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LakerSanity
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 Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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The continuity theme between the movies was a huge risk for Marvel, but its totally worked out. GoG has taken some of the momentum from the other movies to create its own success. That they are all connected also provides more credibility to each one.... not to mention some great story writing and wonderful casting choices.
That said, Marvel has had quite a good deal of flops too. Ghost Rider, Daredevil, Fantastic Four and, to some extent, the Spiderman films, have disappointed.
Ironically, one of my favorite superhero movies ever was the Watchmen. I loved Sin City too. I know I'm in the minority there. The hell boy movies weren't bad either as comic book films go.
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Christopher C
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | Ironically, one of my favorite superhero movies ever was the Watchmen. I loved Sin City too. I know I'm in the minority there. |
I love both of those movies. I love the graphic novel Watchmen even more, however. |
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PrairieAve
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do.
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PLATNUM
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| PrairieAve wrote: | Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
The Marvel films featuring the Avengers are at the top of the hill. Fox has bounced back with Xmen- First Class and DOFP. The Sony produced Spidey films are just awful. Since Spiderman 2 they have gone downhill, FAST. My son fell asleep halfway through Spiderman 2 earlier this summer. Whereas he was wide eyed and fully engaged the entire time during GotG.
The Nolan directed Dark Knight trilogy is awesome. Jury is still out on the last Supes film and the upcoming Justice league themed movies. I have my fingers crossed though.
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Fallout
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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| PLATNUM wrote: | | PrairieAve wrote: | Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
The Marvel films featuring the Avengers are at the top of the hill. Fox has bounced back with Xmen- First Class and DOFP. The Sony produced Spidey films are just awful. Since Spiderman 2 they have gone downhill, FAST. My son fell asleep halfway through Spiderman 2 earlier this summer. Whereas he was wide eyed and fully engaged the entire time during GotG.
The Nolan directed Dark Knight trilogy is awesome. Jury is still out on the last Supes film and the upcoming Justice league themed movies. I have my fingers crossed though. |
I like the last MOS. All the Superman movies since Superman 2 sucked. There are some big logic gaps, and lousy casting of Lois Lane, but I enjoyed it.
Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins.
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Clark Kent
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallout wrote: | Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins. |
With the introduction of the Cosmic Universe in GOTG, Planet Hulk and WW Hulk are entirely doable. Rumors suggest a new Hulk movie will go down that path after Avengers 2. |
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PrairieAve
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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| PLATNUM wrote: | | PrairieAve wrote: | Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
The Marvel films featuring the Avengers are at the top of the hill. Fox has bounced back with Xmen- First Class and DOFP. The Sony produced Spidey films are just awful. Since Spiderman 2 they have gone downhill, FAST. My son fell asleep halfway through Spiderman 2 earlier this summer. Whereas he was wide eyed and fully engaged the entire time during GotG.
The Nolan directed Dark Knight trilogy is awesome. Jury is still out on the last Supes film and the upcoming Justice league themed movies. I have my fingers crossed though. |
Dark Knight trilogy was great (other than TDKR focusing on Bruce, after Joker and Harvey dominated screentime in TDK, the last movie was really disappointing)... but it's finished. DC needs to market something else besides Batman and Superman, and they haven't been successful so far.
The story in Man of Steel should have been better, but I thought that it set the right tone for a story arc that leads to Justice League (mankind completely at the mercy of super-powered villains and heroes).
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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Where DC has done better than Marvel is with their animated content. DC has a lot of good straight to video animated movies.
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PLATNUM
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Clark Kent wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins. |
With the introduction of the Cosmic Universe in GOTG, Planet Hulk and WW Hulk are entirely doable. Rumors suggest a new Hulk movie will go down that path after Avengers 2. |
A Doc Strange movie is planned to release in the next 2 years I believe. There was also a rumor floating around that Hulk would be "teaming up" with the Guardians in the next GotG film... segueing into a Planet Hulk or WW Hulk storyline.
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Fallout
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| PLATNUM wrote: | | Clark Kent wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins. |
With the introduction of the Cosmic Universe in GOTG, Planet Hulk and WW Hulk are entirely doable. Rumors suggest a new Hulk movie will go down that path after Avengers 2. |
A Doc Strange movie is planned to release in the next 2 years I believe. There was also a rumor floating around that Hulk would be "teaming up" with the Guardians in the next GotG film... segueing into a Planet Hulk or WW Hulk storyline. |
In terms of action, WW Hulk is the ultimate action movie if done right. But probably 6 years down the road to build that up.
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jonnybravo
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | Where DC has done better than Marvel is with their animated content. DC has a lot of good straight to video animated movies. |
Agreed
They built on the success of the Batman series that came out in the 90's. I don't know for sure but it's the same production/art company that does all of them since then. |
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mhan00
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| jonnybravo wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | | Where DC has done better than Marvel is with their animated content. DC has a lot of good straight to video animated movies. |
Agreed
They built on the success of the Batman series that came out in the 90's. I don't know for sure but it's the same production/art company that does all of them since then. |
DC also has done a great job with their live action television offerings. Smallville was great for its time, Arrow has been awesome, Flash is looking amazing. |
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rwongega
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallout wrote: | | PLATNUM wrote: | | PrairieAve wrote: | Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
The Marvel films featuring the Avengers are at the top of the hill. Fox has bounced back with Xmen- First Class and DOFP. The Sony produced Spidey films are just awful. Since Spiderman 2 they have gone downhill, FAST. My son fell asleep halfway through Spiderman 2 earlier this summer. Whereas he was wide eyed and fully engaged the entire time during GotG.
The Nolan directed Dark Knight trilogy is awesome. Jury is still out on the last Supes film and the upcoming Justice league themed movies. I have my fingers crossed though. |
I like the last MOS. All the Superman movies since Superman 2 sucked. There are some big logic gaps, and lousy casting of Lois Lane, but I enjoyed it.
Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins. |
What Marvel, Disney, and Paramount did right was bring in the right people to direct, write, and produce with minimal interference (cough, Sony, cough). Outside of Nolan, WB/DC's been underwhelming with penis enthusiast and Michael Bay wannabe Snyder (even Watchmen was underwhelming considering the source material) and the debacle known as Green Lantern. Haven't even gotten to the (bleep)-pile known as Catwoman. Simply horrendous casting decisions too (wrong-figured Wonder Woman with sparse acting ability, Kate Bosworth as a Lois Lane, middle age looking Lois Lane and Katie Holmes replacements, and Ben Affleck).
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AllorNothing
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| Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Green Lantern was one of my favorite character and the mess that one up so bad. I hope they can do a good wonder woman or flash movie. Sick of superman and batman. |
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Manilathrilla121
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 2:25 am Post subject: |
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| Fallout wrote: | | PLATNUM wrote: | | Clark Kent wrote: | | Fallout wrote: | Disney hit the jackpot buying Marvel. Match made in heaven. Disney enabled Marvel to budget all these movies, and Marvel provided all these content.
Marvel has some very good story lines, the Civil War story, and my favorite, World War Hulk. If there was a comic that is designed for a movie, its World War Hulk. Hulk vs everyone and wins. |
With the introduction of the Cosmic Universe in GOTG, Planet Hulk and WW Hulk are entirely doable. Rumors suggest a new Hulk movie will go down that path after Avengers 2. |
A Doc Strange movie is planned to release in the next 2 years I believe. There was also a rumor floating around that Hulk would be "teaming up" with the Guardians in the next GotG film... segueing into a Planet Hulk or WW Hulk storyline. |
In terms of action, WW Hulk is the ultimate action movie if done right. But probably 6 years down the road to build that up. |
They'd need to introduce Sentry, which I'd be all for. Even though some people never liked his character, I always did. The Sentry/Void would be an awesome cinematic hero/villain imo. Or instead of Sentry they could just have Thor fill that role because he's the only one close to Hulk's power level. But man, the ending of World War Hulk of two heroes controlling their inner demons fighting it out is just too perfect. Thor has no demons he has to control.
On another note to go back to the original post of this whole thread, check out the easter egg section for GOTG on reddit. People are seeing some very interesting things. |
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City_Dawg
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:33 am Post subject: |
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| PrairieAve wrote: |
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
If DC is going to rely on Zack Snyder to direct these movies, good luck.
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CBaller8
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 7:44 am Post subject: |
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| This movie is sweet. So damn fun. Is the director a fan of Howard the duck? So random |
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AllorNothing
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Are they going to introduce TOAA?  |
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marga86
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 8:35 am Post subject: |
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| i loved the movie.. saw it last night and i thought it was epic. it became an all time favorite for me. |
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22
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| PLATNUM wrote: | | PrairieAve wrote: | Keep in mind that Marvel Cinematic Universe is separate from other Marvel films from Sony and Fox (Spider-man, X-Men, F4, Ghost Rider, Daredevil). The continuity that started with Iron Man in 2008 was a bold strategy (was it really risky to feature a movie with multiple superheroes? Even if Avengers wasn't a monstrous success, a movie of that scale was unlikely to bomb), that's still paying off. I don't think any movies in the MCU continuity have been commercial flops.
DC has a lot of catching up to do. |
The Marvel films featuring the Avengers are at the top of the hill. Fox has bounced back with Xmen- First Class and DOFP. The Sony produced Spidey films are just awful. Since Spiderman 2 they have gone downhill, FAST. My son fell asleep halfway through Spiderman 2 earlier this summer. Whereas he was wide eyed and fully engaged the entire time during GotG.
The Nolan directed Dark Knight trilogy is awesome. Jury is still out on the last Supes film and the upcoming Justice league themed movies. I have my fingers crossed though. |
You guys are right. And like someone mentioned I would love to see the WWHULK storyline branch off of Avengers 2 or 3. The continuity makes the MCU so great. It's the main reason I enjoyed AoS |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 11:31 am Post subject: |
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One of the reasons I brought up the non-disney marvel movies is that most of them predated 2008. Marvel started licensing it's content and learned from a stream of mediocre films, if not downright flops. Films like ghost rider, daredevil and fantastic four came with a degree of corniness and attempted to play too much to the die hards. Those films underestimated the intelligence of audience and were rightfully criticized as a result.
If you look at Green Lantern, it was very kitschy too. Same thing happened with RIPD and the post-burton, pre-nolan Batman films. Same problem with that Jonah Hex movie. Those films seemed to make the same mistakes. The key seems to be to write story that would happen in real life and then adapt that to a superhero theme, not the other way around. If you start right off the bat trying to cater to the fanboys, you play too much to a small group within a very small group.
DC hasn't had a lot of experience in making films yet, it hasn't learned it's lessons and found what the audience wants. However, Nolans batman was key because it maintained the theme that while sunshine and happy endings work with cartoons, they don't work on live action. You need to go dark and infuse humor on the edges. Every successful comic book film has kept these baic themes.
DC seems to be coming around, but given that marvel had a head start, it makes sense DC is a bit behind.
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jonnybravo
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | One of the reasons I brought up the non-disney marvel movies is that most of them predated 2008. Marvel started licensing it's content and learned from a stream of mediocre films, if not downright flops. Films like ghost rider, daredevil and fantastic four came with a degree of corniness and attempted to play too much to the die hards. Those films underestimated the intelligence of audience and were rightfully criticized as a result.
If you look at Green Lantern, it was very kitschy too. Same thing happened with RIPD and the post-burton, pre-nolan Batman films. Same problem with that Jonah Hex movie. Those films seemed to make the same mistakes. The key seems to be to write story that would happen in real life and then adapt that to a superhero theme, not the other way around. If you start right off the bat trying to cater to the fanboys, you play too much to a small group within a very small group.
DC hasn't had a lot of experience in making films yet, it hasn't learned it's lessons and found what the audience wants. However, Nolans batman was key because it maintained the theme that while sunshine and happy endings work with cartoons, they don't work on live action. You need to go dark and infuse humor on the edges. Every successful comic book film has kept these baic themes.
DC seems to be coming around, but given that marvel had a head start, it makes sense DC is a bit behind. |
The bolded is what I've maintained for ages. The moment filmmakers made the decision to make a good movie that HAPPENED to be based on comic book movies, that's when we started having good comic book movie. For ages, comic book movies were made by people who think "well, this is how it should look" and nothing else. Batman & Robin was this approach at it's epoch. Literally, every idiotic villain in that movie played an absurd over the top caricature.
As far as them needing to go dark, I don't agree that it's a necessity. There are quite a few examples of recent quality comic book movies that didn't necessarily go that route (Avengers, Iron Man 1, First Class). |
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rwongega
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | One of the reasons I brought up the non-disney marvel movies is that most of them predated 2008. Marvel started licensing it's content and learned from a stream of mediocre films, if not downright flops. Films like ghost rider, daredevil and fantastic four came with a degree of corniness and attempted to play too much to the die hards. Those films underestimated the intelligence of audience and were rightfully criticized as a result.
If you look at Green Lantern, it was very kitschy too. Same thing happened with RIPD and the post-burton, pre-nolan Batman films. Same problem with that Jonah Hex movie. Those films seemed to make the same mistakes. The key seems to be to write story that would happen in real life and then adapt that to a superhero theme, not the other way around. If you start right off the bat trying to cater to the fanboys, you play too much to a small group within a very small group.
DC hasn't had a lot of experience in making films yet, it hasn't learned it's lessons and found what the audience wants. However, Nolans batman was key because it maintained the theme that while sunshine and happy endings work with cartoons, they don't work on live action. You need to go dark and infuse humor on the edges. Every successful comic book film has kept these baic themes.
DC seems to be coming around, but given that marvel had a head start, it makes sense DC is a bit behind. |
Not at all, most of the die hards hated those movies you mentioned especially seeing as a lot weren't true to the source. In fact, Daredevil was dumbed down for a general audience. The Director's Cut is vastly more true to the material and actually much better.
I hate this impression that movies have to go dark to be better and it's that very reason MOS wasn't as successful as WB wanted it to be (it only had 4 million more tickets sold than Superman Returns, which didn't have the benefit of more theaters and IMAX/3D revenue).
I can summarize Hollywood studio strategy as follows:
1. Everything must be darker. If the future Superman movie doesn't have Superman raping Wonder Woman or snapping more necks, it's not dark enough.
2. Make (bleep) generic horror or torture porn films on the cheap.
3. Make more Tyler Perry-type movies because they're cheap and audiences eat up that crap.
4. If it sounds creative, make others foot the bill first or dump it off to an indie house.
5. Copy the other guy.
6. Remake/reboot whatever works until it doesn't work. And do it in a way that infuriates fans of the original.
7. Animation.
8. 3D everything. And continue charging IMAX prices for fake-IMAX theaters.
9. Whine about piracy when in reality it's because we aren't making good movies worth paying $20 for.
10. Continue approving/disapproving movie ideas like a blind moron.
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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I think both Iron Man (the whole story, really) and Avengers (Colson) went dark. What I mean by dark is that not everything is sunshine/lollipops, that there is room for disappointment and sadness.
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jonnybravo
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 3:26 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | I think both Iron Man (the whole story, really) and Avengers (Colson) went dark. What I mean by dark is that not everything is sunshine/lollipops, that there is room for disappointment and sadness. |
That's pretty broad. The best Iron Man was the first and the movies got progressively worse by most people's agreement as it got "darker". Colson's death had absolutely nothing to do with how good the Avengers was. Had he not died, the quality of that movie and how it rates/ranked wouldn't have changed imo. The overall theme of the Avengers wasn't dark at all imo. I think most people when they consider a movie dark or not it's usually based on the main character going through a lot of internal struggle or personal pain that drives them. Any sort of adversity doesn't necessarily make a movie dark. A move has to be driven by that theme. |
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