OFFICIAL LONZO BALL THREAD (Scheduled for Knee Surgery/Scope on 7/17, Should Be 100% for Training Camp, p. 1112)
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AFireInside619
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:47 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
LakerLogic wrote:
The funny part is that the media narrative is probably still, he is not a great defender.


You would expect analysts to actually watch games. It's amazing.

But like AH was saying, I for one did not expect Lonzo to be playing great defense in the NBA. I didn't even think he would guard other point guards. That's why I thought getting KCP to guard point guards was so important.

I love that Lonzo is proving me wrong. I did not expect his instincts that he showed on offense to translate to defense. Shows what smarts + instincts can do.

Things I did not expect:

1. Lonzo's defense (especially help defense)
2. Lonzo running PNR
3. Lonzo rebounding
4. Lonzo's 3ball not falling early


I expect more analyst watch Lakers games then not. Every time I hear someone's top 5 league pass teams, the Lakers are always there. I've seen the national media shift in Zo's favor, especially the ones that have a branch in LA (ESPN, FS1, etc.). Maybe Stephen A Smith isn't on board with Zo, but his show is staged. One person takes one side, one person takes the other, and they are supposed to yell their points at each other. Max Kellerman is a Lakers fan and the media version of Magic Johnson (hypeman), so Stephen A must take the opposing view. Cowherd today asked Chris Broussard if Lonzo was more like Lebron than we thought. Broussard agreed when it came to playmaking and playing defense. My only comp for Lonzo, is a smaller version of Lebron. I'm glad others are starting to see that.

Are there still shows that aren't giving Zo credit, of course. Those people are just not being honest or haven't really watched Zo, but they are becoming fewer and fewer.


Last edited by AFireInside619 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:48 pm    Post subject:

^ Jesus, his RPM is 0.87 with a .440 TS%.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:53 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
epak wrote:
Just glad everyone (well almost everyone) is on board now. Who cares when people got on.

Choo choo!

I'm quietly waiting for it to be acceptable to say Lonzo is a KAT/Embiid/etc level prospect. Outside of Lakers forums (and maybe even here) that'd be ridiculed but I believe it.

Of course, I've been wrong before


People who don't watch the Lakers on a regular basis have no clue. Trade Lonzo b/c his dad is a loudmouth? LOL!! They read the shooting percentage and ppg and call him a bust. No clue what he does for the team.

Rarely do I see one player that young lift a team like Lonzo does. Different team when he's healthy and on the playing floor both offensively and on defense. And he's shooting 40%+ from 3 the last 10 games if I looked at the numbers right.

Yeah, I think it's a fair comparison, perhaps a bit generous to KAT and Embiid in my biased opinion.
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LakerLogic
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:55 pm    Post subject:

I actually thought he would be a good defender. I remember someone posting stats from Cranjis' twiitter to dispel the notion that Lonzo was a poor defender.
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tox
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:57 pm    Post subject:

LakerLogic wrote:
I actually thought he would be a good defender. I remember someone posting stats from Cranjis' twiitter to dispel the notion that Lonzo was a poor defender.

I saw that too. I was cautiously optimistic because of it, but I didn't think college defense translates with enough regularity to be confident.
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Daphanabe
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:59 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
epak wrote:
Just glad everyone (well almost everyone) is on board now. Who cares when people got on.

Choo choo!

I'm quietly waiting for it to be acceptable to say Lonzo is a KAT/Embiid/etc level prospect. Outside of Lakers forums (and maybe even here) that'd be ridiculed but I believe it.

Of course, I've been wrong before


I got flak on here a few weeks back for calling Lonzo 'transformative'. So I'd guess the general public won't get there for a while.
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tox
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:59 pm    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
tox wrote:
epak wrote:
Just glad everyone (well almost everyone) is on board now. Who cares when people got on.

Choo choo!

I'm quietly waiting for it to be acceptable to say Lonzo is a KAT/Embiid/etc level prospect. Outside of Lakers forums (and maybe even here) that'd be ridiculed but I believe it.

Of course, I've been wrong before


People who don't watch the Lakers on a regular basis have no clue. Trade Lonzo b/c his dad is a loudmouth? LOL!! They read the shooting percentage and ppg and call him a bust. No clue what he does for the team.

Rarely do I see one player that young lift a team like Lonzo does. Different team when he's healthy and on the playing floor both offensively and on defense. And he's shooting 40%+ from 3 the last 10 games if I looked at the numbers right.

Yeah, I think it's a fair comparison, perhaps a bit generous to KAT and Embiid in my biased opinion.

Like AH said KAT is playing defense now, and when Embiid plays he's a total difference maker (iirc the Sixers were something like 45-win team last year when Embiid played and a 12 win team when he didn't). It's definitely high praise to be in that category, and I'm not bold enough to put him ahead of those two.

But it feels good to finally have *that* level of prospect.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:07 pm    Post subject:

All this talk of KAT and Embiid, and Jokic might be the best of the three
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epak
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 11:27 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
All this talk of KAT and Embiid, and Jokic might be the best of the three


You don't say...
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 12:02 am    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
tox wrote:
epak wrote:
Just glad everyone (well almost everyone) is on board now. Who cares when people got on.

Choo choo!

I'm quietly waiting for it to be acceptable to say Lonzo is a KAT/Embiid/etc level prospect. Outside of Lakers forums (and maybe even here) that'd be ridiculed but I believe it.

Of course, I've been wrong before


I wouldn't trade him for either guy.


That's kind of a wild statement. I am very high on Lonzo but KAT is a no brainer. Embiid the injury prone argument can be made but health being equal he's clearly above Zo as well.


Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:27 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
kobe_luver wrote:
Isn't there someone that posts full Laker games? I really want to see last night's game on line!! Anyone here know if I'm right there is somewhere to see it?


Go to tvrex.net


Yo HUGE thanks for this link man, never knew this existed I was having to torrent whole games the day after. This link is a goldmine for somebody living abroad.
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jjangx27
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:58 am    Post subject:

El Seano wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
kobe_luver wrote:
Isn't there someone that posts full Laker games? I really want to see last night's game on line!! Anyone here know if I'm right there is somewhere to see it?


Go to tvrex.net


Yo HUGE thanks for this link man, never knew this existed I was having to torrent whole games the day after. This link is a goldmine for somebody living abroad.


Same here. It's tough moving halfway across the world and still trying to maintain your Laker fix
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ZenMaster4President
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:07 am    Post subject:

jjangx27 wrote:
El Seano wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
kobe_luver wrote:
Isn't there someone that posts full Laker games? I really want to see last night's game on line!! Anyone here know if I'm right there is somewhere to see it?


Go to tvrex.net


Yo HUGE thanks for this link man, never knew this existed I was having to torrent whole games the day after. This link is a goldmine for somebody living abroad.


Same here. It's tough moving halfway across the world and still trying to maintain your Laker fix


Not for around $150/year it is not. NBA LP works beautifully. No blackouts, replays, away and home announcers.
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:30 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.


That depends a lot on what you think about the value of elite bigs in the modern game. Of course, it also depends on what you expect Ball to become down the line. If your model is Jason Kidd, then I'll take the elite big.
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AFireInside619
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:33 am    Post subject:

When the Pacers lost Jeff Teague last year, I remembered that they wanted Lance Stevenson to play point for them. Initially I though my it was a great idea. Good height, tough kid with some ball handling skills. He even had a great game vs Lebron last night. I'm not sure if he's a point guard for them anymore, but he still handles the ball a lot. And as well as Lance played last night, Lonzo makes one thing very clear... Not all point guards are created equal.

Lonzo's style of play might not help us get a top name in 2018, but for years and years after that, free agents that can run, dunk, or make an open 3 will want to play with him.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:40 am    Post subject:

El Seano wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
kobe_luver wrote:
Isn't there someone that posts full Laker games? I really want to see last night's game on line!! Anyone here know if I'm right there is somewhere to see it?


Go to tvrex.net


Yo HUGE thanks for this link man, never knew this existed I was having to torrent whole games the day after. This link is a goldmine for somebody living abroad.


My pleasure. Getting footage early on for the LFR stuff was difficult, and I found a few places along the way.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:53 am    Post subject:

I want Lonzo to improve as a scorer, sure, but part of me wants him to always stay this beautiful 18% USG all-around dynamo.

#noisoBall
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Don Draper
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:05 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.


That depends a lot on what you think about the value of elite bigs in the modern game. Of course, it also depends on what you expect Ball to become down the line. If your model is Jason Kidd, then I'll take the elite big.


Kidd isn't a great comp if only for reasons of size. He's closer to 6'2", Lonzo is closer to 6'6".

Lonzo is more like a thinner less athletic LBJ with a better shot and an even higher IQ.
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:08 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
I want Lonzo to improve as a scorer, sure, but part of me wants him to always stay this beautiful 18% USG all-around dynamo.

#noisoBall


I just want him to have that in his back pocket when he needs it. Agreed that I don't want him to change stylistically.
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LakerLogic
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:28 am    Post subject:

Don Draper wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.


That depends a lot on what you think about the value of elite bigs in the modern game. Of course, it also depends on what you expect Ball to become down the line. If your model is Jason Kidd, then I'll take the elite big.


Kidd isn't a great comp if only for reasons of size. He's closer to 6'2", Lonzo is closer to 6'6".

Lonzo is more like a thinner less athletic LBJ with a better shot and an even higher IQ.


That comparison would be more accurate once he can take the ball to the basket stronger and get to the line.
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FanOfFour
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:31 am    Post subject:

When Lonzo was at UCLA, he turned it on when he had to. He took and hit big shots for them in crunch time. He has that mentality in him and it has been said (sometimes begrudgingly) on even the national sports morning shows, he seems to show out on the big stage. And I've said this pre-draft as well, when UCLA started turning it on defensively toward the mid-point of his senior year, Lonzo was leading the way. That's when I knew he had it in him. He just gets unfairly painted by the Steve Alford not coaching defense brush.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:33 am    Post subject:

FanOfFour wrote:
When Lonzo was at UCLA, he turned it on when he had to. He took and hit big shots for them in crunch time. He has that mentality in him and it has been said (sometimes begrudgingly) on even the national sports morning shows, he seems to show out on the big stage. And I've said this pre-draft as well, when UCLA started turning it on defensively toward the mid-point of his senior year, Lonzo was leading the way. That's when I knew he had it in him. He just gets unfairly painted by the Steve Alford not coaching defense brush.


UCLA is solid defensively this year, last year was a personal problem. Lonzo played with 4 bad defenders. But who needs facts when you can hate on Alford right? Now back to Lonzo.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:37 am    Post subject:

FanOfFour wrote:
When Lonzo was at UCLA, he turned it on when he had to. He took and hit big shots for them in crunch time. He has that mentality in him and it has been said (sometimes begrudgingly) on even the national sports morning shows, he seems to show out on the big stage. And I've said this pre-draft as well, when UCLA started turning it on defensively toward the mid-point of his senior year, Lonzo was leading the way. That's when I knew he had it in him. He just gets unfairly painted by the Steve Alford not coaching defense brush.


Didn't UCLA primarily play zone last season?

I wasn't worried about his defense because of his size combined with his motor. He is also moving his feet well and not getting abused off the dribble by smaller guards any worse than anyone else does.

What I love about him is he doesn't give up on plays when he is beaten and contests the shots really well. Not to mention that he is at Westbrook levels already as far as rebounding which is amazing for a 20 year old kid, he isn't afraid to hang around in the paint and bang with the big guys.

And when he gets a rebound, he knows what to do with the ball. He is already clearly the best outlet passer in the league.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:37 am    Post subject:

Don Draper wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.


That depends a lot on what you think about the value of elite bigs in the modern game. Of course, it also depends on what you expect Ball to become down the line. If your model is Jason Kidd, then I'll take the elite big.


Kidd isn't a great comp if only for reasons of size. He's closer to 6'2", Lonzo is closer to 6'6".

Lonzo is more like a thinner less athletic LBJ with a better shot and an even higher IQ.


Forget height for a second.

What's the difference in the kinds of shots Isaiah Thomas gets compared to Klay Thompson?
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:43 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Don Draper wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Not wild at all. I respect the counter view, I just think the kid is going to impact the game in a unique way. What he projects to me is more valuable than even an Uber elite big.


That depends a lot on what you think about the value of elite bigs in the modern game. Of course, it also depends on what you expect Ball to become down the line. If your model is Jason Kidd, then I'll take the elite big.


Kidd isn't a great comp if only for reasons of size. He's closer to 6'2", Lonzo is closer to 6'6".

Lonzo is more like a thinner less athletic LBJ with a better shot and an even higher IQ.


Forget height for a second.

What's the difference in the kinds of shots Isaiah Thomas gets compared to Klay Thompson?


I'm not quite picking up your point here entirely. You're going to have to further explain for us basketball illiterate folk
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