Where Should KDP Rank as the Best On-Ball Defender
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crazylakerfan001
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 8:34 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
ocho wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).


Let's put it this way.

If Pope wasn't a Laker, and we had a thread here about the best on-ball defenders, the over under on votes he would receive would be 0.5.


Yup.

No doubt he's the best on ball defender we've had in years, but compared to the top NBA perimeter defenders, he's not in the elite class at all.

But he is a Laker!


Exactly! I don't remember his initials ever being mentioned here as a FA target nor as an elite defender prior to when the news broke he was talking to us.

Not saying he will suck but temper the expectations accordingly and lets see how he does for us.


Actually I proposed a trade on here months ago to bring him in. I was made fun of and people said Detroit would never give him up. I guess they were wrong.
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Luminous8
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:54 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).


The metrics weren't very favorable to Avery Bradley in 2016 either. Haven't seen the numbers for 17 yet, but defensive metrics can be misleading IMO.
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A Mad Chinaman
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:15 pm    Post subject:

crazylakerfan001 wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
ocho wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).
Let's put it this way.

If Pope wasn't a Laker, and we had a thread here about the best on-ball defenders, the over under on votes he would receive would be 0.5.
Yup.

No doubt he's the best on ball defender we've had in years, but compared to the top NBA perimeter defenders, he's not in the elite class at all.

But he is a Laker!
Exactly! I don't remember his initials ever being mentioned here as a FA target nor as an elite defender prior to when the news broke he was talking to us.

Not saying he will suck but temper the expectations accordingly and lets see how he does for us.
Actually I proposed a trade on here months ago to bring him in. I was made fun of and people said Detroit would never give him up. I guess they were wrong.
With the Pistons having KCP guarding the opposing team's best players, their action speaks volumes

KCP will be definitely guarding the Lakers' opposition's best player(s).
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nash
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:40 am    Post subject:

I like his highlights defending top players, but his metrics aren't impressive at all.

Is he sleeping too much most of the games to have average defensive stats alongside eye catching defensive highlights?
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Car54
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:54 am    Post subject:

nash wrote:
I like his highlights defending top players, but his metrics aren't impressive at all.

Is he sleeping too much most of the games to have average defensive stats alongside eye catching defensive highlights?


If his metrics are that of an avg defender one could chalk it up to him defending Stars and we know they're going to get there's because of the star calls. So having an avg metric after defending the Kyries and Currys of the league may not be a bad sign of his abilities
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nash
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:07 am    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
nash wrote:
I like his highlights defending top players, but his metrics aren't impressive at all.

Is he sleeping too much most of the games to have average defensive stats alongside eye catching defensive highlights?


If his metrics are that of an avg defender one could chalk it up to him defending Stars and we know they're going to get there's because of the star calls. So having an avg metric after defending the Kyries and Currys of the league may not be a bad sign of his abilities


It is a fair point.
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governator
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:59 am    Post subject:

Luminous8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).


The metrics weren't very favorable to Avery Bradley in 2016 either. Haven't seen the numbers for 17 yet, but defensive metrics can be misleading IMO.


I can't believe Celtics gave up Avery Bradley, pretty sure they could've shed salary some other way with their bucket of picks
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governator
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:01 am    Post subject:

A Mad Chinaman wrote:
crazylakerfan001 wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
ocho wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).
Let's put it this way.

If Pope wasn't a Laker, and we had a thread here about the best on-ball defenders, the over under on votes he would receive would be 0.5.
Yup.

No doubt he's the best on ball defender we've had in years, but compared to the top NBA perimeter defenders, he's not in the elite class at all.

But he is a Laker!
Exactly! I don't remember his initials ever being mentioned here as a FA target nor as an elite defender prior to when the news broke he was talking to us.

Not saying he will suck but temper the expectations accordingly and lets see how he does for us.
Actually I proposed a trade on here months ago to bring him in. I was made fun of and people said Detroit would never give him up. I guess they were wrong.
With the Pistons having KCP guarding the opposing team's best players, their action speaks volumes

KCP will be definitely guarding the Lakers' opposition's best player(s).


I do wanna see perimeter shutdown by KCP/BI ala the old MJ/Pip
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Cutheon
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:17 pm    Post subject:

I'd say top 20 amongst guards that play more than (or equal to) 32 mpg.

Just looking at some of his numbers from last season, DTrg, DWS, dreb%, stl%, blk%, etc, he's in the top 15 for pretty much each category amongst guards that played more than (or equal to) 75 games and 32mpg. Consider that some of those "guards" had otherworldly seasons -- Westbrook, Harden (both of whom rate highly in the categories above yet have decidedly negative reps on D)-- and that NBA.com includes Giannis as a "guard;" throw in the fact that Detroit has a decidedly better defensive model than us (and a significantly slower pace of play); add increased offensive responsibilities --- and i think top 20 amongst starting/quasi-starting (32mpg) guards is fair.

He's no Marcus "basically a Doberman/Ron Artest" Banks, that's for sure.


Last edited by Cutheon on Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 3:20 pm    Post subject:

The GOAT
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A Mad Chinaman
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:04 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
A Mad Chinaman wrote:
crazylakerfan001 wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
ocho wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I think he works hard, but the metrics don't have him anywhere near the top. Maybe around average to slightly above average, which is elite at least on the Lakers (we've had poor defenders the past 4 years).
Let's put it this way.

If Pope wasn't a Laker, and we had a thread here about the best on-ball defenders, the over under on votes he would receive would be 0.5.
Yup.

No doubt he's the best on ball defender we've had in years, but compared to the top NBA perimeter defenders, he's not in the elite class at all.

But he is a Laker!
Exactly! I don't remember his initials ever being mentioned here as a FA target nor as an elite defender prior to when the news broke he was talking to us.

Not saying he will suck but temper the expectations accordingly and lets see how he does for us.
Actually I proposed a trade on here months ago to bring him in. I was made fun of and people said Detroit would never give him up. I guess they were wrong.
With the Pistons having KCP guarding the opposing team's best players, their action speaks volumes

KCP will be definitely guarding the Lakers' opposition's best player(s).
I do wanna see perimeter shutdown by KCP/BI ala the old MJ/Pip
With a legitimate center in Lopez (possibly Zubac), with Nance and BI on the wings, the perimeter defenders will have much more confidence that there will be far less "straight-line" dunks that will provide time for recovery try.

Will Randle and JC provide the needed defense to keep them on the court during crunch time. They have both stated that defense is a very high, highest, priority during the off-season, seeing how their work translate in the regular season will be key.
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Inspector Gadget
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:51 pm    Post subject:

Where do you guys rank these SGs? :

Avery Bradley
Danny Green
Caldwell-Pope
Wesley Matthews
Gary Harris
Dion Waiters
Tim Hardaway Jr
Buddy Hield
Rodney Hood

I would like to see KCPs value.
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