OFFICIAL GENERAL FREE AGENCY/TRADE THREAD
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Yong
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:08 am    Post subject:

laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I agree. Was always in favor of PG and was sad that we got LBJ instead of PG. Sure he's a better influence and role model. But he can be quite destructive to the franchise too.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:10 am    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I kind of agree, but AD is only 26 years old and a top 12-15 player. He should have another good 6 years or more. You can build around him even after Lebron is gone. If we were talking about an aging star player then it would be different. It just comes down to asking price. Emptying all of our assets for him would be disappointing but I'd be excited about a Lebron/AD/free agent core.


If Lonzo and Ingram were better players I'd agree with him
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:11 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
I would try to get the #6 from Phoenix with Josh Jackson for Lonzo Ball.

Then trade Josh Jackson, Kuzma, Wagner, #4, #6 & 2021 1st Round Pick.

So a three team deal since the Pels would presumably want to pick their oen player at #6.


It do not think it qualifies? Maybe add a Pels future 2nd swapping with PHX.

That would work.


basically so is someone else in the deal from my perception....trading one 2017 draft pick that did not work out and cant shoot for another.....it is about need...PHX desperately needs a PG and have too many young SF's. Jackson appears to be the odd man out.

You're making a false equivalence since Zo is bringing back Jackson and the #6 pick in your proposed trade, but sure. If that's what the Pelicans prefer, then it would make sense to do it since the Lakers would be able to come out of the deal with AD and enough cap space to sign Kyrie.


It is not a "false equivalence" because I described how team needs would influence the decision.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:11 am    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I kind of agree, but AD is only 26 years old and a top 12-15 player. He should have another good 6 years or more. You can build around him even after Lebron is gone. If we were talking about an aging star player then it would be different. It just comes down to asking price. Emptying all of our assets for him would be disappointing but I'd be excited about a Lebron/AD/free agent core.


Haha you say that now. But look at what superstar AD achieved with a crappy roster in NO. They never managed to build anything with him lol. That's exactly the situation that we will be facing when LBJ retires and all that's left is AD and scrubs.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:12 am    Post subject:

laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.

There's an alternate reality in which the Lakers trade Lebron for Zion (and a couple expiring deals to match salary). Lebron and AD get to team up and the Lakers get to move on with a star caliber talent to structure the youth movement around.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:12 am    Post subject:

manlisten wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
manlisten wrote:
I wouldn't bother going out of my way to appease Griffin's demands. He's not in the driver's seat here.


His worst case scenario is AD comes back next season and they try again before the deadline. That isn't a terrible place to be. We just have to read the market and make sure we aren't bidding against ourselves.


The offers only get worse the longer it takes. He said himself he wants a deal done before the draft for that reason. Griffin has this sort of clout and dignity about him that makes you take him seriously but he has absolutely no leverage and is in no position whatsoever to be making such lofty demands. He essentially wants 3 all star players and an additional first rounder for a player who has both feet out the door. It's ludicrous.


I agree he's asking too much and don't think he'll get all that. It's the smart way to negotiate though. He can always walk it back after seeing the offers on the market. But if your asking price is low or even right on the dot, you can't go back and say "Well you're giving me everything I asked for, but now I want more". He's trying to get the best offer he can, which is understandable.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:12 am    Post subject:

If KD wants to come to the Lakers on a cheap short term deal I would be interested in signing him...
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:13 am    Post subject:

Yong wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I kind of agree, but AD is only 26 years old and a top 12-15 player. He should have another good 6 years or more. You can build around him even after Lebron is gone. If we were talking about an aging star player then it would be different. It just comes down to asking price. Emptying all of our assets for him would be disappointing but I'd be excited about a Lebron/AD/free agent core.


Haha you say that now. But look at what superstar AD achieved with a crappy roster in NO. They never managed to build anything with him lol. That's exactly the situation that we will be facing when LBJ retires and all that's left is AD and scrubs.


Still rather build around AD than 3 role players
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:15 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
adkindo wrote:
I would try to get the #6 from Phoenix with Josh Jackson for Lonzo Ball.

Then trade Josh Jackson, Kuzma, Wagner, #4, #6 & 2021 1st Round Pick.

So a three team deal since the Pels would presumably want to pick their oen player at #6.


It do not think it qualifies? Maybe add a Pels future 2nd swapping with PHX.

That would work.


basically so is someone else in the deal from my perception....trading one 2017 draft pick that did not work out and cant shoot for another.....it is about need...PHX desperately needs a PG and have too many young SF's. Jackson appears to be the odd man out.

You're making a false equivalence since Zo is bringing back Jackson and the #6 pick in your proposed trade, but sure. If that's what the Pelicans prefer, then it would make sense to do it since the Lakers would be able to come out of the deal with AD and enough cap space to sign Kyrie.


It is not a "false equivalence" because I described how team needs would influence the decision.

Well, it's unimportant, but let me register my disagreement with your absurd claim that Lonzo is a "2017 pick who didn't work out." Heck, I wouldn't even go that far with Jackson yet.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:17 am    Post subject:

No.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:18 am    Post subject:

Grodyman wrote:
Ok, the Raptors got Kawhi and Green for Derozan, a young center, and a protected future first, which will probably be late round.

Why in the hell are the Lakers giving up so much for Davis????????????????

#4, BI, Wagner TOPS, maybe not even that

Good God


Part of it was because the Raptors were a) giving them back an All-Star in return and b) taking a huge risk because Kawhi gave no indication he would stay in Toronto. They were also dealing with a softer market because of that plus no one knew for sure the extent of his leg injury because he was ducking the media all season.

It's funny how the plan changed in just one season. Last season the plan was to land two All-Stars to play alongside the young core. We got half of it done but whiffed on PG13. A year later, now many talking like we need three stars.

The Lakers don't have to outbid what the Raptors bid for Kawhi. They have to outbid what everyone else is bidding for AD. If the price is too high, like what Tragic offered, then walk away and go back to last year's plan to acquire the second star and hope the young guys step it up.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:19 am    Post subject:

Inspector Gadget wrote:
If KD wants to come to the Lakers on a cheap short term deal I would be interested in signing him...


Take a second to think about what you said and why it makes zero sense..
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:19 am    Post subject:

LKA wrote:
Yong wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I kind of agree, but AD is only 26 years old and a top 12-15 player. He should have another good 6 years or more. You can build around him even after Lebron is gone. If we were talking about an aging star player then it would be different. It just comes down to asking price. Emptying all of our assets for him would be disappointing but I'd be excited about a Lebron/AD/free agent core.


Haha you say that now. But look at what superstar AD achieved with a crappy roster in NO. They never managed to build anything with him lol. That's exactly the situation that we will be facing when LBJ retires and all that's left is AD and scrubs.


Still rather build around AD than 3 role players

There's perversely a negative opportunity cost trying to build around a non-initiating star like AD. I don't know, maybe AD would be a draw for other stars in LA.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:19 am    Post subject:

There are very few PROVEN all-stars in the league. There are even fewer multiple time, perennial all-stars in the league.

Griffin may not value D'Angelo Russell on the same level as other elite talent, but that's because DLO isn't elite talent. He is a damn good player, a guy who has made an all-star team. There's potential for D'LO to become a top 15-20 player. So you do have the qualifications for one of the core wants from Griffin. He is getting an all-star talent back. Not a perennial, superstar type. Not a guy you may think will win you a ring as the #1. But you also have Zion. And you're not asking for one back anyway, because you know you won't get equal value.

Griffin is not mad, he knows he's not getting equal value back. He won't get a perennial all-star or all NBA player like Anthony Davis is. He won't get a top 10, 15 player back.

D'LO is a top 30-40 player in the league, based on last year. He is still young, and could get better. Then the other demand the Pels have is picks. This is where BRK is in need of more team. They need to send their assets to a third team to get these picks to NOR.

Big question is whether a) D'LO is willing to sign the max 4 years with Pelicans and b) if Nets can structure a 3rd team into it that will take on Allen and other players they have for a few picks. If BRK can get D'LO's agent and NOR to agree on a contract, if they can get the draft picks via a third team, I think this is the deal that gets done.

Now for us to get there, we would need to turn Ingram and another asset into an all-star level player, then add our #4 into it. If we do that, we can get AD. However it remains to be seen if a) We want to give up all that and b) If we would be able to get that all-star level player.


Last edited by wolfpaclaker on Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject:

https://twitter.com/_Andrew_Lopez/status/1138470403146428422

Quote:
Andrew Lopez
‏@_Andrew_Lopez

Full quote here from David Griffin about any potential Anthony Davis deal coming before the Draft.

He tries to downplay the timetable part.



Darn, so it might not be by this weekend.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject:

I would keep entire young core, trade Lebron to the Knicks for #3, then draft Barrett and Hunter. Then I would sign any max FA that would come here.

Ball
Ingram
Kuzma
Barrett
Hunter
Hart
Wagner
Max FA
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:21 am    Post subject:

rock0100 wrote:
Darkndeep wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
LBJ23 wrote:
Ingram, #4, Hart, another 1st. Keep Zo and Kuz


Deal


This trade would require Ingram, Hart, Wagner, Bonga and we would still be about $2 million shy on the salary side.

Would it be possible to use the trade exception from the Zubac trade to bring in a player that would be used just to include in the trade and close the $2 million gap?

I would happily give the #4 and 2 future first round picks with the players listed above if we got to keep Kuz and Zo.



Probably so if they can find the right contract that another team wants to get rid of and it fits within the TPE.

The issue is that current projections have the TPE needing to be surrendered to have the cap space for a 30% max player. Converting the TPE to actual salary would make it probably impossible to offer a 30% max contract.


If the goals are to sign a 30% max and trade for Davis, then they will have to work things in a certain sequence.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:22 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
rock0100 wrote:
Darkndeep wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
LBJ23 wrote:
Ingram, #4, Hart, another 1st. Keep Zo and Kuz


Deal


This trade would require Ingram, Hart, Wagner, Bonga and we would still be about $2 million shy on the salary side.

Would it be possible to use the trade exception from the Zubac trade to bring in a player that would be used just to include in the trade and close the $2 million gap?

I would happily give the #4 and 2 future first round picks with the players listed above if we got to keep Kuz and Zo.



Probably so if they can find the right contract that another team wants to get rid of and it fits within the TPE.

The issue is that current projections have the TPE needing to be surrendered to have the cap space for a 30% max player. Converting the TPE to actual salary would make it probably impossible to offer a 30% max contract.


If the goals are to sign a 30% max and trade for Davis, then they will have to work things in a certain sequence.

I'm almost certain the TPE has to be renounced for cap space purposes.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:22 am    Post subject:

Yong wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
laker50 wrote:
Actually, beginning to conclude that the Lakers will be better off in the long run without Lebron. Sure he is an all time player.
But the Lakers are making stupid moves to meet his timeframe.
Two years at the most. At the expense of 15 to 20 years of being in the lottery again.
It takes time for wine to age.
It would be best if the Lakers just take him as a player and not try to change the whole roster for him. You saw what was left of Miami and Cavs.
And if Lebron wants a trade trade him for some good assets do it.


I kind of agree, but AD is only 26 years old and a top 12-15 player. He should have another good 6 years or more. You can build around him even after Lebron is gone. If we were talking about an aging star player then it would be different. It just comes down to asking price. Emptying all of our assets for him would be disappointing but I'd be excited about a Lebron/AD/free agent core.


Haha you say that now. But look at what superstar AD achieved with a crappy roster in NO. They never managed to build anything with him lol. That's exactly the situation that we will be facing when LBJ retires and all that's left is AD and scrubs.


I get it. AD isn't a #1 or even a 1b. The point is I think we can compete with a Lebron/AD/max FA core. When Lebron retires that'll be $40M off the books and we can add talent around AD.

To be clear, my dream scenario is to just sign Kawhi and keep the band together. I'm just trying to play out this AD scenario as mental preparation for when/if it goes down. It's not my preferred path this offseason.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:23 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
https://twitter.com/_Andrew_Lopez/status/1138470403146428422

Quote:
Andrew Lopez
‏@_Andrew_Lopez

Full quote here from David Griffin about any potential Anthony Davis deal coming before the Draft.

He tries to downplay the timetable part.



Darn, so it might not be by this weekend.

Of course he is right now. This adds pressure on him, not the other teams. He totally wants to get the deal done before, so he can then select the player in the draft. Means if he's dealing with NY or LA. He wants the pick at 3 or 4 to be his call, not NY's. If he's dealing with a team that is getting him a top 15 pick in this draft using their assets, again, his call.

So I don't know why he would think otherwise. I think AD will get moved by draft day. I don't know which team, but I would be surprised if AD isn't moved by then. I can see a deal be agreed to, but not become official until the new cap comes into play June 30.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:23 am    Post subject:

unleasHell wrote:
We should only bring DLO back if we can also bring in Nick Young...


and hire an assistant coach of social media.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:23 am    Post subject:

Grodyman wrote:
Ok, the Raptors got Kawhi and Green for Derozan, a young center, and a protected future first, which will probably be late round.

Why in the hell are the Lakers giving up so much for Davis????????????????

#4, BI, Wagner TOPS, maybe not even that

Good God


Right? Some of these offers are ridic. Paul George netted Victor Oladipo (a former #2 pick with four mediocre years under his belt) and Domantas Sabonis (a former #11 pick coming off a disappointing first year). Oladipo hadn't flashed the kind of promise that either Lonzo or Ingram have to this point and Sabonis seemed like a bust and probably worth less than Kuz or Hart at this point. But for AD, we have to trade all those guys, the #4 pick in this draft AND future picks (and possibly eat a bad contract)? No way.

There's two scenarios in play for me here. One is that we're getting a stud FA who's worth mortgaging the future to create a three-headed monster (Kawhi, possibly Klay or Kyrie). In that case, we need to move the majority of our young assets to make the deal work. By my rough math, we can either keep Zo alone or send Zo with BI/#4 and keep Kuz/Hart (and potentially Bonga/Wagner). If you are putting together a super team, it's worth the price, but that price shouldn't include ALL our chits.

If we ain't getting Kawhi, then I'd still go after AD, but I'd only offer something like BI & #4. Maybe Hart or another future first. That's a better package than the Spurs or Pacers received when they traded their stars, why are we paying so much more? That still leaves a team with Bron/AD/Zo/Kuz/Hart and about $25M in cap space.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:26 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
https://twitter.com/_Andrew_Lopez/status/1138470403146428422

Quote:
Andrew Lopez
‏@_Andrew_Lopez

Full quote here from David Griffin about any potential Anthony Davis deal coming before the Draft.

He tries to downplay the timetable part.



Darn, so it might not be by this weekend.


It won’t be because they’re asking for too much.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:27 am    Post subject:

I am trying to think why the Nets would do this? Is it to get a cheaper cap hold? Assuming they are sure they can get two max free agents, then they want someone cheaper on a cheap cap hold. So for them in that scenario, Garland or someone like that at 4, makes more sense than D'LO at the max. They'll have Kyrie and another max player.

Now for us, we would be trying to re-direct D'LO to Pelicans and add maybe Ingram and a future pick to it? It's a lot involved and I don't know if this is at all realistic.

Would I do it to get D'LO at the max? No. I don't think it's worth using 4 and the max contract D'LO would likely get to get D'LO. I wouldn't use capspace and the 4th pick to get D'LO on a max. Straight up for cap? Yes, I'd use it on D'LO.

Now if it's package D'LO to get Anthony Davis. I would consider it.

Basically -

Use max slot on D'LO? Yes ok with me if other vet All-stars say no. Can fit in with Ball/LBJ/Kuzma very well. Trade Ingram for a big.

Use 4 to get D'LO and then re-sign him? NO WAY.

Use 4 to get D'LO and then package D'LO and other assets for AD? Yes, probably.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:31 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
https://twitter.com/_Andrew_Lopez/status/1138470403146428422

Quote:
Andrew Lopez
‏@_Andrew_Lopez

Full quote here from David Griffin about any potential Anthony Davis deal coming before the Draft.

He tries to downplay the timetable part.



Darn, so it might not be by this weekend.


He also might want to downplay the narrative that Woj just pushed yesterday; that they are really on a strict timetable. Supposedly he really does want to work out prospects.

Or maybe KD’s injury may have shook things up and he will let the dust settle
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