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THE_SHOES
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 Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:10 am Post subject: Re: Has it crossed your mind that our guys could look as hapless as the Spurs next year, unless they get younger? |
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| deal wrote: | | THE_SHOES wrote: | Next year, the Lakers will struggle against a list that is long...
Starting with...
OKC
Golden State
Denver
Memphis
Houston
The Clipps
Phoenix
In fact the only team in the west the Lakers may be
able to deal with is San Antonio, especially if they don't
use one of that core of Duncan, Parker, or Ginoboli to get younger.
The beginning of a new era is now underway...
I see 8th as being only a possibility next year provided that teams like Dallas, Sac, Portland, and especially Utah don't improve...
If Minny gets their premier forward back, suddenly they are in the mix...
Scary stuff... |
IF the Lakers don't retool we're not going far next year either.
The Spurs have found a way to continue to stay competitive under Pop and Parker is still young. Pop is a different coach, he has no problem sitting Duncan or Manu if need be and they know and accept it. Most Diva's would have a fit....
 |
True, but no matter what the understanding between the foursome, Duncan, Parker, and Ginoboli may even do well again during the regular season next year, but 2nd round exits at the most are all they'll ever be able to do again...
As for the Lakers... Now days? All it takes is 1 injury... Season over...
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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THE_SHOES
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:15 am Post subject: Re: Has it crossed your mind that our guys could look as hapless as the Spurs next year, unless they get younger? |
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| angrypuppy wrote: | | THE_SHOES wrote: | Next year, the Lakers will struggle against a list that is long...
Starting with...
OKC
Golden State
Denver
Memphis
Houston
The Clipps
Phoenix
In fact the only team in the west the Lakers may be
able to deal with is San Antonio, especially if they don't
use one of that core of Duncan, Parker, or Ginoboli to get younger.
The beginning of a new era is now underway...
I see 8th as being only a possibility next year provided that teams like Dallas, Sac, Portland, and especially Utah don't improve...
If Minny gets their premier forward back, suddenly they are in the mix...
Scary stuff... |
I see it playing out under two possible scenarios. The biggest unknown is how Kobe responds to surgery and rehab, but we'll shelve that in an effort to simplify. Conceivably the Lakers could compete for a championship next season with minor tweaks, but that depends on the joint probability of Kobe, Nash and Pau staying healthy and beating Father Time. I don't see it as a likely outcome either.
There's a plan in place Shoes, and that is to dissolve the team through contractual expiration. The front office won't mess with that plan. They won't trade Pau for anything other than a very good young prospect with at least a couple of years left on a rookie contract, or a middling first round pick plus cap space. The smart move is to not force the issue by taking back a bad contract and a high quality role player or two. That would ensure a "San Antonio" finish (best case actually).
Don't expect big changes Shoes. Here's how I see it panning out:
An amnesty waiver or cap space driven trade would be a vote of no confidence by the front office, hardly the message you want to send to Dwight before he's re-signed. Pau will only be traded for cap space if Dwight quickly re-signs and a good quality prospect is dangled with cap space. Don't bet on it.
They will try trading Pau during the regular season if they don't think Kobe will be a factor this season. The problem is that they probably won't get a cap space driven trade given the size of Pau's contract and the fact that teams have far less cap space during the regular season versus during the offseason. A blown financial opportunity, but perhaps the front office should take a hit for the sake of pleasing the brass at Time Warner Cable and the silently suffering season ticket holders.
The big change will come during this season and next. We won't likely bomb and get a franchise player in the lottery, and we're draft pick poor. The best shot for the front office is to hunt for free agents. Adopt a college strategy: Get the best (and most charismatic) coach that money can buy, sell the Lakers tradition, the Los Angeles locale and pray it's enough to land a franchise player.
In the meantime I want Mitch to do something the Lakers haven't been able to do, and that is to identify and aggressively chase those free agents who best compliment our weaknesses. Our free agent signings for the most part have been sorry, and it saddens me that they've turned the scouting department into a family reunion and ignore all the advanced analytic tools that can assist them in targeting specific free agents. |
I love the perspective... Seriously, I can't wait to see how much of this drama unfolds between now and next October...
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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THE_SHOES
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:20 am Post subject: |
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| dmorans1 wrote: | Like seriously next year is gonna be tough unless we pull some amazing trade. Looking at our roster what players can we say are our (starting positions) of the future? We only have Dwight well for now, he can bolt any minute. Is Clark our SF/PF of the future? I don't think so. Is Hill our PF of the future? Nahh. Every team has at least 2 or 3 guys that they can say that about their players. We might have none, 0, none. 
Is there a way we can fill one position this summer? Tyreke, Jennings, Josh Smith, and all those guys are close to impossible. Only way we could get a guy for the future is through the draft and I don't know if any team would give up a Top 10 draft pick for Pau or anyone else on the roster. Maybe Minny, with Pau for Derrick Williams + their pick and draft Shabazz? Do we fill two of those spots with them? Is Derrick Williams and Shabazz our PF/SF of the future?
I really want to see a young up-and-coming team I'm tired of this slow unathletic old team. Pau, Nash, and Metta can't be our starters, they either have to get traded or get benched. |
ESPECIALLY in a D'Antoni offense... Old people cannot run in the mans idea of offense...
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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Kingpin2010
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:20 am Post subject: |
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[quote="thedude1977"]I wish we looked as hapless as the Spurs.[/quote
This right here. How quick we are to forget that last year at this time the spurs looked unbeatable on a 20 game win streak. OKC then won at home and carried that momentum with Durant shooting fire. The Spurs are fine and will beat the Warriors.
For the Lakers, there isn't much you can do this year to drastically change the roster. Kobe isn't going anywhere, Nash isn't going anywhere and we all agree to re-sign Dwight. That's the cap right there. This summer the Lakers won't do any panic moves, keep the big 4 and make a run at it. If everyone gets healthy and proper rest during the season, the Lakers will be a 52-55 win team. |
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THE_SHOES
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:22 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Kingpin2010"] | thedude1977 wrote: | I wish we looked as hapless as the Spurs.[/quote
This right here. How quick we are to forget that last year at this time the spurs looked unbeatable on a 20 game win streak. OKC then won at home and carried that momentum with Durant shooting fire. The Spurs are fine and will beat the Warriors.
For the Lakers, there isn't much you can do this year to drastically change the roster. Kobe isn't going anywhere, Nash isn't going anywhere and we all agree to re-sign Dwight. That's the cap right there. This summer the Lakers won't do any panic moves, keep the big 4 and make a run at it. If everyone gets healthy and proper rest during the season, the Lakers will be a 52-55 win team. |
Love the optimism... Aight...
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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K2
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:24 am Post subject: |
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| dmorans1 wrote: |
I really want to see a young up-and-coming team I'm tired of this slow unathletic old team. Pau, Nash, and Metta can't be our starters, they either have to get traded or get benched. |
When Dr. Buss was in the hospital, apparently he expressed a desire for the team's eventual return to a faster pace, which may have prompted the changes. At this point, I think they will stay committed and find a way to bring on younger players. There might be some painful years ahead, but Lakers found a way to bounce back in the 90s with Jerry West, who also helped advise two teams making waves this year. Hope Mitch can do the same. |
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Voices
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:30 am Post subject: |
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Turn out the lights the party is over.....there are so many great, young, quick, athletic, high b-ball IQ players out there and none are Lakers.
I just cannot see this team doing anything in the foreseeable future.
I only wish that I had confidence in this management group to be able to build a team that can challenge for a championship. The recent moves by this management group have been horrible. I hope the Lakers do not turn into Donald Sterling 2.
As I have got older I have grown to appreciate watching the young talent on other teams, so if Jimmy can't build the Lakers back into a champion I will still enjoy watching this new generation of players, they are exciting!
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ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20. |
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kfkilla
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:37 am Post subject: |
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Really intriguing to try to get that giant trade exception. It would be around 16m i would think, but i haven't looked up the salaries. A trade exception of that size is essentially like being able to trade for a max without giving up anything.
Put bluntly. In 2014 lakers can sign 2 max players. Fill out the rest of the roster with nice 5-10m players and then trade for a disgruntled cp3 or whoever with that exception.
Much nicer that getting 3 maxes and a bunch of d league scrubs |
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jodeke
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:54 am Post subject: |
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If we don't get younger we'll be in the same boat as the Spurs. A good team during the season that will not go deep into the playoffs.
Mitch kept us relative when he was left alone, listened to.
I get the impression Jim is trying to get back to ShowTime, Dr Buss's supposed wish. I don't think he has the wherewithal to get it done.
I think Mitch can achieve the goal but I don't think Jim will listen to him.
I think we're in for some hard times.
EDIT: Yes we can be as unfortunate, hapless, as the Spurs if we don't get younger.
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Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
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Last edited by jodeke on Thu May 09, 2013 11:56 am; edited 2 times in total |
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kfkilla
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 7:58 am Post subject: |
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Ya i unfortunately don't have faith in thus FO. It was up in the air.....and then they got Nash and Dwight.
Then it seemed like we were in good hands. Until we saw the disaster of Brown. When they fired him quickly we again thought it was going in the right direction. Then when they hired MDA and he preached showtime 2....it made me say then they must want to trade Gasol cause this team can't run!
When they didn't trade Gasol and started blaming injuries......it started to become clear....
When they decided to keep MDA and vowed to keep the team together it became crystal clear...
Nash and Dwight weren't brilliant moves...they were circumstantial. Nash wanted LA and we had TPE. Dwight wanted out and we has a 24 year old all star center.
The current FO are not brilliant. MDA + current roster = stoooopid |
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thedude1977
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:39 am Post subject: |
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...it's a perfectly cromulent word. |
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Chronicle
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:39 am Post subject: |
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how come so few people here know the word hapless  |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| THE_SHOES wrote: | | dmorans1 wrote: | Like seriously next year is gonna be tough unless we pull some amazing trade. Looking at our roster what players can we say are our (starting positions) of the future? We only have Dwight well for now, he can bolt any minute. Is Clark our SF/PF of the future? I don't think so. Is Hill our PF of the future? Nahh. Every team has at least 2 or 3 guys that they can say that about their players. We might have none, 0, none.
Is there a way we can fill one position this summer? Tyreke, Jennings, Josh Smith, and all those guys are close to impossible. Only way we could get a guy for the future is through the draft and I don't know if any team would give up a Top 10 draft pick for Pau or anyone else on the roster. Maybe Minny, with Pau for Derrick Williams + their pick and draft Shabazz? Do we fill two of those spots with them? Is Derrick Williams and Shabazz our PF/SF of the future?
I really want to see a young up-and-coming team I'm tired of this slow unathletic old team. Pau, Nash, and Metta can't be our starters, they either have to get traded or get benched. |
ESPECIALLY in a D'Antoni offense... Old people cannot run in the mans idea of offense... |
The old men didn't look so bad offensivley this past season. Defense is another story.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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no_more_mr_nice_guy
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:47 am Post subject: |
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Has it crossed your mind that we could look as physical and intimidating as Memphis and Chicago if Dwight and Pau are 100% healthy?
The one thing this years playoffs has shown me is the so called death of the big/physical team was WRONG. Size does still matter and you can still push people around and play physical defense in the playoffs.
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"Look, I've seen all this before. We've been here before. So to me it's just old hat," Bryant said. "We do what we do and then we see where we end up. Doubt us. That's our challenge." |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:49 am Post subject: |
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| kfkilla wrote: | Really intriguing to try to get that giant trade exception. It would be around 16m i would think, but i haven't looked up the salaries. A trade exception of that size is essentially like being able to trade for a max without giving up anything.
Put bluntly. In 2014 lakers can sign 2 max players. Fill out the rest of the roster with nice 5-10m players and then trade for a disgruntled cp3 or whoever with that exception.
Much nicer that getting 3 maxes and a bunch of d league scrubs |
Yes, it we trade Pau for nothing but thin air we will be walking around with a $19 mil pre-paid credit card.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
Last edited by venturalakersfan on Thu May 09, 2013 8:51 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Fadeaway_Jumper
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:50 am Post subject: |
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We need to get younger. Thats the bottom line. Young teams like G-state are just out-hustling and outplaying the old spurs with high energy, and athleticism thats becoming necessary to succeed in todays NBA. Harrison Barnes the rookie who primarily relies his athleticism is outplaying seasoned veterans on that spurs team. The mantle has been passed and we need youth, not bringing back these 30+ players on our cursed squad. Nash, Pau, and Metta need to be gone this offseason to make room for younger players.
Also as a side note why is it that Tim Duncan teams get a pass for flopping early out of the playoffs every year, but Kobe will get blasted for not making the finals with a great team around him. Spurs have a 50+ win team every year but have not made the finals since 2007. I don't get way Duncan does not get called out, but Kobe would get killed by everyone for it |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 8:52 am Post subject: |
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That's the spirit, complain about something that hasn't happened.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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KBH
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:07 am Post subject: |
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| Lol, looking like the Spurs would be an improvement for us. |
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THE_SHOES
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:24 am Post subject: |
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Which is a crying shame KBH...
They'll be back next year after having made the entire state of Texas anticipate a parade only to "old up" just before the playoffs from having pretty much ran out of gas, and fall prey to a youthful team like OKC, and in this case this year Golden State.
Seriously if the Warriors were just slightly more seasoned, this current series would be an embarrassment... The poor kids donated game 1 to the Spurs, tried to give the game away in game 2, but snapped out of it just in time.
Now... The Warriors know enough about the Spurs for a blowout in the bay area coming up in about another 36hrs... Curry actually took it easy on em this past game. So what happened? Michael Thompson's boy took over, and beat the living daylights out of em. The Spurs better be glad David Lee isn't available or this really would be frightening...
Time is up for the past champs, including the Lakers... Make some kind of move Mitch, I'm begging you...
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"According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| KBH wrote: | | Lol, looking like the Spurs would be an improvement for us. |
At least we are suffering from a 3 Finals vists, 2 title hangover, while the Spurs are suffering from a "can't make the Finals" hangover.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Don Draper
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:29 am Post subject: |
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What's with LGers and not knowing the meaning of basic adjectives?
Anyways...yes we are pretty much screwed unless we unload some of our dinosaurs for some talented young pups. |
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Chronicle
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:35 am Post subject: |
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| Don Draper wrote: | What's with LGers and not knowing the meaning of basic adjectives?
Anyways...yes we are pretty much screwed unless we unload some of our dinosaurs for some talented young pups. |
has it crossed your mind that some adjectives are hapless  |
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P.K.
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:50 am Post subject: |
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"Has it crossed your mind that our guys could look as hapless as the Spurs next year, unless they get younger?"
Well, we looked pretty hapless AGAINST the Spurs this year, so if LAL only looked as hapless as the Spurs next year, that'd be an improvement wouldn't it?
Who knows.... Maybe we could even win a game against them if we were merely as hapless as the Spurs instead of more hapless then them
just saying
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Wilt's unstoppable fadeaway: www.youtube.com/watch?v=8O9MgNfcGJA
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mhan00
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:02 am Post subject: |
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| kfkilla wrote: | Really intriguing to try to get that giant trade exception. It would be around 16m i would think, but i haven't looked up the salaries. A trade exception of that size is essentially like being able to trade for a max without giving up anything.
Put bluntly. In 2014 lakers can sign 2 max players. Fill out the rest of the roster with nice 5-10m players and then trade for a disgruntled cp3 or whoever with that exception.
Much nicer that getting 3 maxes and a bunch of d league scrubs |
Don't trade exceptions count against your cap space? Would seem to be a pretty big oversight if they don't and you could use all your available cap space and then trade for a player using the trade exception. |
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City_Dawg
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| Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Becoming another regular season mirage would be an upgrade...of sorts.
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