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activeverb
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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 Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Fishlakers wrote: | | Gatekeeper wrote: | Front office did not ask for West when he announced publicly that he was available in 2010-2011. For whatever reason, Dr. Buss thought Jim and Mitch would be more than enough able to handle the basketball ops on a daily basis. GS hired West as consultant; end of story.
I respect West for what he's done for this organization, but what's done is done. It wasn't a matter of Phil or Jerry in 2011; it was the front office's decision to take over the reins of the team the way they did. |
Somebody help me out here: Didn't the Warriors luck out on drafting Curry, Thompson, and Barnes before Jerry West started consulting??? The only things he was apart of were hiring Mark Jackson, FA Signings since 2012, and perhaps interviewing Steve Kerr? Yes, he probably helped with legitimizing the Warriors organization but I think everyone here is giving him too much credit for what Bob Meyer did?
Maybe I'm wrong here, any fellow Lgr have something I'm missing? |
West was hired as a consultant in May 2011, a month after they hired Bob Myer. So West was there before the 2012 draft in which they got Barnes and Green. Reportedly, West was also an important voice in stopping a Thompson for Kevin Love trade. |
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27
Star Player
Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Posts: 4455
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 9:17 pm Post subject: |
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| still my favorite Lakers jersey that I own. Glad you couldn't leave back then =P |
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Goldenwest
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Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 2802
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2016 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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Why say it publicly?  What's the point now? To stick it to the organization that made you what you are? |
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Wino
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Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 1:20 am Post subject: |
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For anyone who doubted that he would leave, remember that Jack Kent Cooke was a colossal jerk to him. West quit playing because of Cooke, not because he got old. Cooke was underpaying him and in some instances, he would not pay him the money his contract said he owed West. West actually had to sue Cooke to get his money, then he quit rather than play for the idiot. Then Cooke turned around and sued West for retiring!! It was an amazing time. They had apparently solved most of their issues when West agreed to coach the Lakers, but instead, he started in on that crap again and then sold the team. The real bummer was when Buss chose Phil over West. That was really the last straw for West. He bailed.
So the bottom line is, he would have left if he could have when he was a player and I personally would have understood. Cooke was lucky they had those slave rules in place back then, they made it really easy for horrible owners to continue to do business, even if nobody wanted to play for them.
As far as West getting too much credit, I will point out that in todays game, it is SOOOOO much easier to get slammed and NOT given credit where it is due, that it is kind of amazing that anyone would even guess that of him. Every place he has been, has developed a solid winning culture. He has something to do with that. It takes a team to be great but it takes a solid FO and coach to have the vision to bring the right people together. It's not always about going out and pulling in superstars, it's about pulling the right guys together, guys who make each other better and have complimentary skill sets. West has been very good with seeing this in players.
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Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144474
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2016 7:59 am Post subject: |
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| Goldenwest wrote: | | Why say it publicly? What's the point now? To stick it to the organization that made you what you are? |
Ego
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Dwarf Nebula
Star Player
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Posts: 1338
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| Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| kikanga wrote: | I've disliked West more and more the past few years.
Not personal. Just hate that he's elevating a franchise that isn't us. |
To me that's sacrilegious as a Lakers fan. West is probably responsible for the Lakers long-term dominance as any one else. Much love for the Logo. |
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activeverb
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
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| Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Dwarf Nebula wrote: | | kikanga wrote: | I've disliked West more and more the past few years.
Not personal. Just hate that he's elevating a franchise that isn't us. |
To me that's sacrilegious as a Lakers fan. West is probably responsible for the Lakers long-term dominance as any one else. Much love for the Logo. |
when you combine west's playing career with his general manager career, i consider him the greatest laker. he doesn't owe the franchise a thing -- just the opposite |
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Dwarf Nebula
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| Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| YSong wrote: | | Jerry West right place at right time. But he not very good against the Celtics. |
I actually thought he was the best player on the court for either team. In fact, he's remains the only player from the losing team, to ever be named Finals MVP. That speaks volumes. But, no, he was, 'very good' against the Celtics. The Cs were just a better team and a better run organization at that time. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 10:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Goldenwest wrote: | | Why say it publicly? What's the point now? To stick it to the organization that made you what you are? |
West has been saying stuff like this about Cooke publically for decades. It's nothing new; it's just new to you. Cooke was a horrible man, by the way; a real prick, and I doubt you'll find many people who find his absence from this world a cause of sorrow.
Only reason it came up (again) right now is because it's a relevant point for West to bring up when he defends Durant's decision to leave Oklahoma for his team. |
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J.C. Smith
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think it has to do with Jeanie personally, but had a few thoughts here. Some things we know it had to do with:
- Dr. Buss had promised him a raise or bonus that he was slow to pay. He said his money was tied up, but Jerry West had a history of feeling undervalued and taking exception with this. It likely had some contribution. After all this is a guy who had dedicated forty years to the franchise.
- Jerry West never liked Phil. Prior to Phil becoming the head coach he was asked about Phil by a reporter one time and said, "F__ Phil Jackson". Due to his friendships with the Bulls front office he knew a lot about Phil's manipulating ways before he came to L.A. and did not like it.
- Despite the above, when Shaq and Kobe came asking for Phil, and given the pressures the Lakers had to succeed at that point, West knew the right decision was to hire him so he did.
- There remained a problem between the two. West was a very involved GM and often in players ears. That didn't quite sit well with Phil. The culmination of that was Phil throwing Jerry West out of the locker room late in the season.
- Jerry West also had a problem with stress and anxiety and that also probably contributed.
I think the main issue there was Phil. The only real Jeanie tie I can see is Phil's relationship with Jeanie. I think the most likely situation is that West's frustrations with several things mounted up and the locker room incident was probably what pushed him over the top. The Lakers couldn't part ways with Phil after he had just won a title, so he probably just felt like it wasn't worth the stress moving forward. I don't buy a huge hidden rift with the front office, considering his son's place in the organization. |
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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 8:37 am Post subject: |
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| J.C. Smith wrote: | I don't think it has to do with Jeanie personally, but had a few thoughts here. Some things we know it had to do with:
- Dr. Buss had promised him a raise or bonus that he was slow to pay. He said his money was tied up, but Jerry West had a history of feeling undervalued and taking exception with this. It likely had some contribution. After all this is a guy who had dedicated forty years to the franchise.
- Jerry West never liked Phil. Prior to Phil becoming the head coach he was asked about Phil by a reporter one time and said, "F__ Phil Jackson". Due to his friendships with the Bulls front office he knew a lot about Phil's manipulating ways before he came to L.A. and did not like it.
- Despite the above, when Shaq and Kobe came asking for Phil, and given the pressures the Lakers had to succeed at that point, West knew the right decision was to hire him so he did.
- There remained a problem between the two. West was a very involved GM and often in players ears. That didn't quite sit well with Phil. The culmination of that was Phil throwing Jerry West out of the locker room late in the season.
- Jerry West also had a problem with stress and anxiety and that also probably contributed.
I think the main issue there was Phil. The only real Jeanie tie I can see is Phil's relationship with Jeanie. I think the most likely situation is that West's frustrations with several things mounted up and the locker room incident was probably what pushed him over the top. The Lakers couldn't part ways with Phil after he had just won a title, so he probably just felt like it wasn't worth the stress moving forward. I don't buy a huge hidden rift with the front office, considering his son's place in the organization. |
I think you are mostly right. West had already gone through tons of problems with Cooke, when Buss bought the team and this crap with Phil occurred, it was just the straw that broke the camels back.
I love what Jerry Buss did for this team, who wouldn't, but his partying style was likely not the best fit for West and the money thing was actually kind of poorly conceived. Unless, of course, Buss actually hoped it might push West out and help everyone save face.
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Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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