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Phil Jackson TMZ Video "Wasn't looking to coach again, chances of ever coaching Lakers is slim to none"
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Druggas
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:57 am Post subject:

From Brian Shaw: <<Brian Shaw was surprised by the Los Angeles Lakers' decision not to hire Phil Jackson to replace Mike Brown as head coach. "Under the circumstances, Phil Jackson, who's been there and done that and put a lot of money in everybody's pockets around here, the way it was done . . . it's mind-boggling," Shaw said Monday in an interview with The Times. "I was joking with him, at least you got a phone call, even though it was midnight. "In 11 years he was coach here, he took the team to the Finals seven times and won five. I don't know if any of the other 29 teams would have done him the way he was done [by the Lakers] after he had done so much for the organization and the city.">> _________________ Laker historian.

venturalakersfan
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:03 am Post subject:

Druggas wrote:

PJ deserved the right of first refusal.

Not when he wasn't the FO's first choice. Think about it, if you wanted X, why would you give Y the first shot at the job?

wolfpaclaker
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:21 am Post subject:

Quote:

"Under the circumstances, Phil Jackson, who's been there and done that and put a lot of money in everybody's pockets around here, the way it was done . . . it's mind-boggling," Shaw said Monday in an interview with The Times. "I was joking with him, at least you got a phone call, even though it was midnight.

"In 11 years he was coach here, he took the team to the Finals seven times and won five. I don't know if any of the other 29 teams would have done him the way he was done [by the Lakers] after he had done so much for the organization and the city."

Well said, Brian.

That's just the way the Buss' roll these days, though. Hey, what can you do? They've got the Lakers brand, and it's their choice.

focus
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Joined: 23 May 2012
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:29 am Post subject:

SmokeAndAshes wrote:

postandpivot wrote:

focus wrote:

postandpivot wrote:

24 wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Phil seemed classy. Nice words for the team as well. Didn't seem bitter at all.

True. Also telling that he even now admits he wasn't really that in to coaching again, which backs up the impression the FO said they got.

exactly. all the FO detractors where are you now that we have the horse speaking?

What happened actually seems pretty straightforward, and seemed the same back when it happened. He was not that into coaching in his last year, except during the playoffs...too late. Not a good coach for this new Frankenstein team during the regular season when they need an active engaged tinkering focused coach. The man set the bar, but he was inappropritate for this team's personnel and needs, and the FO probably saw that, and also realized they need someone to spend a few years with Dwight, more than just two. Not that D'Antoni guarantees a ring, but he probably does end up with some clear progress from now and end of the year.

exactly.

+1

I never understood the fevered indignation when the Lakers didn't hire Phil. I was always 100% in favour of Phil coming back, but not to the point where I couldn't see the drawbacks. Plus, it was never guaranteed we'd win the title just because we had Phil. (Though adding his championship swagger would have been nice!!)

And the end of the day, the Lakers wanted D'Antoni originally, weren't sold on Phil's hunger to return to coaching, and went with their initial choice. (Mitch's interview on the Hangtime podcast on nba.com spells out the process in detail, for anyone who's interested). I don't see how that makes them evil or unprofessional.

The ONLY thing I fault the Laker FO and the Buss family for is that they should have stopped all the media speculation and "Phil-is-the-new-coach" percentages that were rampant all day Saturday and Sunday. Especially knowing that Phil wasn't 100% sold on returning, and they weren't 100% sold on him.

I dont think they could have stopped this, it was rampant wildfire speculation as this board and espn showed, and releasing a statement saying what exactly? Lastly, this all happened over the course of a few days, from MB fired to DA hired (3 days!), and the Phil stuff happened just over the weekend. I was worried that they wouldnt have any options for a good coach midseason here, and here they got it done with a viable top coach in a matter of days. Some blame the 'handling' of the situation. Well, Im guessing things were a bit hectic, and they should get credit for getting a headhunter search done successfully(i.e. good coach) for a top organization within 3 days and not stretch it out.

I am not happy with how they handled Brian Shaw, Rudy the equipment guy or the dismissal of so many employees in the manner they did, nor of course the hiring of Mike Brown. So plenty of worries about Jim Buss long term talent level but this situation I dont have that much of a problem with, particularly since they including Jim were rectifying their own mistake in hiring Mike. Thats a humbling thing, and I am encouraged by Jim's willingness to adjust and learn and essentially publicly acknowledge their mistake (rare quality among corporate leaders in my opinion). As he did with Kobe - mistake, understanding, try to rectify, rectify, lessonlearned.

postandpivot
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:31 am Post subject:

Druggas wrote:

From Brian Shaw:

<<Brian Shaw was surprised by the Los Angeles Lakers' decision not to hire Phil Jackson to replace Mike Brown as head coach.

"Under the circumstances, Phil Jackson, who's been there and done that and put a lot of money in everybody's pockets around here, the way it was done . . . it's mind-boggling," Shaw said Monday in an interview with The Times. "I was joking with him, at least you got a phone call, even though it was midnight.

"In 11 years he was coach here, he took the team to the Finals seven times and won five. I don't know if any of the other 29 teams would have done him the way he was done [by the Lakers] after he had done so much for the organization and the city.">>

and this is why B.shaw got cut along with pjax and all of his staff. you cant have guys around thinking that just because what a guy DID for you in the past. he should be paid and given the same job no matter what, TODAY.

pjax didnt want to coach the last year we had him. he overstayed his own personal welcome 1 season to many. thats the reality. so no matter how many rings he has won and money he has put into people's pockets. he still was burnt out with coaching and done.

so with that being the case, he didnt deserve anything more then the first call and the 2nd midnight call. why do i need to treat someone who doesnt really want the job like someone who does?
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LAL4K3RS wrote: He(Kobe) is the white haired kung fu master that you realize is older than dirt but can still kick your arse when in a sitting position drinking a nice herbal tea.

venturalakersfan
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:37 am Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

Well said, Brian.

That's just the way the Buss' roll these days, though. Hey, what can you do? They've got the Lakers brand, and it's their choice.

They treated Phil bad by not hiring him? That doesn't pass the comon sense test. If Phil and Brian were presumptious enough to believe that it was Phil's job and not anyone else's, then they need to take their unrightful indignation elsewhere.

Wino
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:15 am Post subject:

24 wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Phil seemed classy. Nice words for the team as well. Didn't seem bitter at all.

True. Also telling that he even now admits he wasn't really that in to coaching again, which backs up the impression the FO said they got.

NO NO this doesn't fit my agenda!!!!!!!!!!!

Phil wanted this badly to be with Jeanie and Jim Buss is trying to break them up!!!!!!!!

Phil was probably willing to work for half a mil a year!!! Jim Buss wanted him to pay back some of the money he over spent on him last time!!!!!!!!

Phil hates D'antoni and that is why Jim hired him!!!!!

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Wino
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:17 am Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

He wasn't into coaching gain until that job opportunity popped up

Yeah. Can't believe people still deny this. But whatever. He was retired. He had no interest in coaching. However when the Lakers came, he was interested and willing to come back. Before he could, they went in and made the D'Antoni "coup". Now he's back to being retired and not into coaching.

All history now, but no way did Jackson say anywhere he wasn't interesting in coming back when it was presented to him. Jackson pass on coaching Howard, Gasol, Kobe and Nash?

In all respect, you have no idea what he said to Mitch or Jim. Phil doesn't pull any punches. If he said it on the film, he could have easily said it to their faces. Just sayin'! Don't put or pull words in his mouth that you weren't there to listen to!
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Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain

Chronicle
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Joined: 21 Jul 2012
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:18 am Post subject:

Wino wrote:

24 wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Phil seemed classy. Nice words for the team as well. Didn't seem bitter at all.

True. Also telling that he even now admits he wasn't really that in to coaching again, which backs up the impression the FO said they got.

The wins we got was because of phil zen not because of d'antoni !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AJLakerFan
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Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 4161

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:25 am Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:

They treated Phil bad by not hiring him? That doesn't pass the common sense test.

This

Omar Little
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:46 am Post subject:

I'm not too upset at guys like Shaw and Rambis. They're Jackson's guys, and loyalty demands this of them. That doesn't change the facts, but I understand. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel

Gimme_the_rock
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Joined: 13 Apr 2001
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:03 pm Post subject:

Phil's time as a Laker yielded supreme results. That era has passed ... that chapter is closed. As a Laker fan, I am at complete peace. Stay in the moment, Laker fans.

wolfpaclaker
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:05 pm Post subject:

Quote:

In all respect, you have no idea what he said to Mitch or Jim. Phil doesn't pull any punches.

And neither to those who are believing everything anti-Phil. Recall how at first it was all about Phil's "demands". And then we realize there were no such demands as road layoffs, ownership stake etc.

So we're being BS'ed and it's been proven with the Phil "demands" card. Who said that? I don't know. I'm not saying Mitch or the Lakers FO pulled that card, but someone did, and it was lies.

In the end, Jackson is the greatest coach of all time. They attracted his interest. He didn't go to them. He was retired. They went to him, got him back into it, and then decided within a day, hey I think D'Antoni is just a better coach to have right now for this team. That's fine, but in my book, if I contact Jackson, I'm not contacting him to just think about hiring him. He is who I want. It seemed they did it mainly just to make fans happy that they tried. I honestly believe, the Buss' want to show they can win without the Tri and without Phil. They're tired of everyone chanting for Phil and thinking Phil is some sort of panacea for the franchise.

DaMuleRules
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:18 pm Post subject:

Druggas wrote:

Been a big BShaw fan since we were at UCSB in the Gaucho Glory days. But he's flat out wrong here. He wasn't "done" by the Lakers.

postandpivot
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:23 pm Post subject:

focus wrote:

SmokeAndAshes wrote:

postandpivot wrote:

focus wrote:

postandpivot wrote:

24 wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Phil seemed classy. Nice words for the team as well. Didn't seem bitter at all.

True. Also telling that he even now admits he wasn't really that in to coaching again, which backs up the impression the FO said they got.

exactly. all the FO detractors where are you now that we have the horse speaking?

exactly.

^^THIS. i still believe they chose brown over adelman because brown was cheaper and younger with a coach of the year award.

i really think Jim was thinking about the future remember he got mike brown cp3, and dwight. oh wait, the nba shutdown cp3, which messed up the dwight deal coming later.

that would've been the perfect mix of today and the future. perhaps more young runners could endure long mike brown practices. not so much with a team full of a old folks.

thats where i think jim's plan got lost to a degree. he recoved with the nash pickup. but nash is old. so now you cant just fire the coach for the future you just hired last season during a short season at that.
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LAL4K3RS wrote: He(Kobe) is the white haired kung fu master that you realize is older than dirt but can still kick your arse when in a sitting position drinking a nice herbal tea.

postandpivot
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:25 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

In all respect, you have no idea what he said to Mitch or Jim. Phil doesn't pull any punches.

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media. we have to stop allowing the media to get us all up in arms about things that didnt actually occur.

the moment pjax was brought up talk radio and every blog, sport website. had their own angle on what the demands would be. i'm thinking "why would a now healthier pjax ask for no away games?" makes no sense.

the reason he asked for that before wasnt due to his age or lack of desire to coach. it was because of his body breaking down pre surgery.

again that was the media that set that storm up. not the FO or pjax.
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LAL4K3RS wrote: He(Kobe) is the white haired kung fu master that you realize is older than dirt but can still kick your arse when in a sitting position drinking a nice herbal tea.

wolfpaclaker
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:29 pm Post subject:

Quote:

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media.

Media has sources. Has to be either Phil, Lakers, Agents. Usually when Woj reports stuff like that, the sources are pretty good.

I'd be surprised that the stuff about his demands wasn't floated to make Jackson look bad so the initial fall out of choosing MDA over Phil wouldn't be too bad.

Either way, all water under the bridge now.

DaMuleRules
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:41 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media.

That doesn't even make sense.

wolfpaclaker
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:43 pm Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media.

That doesn't even make sense.

Go look at the thread when it was first announced Jackson wasn't chosen over MDA. You'll see many posters blame it on Phil wanting too much in terms of road games off, ownership stake etc.

postandpivot
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:47 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

DaMuleRules wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media.

That doesn't even make sense.

Go look at the thread when it was first announced Jackson wasn't chosen over MDA. You'll see many posters blame it on Phil wanting too much in terms of road games off, ownership stake etc.

yes fans got duped. but you also got duped into thinking the FO had something to do with that info being floated out there.

the media started the "demands" crap before the FO spoke to pjax. they were ASSUMING pjax would have crazy demands.
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LAL4K3RS wrote: He(Kobe) is the white haired kung fu master that you realize is older than dirt but can still kick your arse when in a sitting position drinking a nice herbal tea.

City_Dawg
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:48 pm Post subject:

That's not the first time "Phil's demands" have come up. They also (supposedly) came up when Phil inquired about the FO job in Orlando. http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/19279981 _________________ sighs !...

DaMuleRules
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:20 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

DaMuleRules wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

WOLF. no one pulled the demands card. that was the media.

That doesn't even make sense.

Go look at the thread when it was first announced Jackson wasn't chosen over MDA. You'll see many posters blame it on Phil wanting too much in terms of road games off, ownership stake etc.

I'm talking about your theory that they intentionally floated it knowing they were going to go meet with PJ even though they knew they weren't going to hire him. I know there's questions about Jimmy, but there's no way Jerry Buss is pulling (bleep) like that. He just would never have met with Phil.

Omar Little
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:20 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

In all respect, you have no idea what he said to Mitch or Jim. Phil doesn't pull any punches.

I don't know why you keep leaving out the part they both agree on. The part where jackson said he was intrigued, felt he could do it, but wasn't sure he would. The part where he said he wrestled with whether he wanted to do it all weekend.

That apparently mattered to them. It would to me too. When you have a coach who looked pretty burned out the last time wavering on whether or not he wants a golden opportunity laid at his feet (especially considering most of us would have guessed that era was over given what had transpired between the parties), there's legitimate concern to be had. PJ's mystique is built on his vital energy and ability to lead more than his X's and O's (although those were always underrated IMO).

Mitch and his conversation over a meal was no accident BTW. They were already thinking of this, as was he. It's likely just as simple as it sounds. He didn't seem to be as gung ho as one would need, and he didn't appear to have really thought through how to use Nash to their satisfaction.

It's OK to prefer Phil. A big part of me does too. It's OK to feel they made the wrong choice. But it seems unnecessary to require it to be a dirty deal. There are reasonable arguments for them making another choice. For those of you who are old enough, research Billy Martin's multiple marriages to the Yankees. At some point you need to stop going to the same well.
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Sister Golden Hair
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

Well said, Brian.

That's just the way the Buss' roll these days, though. Hey, what can you do? They've got the Lakers brand, and it's their choice.

I agree with you both. The FO acted in an odd manner, no matter how badly supporters try to rationalize it. It was strange. I stand by my support for PJ as the right guy at the right time.

I hope I'm wrong about MDA. But his verbal fatwa against Pau two days into the job confirmed that D'Antoni lacks composure under pressure (especially the pressure of losing). Because of that "shoot-from-the-hip-when-I'm-mad" impulse under stress, I don't think he should be anyone's first choice to take over the job as HC of the Lakers. IMO, MDA seems a bit limited in philosophy ("let's just run harder!") and intemperate in dealing with the pressures of the job.

Hope I'm wrong because this team has a good chance to win one, or maybe two more rings.

SGH

Sister Golden Hair
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Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 3:52 pm Post subject:

postandpivot wrote:

wolfpaclaker wrote:

Quote:

In all respect, you have no idea what he said to Mitch or Jim. Phil doesn't pull any punches.

The media was directly quoting someone talking about the alleged demands, no?

It wasn't pure media speculation. Someone put that stuff out there.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--lakers-resist-phil-jackson-s-power-grab-11051709.html

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