View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
BizLA Star Player
Joined: 22 Nov 2017 Posts: 2368
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 3:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | SocalDevin wrote: | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | the first 3rd of the year, a lot of his progression was due to strength - he was attacking the basket relentlessly and finishing. But for the rest of the year, he didn't attack the basket nearly as much..played a lot of good 'floor game' , orchestrating, his jumper started to fall more, midrange included.
It's interesting watching these young guys progress. In the second year, you still only get consistency in facets for portions of a season. until next year, when he can put it all together more often.
Even athletically - as LakerSanity described his hopes for athletic improvement. I think his athletic improvement this year was hidden from view, because he was banged up most of the year. Seriously, go look at the injury report on rotowire - those injuries would linger for multiple games past those reports, as well - from the eye test. And when he would come back from time off - I'd say wow, ok, this is the athleticism that he actually has - but injuries have slowed him down. It's why he stopped attacking the basket so much. He didn't have the same explosion because he was banged up. Next year the athletic improvement should be even more startling because it was hidden this year. Athletic improvement isn't so common - but I think Ingram due to his lack of strength, is a case that can improve. |
This is why I try to stay away from player comps with him.. He's so physically underdeveloped that it's hard to say where his ceiling is athletically. And I would agree that we didn't get to see a lot of bouncy Ingram this season. He's certainly a lot faster getting up the floor when he isn't hobbled. |
https://3ball.io/plays?actt=5%2C6%2C40%2C41%2C42%2C43%2C44%2C71%2C72%2C73%2C74%2C75%2C76%2C97%2C98%2C99%2C100&evtt=1&p1id=1627742&playId=0021700312_40
look at him run up the court here. he does not look healthy, running kinda like a big guy - specifically look at him once he passes the 3pt line before catching, how upright - that's a sign of a guy who's not healthy. he still had 30 points this game. I'm telling you he was banged up 60% of the season, from the eye test |
I’ve noticed this too. Also saw it in the game at Atlanta on the fastbreak when he got the and-1
I can see a clear difference between an injured and healthy Brandon Ingram... healthy Ingram is very hard to stop going downhill with momentum. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BizLA Star Player
Joined: 22 Nov 2017 Posts: 2368
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LakerSanity Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
Twitter: @DeleteThisPost |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Luminous8 Star Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2017 Posts: 2192
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Agreed. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
BizLA Star Player
Joined: 22 Nov 2017 Posts: 2368
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Go put on a Celtics jersey then |
|
Back to top |
|
|
AFireInside619 Franchise Player
Joined: 11 Dec 2015 Posts: 11447
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
BizLA wrote: | Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Go put on a Celtics jersey then |
Damn Son... You went there! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LakerSanity Moderator
Joined: 30 Nov 2006 Posts: 33474 Location: Long Beach, California
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Mike@LG wrote: | Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Agreed. |
You agree with the Murray take, Mike? Or just on the Brown take? Surprised if it is the former. Murray has skill. In the 7 games Jokic missed this year, he averaged 19/3/3 in 28 minutes per game (which includes one game where he only went 2/1/3 in 16 minutes). _________________ LakersGround's Terms of Service
Twitter: @DeleteThisPost |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Endless3D Starting Rotation
Joined: 03 Mar 2018 Posts: 794
|
Posted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 6:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Man I have an irrational hatred for Jaylen Brown at this point. All those hot takes about "Brown being 30 times better then Ingram" on r/nba last year made me lose my (bleep) mind.
I can tell Brown is a cool dude too by the (bleep) I see of him off the court, but my brain can't not root for the dude to have a bad game every time I check a box score. Only bright side to this situation is that he's a Celtic, which makes my irrational hatred a little more rational. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Luminous8 Star Player
Joined: 26 Apr 2017 Posts: 2192
|
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
LakerSanity wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Agreed. |
You agree with the Murray take, Mike? Or just on the Brown take? Surprised if it is the former. Murray has skill. In the 7 games Jokic missed this year, he averaged 19/3/3 in 28 minutes per game (which includes one game where he only went 2/1/3 in 16 minutes). |
That's my point, he can flat out get buckets. But when it comes to making others better, defending. Rebounding. Doing things besides hitting jumpers and scoring. He offers little else. Not trying to knock him, I think he has a bright future. I'm just saying I think having jokic do all of the half court playmaking takes the part of his game he struggles with away from him and allows him to focus on his primary strength. He's a 2 getting away with playing PG because of the team he fell to. I'm just not sure hes as successful on a different team where he's either expected to run a half court offense or be a full time sg. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Dr. Funkbot Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2001 Posts: 8188 Location: Eagle Rock
|
Posted: Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Agreed and I we all know that BI is younger and a late bloomer. Simmons is more of a early bloomer like Lebron... so in the end BI might catch up to Simmons, especially if he continues to shoot the ball so much better from distance. _________________ R.I.P. Doc Buss |
|
Back to top |
|
|
oldlakerfan Star Player
Joined: 15 May 2001 Posts: 2146 Location: Tega Cay, South Carolina
|
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
BI had a fine season and grew as the season went on. He has a lot to work on but he looks like a star in the making.
He gotta get stronger and be more available.
Work on the outside shot
Learn to drive and dish, keep you head up when driving to the hoop
Defense was good but can be great
Continue to become more explosive and athletic, good strength
While Simmons is clearly better BI is on a path to being great and he has the right attitude and work ethic to get there. He is also learning how to lead. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KindCrippler2000 Franchise Player
Joined: 02 May 2003 Posts: 15821
|
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
The 16-5-4 average he finished the season with still puts him in good to historic company for a 20 year old player: https://i.imgur.com/j1LaR5E.png
Expecting him to up the ante next season. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
|
Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
LakerSanity wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Luminous8 wrote: | LakerSanity wrote: | BizLA wrote: | Let’s take a look at Brandon’s draft class... who’s outperforming him at this point?
Simmons. That’s it.
It’s Simmons & him from the 16 class. Murray 3rd. |
Yea, Jamal Murray is pretty good. Don't completely discount Jaylen Brown either, even if he may not be in the same class as those three. |
Jamaal Murray would be exposed if it weren't for Jokic IMO. He makes Murray be able to focus on his primary skill. Scoring. He doesn't have to try and initiate. He really couldn't have fallen into a better situation. I'm a big fan of Jaylen. Kid is aggressive and knows how to play to his ability. |
Agreed. |
You agree with the Murray take, Mike? Or just on the Brown take? Surprised if it is the former. Murray has skill. In the 7 games Jokic missed this year, he averaged 19/3/3 in 28 minutes per game (which includes one game where he only went 2/1/3 in 16 minutes). |
Both, but the Murray take too. He's a shooter first, playmaker second, and the way the Nuggets run that offense with Jokic at the top of the key while Jamal Murray is running off of every screen, is exactly the playtype that facilitates his success. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LakerSD Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2016 Posts: 23731
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lakerz113 Star Player
Joined: 15 Mar 2015 Posts: 2445
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think BI has the most weight on his shoulders this off season.
He made good strides from year 1 to year 2, but this is a crucial year.
I know he came into the league young, but at some point he has to put it together ...year 3 is usually the deciding year for stars. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Endless3D Starting Rotation
Joined: 03 Mar 2018 Posts: 794
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Lakerz113 wrote: | I think BI has the most weight on his shoulders this off season.
He made good strides from year 1 to year 2, but this is a crucial year.
I know he came into the league young, but at some point he has to put it together ...year 3 is usually the deciding year for stars. |
I don't think he's in the "needs to put it together" category, he just needs to continue to improve like has been since his rookie season.
He started off way behind the curve, but once we realized how far behind he started he didn't slow down. He keeps improving like this and we're looking at a 20 point guy next season |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lakerz113 Star Player
Joined: 15 Mar 2015 Posts: 2445
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Endless3D wrote: | Lakerz113 wrote: | I think BI has the most weight on his shoulders this off season.
He made good strides from year 1 to year 2, but this is a crucial year.
I know he came into the league young, but at some point he has to put it together ...year 3 is usually the deciding year for stars. |
I don't think he's in the "needs to put it together" category, he just needs to continue to improve like has been since his rookie season.
He started off way behind the curve, but once we realized how far behind he started he didn't slow down. He keeps improving like this and we're looking at a 20 point guy next season |
thats fair ..but i wont be the fan in year 6 holding out hope saying wait till he bulks up.
If hes going to be a star he should show glimpses of stardom next season. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012 Posts: 32767
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Lakerz113 wrote: | Endless3D wrote: | Lakerz113 wrote: | I think BI has the most weight on his shoulders this off season.
He made good strides from year 1 to year 2, but this is a crucial year.
I know he came into the league young, but at some point he has to put it together ...year 3 is usually the deciding year for stars. |
I don't think he's in the "needs to put it together" category, he just needs to continue to improve like has been since his rookie season.
He started off way behind the curve, but once we realized how far behind he started he didn't slow down. He keeps improving like this and we're looking at a 20 point guy next season |
thats fair ..but i wont be the fan in year 6 holding out hope saying wait till he bulks up.
If hes going to be a star he should show glimpses of stardom next season. |
Dipo showed no signs of stardom until year 5.. and Ingram is a late bloomer. I want to see what he looks like in year 4..year 3 might not show many signs , he's got a long way to go |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Endless3D Starting Rotation
Joined: 03 Mar 2018 Posts: 794
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Lakerz113 wrote: | Endless3D wrote: | Lakerz113 wrote: | I think BI has the most weight on his shoulders this off season.
He made good strides from year 1 to year 2, but this is a crucial year.
I know he came into the league young, but at some point he has to put it together ...year 3 is usually the deciding year for stars. |
I don't think he's in the "needs to put it together" category, he just needs to continue to improve like has been since his rookie season.
He started off way behind the curve, but once we realized how far behind he started he didn't slow down. He keeps improving like this and we're looking at a 20 point guy next season |
thats fair ..but i wont be the fan in year 6 holding out hope saying wait till he bulks up.
If hes going to be a star he should show glimpses of stardom next season. |
I mean if we're still waiting in year 6 then he probably stopped improving like he has been at some point.
But at the same time, if we're still waiting in year 6 then he's probably not a Laker. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Judah Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015 Posts: 4759
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
So BI showed no glimpses of stardom this year? Really?
Gotta love the analysis of folks who watch the games with their eyes closed. _________________ “Christ did not die to forgive sinners who go on treasuring anything above seeing and savoring God. And people who would be happy in heaven if Christ were not there, will not be there."
- John Piper |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Megaton Retired Number
Joined: 18 Feb 2015 Posts: 25624
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I’m very proud of Ingram’s progression as a shooter. His 3 point shooting largely increased and became much better as a catch and shoot player to go along with his iso mid range.
Admittedly after the end of last season and the first 10 or so games of this season, I was really skeptical of Ingram’s fit on this team. Tended to drive constantly with not much success, shot long mid ranges on a not so good percentage, etc. But that’s improved a lot.
I’m expecting that BIG step for him next season. Regardless what moves happen this offseason, I expect him being stronger and more efficient at the free throw line. Improves those two factors and then the rest falls into place as an all star in this league. _________________ Darvin Scam: https://media.tenor.com/images/3c15249955860a4b16b59e8ae035fb75/tenor.gif |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lakerz113 Star Player
Joined: 15 Mar 2015 Posts: 2445
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Judah wrote: | So BI showed no glimpses of stardom this year? Really?
Gotta love the analysis of folks who watch the games with their eyes closed. |
oh shut up..he had some awesome moments, but at this point i would put the adds at 50-50 he becomes an all star.
I just hold him to a high standard considering he was a #2 pick
Im just saying by year three you can usually tell if a player is going to be a role player or actually turn into the star you hoped when you drafted them 2nd overall. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KeepItRealOrElse Retired Number
Joined: 11 Oct 2012 Posts: 32767
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:15 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Judah wrote: | So BI showed no glimpses of stardom this year? Really?
Gotta love the analysis of folks who watch the games with their eyes closed. |
I don't think he did, doesn't mean I don't expect him to get there.
Reasonable minds can disagree, man |
|
Back to top |
|
|
greek laker Starting Rotation
Joined: 06 Dec 2017 Posts: 778
|
Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2018 8:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
he needs to stay healthy at first. He needs to attempt at least 4 threes
per game.and he needs to be a 20 pts player at year 3. he is getting there i think |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|