New Foston Celtic Argument
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babyskyhook
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:32 pm    Post subject:

Beir32 wrote:
I will say that I agree with one point in all this silliness…

If the Lakers are gonna count their Minneapolis championships (which they should) then it’s past time to retire Mikan’s number.


Agreed.
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LandsbergerRules
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:54 am    Post subject:

babyskyhook wrote:
Beir32 wrote:
I will say that I agree with one point in all this silliness…

If the Lakers are gonna count their Minneapolis championships (which they should) then it’s past time to retire Mikan’s number.


Agreed.



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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:05 am    Post subject:

Let them make the arguments.

I mean, how many titles have the Celtics won in the last 50 years?

How many have the Lakers?
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GOODRICH25
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:13 am    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
CervantesRises wrote:
So it's either 11 to 4 Us or 18 to 17 Us...damn right I'm claiming the one in '48.

Either way it's US!


Me, too. The NBA celebrates its starting year as 1946 - which was when the NBL started, therefore our 1948 NBL Title should count.


That's because the BAA was founded in 46. In 49 the BAA and NBL merged to form the NBA, but the new NBA officially recognized championships from the BAA only. The NBL has been around for much longer though, it would have been better if they recognized the NBL past as well (even tho there is a overlap with the BAA 46-49):

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basketball_Association_of_America
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Basketball_League_(United_States)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_National_Basketball_League_(United_States)_champions

For example, Pistons would now have 5 championships instead of 3, and we would have 18 officially. The other champions like Oshkosh, Sheboygan and Chicago are extinct by now.
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governator
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:44 am    Post subject:

pokoy wrote:
DLaker wrote:
https://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/22/freaky-friday-n-b-a-style-when-the-clippers-were-the-celtics/


Yep.

Sure, we’ll say we only have 12. Way more than their measly 4.


Lol, honestly didn’t know this, thanks for this new ammo to my suddenly Celtics-clippers loving knicks fan friends up here
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:46 am    Post subject:

l4kerz wrote:
activeverb wrote:
Beir32 wrote:
I will say that I agree with one point in all this silliness…

If the Lakers are gonna count their Minneapolis championships (which they should) then it’s past time to retire Mikan’s number.



The Lakers have always had a weird relationship with their Minneapolis days. They love the ring count, but don't want to truly acknowledge the players.

They should have retired the numbers of George Mikan, Slater Martin, Jim Pollard, and Vern Mikkelsen 20 or 30 years ago.

Although at this point, it also seems a little pointless. You can't honor them, because they're all dead. You can't really honor their memory, because hardly any Lakers fans remember them.


There was a ceremony in 2002.

https://www.splicetoday.com/sports/the-los-angeles-lakers-and-the-art-of-legacy-inflation

Quote:
On April 11, 2002, the Los Angeles Lakers completed their assumption of all things “Laker” by affixing two banners to the wall of the Staples Center. One banner featured the names of the five Minneapolis Lakers players enshrined in the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, along with the name of their coach, John Kundla, and the other acknowledged and laid claim to the five NBA championships won by the Lakers franchise in Minneapolis.

All of this was done during a late-season home game against the Minnesota Timberwolves, which was either a deliberate attempt to legitimize the title grab by ostensibly paying homage to the former Minneapolis franchise while some of their former fans might be tuning in, or a cruel powerplay to strip Minnesotans and their city of five of their championships and make them watch helplessly while it occurred. Certainly, there would be little Minnesota could do to honor the men who had done all of their winning while headquartered in Minneapolis if the most public monuments to their achievements adorned the walls of the Staples Center.

The Lakers, led by Shaquille O’Neal and Kobe Bryant, took the floor adorned in bright blue jerseys bearing yellow trim, with the classic “MPLS” lettering of the defunct Minneapolis Lakers franchise stitched across their chests. On commentary, legendary Lakers play-by-play announcer Chick Hearn immediately localized the color combination, claiming that it reminded him of “...UCLA, all the way!”

During a halftime ceremony, Los Angeles Lakers legends James Worthy, Elgin Baylor and Magic Johnson were among the former players who awarded championship rings and other trinkets to the former members of the Minneapolis franchise, including their franchise center George Mikan, and then the banner representing five championships was hoisted along the wall. Color commentator Stu Lantz quickly did the math, but then made a Freudian slip when he remarked, “So, you add those five championships with the eight Laker banners that are up there, and you’ve got 13 franchise championships!”


What insipid old crotch wrote that soured buttermilk? Might as well have been Charley Rosen, Phil's old pal. Another "the Lakers are not the Lakers" genius.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:49 am    Post subject:

The only real debate is 17 versus 18 for the Lakers.

Everything else is rationalization.

There was basketball in the '50's, the Lakers were the first real dynasty the NBA had, the Lakers have competed in the NBA every year since then, and the Lakers are still on top. Period.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:56 am    Post subject:

NBA.com says the Lakers franchise has won 17 titles and are tied with the Celtics.

This is what the NBA recognizes.

Again, anything else is rationalization by fans who can't accept the truth.

Fan fiction by Boston stans.
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Harlemlakerfan
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:06 am    Post subject:

so..... If the Lakers shouldn't get credit the the Minny titles, does that mean that the Twolves should get the credit the titles because they are the team in Minny now? sounds silly right? Its not about the city. The franchise moved.
This complaint reeks of desperation.
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hydrohead
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:03 am    Post subject:

The Lakers have 17 and counting
The LA Lakers have 12 and counting
To say the Laker have tied the Celtics is a correct statement.

The LA Lakers will eventually have more than the Celtics anyway. no player wants to play on Boston.
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Nobody
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:10 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
I think everyone’s championships count. Even though 11 of Boston’s 17 happened before the 1970s they still get to count them. Personally I feel pretty good that most of ours have come in the modern era but ya never know maybe Boston will figure out how to win more in the color TV era.


Zing!
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:12 am    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
The argument that the Minneapolis chips shouldn't count has never made any real sense. The organization is what matters, not where they're located. The Lakers, the organization, relocated to Los Angeles.

Several teams have relocated over the many years of this league. Should we dismiss all of the team history of the Thunder since they relocated there from Seattle? And what about the Clippers? We can play this asinine game all day. It's silly.


Yep. The team relocated under the same owner (Bob Short) and continued playing. The argument is nonsensical. But they can feel free to make it. When you've won as little as they have in recent decades I guess that's one way to find some solace.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:32 am    Post subject:

1 title in 34 years and if we had a healthy Bynum it wouldn’t exist 😆😂🤣
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GOODRICH25
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:59 am    Post subject:

KingKobe20 wrote:
1 title in 34 years and if we had a healthy Bynum it wouldn’t exist 😆😂🤣

And Ariza
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:39 am    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
CervantesRises wrote:
So it's either 11 to 4 Us or 18 to 17 Us...damn right I'm claiming the one in '48.

Either way it's US!


Me, too. The NBA celebrates its starting year as 1946 - which was when the NBL started, therefore our 1948 NBL Title should count.


The NBL started in 1938.

Funny that there are only 3 original BAA franchises currently in the NBA: the Celtics, the Warriors and the Knicks.

On the other hand, there are 5 NBL franchises currently in the NBA: the Lakers, the Nationals (76ers), the Royals (Kings), the Pistons, the Blackhawks (Hawks).
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WorthyNum1
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:56 am    Post subject:

No one ever questioned the total # of championships of the Dodgers (6, 1 in Brooklyn), Giants (8, 5 in New York), Athletics (9, 5 in Philadelphia), Raiders (2 in Oakland, 1 in L.A.), Braves (3, 1 in Boston and 1 in Milwaukee), Warriors (6, 2 in Philadelphia), 76ers (3, 1 in Syracuse), etc.

Yet it's always the Lakers' 5 titles from Minny that's being disputed. Only Celtics fans can think of such nonsense to whine.

One of the dumbest arguments I've seen from a Celtics forum is "they shouldn't be counted because you fans in Los Angeles didn't experience those championships".

Experience? BFD!
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Ziggy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:20 pm    Post subject:

LandsbergerRules wrote:
babyskyhook wrote:
Beir32 wrote:
I will say that I agree with one point in all this silliness…

If the Lakers are gonna count their Minneapolis championships (which they should) then it’s past time to retire Mikan’s number.


Agreed.




I read a story on reddit that Mikan only wanted the Lakers to retire his number if they'd retire a few of his teammates numbers too. But some of those numbers were either already being worn or were retired. So that is why they decided to just hang a banner with their names listed on it. Mikan's number is essentially retired as they won't allow any other player to wear it if they request it.
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LakerDynasty6.0
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:26 pm    Post subject:

GOODRICH25 wrote:
strong9 wrote:
Beir32 wrote:
I will say that I agree with one point in all this silliness…

If the Lakers are gonna count their Minneapolis championships (which they should) then it’s past time to retire Mikan’s number.


It's way overdue. So is Vern Mikkelson as well to be honest. Hall of Famer who won titles with the Lakers (other than Elgin). That's the criteria right?


Im not sure if there is a criteria but comparing what those guys did to other dynaaties i would retire some and some wouldnt. 1st of all, Mikan definitely. No questions asked. The other 2 are Pollard and Mikkelsen. They were no.2 and no.3 at different times in that 1st dynasty (Pollard was there from the beginning, winning 48 NBL and 49 BAA titles with Mikan, Mikkelsen joined for the remaining 4). They both spent their career in our shirt and interestingly both are born in California. Martin was as high as no.4 (sometimes lower) on our championship teams and left to win another chip for a rival (St Louis). I dont see how his contribution for us is higher than that of a Cooper or Fisher, so he shouldnt be held in as high regards as Mikan, Pollard and Mikkelsen. Lovellette won just one chip here as a rookie and another 2 in Boston. He was probably the best od them behind Mikan but he showed it elsewhere mostly. So them 2 i would not retire. Plus their numbers are up there already with Shaq and Elgin so they missed out anyway.


well said...
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angrypuppy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 3:46 pm    Post subject:

In the NFL, no one counts championships prior to Super Bowl I in 1967. The reason is that the NFL consisted of only 14 teams prior to the first Super Bowl; in other words there were so few teams that an NFL championship didn't really count. We should apply the same logic to the Celtics. If you make 1967 the marker, then 8 of the Boston championships should be eliminated as the NBA only had 8 to 9 teams back then.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2020 4:10 pm    Post subject: Re: New Foston Celtic Argument

AD23 wrote:
Truly pathetic fans.

My friend (from Boston but lives in LA) now says Lakers only have 12 rings, the 5 from Minneapolis don't count

I just thank him for the $1,000 I won on our bet


Tell your friend that Boston sucks! Always has, always will.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:06 pm    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
CervantesRises wrote:
So it's either 11 to 4 Us or 18 to 17 Us...damn right I'm claiming the one in '48.

Either way it's US!


Me, too. The NBA celebrates its starting year as 1946 - which was when the NBL started, therefore our 1948 NBL Title should count.




The NBL started in 1937 and was merged into the NBA in 1949.

The previous championships of the teams didn't transfer over to the NBA, anymore than the ABA championships did.

If they had the Pistons would have two more rings from its NBL roots. The Indiana Pacers and Brooklyn Nets would have a ring from their ABA roots.
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