Laker Film Room (Pg. 42: Video - Lonzo Ball's Debut & Lakers Pick & Roll Defense)
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epak
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:44 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
New Podcast - Final Thoughts on the NBA Draft

https://www.almightyballer.com/laker-film-room-ep-25-final-thoughts-on-the-nba-draft/


This was a good one (already listened on Tom's link). I thought you actually held back a bit when Darius was going on his rationalization spree at the end.

I guess my counter example to drafting a defender high is, armed with hindsight, where would you draft Draymond in 2012. (Though if you look at Draftexpress, it's funny that they were projecting him to be a defensive liability due to being a tweener.)


I'd probably draft Draymond 2nd in a redraft, behind Davis.

But since we don't have the benefit of hindsight, how do I distinguish a prospect as being the next Draymond Green or the next Stanley Johnson/Michael Kidd-Gilchrist? I can only think of a couple of recent Top 3-5 picks were drafted with defense being their primary calling card, and I can't think of any recent ones who worked out.

IMO, I think it's wiser to draft a guy who has an offensive skill that you can hang your hat on.


Interesting take.
You'd take him 2 even if it wasn't to GS's system?
I would think Dame would have a good shot at #2 in a redraft (has the offensive skill to hang hat on).
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:17 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
epak wrote:
Ball's shot being an exaggerated version of KD's shot was intriguing.
Who was that brother talking?


My brother.


Apropos
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:21 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
I also think Lonzo may be a sneaky good defender in the NBA. I think the lazy narrative is that he's a poor defender. At worst, I can see him being an average to slightly below average defender.


His awareness, anticipation and court vision is every bit as strong on the defensive end as it is on the other side. He was extremely disruptive last season for the Bruins and while he needs more strength and still yet might struggle against PG's, what he does bring already (including a knack for boards) is going to help any team he joins.
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:30 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
Interesting take.
You'd take him 2 even if it wasn't to GS's system?
I would think Dame would have a good shot at #2 in a redraft (has the offensive skill to hang hat on).


Well, we're talking with the benefit of hindsight here. I know that Draymond is a perennial DPOY candidate, the best passer in the game on the short roll, can space the floor, protect the rim, and an emotional leader at the highest of levels. There is only one Draymond Green in the NBA.

Without the benefit of hindsight I'd undoubtedly take Lillard, for exactly that reason of being able to hang my hat on an offensive skill.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:39 am    Post subject:

Gimme_the_rock wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I also think Lonzo may be a sneaky good defender in the NBA. I think the lazy narrative is that he's a poor defender. At worst, I can see him being an average to slightly below average defender.


His awareness, anticipation and court vision is every bit as strong on the defensive end as it is on the other side. He was extremely disruptive last season for the Bruins and while he needs more strength and still yet might struggle against PG's, what he does bring already (including a knack for boards) is going to help any team he joins.


Yeah. He's good size. Athletic tools. Super smart. He can be at least an average NBA defender at worst.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 2:50 pm    Post subject:

Great pod. Good discussion on potential scenarios, etc.
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levon
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:01 pm    Post subject:

Hey GT, great pod as usual. I've noticed yall have stopped uploading to Google Play Music, any reason for that?
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The Logo
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 1:30 am    Post subject:

GT, I generally agree with your idea that us passing up on West is a horrible move. That being said, when Darius mentioned about dealing with geniuses that are a pain to deal with, I think that there should be a concern of whether you want that pain in the ass to be just a consultant. It's different when it's someone like Kobe or Lebron taking the reigns of the team vs someone with a consultant job. That being said, we don't know how much of a pain West would be and we're too void of FO experience to pass him up in my opinion.

Also do you see Lonzo defensively as a low energy guy but is a good positional defender and can use his athleticism to mitigate his energy on that end of the floor?
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lakersfan8
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 6:58 am    Post subject:

The Logo wrote:
GT, I generally agree with your idea that us passing up on West is a horrible move. That being said, when Darius mentioned about dealing with geniuses that are a pain to deal with, I think that there should be a concern of whether you want that pain in the ass to be just a consultant. It's different when it's someone like Kobe or Lebron taking the reigns of the team vs someone with a consultant job. That being said, we don't know how much of a pain West would be and we're too void of FO experience to pass him up in my opinion.


I agree 100% with GT on the Jerry West issue. I don't understand how some people acknowledge Jerry having one of the greatest basketball minds in the NBA but feels okay that we rejected him for reasons like he is difficult to work with or Magic needs time to prove himself. If he can give you the right advice at the right time, you hire him regardless what's his personality or how much credit he will take away from you, as long as this is helping the organisation to success.
He threatened to quit his job so the team can make the RIGHT move. I think Warriors would thank him for that extreme action rather than blaming him for being difficult.
It sounds to me some people maybe want Magic to success more than the Lakers.
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:11 am    Post subject:


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oldschool32
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 1:04 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:


Thanks GT! Lets just hope Lonzo makes it to Luke's offense next year..... along with Russell and Ingram.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:17 pm    Post subject:

Lonzo does well with great shooters. At UCLA he had five good shooters. Alford, Hamilton, Holiday,Leaf, and Welsh. Alford has NBA 3 pointer range. Hamilton, Leaf, and Holiday can score. Welsh is a great mid range shooter. The problem was on defense where Alford and Hamilton were not so good defenders. And Welsh and Leaf's defense were not good also. Lonzo played decent defense.
The offensive was one of the best ever but the defense brought them down.

The Lakers do not have any shooters besides DLO and Young.
Randle, Nance, Mosgov can't shoot, Ingram is learning. Clarkson is a cheese shooter.

Lonzo will give the Lakers open shots. The problem is the Lakers players need to improve their shooting to the pro level. Like the
Warriors, etc.
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laker50
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:03 pm    Post subject:

The Lakers are done by trading a number two pick for a salary dump.

Would now recommend now drafting JJ for they have no shooters.

At this rate the Lakers will be a mess and have no fans. Or only those who live in the past.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:19 pm    Post subject:

Yup we just got rid of our best shooter in a salary dump. Ugg. Can we trade Magic for Jerry West?
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foreveralakerfan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:32 pm    Post subject:

Unfortunately, Magic Johnson is NOT a good talent evaluator. Lakers just traded a guy with a high ceiling to dump a salary for the possibility of getting Westbrook or LeBron next year.

The next stupid deal will likely involve getting PG for god knows what - I have lost all faith and confidence in the FO - now I expect Ryan West to leave too!
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foreveralakerfan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:02 pm    Post subject:

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
Yup we just got rid of our best shooter in a salary dump. Ugg. Can we trade Magic for Jerry West?


If only we could. I was not a Mitch fan, but Magic may indeed prove to be tragic in the FO.

With Ball, Dlo, BI and Randall, we had the makings of a very good if not great team in 3-5 years. Now, FO wants to win now, and it doesn't happen unless GS has injuries. Hate this.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:11 pm    Post subject:

Yo this podcast coming out better be LIT
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:19 pm    Post subject:

Magic is following the blueprint Riley laid out the first time Lebron moved to a super team.

I think they are going to use Randle to get rid of Deng, whether that is for PG or not, and then get whatever draft considerations they can for Clarkson (if not part of a PG trade). Those two moves clear our cap space down to about $15 million for next summer.

That opens up the possibility of 3 max slots in a summer where there will actually be multiple max-worthy free agents that are likely to be interested in teaming up. There are very few years when as many top 20 players are all free agents at the same time. Magic is going to swing for the fences and hope he can build a super team in LA.
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foreveralakerfan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:25 pm    Post subject:

DoubleClutch wrote:
Magic is following the blueprint Riley laid out the first time Lebron moved to a super team.

I think they are going to use Randle to get rid of Deng, whether that is for PG or not, and then get whatever draft considerations they can for Clarkson (if not part of a PG trade). Those two moves clear our cap space down to about $15 million for next summer.

That opens up the possibility of 3 max slots in a summer where there will actually be multiple max-worthy free agents that are likely to be interested in teaming up. There are very few years when as many top 20 players are all free agents at the same time. Magic is going to swing for the fences and hope he can build a super team in LA.


Well, the 3 top FA's next year would be PG, LeBron....and Westbrook! Now that's a team that has a shot at beating GS!
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:28 pm    Post subject:

foreveralakerfan wrote:
DoubleClutch wrote:
Magic is following the blueprint Riley laid out the first time Lebron moved to a super team.

I think they are going to use Randle to get rid of Deng, whether that is for PG or not, and then get whatever draft considerations they can for Clarkson (if not part of a PG trade). Those two moves clear our cap space down to about $15 million for next summer.

That opens up the possibility of 3 max slots in a summer where there will actually be multiple max-worthy free agents that are likely to be interested in teaming up. There are very few years when as many top 20 players are all free agents at the same time. Magic is going to swing for the fences and hope he can build a super team in LA.


Well, the 3 top FA's next year would be PG, LeBron....and Westbrook! Now that's a team that has a shot at beating GS!

Yep. And Westbrook is going to need to decide if he wants to retire as the greatest player in OKC history, but never win a championship. Or if he wants to come home to LA and contend for the rest of his prime. Tough call.
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foreveralakerfan
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:53 pm    Post subject:

DoubleClutch wrote:
foreveralakerfan wrote:
DoubleClutch wrote:
Magic is following the blueprint Riley laid out the first time Lebron moved to a super team.

I think they are going to use Randle to get rid of Deng, whether that is for PG or not, and then get whatever draft considerations they can for Clarkson (if not part of a PG trade). Those two moves clear our cap space down to about $15 million for next summer.

That opens up the possibility of 3 max slots in a summer where there will actually be multiple max-worthy free agents that are likely to be interested in teaming up. There are very few years when as many top 20 players are all free agents at the same time. Magic is going to swing for the fences and hope he can build a super team in LA.


Well, the 3 top FA's next year would be PG, LeBron....and Westbrook! Now that's a team that has a shot at beating GS!

Yep. And Westbrook is going to need to decide if he wants to retire as the greatest player in OKC history, but never win a championship. Or if he wants to come home to LA and contend for the rest of his prime. Tough call.


Actually, I dont think thats the reason he stays there. But he likely would qualify for the super-max contract, and no one else could give it to him. That alone might keep him there. But remember, he did play for UCLA and his "buddy" left him to play and win a title at GS - could he leave if he has a chance to win and take it to KD?
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:14 pm    Post subject:

justsomelakerfan wrote:
Yo this podcast coming out better be LIT


I just started listening...
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject:

TDRock wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Yo this podcast coming out better be LIT


I just started listening...


link me I need to feel things and drink
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:22 pm    Post subject:

justsomelakerfan wrote:
TDRock wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Yo this podcast coming out better be LIT


I just started listening...


link me I need to feel things and drink


https://www.almightyballer.com/laker-film-room-ep-26-oh-dangelo-we-hardly-knew-ye/
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tox
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:34 pm    Post subject:

GT said exactly what I did about Magic, and his assumptions on how the PG has to be the leader, yadda yadda yadda. This is exactly what concerned me about Magic as (edit) an exec: that hubris of only seeing things through his narrow prism of how things ought to be.
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Last edited by tox on Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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