Bad timing, amidst the loss against PHX. Then he's gone.
Didn't think anybody would care to read, haha. It's interesting that the Lakers were looking to extend Riley's contract, at least publicly. Buss considered him family. Like you said, no more than a few weeks later Riley was let go. _________________ Smrek 2, Nevitt 1, Barkley 0
Bad timing, amidst the loss against PHX. Then he's gone.
Didn't think anybody would care to read, haha. It's interesting that the Lakers were looking to extend Riley's contract, at least publicly. Buss considered him family. Like you said, no more than a few weeks later Riley was let go.
I was interested because the 90 season interests me more than some others. The body language of Byron and others...and that of Pat himself. Sometimes it looked like Pat knew it was over in January, much less May. That's despite the record. He seemed to struggle to maintain the level of intensity and execution that he expected from them. He really rode the starters to blow teams out. There was a period in there where he would re-insert starters if the bench lost a little bit of a comfortable late lead because he wanted to prove a point. Chick and Stu would even comment pointedly about it, and more than once.
I loved that 90 team with Woolridge (OW0 his nick, a la CP3), but they were burnt out by April in hindsight. The first round series against Houston was a pressure. They started looking choppy right exactly as the playoffs began, the worst possible timing.
All that year, Byron was going back and forth with his hamstring issue from the prior year, which he probably blamed on Pat's minicamp in June. One game, he'd dunk on someone, the next he'd take off and it was a gimper that hit the rim and he'd crash to the floor and lay there with an irritated look. I'm sure there were some vibes in the locker room that things had gotten stale at the 10 yr point. Hard even for a GOAT level coach to have a message that's fresh after that long. That group of players had heard it all, AND it was an intense style that Pat had, to boot. Pat's a nice guy, but he's friends with Bobby Knight. He came up as player under that militaristic era. _________________ GOAT MAGIC REEL SEDALE TRIBUTE EDDIE DONX!
Bad timing, amidst the loss against PHX. Then he's gone.
Didn't think anybody would care to read, haha. It's interesting that the Lakers were looking to extend Riley's contract, at least publicly. Buss considered him family. Like you said, no more than a few weeks later Riley was let go.
I was interested because the 90 season interests me more than some others. The body language of Byron and others...and that of Pat himself. Sometimes it looked like Pat knew it was over in January, much less May. That's despite the record. He seemed to struggle to maintain the level of intensity and execution that he expected from them. He really rode the starters to blow teams out. There was a period in there where he would re-insert starters if the bench lost a little bit of a comfortable late lead because he wanted to prove a point. Chick and Stu would even comment pointedly about it, and more than once.
I loved that 90 team with Woolridge (OW0 his nick, a la CP3), but they were burnt out by April in hindsight. The first round series against Houston was a pressure. They started looking choppy right exactly as the playoffs began, the worst possible timing.
All that year, Byron was going back and forth with his hamstring issue from the prior year, which he probably blamed on Pat's minicamp in June. One game, he'd dunk on someone, the next he'd take off and it was a gimper that hit the rim and he'd crash to the floor and lay there with an irritated look. I'm sure there were some vibes in the locker room that things had gotten stale at the 10 yr point. Hard even for a GOAT level coach to have a message that's fresh after that long. That group of players had heard it all, AND it was an intense style that Pat had, to boot. Pat's a nice guy, but he's friends with Bobby Knight. He came up as player under that militaristic era.
Riley's most glaring shortcomings: I'd say running the veterans into the ground, particularly in the regular season. Should have played and developed younger players, so they'd be ready in case of injuries. Secondly, Popovich doesn't seem to have a problem keeping his message fresh after *20* years. Riley became the very thing he initially despited: an egomaniac, overbearing, controlling coach. He's the one that should have kept his ego in check for the betterment of the team. He ceased becoming a player's coach and became a don. _________________ Smrek 2, Nevitt 1, Barkley 0
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 8330 Location: Santa Monica
Posted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:30 pm Post subject:
nevitt_smrek wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
nevitt_smrek wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
Bad timing, amidst the loss against PHX. Then he's gone.
Didn't think anybody would care to read, haha. It's interesting that the Lakers were looking to extend Riley's contract, at least publicly. Buss considered him family. Like you said, no more than a few weeks later Riley was let go.
I was interested because the 90 season interests me more than some others. The body language of Byron and others...and that of Pat himself. Sometimes it looked like Pat knew it was over in January, much less May. That's despite the record. He seemed to struggle to maintain the level of intensity and execution that he expected from them. He really rode the starters to blow teams out. There was a period in there where he would re-insert starters if the bench lost a little bit of a comfortable late lead because he wanted to prove a point. Chick and Stu would even comment pointedly about it, and more than once.
I loved that 90 team with Woolridge (OW0 his nick, a la CP3), but they were burnt out by April in hindsight. The first round series against Houston was a pressure. They started looking choppy right exactly as the playoffs began, the worst possible timing.
All that year, Byron was going back and forth with his hamstring issue from the prior year, which he probably blamed on Pat's minicamp in June. One game, he'd dunk on someone, the next he'd take off and it was a gimper that hit the rim and he'd crash to the floor and lay there with an irritated look. I'm sure there were some vibes in the locker room that things had gotten stale at the 10 yr point. Hard even for a GOAT level coach to have a message that's fresh after that long. That group of players had heard it all, AND it was an intense style that Pat had, to boot. Pat's a nice guy, but he's friends with Bobby Knight. He came up as player under that militaristic era.
Riley's most glaring shortcomings: I'd say running the veterans into the ground, particularly in the regular season. Should have played and developed younger players, so they'd be ready in case of injuries. Secondly, Popovich doesn't seem to have a problem keeping his message fresh after *20* years. Riley became the very thing he initially despited: an egomaniac, overbearing, controlling coach. He's the one that should have kept his ego in check for the betterment of the team. He ceased becoming a player's coach and became a don.
I recently read Jeff Pearlman's book about those showtime teams. It seems like Riley was a living example of the greed and narcissism of the 80s, with his Armani suits, slicked-back hair and ego. He became super successful and famous, but at some point all that success and power went to his head and he lost perspective. I know he was a great coach and leader, but his great qualities became consumed by his growing hubris, unlike someone like Popovich who is real and down to earth. _________________ Lakers 49ers Chargers Dodgers
Bad timing, amidst the loss against PHX. Then he's gone.
Didn't think anybody would care to read, haha. It's interesting that the Lakers were looking to extend Riley's contract, at least publicly. Buss considered him family. Like you said, no more than a few weeks later Riley was let go.
I was interested because the 90 season interests me more than some others. The body language of Byron and others...and that of Pat himself. Sometimes it looked like Pat knew it was over in January, much less May. That's despite the record. He seemed to struggle to maintain the level of intensity and execution that he expected from them. He really rode the starters to blow teams out. There was a period in there where he would re-insert starters if the bench lost a little bit of a comfortable late lead because he wanted to prove a point. Chick and Stu would even comment pointedly about it, and more than once.
I loved that 90 team with Woolridge (OW0 his nick, a la CP3), but they were burnt out by April in hindsight. The first round series against Houston was a pressure. They started looking choppy right exactly as the playoffs began, the worst possible timing.
All that year, Byron was going back and forth with his hamstring issue from the prior year, which he probably blamed on Pat's minicamp in June. One game, he'd dunk on someone, the next he'd take off and it was a gimper that hit the rim and he'd crash to the floor and lay there with an irritated look. I'm sure there were some vibes in the locker room that things had gotten stale at the 10 yr point. Hard even for a GOAT level coach to have a message that's fresh after that long. That group of players had heard it all, AND it was an intense style that Pat had, to boot. Pat's a nice guy, but he's friends with Bobby Knight. He came up as player under that militaristic era.
Riley's most glaring shortcomings: I'd say running the veterans into the ground, particularly in the regular season. Should have played and developed younger players, so they'd be ready in case of injuries. Secondly, Popovich doesn't seem to have a problem keeping his message fresh after *20* years. Riley became the very thing he initially despited: an egomaniac, overbearing, controlling coach. He's the one that should have kept his ego in check for the betterment of the team. He ceased becoming a player's coach and became a don.
I recently read Jeff Pearlman's book about those showtime teams. It seems like Riley was a living example of the greed and narcissism of the 80s, with his Armani suits, slicked-back hair and ego. He became super successful and famous, but at some point all that success and power went to his head and he lost perspective. I know he was a great coach and leader, but his great qualities became consumed by his growing hubris, unlike someone like Popovich who is real and down to earth.
geezus h christ...sometimes i feel like this is a purple and gold colored spurs forum.
edit...even spurs fans dont think he's better than riley. which is even funnier.
I recently read Jeff Pearlman's book about those showtime teams. It seems like Riley was a living example of the greed and narcissism of the 80s, with his Armani suits, slicked-back hair and ego. He became super successful and famous, but at some point all that success and power went to his head and he lost perspective. I know he was a great coach and leader, but his great qualities became consumed by his growing hubris, unlike someone like Popovich who is real and down to earth.
This is probably seeing thru purple colored glasses, but it seemed to me that Pat's conglomeration of power and the hubris that is almost part and parcel of that really began to show in NY for sure, if not towards the end of his Laker stay. I think the way 1989 unfolded spooked him. Although injuries made the Finals moot, the team won "only" 57 and had a record 8 gm road losing streak which was unheard of then. It took the 1994 lottery team to break that streak. They really pressed hard to win 63 in 1990 and then they were out in the playoffs against a team they swept (with ease) in 89. They were totally befuddled by the Suns. It's just my belief that they were mentally and physically burned out by the 90 playoffs.
Pat was always very sensitive towards the East Coast accusation that the Lakers were carefree (despite winning more than any other 80s team including the Celtics, who were supposed to be their equals). He always brought that up. By the time he was in NY, he was so thoroughly entrenched in hardcore D and rebounds as the way forward that I think the fact that he had a bunch of brutes on the roster is overrated as a reason for the change in mindset. Those Knicks had offensive woes that were self-evident to even non-Knicks fans for entire seasons, plural, and there wasn't much of a push to bring in natural scorers (Ced C types) who were typically shoddy defenders. Everyone credits Pat for adjusting/adapting to wholly different style than Showtime, but the Heat played the same style as the Knicks and they got Zo under his watch. Good defensive C. By the time he was gone from LA, the mere coach persona of Pat was gone forever. He became half GM type, not merely in actual title, but as an internalized mindset. He wanted to call the shots, not to deal with whomever the FO provided him. It's arguable whether his "my way or highway" style got more intense after LA. It was always there, he once yelled at Kareem for not showing to a team BBQ, but he never had a situation like he had with Anthony Mason over here. Mase wanted out of there bad in 95. That was when Pat would muse to reporters about "the disease of ME". _________________ GOAT MAGIC REEL SEDALE TRIBUTE EDDIE DONX!
I recently read Jeff Pearlman's book about those showtime teams. It seems like Riley was a living example of the greed and narcissism of the 80s, with his Armani suits, slicked-back hair and ego. He became super successful and famous, but at some point all that success and power went to his head and he lost perspective. I know he was a great coach and leader, but his great qualities became consumed by his growing hubris, unlike someone like Popovich who is real and down to earth.
This is probably seeing thru purple colored glasses, but it seemed to me that Pat's conglomeration of power and the hubris that is almost part and parcel of that really began to show in NY for sure, if not towards the end of his Laker stay. I think the way 1989 unfolded spooked him. Although injuries made the Finals moot, the team won "only" 57 and had a record 8 gm road losing streak which was unheard of then. It took the 1994 lottery team to break that streak. They really pressed hard to win 63 in 1990 and then they were out in the playoffs against a team they swept (with ease) in 89. They were totally befuddled by the Suns. It's just my belief that they were mentally and physically burned out by the 90 playoffs.
Pat was always very sensitive towards the East Coast accusation that the Lakers were carefree (despite winning more than any other 80s team including the Celtics, who were supposed to be their equals). He always brought that up. By the time he was in NY, he was so thoroughly entrenched in hardcore D and rebounds as the way forward that I think the fact that he had a bunch of brutes on the roster is overrated as a reason for the change in mindset. Those Knicks had offensive woes that were self-evident to even non-Knicks fans for entire seasons, plural, and there wasn't much of a push to bring in natural scorers (Ced C types) who were typically shoddy defenders. Everyone credits Pat for adjusting/adapting to wholly different style than Showtime, but the Heat played the same style as the Knicks and they got Zo under his watch. Good defensive C. By the time he was gone from LA, the mere coach persona of Pat was gone forever. He became half GM type, not merely in actual title, but as an internalized mindset. He wanted to call the shots, not to deal with whomever the FO provided him. It's arguable whether his "my way or highway" style got more intense after LA. It was always there, he once yelled at Kareem for not showing to a team BBQ, but he never had a situation like he had with Anthony Mason over here. Mase wanted out of there bad in 95. That was when Pat would muse to reporters about "the disease of ME".
another historic post riddled with details.
also, the 90s in general had that whole defense and hustle thing in spirit everywhere.
pat has this reputation now from those last years of coaching that he ran his players into the ground, especially with regards to losing in the playoffs. when dunlee took over, didn't the lakers have similar injuries in the finals...like hamstring injuries to worthy, magic, byron something along those lines? and if that is the case, was dunleavy accussed of running the team too hard? i must have some of these details wrongs somewhere,.
Forgot I up'd this. This was the first time that Riles went to a game at The Forum during his year off. He had actually tried to get into the locker room during a previous road game to say hello to the guys, but he wasn't allowed in.
Forgot I up'd this. This was the first time that Riles went to a game at The Forum during his year off. He had actually tried to get into the locker room during a previous road game to say hello to the guys, but he wasn't allowed in.
npz gold, as always.
nice clip man, more member berries. vlade would soon have his great moment in the playoffs vs the bulls, where he makes that clutch layup and magic hugs him. (then i think mj made a shot that was devastating)
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