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h2omike Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 2811
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Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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I think dumping Deng takes almost all costs probably anyone not named BI or Ball would get matched to send out Deng for picks or expiring, Kuzma included. Russell should be seen as a sign of things to come. |
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awntawn Starting Rotation
Joined: 29 Apr 2016 Posts: 953
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Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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h2omike wrote: | I think dumping Deng takes almost all costs probably anyone not named BI or Ball would get matched to send out Deng for picks or expiring, Kuzma included. Russell should be seen as a sign of things to come. |
We don't need to dump Deng for the two max plan. We can stretch him. The only reason dump him would be to be able to keep Randle in addition to the two maxes. Trading Randle in order to dump Deng defeats its own purpose. |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: | 22 wrote: | The caphold pretty much means nothing. It will be worked out after the other negotiations. Boston didn't have enough space to sign Hayward but they worked it out afterward.
Same thing with Julius. If he plays well his year he stays IMO. They can move other pieces to sign two maxes if need be or stretch Deng |
The thing about Boston is they waited till they had Hayward commit before making subsequent moves. Which is why the Lakers should hold on moving anyone (unless they get a deal that right away moves a contract like Deng's or Clarkson's without needing to give up any of the core) until a max free agent commits to them.
Because ultimately they're gonna have room for one max this off-season without needing to worry about moving anyone, it's the '2nd max' that's got people all flustered. To me they should focus on landing one max player first and then if that's accomplished THEN worry about who or who not to move.
Till then it's pointless to even plan for it like it's an absolute. Like Boston did, they waited till they got a commitment and THEN made moves to free up the space. |
exactly |
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True Lakers Fan Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Oct 2011 Posts: 917 Location: Texas
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:16 am Post subject: |
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awntawn wrote: | h2omike wrote: | I think dumping Deng takes almost all costs probably anyone not named BI or Ball would get matched to send out Deng for picks or expiring, Kuzma included. Russell should be seen as a sign of things to come. |
We don't need to dump Deng for the two max plan. We can stretch him. The only reason dump him would be to be able to keep Randle in addition to the two maxes. Trading Randle in order to dump Deng defeats its own purpose. |
Plus. if they did try to attach Randle with Deng most teams won't bite on that because they wouldn't want to pay Deng's contract and give Randle his money when the time comes. _________________ I can accept failure, but I can't accept not trying. |
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Ziggy Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 12712
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:58 am Post subject: |
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h2omike wrote: | I think dumping Deng takes almost all costs probably anyone not named BI or Ball would get matched to send out Deng for picks or expiring, Kuzma included. Russell should be seen as a sign of things to come. |
Russell wasn't a "dump" though. We got back an all-star center at 29 years old. |
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Ziggy Franchise Player
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 12712
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:03 am Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | MJST wrote: | 22 wrote: | The caphold pretty much means nothing. It will be worked out after the other negotiations. Boston didn't have enough space to sign Hayward but they worked it out afterward.
Same thing with Julius. If he plays well his year he stays IMO. They can move other pieces to sign two maxes if need be or stretch Deng |
The thing about Boston is they waited till they had Hayward commit before making subsequent moves. Which is why the Lakers should hold on moving anyone (unless they get a deal that right away moves a contract like Deng's or Clarkson's without needing to give up any of the core) until a max free agent commits to them.
Because ultimately they're gonna have room for one max this off-season without needing to worry about moving anyone, it's the '2nd max' that's got people all flustered. To me they should focus on landing one max player first and then if that's accomplished THEN worry about who or who not to move.
Till then it's pointless to even plan for it like it's an absolute. Like Boston did, they waited till they got a commitment and THEN made moves to free up the space. |
exactly |
The thing is, you want max free agents to know that you have the possibility to sign 2 of them. Magic is trying to produce another situation like the Miami Heat, where these guys want to team up with each other. Having 2 spots open increases your chances of getting 1. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:13 am Post subject: |
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Ziggy wrote: | 22 wrote: | MJST wrote: | 22 wrote: | The caphold pretty much means nothing. It will be worked out after the other negotiations. Boston didn't have enough space to sign Hayward but they worked it out afterward.
Same thing with Julius. If he plays well his year he stays IMO. They can move other pieces to sign two maxes if need be or stretch Deng |
The thing about Boston is they waited till they had Hayward commit before making subsequent moves. Which is why the Lakers should hold on moving anyone (unless they get a deal that right away moves a contract like Deng's or Clarkson's without needing to give up any of the core) until a max free agent commits to them.
Because ultimately they're gonna have room for one max this off-season without needing to worry about moving anyone, it's the '2nd max' that's got people all flustered. To me they should focus on landing one max player first and then if that's accomplished THEN worry about who or who not to move.
Till then it's pointless to even plan for it like it's an absolute. Like Boston did, they waited till they got a commitment and THEN made moves to free up the space. |
exactly |
The thing is, you want max free agents to know that you have the possibility to sign 2 of them. Magic is trying to produce another situation like the Miami Heat, where these guys want to team up with each other. Having 2 spots open increases your chances of getting 1. |
I think Magic understands that 1 star is unlikely to come here by his lonesome. It's either 2 stars or none IMO. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:19 am Post subject: |
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Ziggy wrote: | h2omike wrote: | I think dumping Deng takes almost all costs probably anyone not named BI or Ball would get matched to send out Deng for picks or expiring, Kuzma included. Russell should be seen as a sign of things to come. |
Russell wasn't a "dump" though. We got back an all-star center at 29 years old. |
To go with our all star Deng. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:20 am Post subject: |
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Ziggy wrote: | 22 wrote: | MJST wrote: | 22 wrote: | The caphold pretty much means nothing. It will be worked out after the other negotiations. Boston didn't have enough space to sign Hayward but they worked it out afterward.
Same thing with Julius. If he plays well his year he stays IMO. They can move other pieces to sign two maxes if need be or stretch Deng |
The thing about Boston is they waited till they had Hayward commit before making subsequent moves. Which is why the Lakers should hold on moving anyone (unless they get a deal that right away moves a contract like Deng's or Clarkson's without needing to give up any of the core) until a max free agent commits to them.
Because ultimately they're gonna have room for one max this off-season without needing to worry about moving anyone, it's the '2nd max' that's got people all flustered. To me they should focus on landing one max player first and then if that's accomplished THEN worry about who or who not to move.
Till then it's pointless to even plan for it like it's an absolute. Like Boston did, they waited till they got a commitment and THEN made moves to free up the space. |
exactly |
The thing is, you want max free agents to know that you have the possibility to sign 2 of them. Magic is trying to produce another situation like the Miami Heat, where these guys want to team up with each other. Having 2 spots open increases your chances of getting 1. |
Yes, putting the cart before the horse is always the solid move. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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nash Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 Posts: 8194
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:51 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: |
I think Magic understands that 1 star is unlikely to come here by his lonesome. It's either 2 stars or none IMO. |
Lopez is a legit player that can help the process, we are in better situation than we were one year ago without any flexibility for sure.
Last edited by nash on Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:31 am; edited 1 time in total |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:55 am Post subject: |
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nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: |
I think Magic understands that 1 star is unlikely to come here by his lonesome. It's either 2 stars or none IMO. |
Lopez is a legit player that can help the process, we are in better situation than we had one year ago without any flexibility for sure. |
We didn't make the trade only to end up maxing Brook.
It is a 2 max plan, Magic and Pelinka have stated it publicly many times. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
No, I'm not entertaining the fantasy that Deng is traded for $0.
Bird rights waived, team is capped out, how much can offer on a one-year deal? |
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nash Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 Posts: 8194
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
The problem is unloading Deng without taking back any salary in return, because I can see Lopez taking a big one year discount to play with LeBron. |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
The problem is unloading Deng without taking back any salary in return, because I can see Lopez taking a big one year discount to play with LeBron. |
This. He's logged enough years to get into some kind of exception, right, so he's not taking the league minimum? |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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greenfrog wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
No, I'm not entertaining the fantasy that Deng is traded for $0.
Bird rights waived, team is capped out, how much can offer on a one-year deal? |
Would be the room exception of around 4.5m. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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yall are getting way off topic lol |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
The problem is unloading Deng without taking back any salary in return, because I can see Lopez taking a big one year discount to play with LeBron. |
Deng could be offloaded for 2 future 1sts (I'm not in favor of that). Future 1st + 2nd rounder(s) for Deng in 2018 (so only 2 years on deal)? Maybe. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
Depends.
Is Deng traded for $0 (assuming JC/Jules aren't on the books either). If so, I think 10-11m. Bear in mind, Lakers have his full Bird rights so in 2019, could offer him more. Just a 1 year reprieve to get 2 max players. |
No, I'm not entertaining the fantasy that Deng is traded for $0.
Bird rights waived, team is capped out, how much can offer on a one-year deal? |
Would be the room exception of around 4.5m. |
Thank you. I hate to burden you again, but in terms of a raise in 2019, what could they do for him?
Last edited by greenfrog on Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:20 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | yall are getting way off topic lol |
Yes. Let's take this to the 2017 FA thread. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:21 pm Post subject: |
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greenfrog wrote: | Thank you. I hate to burden you again, but in terms of a raise in 2019, what could they do for him? |
If Bird rights intact, can give him up to the max (which he won't get).
Different from an Early Bird right player, where IIRC, the most you could give is 175% from the year before. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | greenfrog wrote: | Thank you. I hate to burden you again, but in terms of a raise in 2019, what could they do for him? |
If Bird rights intact, can give him up to the max (which he won't get).
Different from an Early Bird right player, where IIRC, the most you could give is 175% from the year before. |
No, I meant with his Bird rights renounced, and just him taking that $4.5m in 2018.
Last edited by greenfrog on Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:23 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Laker's Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 12810
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: |
I think Magic understands that 1 star is unlikely to come here by his lonesome. It's either 2 stars or none IMO. |
Lopez is a legit player that can help the process, we are in better situation than we had one year ago without any flexibility for sure. |
We didn't make the trade only to end up maxing Brook.
It is a 2 max plan, Magic and Pelinka have stated it publicly many times. |
If LA were to maneuver to have a good 18-19 roster and a path to max in 19-20 I could still see a 1-star addition next July. Despite what he's said I could see George being that guy. If he doesn't sign the extension I could also see Westbrook being that guy. LeBron seems like a bit more of a stretch given his age, but who knows. A lot depends on how much of an impact Lonzo actually has early on. The unique thing for him is that you don't depend on him doing things on his own. He's more of a 3M kind of guy.
If you went max guys in successive years Deng would be an expiring so moving him would become less difficult and perhaps even serve as salary ballast.
You still would need to defer salary so other adjustments would need to be made. But I'm just saying I don't know that it's 2Max or none. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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greenfrog wrote: | What's the most they can offer Lopez after signing PG13 and Lebron? |
The room exception. They would have to renounce his app. $33 mil cap hold to have space to sign two max FAs. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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