Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:27 am Post subject:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
I think it's possible that you guys/draft experts are overthinking Bamba.
definitely on the "guys" side, but I recognize that Bamba definitely has the potential @ 6'11 1/2ish" and a 7'9"ish wingspan to be a defensive monster some day.....his ceiling is high, but I just do not think it is as "automatic" as some draft analysts.
Last edited by adkindo on Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:28 am; edited 1 time in total
I think it's possible that you guys/draft experts are overthinking Bamba. Does he not have a pretty linear path to becoming a more skilled Gobert? It will just take time...like an Ingram prospect. Hell, Deandre Jordan took 5 years to become good on defense...
So he doesn't have his in-game jumper working to shoot a good% yet, at 18 - that's common for a bigman, even one's who become good shooters
Athletically he's really impressive IMO, has more twitch than Porzingis, his double jump is super quick. Haven't seen him slide on defense but he appears to be agile enough to be a good prospect in that facet
Bamba is ahead of Gobert's curve already. I liked Gobert in that draft class because I thought that he was a rare guy that actually retained the athleticism along with elite height/WS measurements. Bamba is mostly there. Only has a step of lateral on the perimeter, but is so long w recovery, he's able to get away with it at the NCAA level. Not sure about NBA.
Bamba is a work on progress on offense. I think he makes weird decisions on the floor with his shot selection and how/when he choose to attack a defense. Personally, I think he has a higher upside than Ayton. Both guys have on/off motors (it's so weird w bigs sometimes). Ayton just has an Embiid-level of quad-threat skills w 2-dribble drive, read a defense and kick out, shooting from mid with hints of 3, and post game. Moves his feet on perimeter. But the point of a C is to have a defensive anchor. I don't recall a lot of charge calls or high swat numbers.
Bamba right now is WAY ahead of where DeAndre Jordan was as a senior at Texas A&M. Not great ORtg (not even 110), but DRtg of 77 is pretty absurd, along with the 5.7bpg per 40, [b]16.2%[.b] block rate.
Sidenote: I think a lot of draft guys have been putting very heavy emphasis on current skill level by age and hoop IQ, but a lot less in terms of projecting what a peak player comparison would look like.
I can't even find my old LakeShowLife articles projecting a prime Randle as a Kings version of Webber with high post/face up game and ability to switch.
Thanks. I knew he wasn't far ahead of those guys by age, but I didn't look at his numbers, didn't know he was already elite elite elite with the blocks.
His body is also far ahead of Gobert's by age. He's 225lbs now and he looks it to my eye, he's skinny but has muscle. I know for a fact he will fill out, while someone like Ingram looks like he just can't put muscle on.
It's probably going to be tough for him to find his barrings offensively in terms of decision making --- the lack of spacing in college makes bad shots/ISOs look so clunky and hesitant even. A big man who doesn't know if he can shoot, should shoot or post. Ya I don't expect it to look smooth at his age. But years two in the pro's if his midrange jumper is solid, we could see a breakout like Ingram.
This kid also brings the ball up the court sometimes, he's a "basketball player" ya know, he's got that cliche working for him - he's got skill upside, with slashing and shooting
I think it's possible that you guys/draft experts are overthinking Bamba.
definitely on the "guys" side, but I recognize that Bamba definitely has the potential @ 6'11 1/2ish" and a 7'9"ish wingspan to be a defensive monster some day.....his ceiling is high, but I just do not think it is as "automatic" as some draft analysts.
I think the defensive monster part is automatic.. by age he's amazing defensively.
I think a midrange jumper is likely. Triple threat high post game - solid chance , he did some crossovers in HS and brings the ball up sometimes with Texas - I look at that to just mean that he's a "basketball player" and could cultivate skills one day. Far from a stiff. Hard to imagine him just being a Gobert offensively (although, not stepping out of that role is most fruitful for that archetype usually)
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:56 am Post subject:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
A pointlessly early mock draft (lottery order based on a roll of the Tankathon simulator):
1. CHI - Luka Doncic
2. ATL - DeAndre Ayton
3. SAC - Michael Porter, Jr. (assuming he's 100% healthy for workouts)
4. DAL - Marvin Bagley
5. MEM - Miles Bridges (assuming Memphis doesn't blow it up)
6. PHX - Mo Bamba
7. CHA - Jaren Jackson
8. LAC - Trae Young
9. ORL - Collin Sexton
10. CLE (via BKN) - Wendell Carter (assuming Lebron doesn't bolt)
11. PHI (via LAL) - Mikal Bridges
12. NYK - Kevin Knox
13. PHX (via MIA) - Trevon Duval
14. OKC - Robert Williams (assuming PG13 doesn't bolt)
15. UTA - Killian Tillie
16. NOP - Lonnie Walker (with or without Boogie)
17. POR - Bruce Brown
18. PHI - Anfernee Simons
19. DET - Hamidou Diallo
20. WAS - Mitchell Robinson
21. DEN - Rodions Kurucs
22. ATL (via MIN) - De'Anthony Melton
23. IND - Troy Brown
24. MIL - Nick Richards
25. CLE - Allonzo Trier
26. SAS - Dzanan Musa (draft n' stash)
27. BKN (via TOR) - Rui Hachimura
28. GSW - Landry Shamet
29. BOS - Brandon McCoy
30. ATL (via HOU) - Arnoldas Kubolka (draft n' stash)
Tear my mock apart!
Curious.
Miles Bridges that high? Mikal, that low? I haven't bought into Miles playing 3 at the NBA level but I know MSU is experimenting with him doing some point forward things.
As for Mikal, I'd just have him top 10, over Carter and arguably Trae.
Were team needs taken into consideration? _________________ Resident Car Nut.
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:12 am Post subject:
Mike@LG wrote:
As for Mikal, I'd just have him top 10, over Carter and arguably Trae.
he is definitely showing that consistent growth and improvement this year....a lot of that potential and measurements have turned into on court production this year. He is one of the few "hot" guys last year that probably made the right decision in returning....his stock has definitely increased.
Interesting first round speculation but who or maybe more importantly which position/skill set are you looking for in the mid 40s where the Lakers next “steal of the draft” will be?
Backup scoring PG or best available 3pt shooter seems appropriate
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:25 am Post subject:
Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
Interesting first round speculation but who or maybe more importantly which position/skill set are you looking for in the mid 40s where the Lakers next “steal of the draft” will be?
Backup scoring PG or best available 3pt shooter seems appropriate
If he is available, Jevon Carter is the perfect pick for our team to be backup PG. Best perimeter defender in the country, solid play maker, great handles and can score at all three levels. Averaging over 19 PPG, 5 RPG, 6 APG and 4 Steals per game while shooting over 43% from 3 on 6 attempts per game....all in only 33 minutes a night. He brings everything to the table that a team would want from a backup PG.
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:25 am Post subject:
Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
Interesting first round speculation but who or maybe more importantly which position/skill set are you looking for in the mid 40s where the Lakers next “steal of the draft” will be?
Backup scoring PG or best available 3pt shooter seems appropriate
Not looking at any particular position/skill really, but with a big heavy draft class at the top, I expect 1-2 skill wings to drop to mid 2nd.
Joined: 25 Apr 2015 Posts: 31912 Location: Anaheim, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:13 pm Post subject:
adkindo wrote:
Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
Interesting first round speculation but who or maybe more importantly which position/skill set are you looking for in the mid 40s where the Lakers next “steal of the draft” will be?
Backup scoring PG or best available 3pt shooter seems appropriate
If he is available, Jevon Carter is the perfect pick for our team to be backup PG. Best perimeter defender in the country, solid play maker, great handles and can score at all three levels. Averaging over 19 PPG, 5 RPG, 6 APG and 4 Steals per game while shooting over 43% from 3 on 6 attempts per game....all in only 33 minutes a night. He brings everything to the table that a team would want from a backup PG.
And if we got him, we'd have two 22-year-old point guards in our organization that look like they are old enough to be NBA coaches instead of players, along with Alex Caruso.
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:36 pm Post subject:
ChickenStu wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
Interesting first round speculation but who or maybe more importantly which position/skill set are you looking for in the mid 40s where the Lakers next “steal of the draft” will be?
Backup scoring PG or best available 3pt shooter seems appropriate
If he is available, Jevon Carter is the perfect pick for our team to be backup PG. Best perimeter defender in the country, solid play maker, great handles and can score at all three levels. Averaging over 19 PPG, 5 RPG, 6 APG and 4 Steals per game while shooting over 43% from 3 on 6 attempts per game....all in only 33 minutes a night. He brings everything to the table that a team would want from a backup PG.
And if we got him, we'd have two 22-year-old point guards in our organization that look like they are old enough to be NBA coaches instead of players, along with Alex Caruso.
nah man...he went with the complete shaved head this season....makes him only look 28-30ish....he has been @ WVU or about 8 years....surprised nobody has caught on
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:54 pm Post subject:
Mike, have you saw any film on a kid named Jordan McCabe? He is a high school senior this year...ESPN 100 kid, high 4 Star prospect....and yes committed to WVU.
I just want to be early on the record, I think this kid take college basketball by storm next year....just because he is so damn fun to watch. I have never....never seen a 17 year old with handles like this kid. He is under 6' (5'10"ish...maybe gets to 5'11"?), so not sure if he becomes a pro prospect....but he is a dribbling and passing wizard. He likely starts for WVU next year in place of Carter.
There is tons of film out there on him...but check out the handles.
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:13 pm Post subject:
I think JP Macura is the guy right now. Showed signs of NBA range last year. Has some idea of passing. Straight line slasher. Lanky wing, not strong even with seasoning. Can get high/low demeanor very quickly.
Watched some Sexton last night along with a couple other top 10 prospects. Sexton is quicker than Fox although Fox may be faster when able to build speed and stride. Also saw flashes of a super elite handle. Jumper looks decent. Very good top 6 prospect
Bamba
Ayton
Doncic
Porter
---
Bagley
Sexton
Idk the order in the tiers but I think those tiers are clear to me
Not so high on Jackson.. he's solid.. But his archetype has been lackluster in the past 4 drafts.. If I covet PFs it's ones with SF skills, he doesn't have that. His 3ball looks decent/solid but that's not a sure enough thing and he doesn't have so much skill aside from that offensively right ? So he's in Bobby Portis' vein with more energy? Top 7 in this draft? No. No.
Have to watch more of Bridges at MSU. He, Knox, and Mikal Bridges are the next 3 I like
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:44 pm Post subject:
Jackson isn't the playmaker that the rest of those guys are. More like super role player, but that goes far in the NBA, especially w bigs that can pass and move the ball a bit without stalling an offense.
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:54 pm Post subject:
adkindo wrote:
Mike, have you saw any film on a kid named Jordan McCabe? He is a high school senior this year...ESPN 100 kid, high 4 Star prospect....and yes committed to WVU.
I just want to be early on the record, I think this kid take college basketball by storm next year....just because he is so damn fun to watch. I have never....never seen a 17 year old with handles like this kid. He is under 6' (5'10"ish...maybe gets to 5'11"?), so not sure if he becomes a pro prospect....but he is a dribbling and passing wizard. He likely starts for WVU next year in place of Carter.
There is tons of film out there on him...but check out the handles.
Saw a few clips. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
A pointlessly early mock draft (lottery order based on a roll of the Tankathon simulator):
1. CHI - Luka Doncic
2. ATL - DeAndre Ayton
3. SAC - Michael Porter, Jr. (assuming he's 100% healthy for workouts)
4. DAL - Marvin Bagley
5. MEM - Miles Bridges (assuming Memphis doesn't blow it up)
6. PHX - Mo Bamba
7. CHA - Jaren Jackson
8. LAC - Trae Young
9. ORL - Collin Sexton
10. CLE (via BKN) - Wendell Carter (assuming Lebron doesn't bolt)
11. PHI (via LAL) - Mikal Bridges
12. NYK - Kevin Knox
13. PHX (via MIA) - Trevon Duval
14. OKC - Robert Williams (assuming PG13 doesn't bolt)
15. UTA - Killian Tillie
16. NOP - Lonnie Walker (with or without Boogie)
17. POR - Bruce Brown
18. PHI - Anfernee Simons
19. DET - Hamidou Diallo
20. WAS - Mitchell Robinson
21. DEN - Rodions Kurucs
22. ATL (via MIN) - De'Anthony Melton
23. IND - Troy Brown
24. MIL - Nick Richards
25. CLE - Allonzo Trier
26. SAS - Dzanan Musa (draft n' stash)
27. BKN (via TOR) - Rui Hachimura
28. GSW - Landry Shamet
29. BOS - Brandon McCoy
30. ATL (via HOU) - Arnoldas Kubolka (draft n' stash)
Tear my mock apart!
IMO luka doncic, lonnie walker, mikal bridges, trae young, and marvin bagley will end up the top 5 whether they're consensus draft value top 5 or not and landry shamet should be lotto even if he's not valued there.
i'm not touching strict role players in the top 5 and mo bamba is strictly a role player. no star potential there. porter jr has to be a 4 in the pros and i don't like him there, tho he might be the tatum of this yr who i also didn't like.
i'm just not touching the bigs in the lottery this day and age. if you don't project to shoot nba 3s 35% or higher at volume, i'm not taking you on my team, period. that's why trevon duval isn't a lotto pick either.
i like walker and young a lot more than others because they already show easy NBA range as freshmen. _________________ substance over style
Ooh 44theLogy coming in spicey I like it
Les not forget how much our boards and opinions of players change over the course of a college season though, sir 444, you're writing that top 5 with a pencil
Ooh 44theLogy coming in spicey I like it
Les not forget how much our boards and opinions of players change over the course of a college season though, sir 444, you're writing that top 5 with a pencil
yea for sure i reserve the right to call myself an idiot in 5 months. _________________ substance over style
Ooh 44theLogy coming in spicey I like it
Les not forget how much our boards and opinions of players change over the course of a college season though, sir 444, you're writing that top 5 with a pencil
yea for sure i reserve the right to call myself an idiot in 5 months.
Correct guesses completely nullify the bad ones, cuz we're working with limited info - it's impressive to get anything right
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:18 pm Post subject:
44TheLogo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
A pointlessly early mock draft (lottery order based on a roll of the Tankathon simulator):
1. CHI - Luka Doncic
2. ATL - DeAndre Ayton
3. SAC - Michael Porter, Jr. (assuming he's 100% healthy for workouts)
4. DAL - Marvin Bagley
5. MEM - Miles Bridges (assuming Memphis doesn't blow it up)
6. PHX - Mo Bamba
7. CHA - Jaren Jackson
8. LAC - Trae Young
9. ORL - Collin Sexton
10. CLE (via BKN) - Wendell Carter (assuming Lebron doesn't bolt)
11. PHI (via LAL) - Mikal Bridges
12. NYK - Kevin Knox
13. PHX (via MIA) - Trevon Duval
14. OKC - Robert Williams (assuming PG13 doesn't bolt)
15. UTA - Killian Tillie
16. NOP - Lonnie Walker (with or without Boogie)
17. POR - Bruce Brown
18. PHI - Anfernee Simons
19. DET - Hamidou Diallo
20. WAS - Mitchell Robinson
21. DEN - Rodions Kurucs
22. ATL (via MIN) - De'Anthony Melton
23. IND - Troy Brown
24. MIL - Nick Richards
25. CLE - Allonzo Trier
26. SAS - Dzanan Musa (draft n' stash)
27. BKN (via TOR) - Rui Hachimura
28. GSW - Landry Shamet
29. BOS - Brandon McCoy
30. ATL (via HOU) - Arnoldas Kubolka (draft n' stash)
Tear my mock apart!
IMO luka doncic, lonnie walker, mikal bridges, trae young, and marvin bagley will end up the top 5 whether they're consensus draft value top 5 or not and landry shamet should be lotto even if he's not valued there.
i'm not touching strict role players in the top 5 and mo bamba is strictly a role player. no star potential there. porter jr has to be a 4 in the pros and i don't like him there, tho he might be the tatum of this yr who i also didn't like.
i'm just not touching the bigs in the lottery this day and age. if you don't project to shoot nba 3s 35% or higher at volume, i'm not taking you on my team, period. that's why trevon duval isn't a lotto pick either.
i like walker and young a lot more than others because they already show easy NBA range as freshmen.
I see Mikal Bridges as a strict role player. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
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