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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
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 Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:47 am Post subject: |
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| som3on3_10 wrote: | | Yea being ranked below Bosh, Noah, and Hibbert is ridiculous. I know he's coming off of an achilles injury and all, but he can still impact a game much more than anyone one of those guys even at the tender age of 35. |
That is the point of the ranking. You think he will, others think he won't. Since others do not agree with you, they are wrong. What is the reality? No one knows. Even in our fantasy draft made up of Laker fans Kobe was selected 28th.
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som3on3_10
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Joined: 04 Apr 2004
Posts: 2482
Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | som3on3_10 wrote: | | Yea being ranked below Bosh, Noah, and Hibbert is ridiculous. I know he's coming off of an achilles injury and all, but he can still impact a game much more than anyone one of those guys even at the tender age of 35. |
That is the point of the ranking. You think he will, others think he won't. Since others do not agree with you, they are wrong. What is the reality? No one knows. Even in our fantasy draft made up of Laker fans Kobe was selected 28th. |
So a fantasy draft where the main objective is to build up stats as opposed to determining the impact a player has on a game is the new barometer for a player's worth now? Got it.  What is the reality? Who knows, but I'm pretty sure if you took a survey of all NBA players, coaches, and GM's instead of ESPN's 215 forecast panel, the results would be more in Kobe's favor. |
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Nordvader
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 1:56 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
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Lowest Merion
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
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thedude1977
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Joined: 14 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Lowest Merion wrote: | | Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
Gotta love predictions of the unknowable based on out-of-date information. |
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Telleris
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
Wade went at #18, Westbrook is as noted, probably before they knew he'd be missing an extra 2 months |
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Lowest Merion
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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| thedude1977 wrote: | | Lowest Merion wrote: | | Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
Gotta love predictions of the unknowable based on out-of-date information. |
I get that. But who cares? It's not as if they were going to conduct a vote two days before the season and release all of the results the next day. They want to slow leak it. Like it or not, that is a far smarter business model than dumping all of the picks at once. It's the off season. What do you expect? Espn isn't in the business of trying to lose money. If I ran espn, I'd do the same thing. So, some injuries that pop up after polling will make a couple of results look really weird. Big deal.
If LBJ had to have a leg amputated because of a bizarre boating accident today, which would obviously end his career ( I think), he's still going to be ranked at the top spot this year. |
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thedude1977
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Lowest Merion wrote: | | thedude1977 wrote: | | Lowest Merion wrote: | | Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
Gotta love predictions of the unknowable based on out-of-date information. |
I get that. But who cares? It's not as if they were going to conduct a vote two days before the season and release all of the results the next day. They want to slow leak it. Like it or not, that is a far smarter business model than dumping all of the picks at once. It's the off season. What do you expect? Espn isn't in the business of trying to lose money. If I ran espn, I'd do the same thing. So, some injuries that pop up after polling will make a couple of results look really weird. Big deal.
If LBJ had to have a leg amputated because of a bizarre boating accident today, which would obviously end his career ( I think), he's still going to be ranked at the top spot this year. |
Oh, I'm not invested in these rankings at all ... because they are meaningless for the reasons mentioned above.
It's just a weird defense to say "we didn't know XYZ back when we made our predictions." I mean, no duh. That's what these types of predictions are - speculation based on incomplete data. |
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| thedude1977 wrote: | | Lowest Merion wrote: | | Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
Gotta love predictions of the unknowable based on out-of-date information. |
The information wasn't out of date when they voted, that was the point LM was getting at. Gotta love the outcry against some writers rating players. Do you think it really matters?
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thedude1977
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | thedude1977 wrote: | | Lowest Merion wrote: | | Nordvader wrote: | | I'm done this "Expert" panel just voted an injured Russell Westbrook and D-wade over Tony Parker and Carmelo Anthony how is that even possible? |
As Larry noted earlier, it's not as if the vote was conducted yesterday. Thus, if I had to hazard a guess, I'm guessing the vote was conducted prior to the announcement of Westbrook's most recent surgery. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. No idea about Wade. |
Gotta love predictions of the unknowable based on out-of-date information. |
The information wasn't out of date when they voted, that was the point LM was getting at. Gotta love the outcry against some writers rating players. Do you think it really matters? |
Of course it wasn't out of date when they voted. It just became out-of-date almost immediately. Since "time" exists, that's the only possibility.
I'm saying these rankings have very limited value for that reason.
I'm not part of any outcry, and as I mentioned - no I absolutely don't think it matters. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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And I agree with you, these types of things mean nothing to me.
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krisobe
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| I actually would like to thank ESPN for this. More fuel to the fire. |
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ProfessorKel
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| Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | | bc24 wrote: | | They ranked Kobe at 25! |
For what it's worth, here's a 5-on-5 discussion of the topic (plus Kobe's all-time standing):
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/5-on-5-131016-kobe/kobe-bryant-#nbarank-fair
I tend to agree with Shelburne's comments about the #25 ranking. Even with the injury, I would struggle to come up with 24 players who even arguably rank above him going into the season. |
Good read. Fair analyses. |
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Treble Clef
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:49 am Post subject: |
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| i am sure most ESPN voters still have him close to the top but that 1-10 rating scale is pretty rigid. It would only take a few votes of 5 or 6 from some skeptics to drop his rank significantly. |
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Lowest Merion
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Treble Clef wrote: | | i am sure most ESPN voters still have him close to the top but that 1-10 rating scale is pretty rigid. It would only take a few votes of 5 or 6 from some skeptics to drop his rank significantly. |
Well, sure. Larry said he ranked him an eight. Based on his injury with no known timetable for a return, and the fact that there were about 200 voters, there's no doubt a few ranked him way lower. Who cares? (Not talking to you). |
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krisobe
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| Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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| He will still get All NBA first team. He knows this team won't win the championship until next year. So this is the year he will inflate his stats ala the 35ppg season. Green light all night. 30/5/5 season. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| som3on3_10 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | som3on3_10 wrote: | | Yea being ranked below Bosh, Noah, and Hibbert is ridiculous. I know he's coming off of an achilles injury and all, but he can still impact a game much more than anyone one of those guys even at the tender age of 35. |
That is the point of the ranking. You think he will, others think he won't. Since others do not agree with you, they are wrong. What is the reality? No one knows. Even in our fantasy draft made up of Laker fans Kobe was selected 28th. |
So a fantasy draft where the main objective is to build up stats as opposed to determining the impact a player has on a game is the new barometer for a player's worth now? Got it. What is the reality? Who knows, but I'm pretty sure if you took a survey of all NBA players, coaches, and GM's instead of ESPN's 215 forecast panel, the results would be more in Kobe's favor. |
It is just as valid as a guess on ESPN or on LG. Or even a survey of all NBA players, coaches and GMs. None of that really matters.
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ForrestHump
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| Posted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| krisobe wrote: | | He will still get All NBA first team. He knows this team won't win the championship until next year. So this is the year he will inflate his stats ala the 35ppg season. Green light all night. 30/5/5 season. |
You do realize that no one at Kobe's age has averaged 30 ppg for an entire season? And Kobe hasn't averaged 30 since 07?
I admit, the team is "bad" enough for him to be able to shoot that much to average 30, but he tore his achilles, man... If Kobe didn't get injured and we had this team, I would say 30 a game easily. We don't know when he'll be 100%, my guess is he comes back while still getting in shape, starts off quietly, like 20 ppg on 44% shooting and everyone pretty much writes him off, gets hot in the 2nd half of the season and rounds his numbers out at 25 5 5.
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ringThingDoUrThiNg
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| Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:36 am Post subject: |
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| ForrestHump wrote: | | krisobe wrote: | | He will still get All NBA first team. He knows this team won't win the championship until next year. So this is the year he will inflate his stats ala the 35ppg season. Green light all night. 30/5/5 season. |
You do realize that no one at Kobe's age has averaged 30 ppg for an entire season? And Kobe hasn't averaged 30 since 07?
I admit, the team is "bad" enough for him to be able to shoot that much to average 30, but he tore his achilles, man... If Kobe didn't get injured and we had this team, I would say 30 a game easily. We don't know when he'll be 100%, my guess is he comes back while still getting in shape, starts off quietly, like 20 ppg on 44% shooting and everyone pretty much writes him off, gets hot in the 2nd half of the season and rounds his numbers out at 25 5 5. |
25/5/5 still seems like a stretch. I think Kobe will look like MJ on the wizards. Flashes of that old greatness, but not consistent enough to maintain a high scoring avg. He may score 40 one night, and then have a few 17pt nights that will balance it out.
He may even score 50 in an attempt to prove he "still got it" , but overall he won't be able to do heavy scoring at will |
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