How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that.
The questions could go back and forth endlessly.
Like what would it be like for Kobe to have someone else to take the load off when it comes to ball handling duties? Goes both ways, like you said.
To use your own logic against you for a moment, I think it’s odd that you assume there would be less chance of a beef between LeBron and Shaq.
LeBron can be very passive aggressive and Shaq was known to take any perceived slight to heart.
LBJ never had to Really acquiesce to anyone the caliber of a Shaq. I could see that pairing butting heads very quickly.
One of the reasons I respect Kobe was how long he made it last with Shaq as year after year he added to his game in preparation for championship runs only to see The Diesel come into camp more and more out of shape.
The professional respect Kobe deserved from Shaq was never truly given to him, IMO. And no one loves Shaq more than me. But it’s what went down
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Possibly, but I can imagine it working out well.
Lebron was the best player on every NBA team he's been starting as a teenager. If he joins a prime Shaq, that's completely different. Instead of players learning to coexist with Lebron, Lebron would have to learn to coexist with Shaq.
We can only guess how a player of that magnitude taking the pressure off Lebron affects him. He's a smart guy, and I can see him adapting to the situation. Heck, maybe he ever develops a jumper earlier because of the situation.
I wouldn't assume that if you change the situation, there would be no change to the Lebron we saw in his early Cavs days.
Last edited by activeverb on Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: 29 Aug 2004 Posts: 11197 Location: The Other Perspective
Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:12 pm Post subject:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Enough about rings.
Who hypothetically sings better? Kobe or LBJ?
Lol would Kobe be allowed to rap? _________________ "Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that.
The questions could go back and forth endlessly.
Like what would it be like for Kobe to have someone else to take the load off when it comes to ball handling duties? Goes both ways, like you said.
To use your own logic against you for a moment, I think it’s odd that you assume there would be less chance of a beef between LeBron and Shaq.
LeBron can be very passive aggressive and Shaq was known to take any perceived slight to heart.
LBJ never had to Really acquiesce to anyone the caliber of a Shaq. I could see that pairing butting heads very quickly.
One of the reasons I respect Kobe was how long he made it last with Shaq as year after year he added to his game in preparation for championship runs only to see The Diesel come into camp more and more out of shape.
The professional respect Kobe deserved from Shaq was never truly given to him, IMO. And no one loves Shaq more than me. But it’s what went down
That's the point. People talk like it's a fact in these hypotheticals. What about Kobe possibly not getting along with Wade? Or LBJ and Shaq butting heads in the lane? And so on. I don't really care to argue in hypotheticals. But I will point out when someone acts as if a hypothetical is a fact. It isn't. Too many variables. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that.
The questions could go back and forth endlessly.
Like what would it be like for Kobe to have someone else to take the load off when it comes to ball handling duties? Goes both ways, like you said.
To use your own logic against you for a moment, I think it’s odd that you assume there would be less chance of a beef between LeBron and Shaq.
LeBron can be very passive aggressive and Shaq was known to take any perceived slight to heart.
LBJ never had to Really acquiesce to anyone the caliber of a Shaq. I could see that pairing butting heads very quickly.
One of the reasons I respect Kobe was how long he made it last with Shaq as year after year he added to his game in preparation for championship runs only to see The Diesel come into camp more and more out of shape.
The professional respect Kobe deserved from Shaq was never truly given to him, IMO. And no one loves Shaq more than me. But it’s what went down
That's the point. People talk like it's a fact in these hypotheticals. What about Kobe possibly not getting along with Wade? Or LBJ and Shaq butting heads in the lane? And so on. I don't really care to argue in hypotheticals. But I will point out when someone acts as if a hypothetical is a fact. It isn't. Too many variables.
The Wade example is a good one. People used to say Wade hated Kobe and the broken nose was proof.
Somehow magically they’re supposed to gel enough to win 33% more titles? Amazing how it works out that way but then it’s not really.
You think this thread is long now...it will be brought back to life in 2 years if lebron doesn't win a championship in purple and gold. Real Laker fans know that chips are the only thing that matter, ask Kobe's wife. We don't hand out participation awards, and losing in the Finals is just that....losing.
Are you hoping that the Lakers don't win a ring or two b/c LBJ is on the team?
C'mon my man. I hope we win a ring every year. Let me repeat myself "Chips are the only thing that matter to true Laker fans". Pencil me in as a true Laker fan.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Possibly, but I can imagine it working out well.
Lebron was the best player on every NBA team he's been starting as a teenager. If he joins a prime Shaq, that's completely different. Instead of players learning to coexist with Lebron, Lebron would have to learn to coexist with Shaq.
We can only guess how a player of that magnitude taking the pressure off Lebron affects him. He's a smart guy, and I can see him adapting to the situation. Heck, maybe he ever develops a jumper earlier because of the situation.
I wouldn't assume that if you change the situation, there would be no change to the Lebron we saw in his early Cavs days.
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that.
The questions could go back and forth endlessly.
Like what would it be like for Kobe to have someone else to take the load off when it comes to ball handling duties? Goes both ways, like you said.
To use your own logic against you for a moment, I think it’s odd that you assume there would be less chance of a beef between LeBron and Shaq.
LeBron can be very passive aggressive and Shaq was known to take any perceived slight to heart.
LBJ never had to Really acquiesce to anyone the caliber of a Shaq. I could see that pairing butting heads very quickly.
One of the reasons I respect Kobe was how long he made it last with Shaq as year after year he added to his game in preparation for championship runs only to see The Diesel come into camp more and more out of shape.
The professional respect Kobe deserved from Shaq was never truly given to him, IMO. And no one loves Shaq more than me. But it’s what went down
That's the point. People talk like it's a fact in these hypotheticals. What about Kobe possibly not getting along with Wade? Or LBJ and Shaq butting heads in the lane? And so on. I don't really care to argue in hypotheticals. But I will point out when someone acts as if a hypothetical is a fact. It isn't. Too many variables.
You think this thread is long now...it will be brought back to life in 2 years if lebron doesn't win a championship in purple and gold. Real Laker fans know that chips are the only thing that matter, ask Kobe's wife. We don't hand out participation awards, and losing in the Finals is just that....losing.
Are you hoping that the Lakers don't win a ring or two b/c LBJ is on the team?
C'mon my man. I hope we win a ring every year. Let me repeat myself "Chips are the only thing that matter to true Laker fans". Pencil me in as a true Laker fan.
Awesome! Glad you're still on board. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
You think this thread is long now...it will be brought back to life in 2 years if lebron doesn't win a championship in purple and gold. Real Laker fans know that chips are the only thing that matter, ask Kobe's wife. We don't hand out participation awards, and losing in the Finals is just that....losing.
Then why is this a debate? Just copy/paste an ordered list of ring count with Bill Russell at the top.
From that era You'd get no debate from me, but like I've said many times, I view the current NBA from a post-1979 perspective.
How about prime LBJ and Shaq (and that excellent supporting cast)? How many rings?
maybe 1 or 2. definitely not 3-peating
They dont get past SA or maybe even SAC or Minny in some of those series.
Or maybe more b/c there's less of a chance of a LBJ/Shaq beef that split the team up.
It's really not a science. But I do find it interesting that Kobe will win 4+ rings with the Heat (notwithstanding that Wade/Bosh/Battier, etc. declined pretty rapidly towards the end, culminated with Bosh's blood clot issue) but LBJ is winning "maybe 1 or 2."
I'm not saying it's right or wrong. But kind of shows that this is more fiction than fact. As long as we acknowledge that, it's all done for fun.
Well, LeBron doesn’t like playing with centers who clog the lane, right?
That was Shaq’s territory.
Knowing how unreliable LeBron’s jumper was in his early 20’s I could see there being a issue with how they fit together.
Kobe was probably the best 21 year old to ever play. And his 22 and 23 year old seasons were unreal.
Winning 3 in a row is quite rare. So yeah, I doubt LBJ and Shaq would’ve done it.
Plus they both suck at free throws in the clutch
Huge issue in tight games down the stretch
How does Kobe work with 2 other bona fide All star starters in Wade (who replicates a lot of what Kobe did and the spots on the floor) and Bosh?
How about how Wade/Bosh started petering out towards the end of the run? How does one expect "4+" championships out of it?
Getting 2, maybe 3 is plausible. 4+? Not even Kobe with the mighty Shaq could do that.
The questions could go back and forth endlessly.
Like what would it be like for Kobe to have someone else to take the load off when it comes to ball handling duties? Goes both ways, like you said.
To use your own logic against you for a moment, I think it’s odd that you assume there would be less chance of a beef between LeBron and Shaq.
LeBron can be very passive aggressive and Shaq was known to take any perceived slight to heart.
LBJ never had to Really acquiesce to anyone the caliber of a Shaq. I could see that pairing butting heads very quickly.
One of the reasons I respect Kobe was how long he made it last with Shaq as year after year he added to his game in preparation for championship runs only to see The Diesel come into camp more and more out of shape.
The professional respect Kobe deserved from Shaq was never truly given to him, IMO. And no one loves Shaq more than me. But it’s what went down
That's the point. People talk like it's a fact in these hypotheticals. What about Kobe possibly not getting along with Wade? Or LBJ and Shaq butting heads in the lane? And so on. I don't really care to argue in hypotheticals. But I will point out when someone acts as if a hypothetical is a fact. It isn't. Too many variables.
The Wade example is a good one. People used to say Wade hated Kobe and the broken nose was proof.
Somehow magically they’re supposed to gel enough to win 33% more titles? Amazing how it works out that way but then it’s not really.
Maybe it would’ve worked, maybe not. It’s all fun conjecture
Maybe it would’ve worked, maybe not. It’s all fun conjecture
And what are the reasons Kobe/Wade wouldn’t have worked?
Didn’t you just make the case that they might not have gotten along so easily? You never know how that would play out.
But if you want my opinion, I think they’re both attack dogs that would’ve loved taking turns ripping the soul out of their opponents
Kobe could thrive under any team, regardless of roster configuration.
LeBron needs things to fit his system of play more, I think.
I just see Kobe as far more versatile, in the end
Maybe it would’ve worked, maybe not. It’s all fun conjecture
And what are the reasons Kobe/Wade wouldn’t have worked?
Didn’t you just make the case that they might not have gotten along so easily? You never know how that would play out.
But if you want my opinion, I think they’re both attack dogs that would’ve loved taking turns ripping the soul out of their opponents
I was looking for all of the reasons Kobe/Wade wouldn’t work out. For fun conjecture.
Maybe Wade gets upset Kobe hogging the ball and they have a falling out? Stuff like that. Thoughts?
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