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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:23 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
There's a good chance he was alluding to game action/ overall positive mentality - when he said he's focusing on what he's does well
Again it's just hard to know because he doesn't articulate himself clearly


I don't think people appreciate how "on the fly" the answers that guys give are. In most cases they've just been working their asses off for a couple of hours, then they walk over and get voice recorders shoved in their faces without knowing what they're gonna be asked. I'd probably say a whole bunch of things that were articulated as well as I would want them to be if I was in the same situation. They get better at it because they do it all the time, but it's still tough.

Now that I'm in scrums, I put less weight on what players and coaches say in them. It's a tough environment.


1000% ya. Answers are on the fly and the effort to answer the exact question, or articulate yourself in depth - rarely there.


Right. And then we dissect everything that's said like a bunch of vultures.
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epak
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:24 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
There's a good chance he was alluding to game action/ overall positive mentality - when he said he's focusing on what he's does well
Again it's just hard to know because he doesn't articulate himself clearly


I don't think people appreciate how "on the fly" the answers that guys give are. In most cases they've just been working their asses off for a couple of hours, then they walk over and get voice recorders shoved in their faces without knowing what they're gonna be asked. I'd probably say a whole bunch of things that were articulated as well as I would want them to be if I was in the same situation. They get better at it because they do it all the time, but it's still tough.

Now that I'm in scrums, I put less weight on what players and coaches say in them. It's a tough environment.


1000% ya. Answers are on the fly and the effort to answer the exact question, or articulate yourself in depth - rarely there.


Right. And then we dissect everything that's said like a bunch of vultures.


False! It's buzzards!!! C'mon Fam!!!!!!
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:26 pm    Post subject:

SocalDevin wrote:
I'm not cuttin him any slack.. He meant what he said.

"Of course, there are some days where I’ll just go in and work on my jumper." He needs to work on that shet every time he's in the gym. That's not fatigue talking, that's him telling us what he works on.

“Right now, I’m mainly focused on doing the things I do well." Again I can't chalk that up as fatigue talking.. Thats him communicating a priority.

I defend him to no end, but that just doesn't make any sense. That thing that he says he's focused on, that he does so well, will become a non factor if he doesn't focus on improving his shooting.


I'm just speaking broadly based on the new experiences I've been able to have. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to them, I'm just saying that the very framework of it leads to people not articulating themselves as accurately as they would probably like.
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mookielala
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:37 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
I'm not cuttin him any slack.. He meant what he said.

"Of course, there are some days where I’ll just go in and work on my jumper." He needs to work on that shet every time he's in the gym. That's not fatigue talking, that's him telling us what he works on.

“Right now, I’m mainly focused on doing the things I do well." Again I can't chalk that up as fatigue talking.. Thats him communicating a priority.

I defend him to no end, but that just doesn't make any sense. That thing that he says he's focused on, that he does so well, will become a non factor if he doesn't focus on improving his shooting.


I'm just speaking broadly based on the new experiences I've been able to have. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to them, I'm just saying that the very framework of it leads to people not articulating themselves as accurately as they would probably like.


That sounds right. Also, it seems like the young guys generally are not so great at interviews.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:46 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
I'm not cuttin him any slack.. He meant what he said.

"Of course, there are some days where I’ll just go in and work on my jumper." He needs to work on that shet every time he's in the gym. That's not fatigue talking, that's him telling us what he works on.

“Right now, I’m mainly focused on doing the things I do well." Again I can't chalk that up as fatigue talking.. Thats him communicating a priority.

I defend him to no end, but that just doesn't make any sense. That thing that he says he's focused on, that he does so well, will become a non factor if he doesn't focus on improving his shooting.


I'm just speaking broadly based on the new experiences I've been able to have. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to them, I'm just saying that the very framework of it leads to people not articulating themselves as accurately as they would probably like.


Gotcha.. makes sense..
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:26 pm    Post subject:

Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:32 pm    Post subject:

DrDent wrote:
Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.


He's not done having stinkers.. I don't think it's a big deal. But if he doesn't understand why he's having stinkers then it's a problem.

He probably would have 8 or 9 assists if our guys finished better around the basket.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:36 pm    Post subject:

SocalDevin wrote:
DrDent wrote:
Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.


He's not done having stinkers.. I don't think it's a big deal. But if he doesn't understand why he's having stinkers then it's a problem.

He probably would have 8 or 9 assists if our guys finished better around the basket.


Agreed. I'm honestly not concerned (just dissapointed, I *really* wanted us to win tonight). I dont recall if it was just before this season started or end of last season (which would be before this season anyway lol) but I stick with what I said before: This kid will be one of the top players in the league. He works hard at his game. He'll be fine.
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manlisten
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:40 pm    Post subject:

mookielala wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
I'm not cuttin him any slack.. He meant what he said.

"Of course, there are some days where I’ll just go in and work on my jumper." He needs to work on that shet every time he's in the gym. That's not fatigue talking, that's him telling us what he works on.

“Right now, I’m mainly focused on doing the things I do well." Again I can't chalk that up as fatigue talking.. Thats him communicating a priority.

I defend him to no end, but that just doesn't make any sense. That thing that he says he's focused on, that he does so well, will become a non factor if he doesn't focus on improving his shooting.


I'm just speaking broadly based on the new experiences I've been able to have. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to them, I'm just saying that the very framework of it leads to people not articulating themselves as accurately as they would probably like.


That sounds right. Also, it seems like the young guys generally are not so great at interviews.


Or playing basketball. We should cut them the same slack.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:51 pm    Post subject:

DrDent wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
DrDent wrote:
Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.


He's not done having stinkers.. I don't think it's a big deal. But if he doesn't understand why he's having stinkers then it's a problem.

He probably would have 8 or 9 assists if our guys finished better around the basket.


Agreed. I'm honestly not concerned (just dissapointed, I *really* wanted us to win tonight). I dont recall if it was just before this season started or end of last season (which would be before this season anyway lol) but I stick with what I said before: This kid will be one of the top players in the league. He works hard at his game. He'll be fine.


Yea.. I know folks think I'm crazy but I expect him to be on the same tier as Simmons when he fills out and starts shooting better. I also wouldn't be surprised if he had a better career.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:09 pm    Post subject:

Simmons is basically a bigger more athletic Lonzo that doesn't shoot as much. They have a lot of similarities in their playing styles, so obviously Simmons has the advantage right now with the bigger body, but Lonzo can catch up to him if he develops a reliable J.
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activeverb
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:24 pm    Post subject:

DrDent wrote:
Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.


I think people went a little gaga on him too early. Over the past four games (before tonight), people have been raving about him because he scored a lot of points, but he only shot 40% from the field and 25% from 3-point line. He's shown good development for a young, second year player, but I haven't understood how his performance is causing some fans to call him the next big thing,
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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:36 pm    Post subject:

Atrocious game from BI tonight. He had a very nice stretch of games before this which was very exciting because the kid has a shaky jumper and the body of a baby deer. Even with those deficiencies he was putting up big points driving to the rim at will.

Tonight his lack of a consistent and confident jumper along with his still maturing physique led to a horrible game. As others mentioned I am concerned about his quote in regards to working on his jumper. I put a lot of that blame on the coaches too. They should be the ones that sit him down and show him why he needs a jumper to open up his game to a new level. The coaches should also have a plan in place for him to improve his J. According to Magic, Luke didn't even think we needed a shooting coach. We need to get rid of the Arizona frat house we have as coaches and bring in some real basketball guys.
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mookielala
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:50 pm    Post subject:

manlisten wrote:
mookielala wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
I'm not cuttin him any slack.. He meant what he said.

"Of course, there are some days where I’ll just go in and work on my jumper." He needs to work on that shet every time he's in the gym. That's not fatigue talking, that's him telling us what he works on.

“Right now, I’m mainly focused on doing the things I do well." Again I can't chalk that up as fatigue talking.. Thats him communicating a priority.

I defend him to no end, but that just doesn't make any sense. That thing that he says he's focused on, that he does so well, will become a non factor if he doesn't focus on improving his shooting.


I'm just speaking broadly based on the new experiences I've been able to have. I'm not saying you shouldn't listen to them, I'm just saying that the very framework of it leads to people not articulating themselves as accurately as they would probably like.


That sounds right. Also, it seems like the young guys generally are not so great at interviews.


Or playing basketball. We should cut them the same slack.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:24 pm    Post subject:

Ingram's problem outside of his jumper is reading the defense properly and his tunnel vision at times. That needs to be toned down.

This kind of play we need less of

https://twitter.com/T1m_NBA/status/940793815308390402

But Cranjis McBasketball(T1m_NBA) breaks down a lot of the problems down the stretch, worth checking out his twitter feed on the game.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:26 pm    Post subject:

trablos wrote:
Simmons is basically a bigger more athletic Lonzo that doesn't shoot as much. They have a lot of similarities in their playing styles, so obviously Simmons has the advantage right now with the bigger body, but Lonzo can catch up to him if he develops a reliable J.


If Lonzo uses his length to finish and reads properly what the defense is doing when they are coming to block his shot he'll do fine. Getting stronger is a part of it for him in this case.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:35 pm    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Ingram's problem outside of his jumper is reading the defense properly and his tunnel vision at times. That needs to be toned down.

This kind of play we need less of

https://twitter.com/T1m_NBA/status/940793815308390402

But Cranjis McBasketball(T1m_NBA) breaks down a lot of the problems down the stretch, worth checking out his twitter feed on the game.


You really picked the wrong play to try to make that point.. Everybody on the squad ignores picks to iso with the exception of Ball.
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:39 pm    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
trablos wrote:
Simmons is basically a bigger more athletic Lonzo that doesn't shoot as much. They have a lot of similarities in their playing styles, so obviously Simmons has the advantage right now with the bigger body, but Lonzo can catch up to him if he develops a reliable J.


If Lonzo uses his length to finish and reads properly what the defense is doing when they are coming to block his shot he'll do fine. Getting stronger is a part of it for him in this case.


He doesn't have the length to finish around bigs based purely off that. Average length for a SG ain't a big boon when going up vs bigmen
I think he gets going to fast/downhill for his own good, it's like telling a 100M dash racer to leap during the race, he's not going to get up much
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:48 am    Post subject:

Just a bad game, it happens sometimes. He is still 20. These things happen when you are still basically a kid. Hope he will bounce back the next one.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:01 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
Ingram's problem outside of his jumper is reading the defense properly and his tunnel vision at times. That needs to be toned down.

This kind of play we need less of

https://twitter.com/T1m_NBA/status/940793815308390402

But Cranjis McBasketball(T1m_NBA) breaks down a lot of the problems down the stretch, worth checking out his twitter feed on the game.

I've been disconnected with Lakers twitter, forgot how great Cranjis's stuff is
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tox
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:04 am    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
DrDent wrote:
Didnt get to see this game, so what I say here is in a bit of a vacuum:

Not too long ago the guy we want (PG13) had a 1-12 stinker; then after that a spectacular 2-17 crapper with 6 turnovers [if you are curious re "impact on other areas of game": PG 13did have 10 assists in one of those bad shooting games, and 8 rebounds in another; BI had in his crapper game tonight 7 rebounds and 5 assists ].

Not making excuses, just pointing out even veteran all stars can have real stinkers too. The real test to this is how BI responds.


I think people went a little gaga on him too early. Over the past four games (before tonight), people have been raving about him because he scored a lot of points, but he only shot 40% from the field and 25% from 3-point line. He's shown good development for a young, second year player, but I haven't understood how his performance is causing some fans to call him the next big thing,


I agree with you. I think BI is showing the up-and-down struggles of a player who's very good at one thing, but the whole league knows it. I've always been vocal about my concerns for his shooting, but the other point that now concerns me is his reaction time. He doesn't make quick decisions, and I don't have enough experience watching prospects know to have a feel for how easily players improve on this.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:26 am    Post subject:

Until he can shoot. He will continue to have ups and downs. Other than Kuzma this team is terrible at shooting
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MJST
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 5:01 am    Post subject:

Until he can shoot, I expect more teams to start implementing the strategy the Knicks just used to shut him down.

The only real answer against that game plan for him is to either have a jump shot from mid falling where he can stop and pop, or for the other team to not defend him that way.

Because they played him perfect, took away his only strength offensively and he didn't have any confidence to try anything else offensively because he knows he doesn't have it.

Mentally you see where he was last night, they took away the drive, he kept trying it, they kept stopping it. He doesn't have a consistent jumper from mid so he never went for it after he was stopped, and instead became a drive and kick guy, which they started playing and it caused other issues.


Other teams will watch that clip of Ingram and start forcing him to have to shoot instead of leaving him on an island to get to the basket against single coverage of a big.

If other teams start consistently doing this to Ingram he's gonna need to start using that spot up three and working on that pull up jumper.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 5:18 am    Post subject:

Got scared of Porzingis yesterday. Several times, he changed his mind at the last moment and turned it over or made a bad pass after seeing Porzi waiting for him.
Not confident enough in his physical abilities yet to go at a guy like this I guess. It was quite obvious it was in his mind the all game.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 5:21 am    Post subject:

Afrosho wrote:
Got scared of Porzingis yesterday. Several times, he changed his mind at the last moment and turned it over or made a bad pass after seeing Porzi waiting for him.
Not confident enough in his physical abilities yet to go at a guy like this I guess. It was quite obvious it was in his mind the all game.


He should pass that... no need to repeatedly challenge one of the longest player should in the league at the rim
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