OFFICIAL KYLE got traded for westbrook KUZMA THREAD
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Judah
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:26 am    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
Leg injury and Luke killed his shooting confidence by benching him and not giving him the same rope he had before Lopez came back. Luckily this kid is smart and hard working because his passing and defense have improved during this cold shooting stretch

The reason Kuzma's ball movement, shot selection, and defense has improved considerably is because Luke and the coaching staff have challenged him in those areas throughout the season. But yeah, just fulfill your daily MO of flaming Luke whether it makes a lick of sense or not.
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defense
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:34 am    Post subject:

Kuzma is playing fine. It's not about his stats or minutes. It's about getting wins.
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justsomelakerfan
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:53 pm    Post subject:

And his efficient scoring came back today! I think in the long run of the season this bench stint will be good for Kuz. 18-10-3, good stuff

Only 2 three point attempts. Hm
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:56 pm    Post subject:

defense wrote:
Kuzma is playing fine. It's not about his stats or minutes. It's about getting wins.


If you discount your username. He struggled today, too many layups.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:23 pm    Post subject:

justsomelakerfan wrote:
And his efficient scoring came back today! I think in the long run of the season this bench stint will be good for Kuz. 18-10-3, good stuff

Only 2 three point attempts. Hm


He had a lot of 2-3 attempt games the first 20 games of the year. I don't mind that with him being cold -- he proved in those first 20 games that he can score in a variety of ways. We called him more of a scorer than a shooter. Then bam, he gets hot and is the best shooting PF through ~33 games. Now back down to rookie earth shooting. No matter - ridiculous to think he won't be a ~38% guy in his prime
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tox
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:25 pm    Post subject:

Good statline. No comment on defense since I only woke up in time for OT
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:14 pm    Post subject:

Funny interview.
Says he had his legs today cuz Luke cancelled practice yesterday lol
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justsomelakerfan
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:16 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
And his efficient scoring came back today! I think in the long run of the season this bench stint will be good for Kuz. 18-10-3, good stuff

Only 2 three point attempts. Hm


He had a lot of 2-3 attempt games the first 20 games of the year. I don't mind that with him being cold -- he proved in those first 20 games that he can score in a variety of ways. We called him more of a scorer than a shooter. Then bam, he gets hot and is the best shooting PF through ~33 games. Now back down to rookie earth shooting. No matter - ridiculous to think he won't be a ~38% guy in his prime


Hell even with a second wind this season I could see him bringing up his 3P% back to that number or higher.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:18 pm    Post subject:

Kuzma and JC are proving to be a solid 1-2 punch offensively off the bench today. Has been good to see.

Also good to see Kuzma's legs starting to come back.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:39 pm    Post subject:

Good game by Kuzma tonight.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:27 pm    Post subject:

Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:27 pm    Post subject:

CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:38 pm    Post subject:

3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.
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Lakesh0wtime
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:47 pm    Post subject:

Holy crap Kuzma cannot defend
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:53 pm    Post subject:

CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:08 pm    Post subject:

3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.


Who cares if he's getting better on defense, I would hope so, he was probably the worst one in the league. He still sucks defensively. Clarkson was bad defensively his rookie year, has he progressed on that end? Kuzma has upside defensively? He looks like a nervous wreck on that end like he's whispering to himself don't pass to my man don't pass to my man. You would think after seeing Randle and Clarkson that people would realize that potential is just a word.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:10 pm    Post subject:

CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.


Who cares if he's getting better on defense, I would hope so, he was probably the worst one in the league. He still sucks defensively. Clarkson was bad defensively his rookie year, has he progressed on that end? Kuzma has upside defensively? He looks like a nervous wreck on that end like he's whispering to himself don't pass to my man don't pass to my man. You would think after seeing Randle and Clarkson that people would realize that potential is just a word.


I’m done
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Lakesh0wtime
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:11 pm    Post subject:

This dude cannot defend to save his life.
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Rhazz
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:20 pm    Post subject:

CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.


Who cares if he's getting better on defense, I would hope so, he was probably the worst one in the league. He still sucks defensively. Clarkson was bad defensively his rookie year, has he progressed on that end? Kuzma has upside defensively? He looks like a nervous wreck on that end like he's whispering to himself don't pass to my man don't pass to my man. You would think after seeing Randle and Clarkson that people would realize that potential is just a word.


No joke, you are definitely not watching this kid play and that’s obvious.
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mhan00
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:21 pm    Post subject:

He had five points robbed from him today. One on a goaltend that was missed and one on a three where his defender came under him which is a foul this season.
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CantStopJM
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:21 pm    Post subject:

Rhazz wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.


Who cares if he's getting better on defense, I would hope so, he was probably the worst one in the league. He still sucks defensively. Clarkson was bad defensively his rookie year, has he progressed on that end? Kuzma has upside defensively? He looks like a nervous wreck on that end like he's whispering to himself don't pass to my man don't pass to my man. You would think after seeing Randle and Clarkson that people would realize that potential is just a word.


No joke, you are definitely not watching this kid play and that’s obvious.


Are you sure or maybe you're just a homer?

I saw this dude go into a charge stance on defense when his man wasn't even attacking him and was a foot away from him dribbling. He has no defensive instincts. Do you think those just magically appear?
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tox
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:41 pm    Post subject:

3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
3baller wrote:
CantStopJM wrote:
Seriously, why is he so hyped?

He's another Clarkson. Same pros and same cons. There's a reason why advanced metrics hate him. He can't defend. When his shot is on, he'll give the points right back. When his shot is off, he's as much as a liability as Clarkson.


For someone trying to use advanced metrics, you should’ve at least gotten your facts straight or even close for that matter.

Julius Randle 1st yr playing: -2.75 ORPM, -1.55 DRPM, -4.3 RPM
Jordan Clarkson: Rookie: 0.64 ORPM, -3.00 DRPM, -2.36 DRPM
Sophomore: O.14 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -2.42 RPM
3rd year: -0.63 ORPM, -3.39 DRPM, -4.02 RPM
D’angelo Russell: -1.10 ORPM, -2.56 DRPM, -3.66RPM
Brandon Ingram: -1.76 ORPM, -2.93 DRPM, -4.69 RPM

Kyle Kuzma: 0.02 ORPM, -1.73 DRPM, -1.71 RPM

Kuz was around -2.5, -2.7 DRPM a month ago so he’s been trending upward since focusing more on D. He’s not on the same stratosphere at sucking on defense as JC. Not even close. And he’s playing better D than our other past hyped rookies on their 1st year so..


What in the world did you just prove with this post? He's bad defensively but not as bad as Clarkson? Ok?

He's one of the worst defenders in the league. Visually and numbers wise.

The fact that some people think he's untouchable and part of our future is alarming. He's overrated on this board. Wolves gave up Lavine without blinking yet some people wouldn't trade him at all except for 10-15 guys.


Uhh proved that A.) he’s getting better on D as the season is progressing B.) He’s still a rookie but is playing better D than our last rookies including our other untouchable Ingram C.) Kuz is hyped because he’s a rookie and still has upside on D and has shown elite offensive potential, unlike JC who you compared him to who has been consistently bad on defense D.) You are probably high

Also pretty sure LaVine had a very serious injury which I’m sure made the decision a lot easier.

So I agree with a decent amount of your post, but while Kuzma's DRPM is superficially higher than JC's as a rookie, the thing to remember is that DRPM is biased towards taller players just because they're taller. RPM is generally something that's better to look at positionally -- so Kuzma is last positionally while JC is close to last. It's fair to say they're just about equally bad defenders, despite what the raw numbers say.

That said, you are correct that Kuz's defense is trending upwards whereas JC has had terrible numbers for 3 years. It's fair to raise flags about Kuz's defense, but it's way too early to write him off.
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epak
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:41 pm    Post subject:

Was a bit late on rotations.
It didn't help that our guards didn't help resist penetration.

If you're looking at his defense in the late 4th, that's almost ignorable as the Lakers were trying to trap for steals as they were down big. They weren't sticking to principles at that point
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defense
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:43 pm    Post subject:

Kuzma has some great offensive talent but he has a tendency to try to do too much. On defense he is as bad as the worst defenders on the team. I don't believe hes ready to be a starting PF. Maybe when he figures out the defensive end.
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LakerLogic
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:45 pm    Post subject:

Combine Kuz and Larry together?
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