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yinoma2001
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 Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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LS, what's your valuation of what you think Jules gets on the FA market?
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Cutheon
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| Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:43 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | LS, what's your valuation of what you think Jules gets on the FA market? |
I'm not LS, but I'm just gonna slide right in to say: I want the Lakers to resign him at 12-14; I am okay with 15-16; I do not expect any team to offer a contract above that; if they do, I think the cap is 18m; my dark horse candidate is the Rockets, in the belief that if there is one person in this league that can turn Julius into a shooter overnight, and thereby unlock his fill potential, it's Mike D'antoni. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Cutheon wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | LS, what's your valuation of what you think Jules gets on the FA market? |
I'm not LS, but I'm just gonna slide right in to say: I want the Lakers to resign him at 12-14; I am okay with 15-16; I do not expect any team to offer a contract above that; if they do, I think the cap is 18m; my dark horse candidate is the Rockets, in the belief that if there is one person in this league that can turn Julius into a shooter overnight, and thereby unlock his fill potential, it's Mike D'antoni. |
I'm not as educated as some are re: who has cap space and who doesn't. However, my understanding is that the teams with real cap space this summer will be limited to us, Dallas, Chicago, Indiana and Brooklyn.
Assuming those four other teams are the only teams who could make Randle a real offer, you can eliminate Indiana (Turner and Sabonis) and Chicago (Portis and Markenan) right off the bat. They have their own young players and don't need a 24 year old who is still not an entirely sure thing. Brooklyn could make a play, but I don't think they have serious money or would pay serious money (anything above $16-$18 million a year).
I could see Dallas going after Randle pretty easily. Dallas is really the only true contender IMO. However, they (and the league) may not value Randle as we do. I think Randle is underrated. This summer, here is the list of front court FAs (ranked in order according to Hoopshype): Cousins, Jordan, Capela (RFA), Gordon (RFA), Parker (RFA), Randle (RFA), Mirotic (RFA), Favors, Anthony, Kanter, B. Lopez and Nurkic.
I don't think Dallas goes for Jordan again, but wouldn't be surprised if they make Cousins a big offer. Capela sticks with the Rockets UNLESS Lebron goes there. Magic match for Gordon - no way they let him go no matter the price (the Magic can't afford to let their young guys go). Parker is a wild card and Nurkic I think may actually get paid. I don't think Milwaukee wants to pay Parker a lot given his injury history and could seriously see Dallas step in with an offer for him. Strategically, for both Houston and us, it might make sense to give Capela and/or Randle some quick offers just to put both teams on the clock while we wait for our free agent options to play out. Bottom line is that I could equally see Dallas making offers for Cousins, Parker, Capela and Randle. Who they actually make an offer to is anyone's guess.
Therefore, to answer the question, it really depends on what Dallas does. I could see Dallas making Randle an offer in the $18-$20 million range (just outside of what we likely want to pay him). In that case, I think Randle is likely gone (unless he somehow finishes the year even better than he's already been paid and we just have to keep him). However, if Dallas doesn't do it, I think we offer him something between $12-$14 million. Even then, possible that Randle doesn't take it, pulls a Noel and takes the qualifying offer to see what's out there next summer.
Bottom line is that I don't think he is getting a max deal or one above $20 million. Also, all of this could go out the window if we pull a Deng trade freeing up more space. In that situation, we may not mind paying Randle a little extra while still being able to maintain two max spaces for 2018 and/or 2019.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules?
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Cutheon
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| Posted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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| I'm pretty sure the Rockets would have the room; still, had them as my dark horse for a reason. |
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pio2u
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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Assessing Julius Randle’s long-term value
| Quote: | | Los Angeles Lakers forward Julius Randle is approaching a crucial juncture in his career. He is entering restricted free agency this summer, and the Lakers have to decide how much they want him, though their decision will likely also be dependent on their luck attracting max free agents. |
https://www.fanragsports.com/lakers/assessing-julius-randles-long-term-value/amp/ |
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LakerFan1972
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
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Laker's Fan
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
I think Dallas can keep McBucket's cap hold and still offer Randle a salary starting around $14M, but it would force them to renounce everybody else.
I don't see the Randle fit in Dallas myself. Carlisle's schemes call for spacing and they allow for one spot that can't shoot which is reserved for a rim protecting big. Barnes is their crunch time PF.
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LakerSD
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
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Jesusdelonla
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
I think Dallas can keep McBucket's cap hold and still offer Randle a salary starting around $14M, but it would force them to renounce everybody else.
I don't see the Randle fit in Dallas myself. Carlisle's schemes call for spacing and they allow for one spot that can't shoot which is reserved for a rim protecting big. Barnes is their crunch time PF. |
their top 3 pick will cost them 6/7m as well |
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repandpresent
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:48 am Post subject: |
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Since the trade deadline, he's been trying to attack double teams more often. He's a bully out there but when he does that, and it has been a lot lately, the flow of the game is affected.
The few weeks leading up to the deadline he was playing great.
I want to see less of him trying to score on double teams and more of pre trade deadline hustle. |
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dcarter4kobe
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:25 am Post subject: |
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Will be interesting to see what kind of market it is for Randle & other free agents. I would be pretty happy with a 4y/56M deal.
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pio2u
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:07 am Post subject: |
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I love Julius' hustle and passion but his BBIQ is average at best. His decision-making is, at times, frustrating. He tries to do too much or he tries to do things that he's not good at.
He, too often, does not realize his limitations and does not consistently play to his strengths.
I like his playmaking ability on the break but he frequently tries to create plays in transition that just aren't there and usually picks up an offensive foul by doing so.
He also needs to be a more willing passer once he's doubled under the rim instead of forcing up a shot. His lack of length makes this situation even more problematic.
Lastly, his perimeter shot is still unreliable; he is shooting 23% from behind the arc which is not exactly what teams are looking for these days.
Julius could be a very good playmaking power forward because he has the tools and skills.
He possesses speed, power, passing ability, great rebounding and interior scoring but he has a lot of work to do in order to improve his glaring weaknesses.
I would love for the Lakers to retain his services but at a slight hometown discount.
I hope that he can be persuaded to stay here and potentially play with two super-stars who could help him hone his skills and perhaps also be part of something special.
We will just have to wait until summer where his market value will ultimately be determined. |
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Car54
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:19 am Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
I think Dallas can keep McBucket's cap hold and still offer Randle a salary starting around $14M, but it would force them to renounce everybody else.
I don't see the Randle fit in Dallas myself. Carlisle's schemes call for spacing and they allow for one spot that can't shoot which is reserved for a rim protecting big. Barnes is their crunch time PF. |
Actually Randle can start at Center and he would fit perfectly next to Barnes. You don't need to have shot blocking when you have bigs that can switch on guards.
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ingle
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| pio2u wrote: | I love Julius' hustle and passion but his BBIQ is average at best. His decision-making is, at times, frustrating. He tries to do too much or he tries to do things that he's not good at.
He, too often, does not realize his limitations and does not consistently play to his strengths.
I like his playmaking ability on the break but he frequently tries to create plays in transition that just aren't there and usually picks up an offensive foul by doing so.
He also needs to be a more willing passer once he's doubled under the rim instead of forcing up a shot. His lack of length makes this situation even more problematic.
Lastly, his perimeter shot is still unreliable; he is shooting 23% from behind the arc which is not exactly what teams are looking for these days.
Julius could be a very good playmaking power forward because he has the tools and skills.
He possesses speed, power, passing ability, great rebounding and interior scoring but he has a lot of work to do in order to improve his glaring weaknesses.
I would love for the Lakers to retain his services but at a slight hometown discount.
I hope that he can be persuaded to stay here and potentially play with two super-stars who could help him hone his skills and perhaps also be part of something special.
We will just have to wait until summer where his market value will ultimately be determined. |
I agree with everything here, I love Julius as a wrecking ball at 20 minutes a game, more if the opposing frontline is white guys with slow foot speed that he can abuse at will.
Giving him starter minutes and money would get me very nervous. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| Car54 wrote: | | Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
I think Dallas can keep McBucket's cap hold and still offer Randle a salary starting around $14M, but it would force them to renounce everybody else.
I don't see the Randle fit in Dallas myself. Carlisle's schemes call for spacing and they allow for one spot that can't shoot which is reserved for a rim protecting big. Barnes is their crunch time PF. |
Actually Randle can start at Center and he would fit perfectly next to Barnes. You don't need to have shot blocking when you have bigs that can switch on guards. |
Seems to me Dallas/Carlisle love their big centers. Last year was the first time recently they went without a "traditional" starting center, as they had to find a place to play Dirk with Barnes.
2015: Zaza
2014: Chandler
2013: Dalembert
Etc.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:57 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSD wrote: | | LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
If I'm Dallas, I'd rather tank one more season, and have, you got it, 2 max slots for 2019 after Dirk likely retires. Get a top 5 pick this year and next, and you have a really nice squad for the future.
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LakerSD
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:07 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
If I'm Dallas, I'd rather tank one more season, and have, you got it, 2 max slots for 2019 after Dirk likely retires. Get a top 5 pick this year and next, and you have a really nice squad for the future. |
That’s the better strategy for sure. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSD wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
If I'm Dallas, I'd rather tank one more season, and have, you got it, 2 max slots for 2019 after Dirk likely retires. Get a top 5 pick this year and next, and you have a really nice squad for the future. |
That’s the better strategy for sure. |
Randle would win them a few more games, and you may be spending 16-18m of the cap space you could throw at the 2019 FA class.
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Ziggy
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:34 am Post subject: |
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| ingle wrote: | | pio2u wrote: | I love Julius' hustle and passion but his BBIQ is average at best. His decision-making is, at times, frustrating. He tries to do too much or he tries to do things that he's not good at.
He, too often, does not realize his limitations and does not consistently play to his strengths.
I like his playmaking ability on the break but he frequently tries to create plays in transition that just aren't there and usually picks up an offensive foul by doing so.
He also needs to be a more willing passer once he's doubled under the rim instead of forcing up a shot. His lack of length makes this situation even more problematic.
Lastly, his perimeter shot is still unreliable; he is shooting 23% from behind the arc which is not exactly what teams are looking for these days.
Julius could be a very good playmaking power forward because he has the tools and skills.
He possesses speed, power, passing ability, great rebounding and interior scoring but he has a lot of work to do in order to improve his glaring weaknesses.
I would love for the Lakers to retain his services but at a slight hometown discount.
I hope that he can be persuaded to stay here and potentially play with two super-stars who could help him hone his skills and perhaps also be part of something special.
We will just have to wait until summer where his market value will ultimately be determined. |
I agree with everything here, I love Julius as a wrecking ball at 20 minutes a game, more if the opposing frontline is white guys with slow foot speed that he can abuse at will.
Giving him starter minutes and money would get me very nervous. |
Lamar Odom had the exact same issue with running over guys in the paint and collecting charge calls. He was able to learn to cut down on it drastically at an older age than Randle. As frustrating as it was/is to watch, LO taught me that it can be fixed.
Ultimately, I think Randle should play the same role as LO did on a championship team. Odom came off the bench and killed you with finesse and Randle can do the same with his physicality. LO finished games for us and so can JR. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:34 am Post subject: |
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| Julius may want to go home, making Dallas a threat. But Sacramento is going to have money and will make a stupid free agent offer to someone this summer, so don't be surprised if Vlade overpays to get Joerger his "young ZBo." |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:36 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
If I'm Dallas, I'd rather tank one more season, and have, you got it, 2 max slots for 2019 after Dirk likely retires. Get a top 5 pick this year and next, and you have a really nice squad for the future. |
Or bring a Dallas kid back home to pair with DeAndre Ayton and DSJ. |
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scooterp10
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | Another thing to consider in evaluating Randle - he graduated high school the same year as Kuzma and Hart. Kuzma red-shirted his first year, but was in school for four years. Just something to think about in comparing the three. |
If Randle was a rookie everyone would be singing his praises |
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defense
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:45 am Post subject: |
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| scooterp10 wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | | Another thing to consider in evaluating Randle - he graduated high school the same year as Kuzma and Hart. Kuzma red-shirted his first year, but was in school for four years. Just something to think about in comparing the three. |
If Randle was a rookie everyone would be singing his praises |
When you've seen a guy play for 3 seasons. Is not fair to say "if he was a rookie". There is data and evidence to make assumptions on. Every situation and player is unique, judge them as such. |
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scooterp10
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:48 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | LakerSD wrote: | | LakerFan1972 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | The McDermott move was curious for Dallas. Why trade for a RFA that they will have to renounce if they're not going after someone like Jules? |
Looks like they turned Devin Harris' expiring contract into a 2nd rounder. They are in full tank mode, so collecting assets/picks where they can. Makes me doubt Dallas would really throw a big contract at JR. Going to be an interesting summer. |
Imo this is just tanking for this year’s draft. They could still make a run at JR.
Barnes
DSJ
Lottery pick
Randle
Pretty decent 4 to build around if they choose to go that route. I still think they make a substantial offer to Randle...just not sure if they overpay like they did with Barnes. |
If I'm Dallas, I'd rather tank one more season, and have, you got it, 2 max slots for 2019 after Dirk likely retires. Get a top 5 pick this year and next, and you have a really nice squad for the future. |
That sounds like the Lakers |
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