are you kidding me? That's shades of his father back in the day, when he used to get guys like AC Green, Vlade Divac, Elden Campbell, Nick Van Exel, etc. later in the draft. Tremendous work.
Absolutely this could be its own stickied thread as these guys progress throughout the years. West Jr. and the scouts. I used to worry we were not scouting internationally very much (and the Spurs picking up a couple guys every year ticked me off), but those concerns are gone now.
Seriously. Teams will. Be scared to trade 2nd rounders to us from now on.
When I grade our Basketball Operations the last 3 years. The only passing grade I give is in Drafting. And that's largely due to the late round picks.
My Jim and Mitch report card for the last 3 years.
Trades- D
Free Agency- F
Drafting- A
Coaching choices- C-
I think we've done pretty well in trades, actually. Unless you're counting trades we didn't make..
Mitch has done exceptionally well at trades. You look at the trades the Lakers have made the past decade and most would say the Lakers have ripped other teams off.
The coaching choices have been a complete disaster until The Luke hiring.
Free Agency has been the FO's only weak point and even that amounts to them not being able to trick superstars in their prime to take way less money or play for a bad/rebuilding team.
Which trades has he dominated in? Only trade i really like was how me made (i assume) the magic give ariza as a throw in
Yeah, that Pau Gasol trade really sucked. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
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