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CigaretteProtein Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Jul 2013 Posts: 652
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Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:29 am Post subject: |
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Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | CigaretteProtein wrote: | I guess I personally want more of an immediate impact. It will take 4 years for this guy. Like, I want a player who will be able to contribute in his 2nd year.
Ideally, someone who"ll average 10 ppg in his first year, 17 ppg in his second year. For Vonleh, 10 ppg will come in his third year. |
You want to take someone who's ultimately going to end up being the best player available, we may not have the luxury of having that and being ready for immediate contribution. |
I don't personally get the feeling that Vonleh will be more than a 3rd guy ever. Kinda like Odom. |
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Fan0Bynum17 Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436
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Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:37 am Post subject: |
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CigaretteProtein wrote: | Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | CigaretteProtein wrote: | I guess I personally want more of an immediate impact. It will take 4 years for this guy. Like, I want a player who will be able to contribute in his 2nd year.
Ideally, someone who"ll average 10 ppg in his first year, 17 ppg in his second year. For Vonleh, 10 ppg will come in his third year. |
You want to take someone who's ultimately going to end up being the best player available, we may not have the luxury of having that and being ready for immediate contribution. |
I don't personally get the feeling that Vonleh will be more than a 3rd guy ever. Kinda like Odom. |
I was just speaking in principle. |
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TheElectronica Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2010 Posts: 1392
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Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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CigaretteProtein wrote: | I guess I personally want more of an immediate impact. It will take 4 years for this guy. Like, I want a player who will be able to contribute in his 2nd year.
Ideally, someone who"ll average 10 ppg in his first year, 17 ppg in his second year. For Vonleh, 10 ppg will come in his third year. |
That's how you end up Okafor over Dwight Howard. |
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Triple-Threat-Lakers Star Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2007 Posts: 7504
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Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:55 am Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
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Fan0Bynum17 Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436
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Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:07 am Post subject: |
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He was measured at 6'9.75 in shoes at the hoop summit, and he only has an 8'10 standing reach, so unless he's still growing, that is not ideal C measurements. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:08 am Post subject: |
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Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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davidse Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jul 2005 Posts: 14302
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Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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he is not our guy. |
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T3R Star Player
Joined: 16 Aug 2012 Posts: 2734 Location: L.A.
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Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:04 pm Post subject: |
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Don't like Vonleh for LA.
Hope Mitch and Jim don't become enamored with this guy's size.
Much rather draft Cauley-Stein. |
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GoldenThroat Moderator
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 37474
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Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. |
Vonleh has about 20lbs on Odom and 40lbs on Durant at the same age. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. |
Vonleh has about 20lbs on Odom and 40lbs on Durant at the same age. |
Odom floated around 240-250 as a PF.
My point is, I'm not comfortable with Vonleh as a center. It's the same for Tyler and Cody Zeller. They have the size, and don't play C. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. |
Vonleh has about 20lbs on Odom and 40lbs on Durant at the same age. |
Odom floated around 240-250 as a PF.
My point is, I'm not comfortable with Vonleh as a center. It's the same for Tyler and Cody Zeller. They have the size, and don't play C. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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GoldenThroat Moderator
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 37474
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Posted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:03 am Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. |
Vonleh has about 20lbs on Odom and 40lbs on Durant at the same age. |
Odom floated around 240-250 as a PF.
My point is, I'm not comfortable with Vonleh as a center. It's the same for Tyler and Cody Zeller. They have the size, and don't play C. |
I don't think it's his primary position, but he can play there. Odom floated around 240-250 in his late 20's. Vonleh is 18 years old and in the low 240's. |
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TheElectronica Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2010 Posts: 1392
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Posted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:40 am Post subject: |
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6'8 without shoes, 6'9ish with shoes on. Wingspan helps, but LO floated around there but at the end of the games it was still Gasol finishing. And it isn't like today's centers are awful. They are big, but just not as skilled. But Vonleh doesn't have enough to battle Davis, Aldridge/Lopez, Duncan, Dwight, Cousins, Bogut, DJ, Kanter/Favors, Mozgov/McGee, Randolph/Gasol, Love/Pek, etc.
Those are a lot of quality bigs that he'd have to battle night in and night out at the center position. Not sure if he has the strength for it at all. This isn't like Noah with a strong base and the height giving up some weight. He's about 6'9 and 240, which is good power forward size but you'll wear him out at center. |
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AY2043 Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2012 Posts: 10620
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Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Triple-Threat-Lakers wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | At 6'9" in shoes with a 7'3" wingspan and light in the backpocket, I'm not convinced. It would be like playing Odom at center. |
Mike where are you getting the 6'9'' info from? Most draft sites have him at 6'10" and quite frankly with his length, that's enough to play center in today's NBA. |
Official measurements.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Noah-Vonleh-6471/
That's enough length. That's not enough strength.
Would you play Odom at center? He had that length.
Would you play Durant at center? He has that length. Actually, more so. |
Vonleh has about 20lbs on Odom and 40lbs on Durant at the same age. |
Odom floated around 240-250 as a PF.
My point is, I'm not comfortable with Vonleh as a center. It's the same for Tyler and Cody Zeller. They have the size, and don't play C. |
I don't think it's his primary position, but he can play there. Odom floated around 240-250 in his late 20's. Vonleh is 18 years old and in the low 240's. |
He's 18 and will have access to some of the best strength/conditioning coaches in the world. He should have no problem bulking up. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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AY2043 Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2012 Posts: 10620
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GoldenThroat Moderator
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 37474
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Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:15 am Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. |
He's going to naturally bulk up. He's 18 years old. The S&C programs will help that natural process happen more efficiently. Human beings don't stay the same weight as they are when they're 18. You were just talking about this happening with Odom. Same thing will happen with Vonleh. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:46 am Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. |
He's going to naturally bulk up. He's 18 years old. The S&C programs will help that natural process happen more efficiently. Human beings don't stay the same weight as they are when they're 18. You were just talking about this happening with Odom. Same thing will happen with Vonleh. |
Or KG. Strength was a problem for him but now he's got that wiry strength without too much bulk. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:56 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. |
He's going to naturally bulk up. He's 18 years old. The S&C programs will help that natural process happen more efficiently. Human beings don't stay the same weight as they are when they're 18. You were just talking about this happening with Odom. Same thing will happen with Vonleh. |
Or KG. Strength was a problem for him but now he's got that wiry strength without too much bulk. |
KG. Kevin Durant. Neither guy has really been hit with heavy injuries, especially on the knees.
Contrast to Bynum, Greg Oden... killed their legs.
The way Odom did it was taking boxing classes as his body matured near peak age. It didn't exactly tack on 25lbs. in a short period of time. Between Odom and Horry, the added bulk was a progression throughout their careers, when they started at roughly 220lbs. each. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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GoldenThroat Moderator
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 37474
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Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:21 am Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. |
He's going to naturally bulk up. He's 18 years old. The S&C programs will help that natural process happen more efficiently. Human beings don't stay the same weight as they are when they're 18. You were just talking about this happening with Odom. Same thing will happen with Vonleh. |
Or KG. Strength was a problem for him but now he's got that wiry strength without too much bulk. |
KG. Kevin Durant. Neither guy has really been hit with heavy injuries, especially on the knees.
Contrast to Bynum, Greg Oden... killed their legs.
The way Odom did it was taking boxing classes as his body matured near peak age. It didn't exactly tack on 25lbs. in a short period of time. Between Odom and Horry, the added bulk was a progression throughout their careers, when they started at roughly 220lbs. each. |
Both Bynum and Oden had faulty knees as teenagers. Had nothing to do with bulking up. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:47 am Post subject: |
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GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | GoldenThroat wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Bulking up is what has killed player's knees. |
He's going to naturally bulk up. He's 18 years old. The S&C programs will help that natural process happen more efficiently. Human beings don't stay the same weight as they are when they're 18. You were just talking about this happening with Odom. Same thing will happen with Vonleh. |
Or KG. Strength was a problem for him but now he's got that wiry strength without too much bulk. |
KG. Kevin Durant. Neither guy has really been hit with heavy injuries, especially on the knees.
Contrast to Bynum, Greg Oden... killed their legs.
The way Odom did it was taking boxing classes as his body matured near peak age. It didn't exactly tack on 25lbs. in a short period of time. Between Odom and Horry, the added bulk was a progression throughout their careers, when they started at roughly 220lbs. each. |
Both Bynum and Oden had faulty knees as teenagers. Had nothing to do with bulking up. |
What happens every offseason after the draft is, every player goes through some extreme; 10-15lbs of pounds gained or lost.
Considering the Laker situation with health, I don't want Vonleh to be doing anything that pushes his body to the extreme.
We lack healthy bodies as is. I don't want to risk that on a potential franchise changer (he does have that kind of upside) just because he gets pushed around a bit.
He plays center at college, because they're lightweights.
At the NBA level, it's PF, and he's on the lighter side of that right now. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:07 am Post subject: |
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Vonleh bulked up to play C for Indiana, but I think it hampered his quickness and motor a bit. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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Fan0Bynum17 Franchise Player
Joined: 30 Nov 2005 Posts: 15436
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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All players think bulking up is the answer these days, nothing you can really do about it. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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Fan0Bynum17 wrote: | All players think bulking up is the answer these days, nothing you can really do about it. |
Hopefully he grows into it a bit. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90299 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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FWIW, Vonleh is exactly the kind of guy you'd like to pair with Love. Ability to cover out on the perimeter and protect the rim. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel |
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