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T3R Star Player
Joined: 16 Aug 2012 Posts: 2734 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 8:28 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the thread, very informative. |
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LakerBeastmode Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Aug 2012 Posts: 588 Location: Los Angeles Center of the Universe
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 8:53 am Post subject: |
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Really happy to see more news on Big Bad DH12 health news! Thanks guys |
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Voices Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 10:12 am Post subject: |
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dfchang813 wrote: | A setback can be anything that prevents Dwight from returning to full strength on the basketball court. That could be something as minor as sore muscles which require a bit more rest to the most serious which is a re-herniated disc which would require significantly more downtime or even another surgery.
The chances of a reherniation is very small and is the main reason he has been restricted from running or heavy physical activity for a full 4 months after surgery.
There is obviously no guarantee what will happen in the future but the nature of his injury is considered ACUTE and a full recovery with no loss of strength, agility, and athleticism is expected.
CHRONIC back problems is a rather non-specific phrase that can encompass a wide variety of complaints with very little to do with each other. Certainly if you are thinking about the chronic back issues that plaqued T-Mac or Larry Bird, then Dwight's injury and treatment is completely different from that.
According to most reputable orthopedic surgeons, the only thing he'll need to worry about is a bit more stress and pressure placed on the other vertebra surrounding the one with the small herniation which over a long period of time may slightly shorten his career. Whether it will or not will depend to a large extent on how he takes care of his body and weight as well as the size of the herniation itself (which I hear is very small).
Hope that helps. |
Thank you _________________ .....
.....
ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20. |
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55 Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 12092
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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oldschool32 wrote: | I was listening to the Philly radio station feed after the Bynum press conference, a dr(I think he was a dr) mentioned that in Germany they don't remove part of the disc. They remove the entire disc and replace it with an engineered disc. After disc replacement, the patient is supposed to be good to go. This came up when they were discussing the knee treatment that he will be getting in Germany. I haven't researched it yet to see if it was legit, but I did find it interesting. |
Referring to this? Howard's doctor does it as well. http://watkinsspine.com/artificial-disc-replacement.html |
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dfchang813 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 1508
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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And trust me when I say we don't want Dwight getting ANYWHERE near that ... |
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cital Star Player
Joined: 25 May 2002 Posts: 3649
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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I don't understand why the clapper says Dwight should be ready for training camp, and a lot of other reports say he probably won't be back until December at the earliest??? It will be interesting to see what happens |
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dfchang813 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 1508
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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LakerBaker wrote: | I don't understand why the clapper says Dwight should be ready for training camp, and a lot of other reports say he probably won't be back until December at the earliest??? It will be interesting to see what happens |
Because the other reports are just people making stuff up off of rumors. Meanwhile, Dr. Klapper the chief of orthopedic surgery at Cedar Sinai actually knows what he is talking about! LoL
Dwight is already running, shooting, and lifting weights.
Remember he hasn't worked out for about 4 months so it will take time to get his body back in shape. That won't happen by training camp but by time the season opener hits end of October, he'll be pretty close to normal.
The only sad thing is that the injury prevented him from working on his post moves and adding to his game . . . if that's the sort of thing he does in the off-season . . . |
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JamaalWilkes Star Player
Joined: 25 Oct 2006 Posts: 1176
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Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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KLAP ON
KLAP OFF
DR. KLAPPER |
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Voices Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 8:57 am Post subject: |
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dfchang813 wrote: | LakerBaker wrote: | I don't understand why the clapper says Dwight should be ready for training camp, and a lot of other reports say he probably won't be back until December at the earliest??? It will be interesting to see what happens |
Because the other reports are just people making stuff up off of rumors. Meanwhile, Dr. Klapper the chief of orthopedic surgery at Cedar Sinai actually knows what he is talking about! LoL
Dwight is already running, shooting, and lifting weights.
Remember he hasn't worked out for about 4 months so it will take time to get his body back in shape. That won't happen by training camp but by time the season opener hits end of October, he'll be pretty close to normal.
The only sad thing is that the injury prevented him from working on his post moves and adding to his game . . . if that's the sort of thing he does in the off-season . . . |
..... It is a little confusing....55 provided a link that showed replacing the disc instead of repairing. It seems to me that the replacement surgery has fewer potential problems. I know you do not have access to DH med records, but if you would could you maybe give us some ideas of why one procedure over the other.
I do believe you have stated or confirmed that not all the procedures work 100% of the time, but in DH case, because of the "best in the business Doctors" and his overall health his chances of not having a successful procedure would be very small.
Thanks again for you insight, it is a 100 million dollar question....for us Laker fans...if you are tired of dealing with us backseat Doctors I would understand... _________________ .....
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ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20. |
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55 Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 12092
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 11:06 am Post subject: |
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Voices wrote: | dfchang813 wrote: | LakerBaker wrote: | I don't understand why the clapper says Dwight should be ready for training camp, and a lot of other reports say he probably won't be back until December at the earliest??? It will be interesting to see what happens |
Because the other reports are just people making stuff up off of rumors. Meanwhile, Dr. Klapper the chief of orthopedic surgery at Cedar Sinai actually knows what he is talking about! LoL
Dwight is already running, shooting, and lifting weights.
Remember he hasn't worked out for about 4 months so it will take time to get his body back in shape. That won't happen by training camp but by time the season opener hits end of October, he'll be pretty close to normal.
The only sad thing is that the injury prevented him from working on his post moves and adding to his game . . . if that's the sort of thing he does in the off-season . . . |
..... It is a little confusing....55 provided a link that showed replacing the disc instead of repairing. It seems to me that the replacement surgery has fewer potential problems. I know you do not have access to DH med records, but if you would could you maybe give us some ideas of why one procedure over the other.
I do believe you have stated or confirmed that not all the procedures work 100% of the time, but in DH case, because of the "best in the business Doctors" and his overall health his chances of not having a successful procedure would be very small.
Thanks again for you insight, it is a 100 million dollar question....for us Laker fans...if you are tired of dealing with us backseat Doctors I would understand... |
Just to be clear... I was responding to someone's idea about replacement, nothing to do with Howard's situation.
Replacement doesn't have fewer potential problems. Last resort type of a deal. |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73071
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Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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Jim Buss was a guest on the Mason and Ireland show today. They asked Jim about Dwight's back surgery. Jim said before the trade they consulted their Doctors and they were told he will be fine and they are going to rely on their Doctors. _________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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Voices Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
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Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 1:42 am Post subject: |
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55 wrote: | Voices wrote: | dfchang813 wrote: | LakerBaker wrote: | I don't understand why the clapper says Dwight should be ready for training camp, and a lot of other reports say he probably won't be back until December at the earliest??? It will be interesting to see what happens |
Because the other reports are just people making stuff up off of rumors. Meanwhile, Dr. Klapper the chief of orthopedic surgery at Cedar Sinai actually knows what he is talking about! LoL
Dwight is already running, shooting, and lifting weights.
Remember he hasn't worked out for about 4 months so it will take time to get his body back in shape. That won't happen by training camp but by time the season opener hits end of October, he'll be pretty close to normal.
The only sad thing is that the injury prevented him from working on his post moves and adding to his game . . . if that's the sort of thing he does in the off-season . . . |
..... It is a little confusing....55 provided a link that showed replacing the disc instead of repairing. It seems to me that the replacement surgery has fewer potential problems. I know you do not have access to DH med records, but if you would could you maybe give us some ideas of why one procedure over the other.
I do believe you have stated or confirmed that not all the procedures work 100% of the time, but in DH case, because of the "best in the business Doctors" and his overall health his chances of not having a successful procedure would be very small.
Thanks again for you insight, it is a 100 million dollar question....for us Laker fans...if you are tired of dealing with us backseat Doctors I would understand... |
Just to be clear... I was responding to someone's idea about replacement, nothing to do with Howard's situation.
Replacement doesn't have fewer potential problems. Last resort type of a deal. |
I here you, and understand where you were coming from, but I thought I read that it is the preferred method by some Doc's, because the recovery time was quicker, _________________ .....
.....
ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20. |
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dfchang813 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 1508
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Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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No, never.
There is nothing in medical science that can replace the body's natural elastic cartilage. You want to preserve the MAXIMUM amount possible in any circumstance.
Thus a very small microdiscectomy is light years more preferable than a total disc replacement.
In any case, Dwight isn't even a candidate for that, he has most of his healthy disc intact and doing its job.
A full disc replacement if for a problem several orders of magnitude worse than Dwight's and not even in the same conversation really. |
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Voices Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
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Posted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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dfchang813 wrote: | No, never.
There is nothing in medical science that can replace the body's natural elastic cartilage. You want to preserve the MAXIMUM amount possible in any circumstance.
Thus a very small microdiscectomy is light years more preferable than a total disc replacement.
In any case, Dwight isn't even a candidate for that, he has most of his healthy disc intact and doing its job.
A full disc replacement if for a problem several orders of magnitude worse than Dwight's and not even in the same conversation really. |
Again, thanks for the info....the link that 55 provided " Marina Spine Center" showed the replacement procedure and the quick recovery time. It was a very interesting video but it did not go into the total details of why the discs were replaced over another procedure. But the lady they performed it on was an athlete that was getting ready to run a Marathon after 6mos. recovery time, that is pretty impressive.
Thanks again for your imput... _________________ .....
.....
ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20. |
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lotc Starting Rotation
Joined: 17 Apr 2011 Posts: 517 Location: W.Covina
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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Dr. Klapper just said he expected Dwight to be ready at the beginning of the season at full strength It was on 710am mason and ireland at 4:30pm |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73071
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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lotc wrote: | Dr. Klapper just said he expected Dwight to be ready at the beginning of the season at full strength It was on 710am mason and ireland at 4:30pm |
_________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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dood23 Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jun 2010 Posts: 12084
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dfchang813 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 1508
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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A few more highlights from the latest Dr. Klapper interview on Mason and Ireland today:
1. He reiterated that Dwight should be back in prime form by season opener. He has never budged from that because it is pretty straightforward. 4 months shut down from date of surgery and then start working out again to get conditioning and strength back.
They didn't know his date of surgery but I do: 04/20/2012. That would put 4 months at exactly 08/20/2012 and we know he has been working out a few days earlier even than that.
You need 4 months so that scar tissue can build up and fully mature around the hole you drilled to take out the herniated disc and plug it up thus preventing another herniation.
Also we now know that Dwight's herniation is at the level of L4-L5 which is the most common area for disc herniation.
2. Contrary to popular belief, Dwight likely DID NOT suffer the injury from any acute blow on the basketball court from a hit by another player or falling etc. Likely it was caused simply by the wear and tear of playing such an extraordinary amount of minutes without taking any games off over a 7 year period. Once fixed, Dr. Klapper feels there should be no long-term problems.
3. Dr. Klapper did add that Dwight should obviously pay more attention to core strengthening exercises to take more pressure off his back.
4. He mentioned that ANY surgery takes a year for you to fully feel normal again (as a surgeon I can attest to this) but in my OWN PROFESSIONAL opinion, this is voodoo to deflect any patient complaints over small, trivial deviations from normal. After a year, the patient will likely either get used to the new sensation or forget about it.
He feels that while Dwight may feel slightly odd, this should in no way impact his athleticism or basketball play on the court. In other words, unlike Bynum, Dwight is not going to be "playing scared" (Dr. Klapper's words) because he's thinking of another injury to his back for instance.
So final summary, Dwight injury is caused by wear and tear of thousands of NBA minutes over 7 years, it's a very small injury, and he is on schedule to start the season at basically full strength (or however close to full strength 2 full months of running, weights, and basketball activity can get you. The rest he'll pick up over the first month or so of the season)
Hope that helps and if we hear NOTHING more out of the Lakers camp, that will be good news.
Right now, things should be pretty boring because he is simply "catching up" on the 4 full months where he basically sat around doing nothing waiting for his back to scar up so he wouldn't reherniate the disc.
We'll get another update when training camp opens and see where he is at. He won't be quite at full strength obviously but depending on how cautious the Lakers are, they may have him take part in basketball drills and practice anyway.
Again, if everything goes according to plan, there should be NO REASON for him not to participate. The injury and the surgery is past him, he's basically working on regaining his form now and that will take time after a 4 month lay off. |
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mirak Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 5238
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:56 pm Post subject: |
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I have to say, I'm really not that worried about Dwight's back. As much as I liked and supported Bynum, I'm less concerned with Dwight's back than I am with Drew's knees. And I suspect that DH, physical freak of nature that he is, will heal much quicker than Drew. |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73071
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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dfchang813, Thanks again for taking the time to share with us your professional opinion on Dwight's back surgery and rehab. Do you think Dwight might be able to play in some pre season games? First pre season game begins on Oct 7th and the last one is on Oct 25th. _________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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kobe_luver Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 Posts: 11644 Location: LA
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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dfchang813....I'm going to copy your last informative post to add to my D12 thread like before. Thanks! |
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dfchang813 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 1508
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Posted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Guys,
Appreciate the positive feedback but a few things:
It's important to make the distinction that most of what I have been posting are Dr. Klapper's medical opinions. He is the expert here, not I. I am a head and neck surgeon, NOT an orthopedic surgeon. I do have a comfort level obviously with the vocabulary, the concepts, the anatomy, etc and am translating and extrapolating what I know and what I have read and heard but again I am no expert in these matters.
That said, whether Dwight plays in any pre-season games would be complete and utter speculation on my part. At this point, I have a hard time believing even Dwight's surgeon knows exactly how he will respond. Remember he will have been working out for less than 2 weeks at this point.
A lot will depend on how he feels, how strong he feels, and how much of his conditioning he has gotten back.
Training camp opens October 2nd and the first preseason game is only 5 days later, that is pretty quick. He will have about a month under his belt, not sure if that is going to be enough to throw him into live competition even at the preseason level.
If you want my educated guess, I think he works out and practices with the team but likely won't see any action until the last two preseason games maybe on the 24th and/or the 25th. I doubt he plays both but one of them they will have him in there if no setbacks. Then, he'll start for the season opener.
There's still a chance by the way that if he's not quite back to his full conditioning that the Lakers will play it safe and just hold him out the first few weeks of the regular season. We have a creampuff first month with 11 home games. We'll be fine without him.
But at the end of the day, if Dwight feels strong enough and in shape enough to play, I think he'll want to be out there because the more he plays the more cohesive he'll be with the starting unit and you got to think after over half a year away from the court, he's really going to miss playing pure and simple. |
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ThreePointBomber Star Player
Joined: 14 May 2010 Posts: 3234 Location: Inland Empire
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Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 11:49 am Post subject: |
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32 wrote: | lotc wrote: | Dr. Klapper just said he expected Dwight to be ready at the beginning of the season at full strength It was on 710am mason and ireland at 4:30pm |
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Listening to it now was gonna post this. _________________ The most important shot in basketball. |
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55 Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2008 Posts: 12092
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Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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dfchang813 wrote: | Hi Guys,
Appreciate the positive feedback but a few things:
It's important to make the distinction that most of what I have been posting are Dr. Klapper's medical opinions. He is the expert here, not I. I am a head and neck surgeon, NOT an orthopedic surgeon. I do have a comfort level obviously with the vocabulary, the concepts, the anatomy, etc and am translating and extrapolating what I know and what I have read and heard but again I am no expert in these matters.
That said, whether Dwight plays in any pre-season games would be complete and utter speculation on my part. At this point, I have a hard time believing even Dwight's surgeon knows exactly how he will respond. Remember he will have been working out for less than 2 weeks at this point.
A lot will depend on how he feels, how strong he feels, and how much of his conditioning he has gotten back.
Training camp opens October 2nd and the first preseason game is only 5 days later, that is pretty quick. He will have about a month under his belt, not sure if that is going to be enough to throw him into live competition even at the preseason level.
If you want my educated guess, I think he works out and practices with the team but likely won't see any action until the last two preseason games maybe on the 24th and/or the 25th. I doubt he plays both but one of them they will have him in there if no setbacks. Then, he'll start for the season opener.
There's still a chance by the way that if he's not quite back to his full conditioning that the Lakers will play it safe and just hold him out the first few weeks of the regular season. We have a creampuff first month with 11 home games. We'll be fine without him.
But at the end of the day, if Dwight feels strong enough and in shape enough to play, I think he'll want to be out there because the more he plays the more cohesive he'll be with the starting unit and you got to think after over half a year away from the court, he's really going to miss playing pure and simple. |
Pure coincidence, but there's a fellow at Watkins Spine by the name of David Chang. |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73071
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Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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@MatthewJPizzo
Quote: | @DwightHoward We share a back doctor - Robert Watkins. Saw you went to him & I have no doubt you will be "back" to dominate. |
@DwightHoward
Quote: | @MatthewJPizzo he did a great job |
https://twitter.com/DwightHoward/status/239486226602799104 _________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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