Will we ever be what we once were?

[divncom]

It seems like there are two prevailing philosophies around here at this point and that time is only widening the gap between them.

The first side are labelled reactionaries. They take the stance that the current management has failed. The underlying sentiment seems to be that they feel we're NOT on track to return to greatness.

The second side is loyal to the team's ownership and play the part of "realists" in many contexts here. They take the position that this is just a "typical" developmental cycle. They also argue it's insubordinate of the previous party to constantly undermine front office decisions. The underlying sentiment seems to be we ARE on a NATURAL progression.

Whether we will ever be what we once were seems to be a legitimate question mark. Would it be illogical for us to imagine us going into a similar spiral as the post-dynasty Celtics?

What arguments or evidence are you relying on to supply yourself hope that we're not going to become historical artifacts? What "advantages" do we have?

Isn't it irrational to ASSUME we're somehow going to replicate the level of success we're used to ... ever? Many/most of the elements that led to that formula are gone/have been controlled for, now.

Is this a natural ebb/tide in our orbit around the sun, or have we gone off track into outer space and realms unknown?

Neutral Conclusion: We're not going to be awful forever, but it's also unlikely that we'll have a run of domination similar to the last few decades for a very, very long time.
_________________
Chick Hearn was my favorite broadcaster ever - he's the one who taught me to think basketball, how to love basketball. - Bill Walton

[postandpivot]

[dmorans1]

It's been 4 years since our last title. Today's society is so messed up.

[LuciusAllen]

[divncom]

It would be interesting to see an actual argument, though, to support the idea we're "supposed" to return to greatness or that it's "God's Will" that we will return there.

The more logical conclusion would be a more measured one, taking the modern landscape and situation into account more realistically (cap space, other factors).

There's no intrinsically sound reason to assume we're going to return to our former level of domination. That's not so much a naive perspective as it is a more objective (non-homer) point of view.

Yes it's only 4 years removed from our previous championship, but the changes since then are profound. Much more profound than say, the gap between the 3-peat and those titles.

I think to assume we're going to return to dominance anytime soon is based on absolutely nothing tangible.
_________________
Chick Hearn was my favorite broadcaster ever - he's the one who taught me to think basketball, how to love basketball. - Bill Walton

[divncom]

[postandpivot]

[TheElectronica]

Cap space+draft pick.

There was a longer gap post Magic than we did since our last championship. It's about accumulating talent and cap space for LA. This isn't Milwaukee or Philly where no one wants to come. This is LA. Players are going to want to play here.

[divncom]

[Hector the Pup]

No. This team is doomed. The current structure is brand new and will never deliver results. It's not like it has been in place for years and has proven itself. Jim, Jeannie and Mitch are all brand new to this dynamic and there is no reason to have any faith in them.

I suggest that everyone who agrees with me immediately delete their accounts and start following another team.


















(BTW, there were some idiots here who actually thought that Chick cursed the team when he died and that they would never win once he was gone)

[divncom]

[Omar Little]

Sounds like you already have your "faith", so why bother asking for input?
_________________
“We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel

[divncom]

[divncom]

[Reflexx]

The thing that differentiates the Lakers from other franchises is that people want to play here for multiple reasons.

History
Character
Location
The spotlight
The huge fan base

Other teams may have one, or maybe even a couple of those; but no other team has the complete package like we do.

Half of the players out there grew up imagining that they were on the Lakers. To be the face of this franchise is the epitome of the sport.

[kobeandgary]

never know what superstar could run off and sign here, or be traded here or be drafted here, i have faith that the lakers will be back to there winning ways soon enough.

[divncom]

[laker4life]

Of course.

But it may take a loooong time.

[divncom]

[AY2043]

I agree that we may never achieve the levels of dominance we've had in the past. But I think that will be more due to the CBA than faults in ownership.

[divncom]

[TooMuchMajicBuss]

OK I'll say my 2 cents worth - It's not a 'religion' to say players want to play in LA. I'm not from LA, never lived there, but there's no question the Lakers are the premier franchise in the minds of most fans here in Portland, around the rest of the country, and internationally, and the premier franchise as well for many players who grew up idolizing Kobe, as evidenced by how many potential draft picks say they'd like to be a Laker. There IS a lot more draw to be a Laker than there is to be a Buck, Timberwolve, or Blazer for that matter, and that means, Dwight excluded, that on 50/50 decisions players are going to lean towards LA.

LA has a huge TV market and a huge following here and around the world. Some players want a big stage, and there is none bigger outside of maybe MSG.

Of course there's no predicting the future, but I find it pretty ludicrous to say that the things that made the Lakers great are all in the past and gone. Bullcrap on that. Mitch Kupchak provides continuity, and for that matter few if any people here have any idea how the Lakers actually make decisions, in spite of the army of posters who act and talk as if they have it all figured out. It's possible Jim Buss is reclusive for a reason. His dad prepped him to have a thick skin and he stays out of the limelight. For all we know, the Buss kids are trying to replicate the process Doc had in place with Mitch.

There's a lot of logic to the idea the Buss kids would want to replicate the process to the best of their abilities. That family doesn't own a bank or oil company. The Lakers are all they have. It would only be logical for them to want to do all they can to keep that franchise valuable. That means putting a good product on the floor, and thinking long term, and having a desire to do so just like Doc did because it worked. There's a lot more logic to that argument then there is to the 'religion' that Jimbo flaunts an ego and overrides Mitch all the time, a mantra endlessly repeated by people who never met the guy.

As for the current mess that's on the floor, this is a result of relying on an old core for way too long hoping to squeeze one last title out of the dynasty before blowing it up and starting on a new one. The Lakers salary cap situation is going to look very good in the next couple years, and there is no logical reason to assume the Lakers won't effectively use that cap. Mitch has a good, proven track record and he's just renewed with the Lakers.

Beyond this, nobody knows the future. It could be decades of mediocrity, or we could have another Showtime era starting in a couple years. We just don't know, but where's the logic in being a Laker fan at all if one chooses to believe the worst is ahead of us? Wouldn't it be more logical to sign off, get outside, and do something else if that's what you believe?

[lakersken80]

No, because of the new CBA and the passing of our most successful owner. Our future is uncertain. That being said the Lakers will be a destination because of its market and also its place in the NBA. There are tons of small market teams and teams with a lot more mediocrity that would kill for the Lakers position and marketplace.

[lakersken80]

[divncom]