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jmnluvr
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Joined: 29 Nov 2001
Posts: 1649
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 Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:10 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | jmnluvr wrote: | How many 50 point games would Jordan have strung together if he had a clear path to the hoop on every drive? Harden's a great scorer, sure. But you can't touch him. How many would Kobe have scored every game if he was allowed to push off on every shot? How many would Wilt have scored if he were allowed to travel on every play?
Harden takes what Lebron started to the extreme, and it's bad for basketball. I remember growing up playing ball in the 80's and every dude in LB had "Lil' Jordan" scribbled in his shoes and jacked up shots and never passed and I hated Jordan for it. It took 25 years for the NBA to get team basketball back to something everything was trying to achieve. Now I see the younger generation doing the same crap Harden is doing, and I don't blame them for emulating it. |
The year Jordan averaged 37 points a game... the 20th highest scorer scored 21.7 points
This year the 20th highest scorer averages 21.7 points
I don't think things have changed as drastically as you think in terms of individual production.
If the scoring is higher due to defensive restrictions and the introduction of the 14 second clock... why isn't everyone scoring like crazy? |
My reaction is to the clear individual treatment that Harden gets. Jordan got special treatment too, but not like this. Teams were not afraid to try to guard him the way they are with Harden. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:11 am Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | jmnluvr wrote: | How many 50 point games would Jordan have strung together if he had a clear path to the hoop on every drive? Harden's a great scorer, sure. But you can't touch him. How many would Kobe have scored every game if he was allowed to push off on every shot? How many would Wilt have scored if he were allowed to travel on every play?
Harden takes what Lebron started to the extreme, and it's bad for basketball. I remember growing up playing ball in the 80's and every dude in LB had "Lil' Jordan" scribbled in his shoes and jacked up shots and never passed and I hated Jordan for it. It took 25 years for the NBA to get team basketball back to something everything was trying to achieve. Now I see the younger generation doing the same crap Harden is doing, and I don't blame them for emulating it. |
The year Jordan averaged 37 points a game... the 20th highest scorer scored 21.7 points
This year the 20th highest scorer averages 21.7 points
I don't think things have changed as drastically as you think in terms of individual production.
If the scoring is higher due to defensive restrictions and the introduction of the 14 second clock... why isn't everyone scoring like crazy? |
Because the 20th best perimeter player in the league isn't that great. Doesn't get the phantom calls and is playing next to one or two other guys that can chuck three's too so the team decides to give them shots. |
I hate Harden's flopping... but the league didn't just decide one day to anoint some random dude in Houston with super powers.
He cultivated that game, and now is exploiting it with his reputation.
I agree it should be stopped... but his game is still legit with or without those calls. |
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RI Laker
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7157
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | CandyCanes wrote: | | The whole narrative about Harden being a "manufactured superstar" is a little overblown, IMO. The guy is undeniably a major offensive talent. |
Yeah we designed our entire defense just to stop him and he still scored 48 points without CP3 or Capela to draw defenders away from him.
He's the best player in the league right now.
I hate the cheating and flopping... but he's reached another level.
When all Shaq did was dunk... no one said, well that's all that Shaq does.
Harden's game isn't aesthetically pleasing but until someone stops him, you have to give him credit.
No one's done two fifty point games in a row since Chamberlain and he almost did it three times.
Crazy stuff... Jordan, Kobe... no one has done what he's been doing this week. |
I think Shaq is a bad example. The referees did not know how to officiate games he played in. However, they were actually smart enough to turn a blind eye and let MANY calls go in order not to ruin the games. If they officiated in the games Shaq played in like they currently do with regards to Harden, the games would have lasted 4 hours. There was not a time when Shaq was not fouled. The calls that Harden gets are borderline ridiculous. |
Fans of other team would beg to differ. Notice, that the fans of teams always feel this way about players not on their team.
Back in the day, people used to complain all day about Shaq getting foul calls. You just didn't hear it like you do now because social wasn't as big. |
I do not know. I think if you ask a true basketball fan, they would all say Shaq was routinely fouled and more fouls could have been called against him. There were plenty of players who were in this category (referees had a hard time officiating) including the Malones (Karl and Moses), Dantly, and Aguirre to name a few. |
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ringfinger
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Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:20 am Post subject: |
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| RI Laker wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | CandyCanes wrote: | | The whole narrative about Harden being a "manufactured superstar" is a little overblown, IMO. The guy is undeniably a major offensive talent. |
Yeah we designed our entire defense just to stop him and he still scored 48 points without CP3 or Capela to draw defenders away from him.
He's the best player in the league right now.
I hate the cheating and flopping... but he's reached another level.
When all Shaq did was dunk... no one said, well that's all that Shaq does.
Harden's game isn't aesthetically pleasing but until someone stops him, you have to give him credit.
No one's done two fifty point games in a row since Chamberlain and he almost did it three times.
Crazy stuff... Jordan, Kobe... no one has done what he's been doing this week. |
I think Shaq is a bad example. The referees did not know how to officiate games he played in. However, they were actually smart enough to turn a blind eye and let MANY calls go in order not to ruin the games. If they officiated in the games Shaq played in like they currently do with regards to Harden, the games would have lasted 4 hours. There was not a time when Shaq was not fouled. The calls that Harden gets are borderline ridiculous. |
Fans of other team would beg to differ. Notice, that the fans of teams always feel this way about players not on their team.
Back in the day, people used to complain all day about Shaq getting foul calls. You just didn't hear it like you do now because social wasn't as big. |
I do not know. I think if you ask a true basketball fan, they would all say Shaq was routinely fouled and more fouls could have been called against him. There were plenty of players who were in this category (referees had a hard time officiating) including the Malones (Karl and Moses), Dantly, and Aguirre to name a few. |
Yeah I don't think that's an unfair point to make. I'm just saying that fans in general don't ever think their own player should get fewer foul calls and usually complain about other players getting too many. |
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BennyLava
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Joined: 14 Dec 2012
Posts: 3582
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:35 am Post subject: |
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The no call on lonzos injury puts any debate on whether the refs call fouls evenly to rest. Even if harden does get fouled every time, if they call the game evenly everyone else would as well.
Is Houston such a huge market? I don’t get the reason why NBA wants to manufacture a star there. Is it China and the Yao Ming history? |
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Darth Los Angeles
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Joined: 06 Dec 2011
Posts: 2181
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:50 am Post subject: |
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I don't know if it's been said... But the biggest problem with Harden is the cascading effect of allowing him to travel, carry, etc... It makes it impossible to take anything away from him from a defenders perspective.
How many times does Harden travel/carry to escape being trapped? A lot. This puts the defense of the opposing team in constant duress and it impacts the way the opposing team plays offense.
I'll buy that Harden is a great offensive player. But hell, so are a lot of players. Harden in the ONLY one allowed to travel/carry blatantly. Harden is the only one who is allowed to run directly into defender in the open court (knocking them down).
The NBA either needs to level the playing field by allowing all players to do what Harden does or just remove this crap all together. But it will never happen because Harden is their product. The NBA has full control over his success and failures. This is why players get so pissed. They are being cheated and they know it.
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32
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Joined: 04 Nov 2009
Posts: 73071
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| BennyLava wrote: | The no call on lonzos injury puts any debate on whether the refs call fouls evenly to rest. Even if harden does get fouled every time, if they call the game evenly everyone else would as well.
Is Houston such a huge market? I don’t get the reason why NBA wants to manufacture a star there. Is it China and the Yao Ming history? |
I watched the tape and it looks like he just turns his ankle no contact at all. What no call are you talking about?
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144468
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:57 am Post subject: |
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| RI Laker wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | CandyCanes wrote: | | The whole narrative about Harden being a "manufactured superstar" is a little overblown, IMO. The guy is undeniably a major offensive talent. |
Yeah we designed our entire defense just to stop him and he still scored 48 points without CP3 or Capela to draw defenders away from him.
He's the best player in the league right now.
I hate the cheating and flopping... but he's reached another level.
When all Shaq did was dunk... no one said, well that's all that Shaq does.
Harden's game isn't aesthetically pleasing but until someone stops him, you have to give him credit.
No one's done two fifty point games in a row since Chamberlain and he almost did it three times.
Crazy stuff... Jordan, Kobe... no one has done what he's been doing this week. |
I think Shaq is a bad example. The referees did not know how to officiate games he played in. However, they were actually smart enough to turn a blind eye and let MANY calls go in order not to ruin the games. If they officiated in the games Shaq played in like they currently do with regards to Harden, the games would have lasted 4 hours. There was not a time when Shaq was not fouled. The calls that Harden gets are borderline ridiculous. |
Fans of other team would beg to differ. Notice, that the fans of teams always feel this way about players not on their team.
Back in the day, people used to complain all day about Shaq getting foul calls. You just didn't hear it like you do now because social wasn't as big. |
I do not know. I think if you ask a true basketball fan, they would all say Shaq was routinely fouled and more fouls could have been called against him. There were plenty of players who were in this category (referees had a hard time officiating) including the Malones (Karl and Moses), Dantly, and Aguirre to name a few. |
What is a true basketball fan? One who doesn’t put their favorite team first? Wouldn’t that eliminate this thread? We heard the same things about Shaq and Kobe, any player who pushes the boundaries is conceived as being protected by the league.
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eddiejonze
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Joined: 19 Dec 2013
Posts: 7251
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:00 am Post subject: Re: If it wasn't for the Lakers, I would probably be done with the NBA |
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| Harlemlakerfan wrote: | The fact that I've been a Lakers fan for over 30 years and there is nothing that I enjoy more than sitting down and watching a Lakers game, is the only reason why I still watch this joke of a league. This league is in the business of manufacturing stars, in order to market around the world. Tonight's game was a disgrace. The Refereeing was absolutely disgusting! All done to keep the Harden narrative going! It's not just last night but this happens on a nightly basis all around the league.
They have taken defense completely out of the game and gave all of the advantages to the offensive players. The Rockets don't even play basketball, they just shoot 3's. They have a "manufactured star" that has more free throws and 3 pointers on the season than regular baskets. That is not basketball.
This league is going downhill fast and it's the Lakers, and only the Lakers that keeps me watching! |
Well put Harlem, this is my exact feeling on the NBA since Shaq was a Laker- you just see people being officiated differently and it's not right. Problem is, I got branded young by the Lakers so I put up with this dumb league ( that's truly marketed for a 13 year old) but I never ever watch any other game if the Lakers aren't playing.
Is Harden skilled? of course, but I throw up in my mouth a lil bit anytime someone compares him to Kobe while ignoring that the rules have most obviously changed.
See, Kobe like Jordan, developed the Fadeaway, so a defender couldn't get to the shot- Harden OTOH, developed a move to just get contact which is where the "it aint basketball" argument comes into to play.
My big big BIG problem w the league tho is where is the rule change to limit this supposed "unstoppable" player?
Shaq had the zone defense change.
Barkley and Mark Jackson ( can't decide who it was in regards to) had the 5 seconds backing the defender into the
post change.
Kobe ( and durant) had the swing through rule change.
Where is the rule to limit Harden?
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Creatures crawl in search of blood, To terrorize y'alls neighborhood. |
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Christopher Walken
Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Jul 2016
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| 32 wrote: | | BennyLava wrote: | The no call on lonzos injury puts any debate on whether the refs call fouls evenly to rest. Even if harden does get fouled every time, if they call the game evenly everyone else would as well.
Is Houston such a huge market? I don’t get the reason why NBA wants to manufacture a star there. Is it China and the Yao Ming history? |
I watched the tape and it looks like he just turns his ankle no contact at all. What no call are you talking about? |
Nope, in the replay, lonzo is anticipating that he is about to be blatantly fouled, and seems to turn his ankle a millisecond before contact, but the contact DOES occur, so yes, he turned his ankle due to a blatant foul.
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We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. |
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BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:10 am Post subject: |
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| The way the league officiates Harden is beyond frustrating. It’s dangerous for the league. If this sparks a new generation of foul hunters like him, the league will regret it. High scores are great and all but playing strictly for FTs isn’t fun to watch and that’s what’s occurring. |
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LakerLanny
Retired Number
Joined: 24 Oct 2001
Posts: 47581
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| BigGameHames wrote: | | The way the league officiates Harden is beyond frustrating. It’s dangerous for the league. If this sparks a new generation of foul hunters like him, the league will regret it. High scores are great and all but playing strictly for FTs isn’t fun to watch and that’s what’s occurring. |
I actually turned off the game at the half because I find Houston and especially Harden simply no fun to watch, I don't enjoy the game.
Sounds like the 2nd half turned into the typical NBA Ref assisted nightmare loss.
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Treble Clef
Franchise Player
Joined: 20 Nov 2012
Posts: 23912
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:18 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | jmnluvr wrote: | How many 50 point games would Jordan have strung together if he had a clear path to the hoop on every drive? Harden's a great scorer, sure. But you can't touch him. How many would Kobe have scored every game if he was allowed to push off on every shot? How many would Wilt have scored if he were allowed to travel on every play?
Harden takes what Lebron started to the extreme, and it's bad for basketball. I remember growing up playing ball in the 80's and every dude in LB had "Lil' Jordan" scribbled in his shoes and jacked up shots and never passed and I hated Jordan for it. It took 25 years for the NBA to get team basketball back to something everything was trying to achieve. Now I see the younger generation doing the same crap Harden is doing, and I don't blame them for emulating it. |
The year Jordan averaged 37 points a game... the 20th highest scorer scored 21.7 points
This year the 20th highest scorer averages 21.7 points
I don't think things have changed as drastically as you think in terms of individual production.
If the scoring is higher due to defensive restrictions and the introduction of the 14 second clock... why isn't everyone scoring like crazy? |
Because the 20th best perimeter player in the league isn't that great. Doesn't get the phantom calls and is playing next to one or two other guys that can chuck three's too so the team decides to give them shots. |
I hate Harden's flopping... but the league didn't just decide one day to anoint some random dude in Houston with super powers.
He cultivated that game, and now is exploiting it with his reputation.
I agree it should be stopped... but his game is still legit with or without those calls. |
Yes, he is exploiting rules that were written for normal play and turns them into a cheat code. Same crap we saw when Lou Williams was here, they get ridiculous calls because they're going out of their way to create foul situations.
It's hard to stop players from doing this. It works so more players are doing it. I notice a lot of Lakers are trying to master those same moves, particularly the stepback three. |
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BigGameHames
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| LakerLanny wrote: | | BigGameHames wrote: | | The way the league officiates Harden is beyond frustrating. It’s dangerous for the league. If this sparks a new generation of foul hunters like him, the league will regret it. High scores are great and all but playing strictly for FTs isn’t fun to watch and that’s what’s occurring. |
I actually turned off the game at the half because I find Houston and especially Harden simply no fun to watch, I don't enjoy the game.
Sounds like the 2nd half turned into the typical NBA Ref assisted nightmare loss. |
Yep. Lakers had their opportunities though. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Usage vs FTA per game
Harden 40.1/11.7
Embiid 32.8/9.8
Giannis 31.8/9.1
AD 29.7/9.1
Blake 30.2/7.9
LBJ 31.3/7.8
KD 30.8/7.4
Lillard 30.1/6.7
LouWill 31.7/5.9
Russ 31.4/5.9
LaVine 31.3/5.7
Kemba 31.4/5.4
Ingram 23.3/5.3
Steph 31.4/5.0
Lonzo 16.9/1.0
Looking at the top ten in usage... it seems that Harden's free throw attempts are not far out of whack with his ridiculous usage stats.
Players who drive to the rim predictably draw a lot of fouls.
At quick glance it seems if Embiid, Giannis, AD had the ball in their hands as often... they would get the same number of free throw attempts. |
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RI Laker
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7157
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:37 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | CandyCanes wrote: | | The whole narrative about Harden being a "manufactured superstar" is a little overblown, IMO. The guy is undeniably a major offensive talent. |
Yeah we designed our entire defense just to stop him and he still scored 48 points without CP3 or Capela to draw defenders away from him.
He's the best player in the league right now.
I hate the cheating and flopping... but he's reached another level.
When all Shaq did was dunk... no one said, well that's all that Shaq does.
Harden's game isn't aesthetically pleasing but until someone stops him, you have to give him credit.
No one's done two fifty point games in a row since Chamberlain and he almost did it three times.
Crazy stuff... Jordan, Kobe... no one has done what he's been doing this week. |
I think Shaq is a bad example. The referees did not know how to officiate games he played in. However, they were actually smart enough to turn a blind eye and let MANY calls go in order not to ruin the games. If they officiated in the games Shaq played in like they currently do with regards to Harden, the games would have lasted 4 hours. There was not a time when Shaq was not fouled. The calls that Harden gets are borderline ridiculous. |
Fans of other team would beg to differ. Notice, that the fans of teams always feel this way about players not on their team.
Back in the day, people used to complain all day about Shaq getting foul calls. You just didn't hear it like you do now because social wasn't as big. |
I do not know. I think if you ask a true basketball fan, they would all say Shaq was routinely fouled and more fouls could have been called against him. There were plenty of players who were in this category (referees had a hard time officiating) including the Malones (Karl and Moses), Dantly, and Aguirre to name a few. |
What is a true basketball fan? One who doesn’t put their favorite team first? Wouldn’t that eliminate this thread? We heard the same things about Shaq and Kobe, any player who pushes the boundaries is conceived as being protected by the league. |
A true basketball fan can admit what transpired in years past after reflection and give an honest assessment. I honestly thought Shag (his ENTIRE career) was fouled almost every possession and he EASILY could have received many more calls than he did. The refs were smart enough not to completely destroy the flow of the game. How can Shaq only average a half a free throw attempt more than Harden, especially considering the fact that he always had the ball down low and the employment of hack a Shaq? A true basketball fan admits what really happened. I hated Adrian Dantley and how he destroyed us. I complained about the calls he received, but can now admit he should have gotten MANY more calls. The way the refs are calling games in regards to Harden is really hurting the game. We have come to a point where it is not only acceptable but expected that Harden does a conga line directly to the free throw line. I am not hating on him, but this is reality. |
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governator
Retired Number
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | Usage vs FTA per game
Harden 40.1/11.7
Embiid 32.8/9.8
Giannis 31.8/9.1
AD 29.7/9.1
Blake 30.2/7.9
LBJ 31.3/7.8
KD 30.8/7.4
Lillard 30.1/6.7
LouWill 31.7/5.9
Russ 31.4/5.9
LaVine 31.3/5.7
Kemba 31.4/5.4
Ingram 23.3/5.3
Steph 31.4/5.0
Lonzo 16.9/1.0
Looking at the top ten in usage... it seems that Harden's free throw attempts are not far out of whack with his ridiculous usage stats.
Players who drive to the rim predictably draw a lot of fouls.
At quick glance it seems if Embiid, Giannis, AD had the ball in their hands as often... they would get the same number of free throw attempts. |
Be interesting to add 3pt/drive percentages too (Not sure if exist online) |
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SD2Hollyweird
Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Posts: 247
Location: 92115
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:43 am Post subject: Re: If it wasn't for the Lakers, I would probably be done with the NBA |
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| Harlemlakerfan wrote: | The fact that I've been a Lakers fan for over 30 years and there is nothing that I enjoy more than sitting down and watching a Lakers game, is the only reason why I still watch this joke of a league. This league is in the business of manufacturing stars, in order to market around the world. Tonight's game was a disgrace. The Refereeing was absolutely disgusting! All done to keep the Harden narrative going! It's not just last night but this happens on a nightly basis all around the league.
They have taken defense completely out of the game and gave all of the advantages to the offensive players. The Rockets don't even play basketball, they just shoot 3's. They have a "manufactured star" that has more free throws and 3 pointers on the season than regular baskets. That is not basketball.
This league is going downhill fast and it's the Lakers, and only the Lakers that keeps me watching! |
Agree 100%.
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I believe that a triangle, if it could speak, would say that God is eminently triangular, and a circle that the divine nature is eminently circular; and thus would every one ascribe his own attributes to God. - Baruch Spinoza |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:43 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | Usage vs FTA per game
Harden 40.1/11.7
Embiid 32.8/9.8
Giannis 31.8/9.1
AD 29.7/9.1
Blake 30.2/7.9
LBJ 31.3/7.8
KD 30.8/7.4
Lillard 30.1/6.7
LouWill 31.7/5.9
Russ 31.4/5.9
LaVine 31.3/5.7
Kemba 31.4/5.4
Ingram 23.3/5.3
Steph 31.4/5.0
Lonzo 16.9/1.0
Looking at the top ten in usage... it seems that Harden's free throw attempts are not far out of whack with his ridiculous usage stats.
Players who drive to the rim predictably draw a lot of fouls.
At quick glance it seems if Embiid, Giannis, AD had the ball in their hands as often... they would get the same number of free throw attempts. |
Be interesting to add 3pt/drive percentages too (Not sure if exist online) |
Yeah, you'd also need to calculate minutes played... etc.
But quick glance... he's in line with the other superstars in terms of fouls per possessions with the ball in his hands. |
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Treble Clef
Franchise Player
Joined: 20 Nov 2012
Posts: 23912
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| RI Laker wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | | CandyCanes wrote: | | The whole narrative about Harden being a "manufactured superstar" is a little overblown, IMO. The guy is undeniably a major offensive talent. |
Yeah we designed our entire defense just to stop him and he still scored 48 points without CP3 or Capela to draw defenders away from him.
He's the best player in the league right now.
I hate the cheating and flopping... but he's reached another level.
When all Shaq did was dunk... no one said, well that's all that Shaq does.
Harden's game isn't aesthetically pleasing but until someone stops him, you have to give him credit.
No one's done two fifty point games in a row since Chamberlain and he almost did it three times.
Crazy stuff... Jordan, Kobe... no one has done what he's been doing this week. |
I think Shaq is a bad example. The referees did not know how to officiate games he played in. However, they were actually smart enough to turn a blind eye and let MANY calls go in order not to ruin the games. If they officiated in the games Shaq played in like they currently do with regards to Harden, the games would have lasted 4 hours. There was not a time when Shaq was not fouled. The calls that Harden gets are borderline ridiculous. |
Fans of other team would beg to differ. Notice, that the fans of teams always feel this way about players not on their team.
Back in the day, people used to complain all day about Shaq getting foul calls. You just didn't hear it like you do now because social wasn't as big. |
I do not know. I think if you ask a true basketball fan, they would all say Shaq was routinely fouled and more fouls could have been called against him. There were plenty of players who were in this category (referees had a hard time officiating) including the Malones (Karl and Moses), Dantly, and Aguirre to name a few. |
What is a true basketball fan? One who doesn’t put their favorite team first? Wouldn’t that eliminate this thread? We heard the same things about Shaq and Kobe, any player who pushes the boundaries is conceived as being protected by the league. |
A true basketball fan can admit what transpired in years past after reflection and give an honest assessment. I honestly thought Shag (his ENTIRE career) was fouled almost every possession and he EASILY could have received many more calls than he did. The refs were smart enough not to completely destroy the flow of the game. How can Shaq only average a half a free throw attempt more than Harden, especially considering the fact that he always had the ball down low and the employment of hack a Shaq? A true basketball fan admits what really happened. I hated Adrian Dantley and how he destroyed us. I complained about the calls he received, but can now admit he should have gotten MANY more calls. The way the refs are calling games in regards to Harden is really hurting the game. We have come to a point where it is not only acceptable but expected that Harden does a conga line directly to the free throw line. I am not hating on him, but this is reality. |
Shaq was officiated horribly due to his size and strength. He was fouled many times where it wasn't called because it barely affected him. He was flagrantly fouled many times where it was only called a common foul because it barely affected him. He also cleared out and demolished a lot of defenders without fouls being called. The refs didn't know what to do.
I think most fans and players say they want the refs to be fair but when it comes down to it, most don't actually want that. If Harden joined the Lakers, the conversation would go from how many calls he gets to how few calls he gets, just like it has with LeBron. |
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matrixskillz
Star Player
Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 7502
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:30 pm Post subject: |
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Agreed, the league has gotten soft and way too predictable.
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