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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 9:06 pm    Post subject: 2017 NBA Draft: Your Big Board

Post ya big board
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 9:09 pm    Post subject:

1. Fultz - only guarunteed Allstar

2. Ball

3. Tatum - gaurunteed 20ppg
4. Jackson - don't love his floor. If you can't shoot, I don't like your floor
5. DSJ - very questionable quickness. Prolly gon' make a video on this because it's not being talked about enough
6. Isaac - jumper is actually kind of questionable. Some bad left/right misses when contested

7. Ntilikina - sleeper. Possible swiss army knife. Multiple position defender
8. Collins - questionable NBA range
9. Markkanen - defense could be puuutrid
10. Fox - at least give me a midrange J, and you'll deserve to be higher. 170lbs
11. Monk - how are you not a smaller 2010 JR Smith.

12. Bolden
13. Hartenstein - going to have a really good motor defensively. passing, handling, shooting 5 potentially. Worth the risk
14. Patton - skill upside is there. Ceiling is 2way stretch 5 who can even handle
15. Wilson - Stretch 4. Center length, SF speed, very athletic, big hands
16. Mitchell - might be too small. Could be a bit of a sleeper
17. Lydon - Stretch 4 can shoot coming off screens. can put the ball on the floor a bit. damn good athlete
18. Pasecniks - very mobile 7'2, very mobile. Potential 3pt range
19. Kennard. short arms, very short

20. Bam - will the skill come to light? Calapari somehow managed to hide his skill and at the same time convince him he could play SF at the next level. Has Cal violated an NCAA rule
21. Leaf - thinks he has more skills in his bag.. we'll see.
22. Hart. Legit SG size, you good.
23. Kuzma. Extremely agile, 4-5 on 3s at combine scrimmage. Decent handle
24. Ferguson. 185lbs?
25. Jackson - one year of solid shooting, which disappeared in Tourney with ratcheted up defense. Measurables aint abv average or anything
26. Bryant - if the feet weren't legit slower than Okafor, lotto pick. Issue is improving though
27. Jeanne - 205lbs. Can't shake it
28. Anigbogu - Tristan Thompson ceiling, may be underrating him.
29. Allen - big hands, will be a good finisher/rim protector
30. Bacon/Evans/White/OG
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2017 5:59 am    Post subject:

Can we comment on big boards in this thread, too?
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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Can we comment on big boards in this thread, too?


Yeah. Just no quotes including the big board. Just reference the poster.
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Top 3 Pick: Fultz, Ball, Tatum
LAL ended w 3 of 4 guys of my '17 Draft list.

My summer league spirit player is Brady Heslip.

https://hoop-math.com/
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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2017 1:34 pm    Post subject:

Big Board

Markelle Fultz - Self made player with growth spurt. PG skills in a near SG body. 8/10 athlete.
Lonzo Ball - Decade level passer. 7/10th athlete. SG archetype but toying with the idea of him as a point forward. No more POA issues on O or speed/athl issues on defense. NBA 3pt. range.
Jayson Tatum - Skills for days. Work ethic. NCAA #s compare with Joe Johnson/Paul Pierce/Gordon Hayward. 99th percentile Iso NCAA. 1/3rd shots at rim for 62% at rim. Adequate playmaker. Adequate defender
Josh Jackson - Super role player, arguably franchise. Triple threat player with SF measurables and SG twitch. Emotional player on the court. Highly competitive.
DSJ - Steve Francis. Questions about internal motivation/ "dawg in the fight". Still healing from injuries but showed shiftiness with speed. Loves contested shots. Ball stopper. Great finisher in the paint that should translate to the NBA.

Malik Monk - I believe in his shooting so much. Even if that's his only NBA skill, he's such an elite multilevel shooter that the rest of the game may not matter. SG skills in a PG frame, but shows PG twitch (Josh Jackson-like) and a baseline for ball-handling and passing.
Jonathan Isaac - Love his skills as a role player. Smooth athlete, but elite NBA measureables at PF. Not really twitchy with quickness, but bounce at the rim due to his light frame. Rudimentary ball-handling. Jab steps. Multi-positional defender 1-4 at a high level. Needs conditioning. Needs strength. Super Robert Horry.
Lauri Markkanen - Perhaps controversial possibly over Jonathan Isaac, but has the more NBA ready body and will be able to shoot from day 1. Difficult to contest his shots; quick release with elite height. Like Monk, needs to show other things on the floor to become a future starter. Unlike Monk, not quite the high level athlete/diversified shooter by playtype. Worst case Channing Frye is still a legit role player on a championship team, and I think he has more offensive upside. Potential high post/horns/pick and pop killer.
Zach Collins - Perfect C archetype capable of post play, pick and pop, pick and roll, 3pt. range, passer, straight line drives. Good touch. Surprising verticality and swatting ability despite being a bit light at C. Just foul prone.
Luke Kennard - Overrating him a bit but stud PnR player that can play off-ball as well. Just a legit combo guard that excels at both positions. Can't play defense. Short wingspan. Right handed guy that plays left. Dead eye shooter. I just see Goran Dragic.

Donovan Mitchell - A SF in a SG/PG body. Elite floor athlete with reaction time, lateral movement, strength. Good speed. Good vert. One of the best defenders in the draft. Straight line driver. Developing 3pt shot but caught fire midseason for Louisville. Avery Bradley.
De'Aaron Fox - 9/10 athlete, SG skills in a PG frame, but without the shooting. Motor on defense should make him a neutral defender at the NBA level. Lightweight. Will live on points in the paint unless passing game steps up a level or two. Tony Parker upside/trajectory. Interviews/work ethic did win me over.
OG Anunoby - Floor is Ruben Patterson. Has a chance to be a 3pt. threat while turning into an elite defensive player in the draft. Motor. Base. Wingspan. Instincts. Love the idea of playing him at PF defensively. He's that strong a defender.
Frank Ntilikina - Upside pick, based on size, not athleticism. Efficient #s in Euroball, but clearly dominated with size 6'6", 7' WS. Average ball-handling. Spot up shooter. Project guard for a role playing position.
Justin Patton - Showed Anthony Davis things on offense. Not the same defender or rebounder but still has tremendous length, some bounce. Needs to add strength. Late bloomer. Late growth spurt; guard skills translated with size.

Bias picks:

16-20
Ike Anigbogu - Just really love Anigbogu's age, motor, physical tools, and defensive intensity. Signs of a jumpshot during workouts out to corner 3pt. range. Knows nothing about passing. Mitts for hands. But, PnR C with signs of range and defensive ability/some PnR containment? Isn't that what we all want?
Derrick White - Late blooming PG that isn't a great athlete, but is equally effective on/off ball. Makes good PG decisions. Love his shot selection. Wish he had great motor. Solid measurements. Crafty driver. Jumpshot sets up drive game.
Jawun Evans - Going against my gut feeling. Elite PnR PG and led the #1 offense at the NCAA level without UCLA's talent. 55% finisher.
Justin Jackson - 3 and D guy. I just keep seeing him with Klay Thompson's shots in an offense and looking real good. Quick release. Pretty long arms. Some defensive ability.
Josh Hart - Proven SG/PG. I should have him higher. Mostly a straight line driver but makes up for it with some footwork, strong upper body/gather. + shooter. + defender. VERY underrated passer. Great job within Villanova's system.

21-25
Isaiah Hartenstein - Not the passer that Jokic is, but similar triple threat skills at PF/C. Needs to get stronger to play C. Read about flags w intangibles.
Tony Bradley - Bit of a project C. 7'5" wingspan. Duncan-like athleticism. Big fan of his rebounding/defensive ability. Weird thing to scout, but does great "shoulder and above things"; rebounds at peak height of basketball, keeps the ball up on finishes, controlled finishes around the hoop, legit rebounder on both ends of the floor, touch. 59:43
LFR Ep23
Harry Giles - Heard Jonathan Givony talk about how he's getting explosiveness back. Great for a 2-way contract player. Project.
TJ Leaf - Triple threat PF. Ridiculous 64% 2point, 46% 3pt on low attempts. Can rebound at NBA level. Cannot defend PnR or Iso or switch. Perfect PF that gets transition play and adds passing element/straight line drive within a halfcourt offense. Easy to plug into any offense. Underrated attacking closeouts with pull up jumper. Old school game.
Bam Adebayo - Shows SF skills but with some explosiveness and ability to play C. Like Anigbogu, showed perimeter touch from midrange to 3-point line. Comfortable as a straight line shooter. Underrated defender, solid PnR containment. Wants to play 4/3, but needs to be a 5/4.

26-30
Jordan Bell - One of the best defenders in the draft. Possible he's a Top 50 NBA defender from the get go. Handles all positions, situations well. Lacks midrange shot, but shot 70%FT. Just 20lbs. heavier than Jayson Tatum, but similar in height/length/standing reach. ELITE ELITE floor athleticism/reaction time.
Semi Ojeleye - Elite PnP shooter. Role player. 4-2 switchability on defense. Elite post base, handled Cs at the NCAA level. Like Bell, ELITE floor athleticism and translates to NBA floor. 3 and D PF. 8'6" standing reach based on not being able to put his arms straight up. Hulk strength. Walls up well against post players. Work ethic. Background.
Thomas Bryant - Close measurements ot Jonathan Jeanne, except more physical, VERY young (end of 19YO end of soph year), signs of 3pt. range, 9'4" standing reach, signs of more nimble feet during Pre-Draft workouts, motor. Not an explosive center. Think he only jumps 20" to 24" from a standstill defensively, but I think he can work on it. Basically have to think about building his leg strength/twitch just like Bynum. Needs to run the dunes of the LA beaches.
Tyler Lydon - 3 and D PF without as much D, but unusually bouncy at PF when attacking rim and rebounding.
DJ Wilson - Don't have a strong feel for his game because he's SUCH a late bloomer and only had one strong month. But still, fits the PF unicorn archetype. Worst case Jason Smith.

30-35
Frank Mason Jr. - Just an underrated player. Equally good on and off ball. Strength to handle some contact at the rim. Underrated pull up shooter and spot up shooter. Floor general. Knows his role.
Caleb Swanigan - I don't care if he's slow. If he's available for cheap, you draft him. Dude was out of shape as a youngster, and turned himself into hulk strength/base while displaying some solid post moves, but more importantly, the elite rebounding and 3-point shooting on fair volume will absolutely translate. Built motor from all of that muscle. Not everyone can have a C with pick and pop ability and space the floor on O.
Cam Oliver - The high risk pick. Question marks about body language and attitude. Lottery talent. Face up PF. 225lbs., but legit PF strength. Like Thaddeus Young except more explosive. Lacks basketball feel.
Monte Morris - Efficient PG. Doesn't make mistakes. Good height, subaverage WS. Like Mason, can play on and off ball. Best case, mistake-free/IQ version of Jordan Clarkson.
Sindarius Thornwell - Age. 3 and D SG that played PF. Shocking rebounder, great NBA size. Has NBA translatable skills, but can't take advantage of mismatches like he used to. 3-point shot, rebounding, defense NEED to translate. Can't just be a hot month.

35-40
Sterling Brown - Basically 3 and D SF. Average athlete. Subaverage finisher. Chiseled 6'6" 230. Elite shooting percentages for SMU; basically he's Iwundu a notch down on athleticism but a big plus on shooting.
Wesley Iwundu - Point forward. Can run PnR. Had to reconstruct shot, but still hopeful. 7' wingspan.
Damyean Dotson - Here's my Khris Middleton pick of the year. Hits shots, contested or not. Solid size at SG.
Jake Wiley - Wiry, great athlete. Big numbers, weak competition.
Aleksandar Vezenkov - When the Lakers need to stretch the floor on offense with IQ, post base, and dead eye quick release shooting. Some ability to attack close outs.

Star Wars - Because 6'6" PGs with 7' wingspans and some ball-handling ability are still super rare.
_________________
Resident Car Nut.
Top 3 Pick: Fultz, Ball, Tatum
LAL ended w 3 of 4 guys of my '17 Draft list.

My summer league spirit player is Brady Heslip.

https://hoop-math.com/


Last edited by Mike@LG on Wed May 31, 2017 7:45 pm; edited 21 times in total
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44TheLogo
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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 9:33 am    Post subject:

in progress, will edit with commentary over time.

1. Markelle Fultz. Complete package offensively: +skills, +athleticism, +measurables. Only issues are finishing at the rim against contests and a very slow gather on catch and shoot. VERY slow. Questions for me are competitive drive on defense – how much of it was scheme (soft 2-3 by Romar) and how much of it is innate?

2. Lonzo Ball. Special player in terms of unselfishness, IQ, and speed of recognition/processing. Makes decisions with passes faster than most. +athleticism, +shooting range. Questions are related mostly to specific mechanical issues with his leftside, low shot pocket, his lack of lateral shake and very basic handle.

3. Malik Monk. Elite shooter. Elite off ball movement. Plus athleticism. Flashes of potential as secondary pnr ballhandler. Only issue is size for position, but willing and competent defender, especially at the 1. CJ McCollum?

4. Zach Collins. To me, one of the most underrated prospects by virtue of limited minutes behind All American Karnowski, as well as (imo) racial biases against white American Centers (e.g., questions about length/physicality yet measured 9'3 standing reach and has elite rebound numbers). Mobile, skilled, with solid measurables and what I think are the best advanced stats in the class. Imagine Myles Turner here. Would not surprise me if Collins ends up one of the 3 or 4 most effective player in the class in 5 years.

https://twitter.com/T1m_NBA/status/867820380915892225/photo/1

https://twitter.com/collegebb_ref/status/863539437237612544

https://fansided.com/2017/05/19/nylon-calculus-projecting-3-point-shooting-2017-nba-draft-prospects/

https://twitter.com/colezwicker/status/867823654632947716

impressive workout and interview with DX imo as well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_Vhi8nAeUQ


5. Donovan Mitchell. Defensive upside at the wing with developing offensive skills. Capable shooter. Incredible measurables. One of the very few prospects in this draft with the possibility of becoming a true two way player. We all wonder what Damian Lillard would be if he were bigger and played better defense...Donovan Mitchell has that kind of talent

6. Jayson Tatum. Skilled offensively out of triple threat. Overrated athleticism. Unfortunate for Tatum, scoring out of the triple threat is no longer efficient in the modern NBA. Not a fan, but will score 20 a game for a bad team. Would be a valuable offensive option off the bench for a good team.

7. Dennis Smith Jr. Three level offensive threat. Terrible defense. Completely disengaged on that end of the floor. One way player. Questionable motor/drive...how much was NC State dysfunction, how much was him?

8. Josh Jackson. Best motor in the class. Can count on his competitive edge and activity to translate, as well as his underrated passing. Overrated defensive versatility - will only be able to defend 2s and 3s. Slight frame means he can't defend 4s or 5s, lack of lateral agility means he can't defend 1s. Relentless rebounder but low skilled. Budget Gerald Wallace.

9. Lauri Markkanen. We know what he will be – pick and pop sniper. What position does he defend? The answer to that will make a big difference as to his effectiveness. Can he rebound enough to punish teams going small against him? Truly a difficult prospect to get a handle on – so uniquely elite a combination of size and shooting, but with such obvious flaws defensively and on the glass. Can he be played for extended minutes and give enough on offense without giving too much up in those two areas?

10. Jonah Bolden. I know, I know. 6’10 7’4 WS. 40% 3pt in ABA. Mobile defender in PnR switches. Swats, rebounds, ballhandling, passing, shooting stroke out to 30’. Exited UCLA in unfavorable conditions, but excelling in professional play in Europe. Big time prospect at 4/5. Does not project well if he insists on playing 3/4.

11. Luke Kennard. Elite shooter, good decision maker as PnR ballhandler, creative finisher with both hands. Compared to JJ Redick but much better playmaker than JJ, though not as crisp moving without the ball. Competes on defense but poor measurables limit effectiveness on that end. Legit combo guard.

12. Jonathan Isaac. 3+D role player in a draft with very few players who project well into this valuable archetype at the next level. May end up much better than this if he makes serious leaps on the offensive end, but unlikely.

13. Frank Ntilikina. Another 3+D role player at the combo guard spot rather than the 3. Limited athleticism, limited ballhandling, but excellent measurable. 50/50 on being a bigger Avery Bradley or another Dante Exum.

14. TJ Leaf. Size and skill combination very attractive. A bit thin so concerned about ability to hold up at the 4 defensively. Will have a long career, but limited upside.

15. De’Aaron Fox. Elite straight line speed. Solid from midrange and in. But what else does he have? Extreme lightweight who needs to bulk up nearly 20 pounds of muscle before he can compete with NBA players. Shooting problems stem from this lack of strength as well – can’t extend his range easily without putting significant time into the weight room, so struggled with move from hs to college 3pt line. FT% fine because strength not an issue there. Will struggle even more from college to NBA 3pt line. Will take a lot of time but will be a late career bloomer once body fills out. Would not want him on my team under rookie contract, but would want to sign him afterwards when he is 26-28 years old.

16. Bam Adebayo. Measurables, skills, potential potential. Is he willing to play a role at the 4/5 and defend and rebound, because he could be elite at that, or does he insist on playing as a 3/4 to try and show off his skills? In other words, will he learn from TRob and embrace being a role player at the next level or will he want to prove himself a star.

17. Jawun Evans. Elite shot creator, especially out of pick and roll. Gets to the rim with ease, but struggles finishing once there. Sparkplug off the bench type, to “unstick” offense if struggling. Very high ceiling but also pretty low floor.

my scouting report-
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Zp8nixF0KMiNVXRj0gym4HuqAOHSJ5iWuzFlkRUcoi4/pub

18. Justin Patton.

19. OG Anunoby. Potential to be a defensive beast, but what is the offensive upside here? Andre Roberson-like. One way player.

20. Jordan Bell. True defensive versatility. Legitimately can defend 1-5 while providing rim protection and solid rebounding. Offensive deficiencies lower his stock a bit - low skill level in terms of handling and shooting. could be decent screen setter but not much of a threat on that end. Defensive role player.

21. Isaiah Hartenstein. Potential, potential, potential. Has work to do on mechanics (side rotation on his 3 ball, hunches his back often causing him to shrink and not utilize his size advantages) but has legit unicorn potential as two way versatile 7

22. Justin Jackson

23. Monte Morris

24. Kyle Kuzma

25. Caleb Swanigan

26. Thomas Bryant

27. Sindarius Thornwell

28. Sterling Brown

Do not like:
Ivan Rabb
Jarrett Allen
John Collins
Terrance Ferguson
Jonathan Jeanne
DJ Wilson
Tyler Lydon
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ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 1:24 pm    Post subject:

Posting this from the Draft thread in the Lounge. I don't actually have them in my preferred order, but here it is...

Fultz--deservedly the top prospect because he simultaneously has the highest floor in the draft combined with a ceiling as high as anyone. poor FT shooting is my biggest concern.
Ball--such an odd player (low usage rate) that I believe he has the highest potential range of outcomes of any of the prospects in tier 2 (Fultz is in his own tier IMO). if he is a 40% 3-point shooter, chance to be a star. if he's a 35% 3-point shooter and can't do much in the halfcourt and the pick-and-roll, he could be a bust.
Josh Jackson--highest ceiling of anyone in tier 2 and even as high as Fultz's IMO; if the perimeter shot is decent, he's a star. dude is everywhere on defense and is a very willing passer on offense. doesn't have tunnel vision, which Laker fans should know quite well with JC and Randle on the team.
Tatum--his potential as a triple threat scorer is intriguing. his outstanding FT % gives me hope that he could be a nice 3-point shooter as well. concerned about athleticism at the 3, and only 200 lbs. if playing the 4. oh, and figures to be a below-average defender.
Fox--the most overrated player in Tier 2 IMO. His shooting from the perimeter is just insanely bad, and his athleticism, while good, is overhyped. He's no John Wall, and he's also much smaller in terms of body type. his NCAA Tourney is really going to make him a lot of money, and I still think his Kentucky backcourt mate is better than he is. If he ends up better than Dennis Schroder, I'll be mildly surprised.
Isaac--while his height, wingspan, potential as a two-way player, shooting form, and FT % are major things to get excited about, he also feels like the biggest project in the top 10.
Monk--if you want shooting from a guard, here's your guy. dude has a great stroke and can really fill it up, and has a strong FT % which I like. And he isn't just a mad bomber; he can score from different areas. May have more of a handle and playmaking potential than it appears, as Fox did most of the ball-handling at Kentucky. At worst, I think you have JR Smith here, so I like his floor and think he has potential for more.
Markannen--if you want shooting from your 7 footer, here's your guy. This guy just looks pure when he's shooting it from deep, and I think he can do more than just shoot it from 3. Good footwork for a big man. Of course, the D will be terrible, but a potentially better version of Ryan Anderson in today's NBA is highly valuable.
Dennis Smith Jr.--if he ends up better than Ball and Fox, it wouldn't surprise me in the least. He seemed to perk up in his team's bigger games, and I think there's a reasonable chance that he regains even more explosiveness with another year removed from the ACL injury. he can shoot it and he can get to the rack. Fox hasn't shown that he can do much of the former, while Ball hasn't shown that he can do much of the latter.
Zach Collins--I realize that he was statistically awesome this season and had a great NCAA Tournament, but I'm nonetheless a bit skeptical. Gonzaga's competition for most of the season is genuinely a joke, and he wasn't exactly playing heavy minutes. That said, it's not like Towns was playing heavy minutes at Kentucky, either, and he does have a lot of skill. I just feel like I've seen this movie before. Maybe this is recency bias on Gonzaga players in the pros lately.

I'm not as familiar with some of the rest of the guys that are going to get drafted, so I think it would be foolish to comment on guys I just haven't seen that much. (At some point between now and the draft I will try to watch tape of virtually everyone in the top 60 or so.) Nonetheless, I do have thoughts on some of them...

Justin Jackson
--I'm only going off my own personal eye test here, but he feels like a guy that would be termed a AAAA baseball player. In other words, great at AAA, but not quite good enough to make it in the majors. Jackson just looks to me like a really good college player who might struggle in the NBA.
Anigbogu--when UCLA fans were even debating if he should declare or not, I was saying that I thought he was a shoo-in first rounder. Now he's being mocked just outside the lottery. His defense is going to be legit in the NBA, with a much higher defensive upside than a guy like Adebayo. If he combines any offensive skill to go with it, he has a ton of upside.
Kennard--won't be much of a defender, but I love his offensive game. he's probably my 2nd-favorite perimeter shooter in this whole class, behind just Monk. and he can get into the paint, too. great FT %. I think it's 50/50 that he has a better career than Tatum.
DJ Wilson--intrigued by his potential as a stretch 4, but the more I think about it, he hardly gets to the FT line (and he's a great FT shooter), and while I like his form and his shot, 37% from 3-point range in college isn't exactly outstanding. he also wasn't close to as good as a freshman, and he's only 4 days younger than Dlo.
Bolden--I've talked about him a lot, but I'll just compare him here to Wilson and say that he's about a month older and, like Wilson, didn't show much in his freshman season of college. But he showed more on tape last season than Wilson did, and Bolden was playing against much better competition. Absolutely believe he's a lottery talent.
Leaf--he's going to be as soft as Charmin as an NBA defender, but he's very skilled offensively, and if we drafted Ball, his value to us would only go up IMO. For that reason, if he's there at 28, we have to strongly consider it.
Rabb--Please God, no. Seriously, I've seen him play multiple times and nothing stood out to me. A hard pass for me.
Jawun Evans--the Julius Randle of point guards when he gets to the rim, but he is a pretty good shooter otherwise, and a nice perk is that his style of play does lend itself to getting to the FT line, and he was over 80% with his free throws in both of his college seasons. Could be a sparkplug of a backup PG. Starting to grow on me a bit.
Adebayo--Dude has an NBA body right now, and is it possible that he's another Kentucky player who actually has more skills than were able to be shown in Calipari's system? Workouts could really move him up.
Bell--who doesn't want a Swiss Army knife of a defender? Like Josh Jackson, he just seems to be everywhere on D when I've seen him.
Ojeleye--Wow. I just watched some tape of him, and if any of you have seen that play "Oliver!", all I can say is...please sir, can I have some more? He can shoot from 3, he can score in the mid-range, he looks good in the pick-and-roll, and he's built like a freaking tank. I'm going to have to change my sig and add him to my favorites for the #28.
Swanigan--I still think he'll have a nice NBA career, at least as a backup big. Has a good feel for putting the ball in the hoop and has a good touch from mid-range. (I think his 45% 3-point shooting last year shows that he is very comfortable from 18-20 feet, but I don't know that he will be pushing that range out to 23 feet in the NBA.) Good wingspan for his 6'9 height, even though he's certainly going to be slow laterally. Should gobble up rebounds. I'm not sure if this is apt or not, but he strikes me as a much better version of DeJuan Blair when he was on the Spurs.
Hart--this year's Brogdon? If we did trade Clarkson, I like the idea of picking up a savvy, experienced college guard in the draft. Heck, even if we don't trade JC, I wouldn't mind getting Hart.
Bacon--He strikes me as a guard version of Mo Speights--a chucker--and I am just not a fan of those types of players. He has skills and can score, but I'd pass.
Thornwell--I can see him being a nice 2nd unit player in the NBA. As Mike has pointed out, you can't overrate him as a college senior playing the 4 against younger defenders--he'll be a 3 in the NBA, maybe even a 2--but he is a good shooter, and he won't be afraid to get near the rim. A tough, heady kid. I know his NCAA Tourney run helped him gain an audience, but I have a good feeling with him.
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droopdog7
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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 9:07 pm    Post subject:

Some really nice analyses here. I haven't done a whole lot research so I'll just go top few and add later.

Fultz - what else can you say. At worse he projects to be a very good NBA player. At best he's a multiple time all star. Outstanding offensive polish that tailor made for the NBA. His physical dimensions are among the best ever for a lead guard.

Jackson - I've gone back and forth between jackson and Tatum at #2. Ultimately I'm going with jackson because of his athleticism and tenacity on both ends. The team that drafts him won't have to worry about fitting him in because he's a Swiss army nice. Great moving without the ball and an underrated passer. Fierce. Downside is that jump shot and he's not an ISO scorer.

Tatum - perhaps the best array or skills on the offensive end. Needs to tighten up his three ball but has everything else. NBA ready in that sense. Downside is his limited athleticism. Defense will be a question mark and can be a bit of a black hole.

Ball - I think Ball is a boom or bust prospect. He has vision but the lack of sophistication as a scorer would have me really conderned. That said, great vision and team mentality. Can't discount what he did girls ucla.

Dennis smith jr - the NBA draft goes to boom or bust fairly quickly. At this point, I'm looking for traits and I think DSJ has them. Plus athlete that I think will be able to get to the basket in the NBA. Shot could use some work but not broken.

Monk - I see jr smith frankly but jr has been in the league for a number of years so there's that. Very good shooter that is a bit of a one trick pony. If he can develop a little as a lead guard his stock rises in my eye.
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daygoboy6191
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 8:59 pm    Post subject:

Funny how everyone thinks Tatum will be a 20 PT scorer, and I think he has the ability to be a good defender but nobody will consider him at 2.

IMO he is the 2nd best player when it comes to ability, work ethic, and no off-the field problems/ distractions.
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droopdog7
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 06, 2017 6:00 pm    Post subject:

daygoboy6191 wrote:
Funny how everyone thinks Tatum will be a 20 PT scorer, and I think he has the ability to be a good defender but nobody will consider him at 2.

IMO he is the 2nd best player when it comes to ability, work ethic, and no off-the field problems/ distractions.
I'd consider him at #2. I just would pick jackson. My biggest concerns for Tatum is that he can be a ball stopper and has no more than average potential as a defender. It's close especially if you factor in his age. Jackson is more plug and play and will fit into any situation and do what is needed.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2017 1:30 pm    Post subject:

Top 3 Pick: Fultz, Ball, Tatum
#28
TJ Leaf
Josh Hart
Bam Adebayo
Tony Bradley
Thomas Bryant
Derrick White
Semi Ojeleye
Jordan Bell
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Top 3 Pick: Fultz, Ball, Tatum
LAL ended w 3 of 4 guys of my '17 Draft list.

My summer league spirit player is Brady Heslip.

https://hoop-math.com/
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ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:31 am    Post subject:

Thought I would bump this thread again, with a take on Zach Collins. I think that my skepticism was warranted...

https://www.blazersedge.com/2017/7/17/15977214/nba-summer-league-zach-collins-trail-blazers-gonzaga-pelton-espn
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 12:44 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Thought I would bump this thread again, with a take on Zach Collins. I think that my skepticism was warranted...

https://www.blazersedge.com/2017/7/17/15977214/nba-summer-league-zach-collins-trail-blazers-gonzaga-pelton-espn


Expected him to be a project player. Came off the bench last year for Gonzaga. Played behind more highly touted centers as he ascended with his talent.

I trust he'll get there.
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Top 3 Pick: Fultz, Ball, Tatum
LAL ended w 3 of 4 guys of my '17 Draft list.

My summer league spirit player is Brady Heslip.

https://hoop-math.com/
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:24 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Thought I would bump this thread again, with a take on Zach Collins. I think that my skepticism was warranted...

https://www.blazersedge.com/2017/7/17/15977214/nba-summer-league-zach-collins-trail-blazers-gonzaga-pelton-espn


Expected him to be a project player. Came off the bench last year for Gonzaga. Played behind more highly touted centers as he ascended with his talent.

I trust he'll get there.


I have less faith than you do.
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ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:52 am    Post subject:

My 2017 NBA Draft Big Board, Top 7 edition:

1. Ball (His passing and rebounding are so good that he will be a triple-double threat in his rookie year. Likely to lead Lakers to Summer League title.)
2. Fultz (skillful and talented, just needs to avoid the injury bug)
3. Tatum (midrange maestro with fantastic footwork and will miss nary a free throw)
4. DSJ (underrated athleticism, will be a highlight-reel dunker, and can shoot it. character concerns way overblown.)
5. Mitchell (athletic, skilled, poised two-way player is going to be a steal; will make behind-the-back-while-falling-out-of-bounds passes with ease)
6. Josh Jackson (heralded two-way Kansas freshman may get overshadowed a bit coming out of the gate)
7. Kuzma (will be the steal of the draft, as he will be a much better pro than he was a collegian. shot form reminiscent of Robert Horry. two-way player.)


Thank you for taking the time to read my Top 7 Big Board. I trust that it will be completely accurate.

Sincerely,
Chad Ford
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mirak
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:28 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
My 2017 NBA Draft Big Board, Top 7 edition:

1. Ball (His passing and rebounding are so good that he will be a triple-double threat in his rookie year. Likely to lead Lakers to Summer League title.)
2. Fultz (skillful and talented, just needs to avoid the injury bug)
3. Tatum (midrange maestro with fantastic footwork and will miss nary a free throw)
4. DSJ (underrated athleticism, will be a highlight-reel dunker, and can shoot it. character concerns way overblown.)
5. Mitchell (athletic, skilled, poised two-way player is going to be a steal; will make behind-the-back-while-falling-out-of-bounds passes with ease)
6. Josh Jackson (heralded two-way Kansas freshman may get overshadowed a bit coming out of the gate)
7. Kuzma (will be the steal of the draft, as he will be a much better pro than he was a collegian. shot form reminiscent of Robert Horry. two-way player.)


Thank you for taking the time to read my Top 7 Big Board. I trust that it will be completely accurate.

Sincerely,
Chad Ford


Nice.
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:45 pm    Post subject:

Stu
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:50 am    Post subject:

My very late addition, which is obviously cheating given that it's come after the draft, Summer League, and a few preseason performances, but I did want to record my thoughts on what looks to be a very deep draft before the real games started. I'm going off of an old pre-draft lottery board I had saved, while trying to project the back half of the draft from my pre-draft analyses so that I'm not retroactively dropping Anigbogu for injury concern or putting Kyle Kuzma down as a top-10 pick (he's already a clear miss on my board since I had him just outside the 1st round).

With those caveat out of the way, I look forward to revisiting this with the LG draftniks in 2022 and 2027:

1. Markelle Fultz
2. Lonzo Ball
3. Malik Monk - rare combination of shooting and explosiveness, Monk is going to score in bunches throughout his career. I think there's a not insignificant chance he develops into a primary initiator/scoring lead guard who can kill teams off the high PnR.
4. Dennis Smith, Jr.
5. Josh Jackson
6. Zach Collins - unicorn big potential, but doesn't have the star upside of KAT or Embiid.
7. Jonathan Isaac - maybe too high for a non-creator in this lottery, but I think he has special defensive upside.
8. Donovan Mitchell
9. Jayson Tatum
10. Lauri Markkanen
11. De'Aaron Fox
12. Luke Kennard
13. Justin Patton
14. Frank Ntilikina
15. O.G. Anunoby
16. Jonah Bolden
17. Jarrett Allen
18. Jawun Evans
19. T.J. Leaf
20. Bam Adebayo
21. John Collins
22. Ike Anigbogu
23. Terrance Ferguson
24. Justin Jackson
25. A.Pasecniks
26. D.J. Wilson
27. Derrick White
28. Tony Bradley
29. Josh Hart
30. Caleb Swanigan
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