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jlinfan
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 Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 4:38 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | jlinfan wrote: | | Team of the 80's wrote: |
The next Lebron, the Bird, the next Magic, the next.......
If it was so easy to just tank and get the next great player all of these lottery teams that end up with the first pick would have one.
Equity is a funny thing these days. One day your house or business is worth millions, the next day its underwater. If the Lakers continue to lose just to get into the lotto it will turn off fans, casual fans for sure, and the franchise will lose equity.
Of course I have no facts to back any of this up. It's just my opinion. I'll leave the facts to the experts. |
Agreed. From a owner point of view, tanking makes sense. It gives them an excuse to suck year after year. From a fan point of view, I find it ridiculous to support a product that sucks on purpose. How can miracles happen if your tanking? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Here we are now, entertain us. |
Then you would have had to support the team trading Kobe last season when he couldn't play. $30M eating up lots of cap space, taking up roster space.
Why would you be ok with burning $30M of your cap space for something that doesn't contribute on the court unless you want to support a product that sucks on purpose? How can miracles happen when you have players eating up lots of salary cap space and they're not even playing? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Right? Or ... right?
See how silly that sounds? So you can't just always live in the now, sometimes you have to look ahead (both in life and basketball)
It's not always easy nor desirable, I mean, I'm pretty sure no one on Team Tank WANTS to tank, they just feel that it is a necessary short-term sacrifice for an incrementally better long term benefit. |
At this point, your arguing with yourself because you misinterpreted my words.
I did not imply trading anyone let alone someone who should retire a laker.
I understand your passion and your desire to win another championship. But I think there is more than one way to skin a cat. Especially when the odds are stacked against us even with a high pick. I'm sure its been said ad nauseum that we only have 1/30 chance of winning every year; that includes each and every team that has a top 5 pick on their roster; having a lottery pick is not guaranteed a shot at the title let alone becoming an all star; injuries and fate will lay waste to the best laid plans. In other words the odds are overwhelming in favor of losing. With that said I would rather cheer for and watch an entertaining team that plays balls out, win or lose. Don't want to suck on purpose for an entire year just for a "chance" at improving. On top of that, how many years are you willing to tank? 3 maybe 4 years? What if at the end of the 4 years you are no better?
Does not compute for me. |
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pio2u
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Joined: 26 Dec 2012
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 4:42 am Post subject: |
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| jlinfan wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | jlinfan wrote: | | Team of the 80's wrote: |
The next Lebron, the Bird, the next Magic, the next.......
If it was so easy to just tank and get the next great player all of these lottery teams that end up with the first pick would have one.
Equity is a funny thing these days. One day your house or business is worth millions, the next day its underwater. If the Lakers continue to lose just to get into the lotto it will turn off fans, casual fans for sure, and the franchise will lose equity.
Of course I have no facts to back any of this up. It's just my opinion. I'll leave the facts to the experts. |
Agreed. From a owner point of view, tanking makes sense. It gives them an excuse to suck year after year. From a fan point of view, I find it ridiculous to support a product that sucks on purpose. How can miracles happen if your tanking? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Here we are now, entertain us. |
Then you would have had to support the team trading Kobe last season when he couldn't play. $30M eating up lots of cap space, taking up roster space.
Why would you be ok with burning $30M of your cap space for something that doesn't contribute on the court unless you want to support a product that sucks on purpose? How can miracles happen when you have players eating up lots of salary cap space and they're not even playing? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Right? Or ... right?
See how silly that sounds? So you can't just always live in the now, sometimes you have to look ahead (both in life and basketball)
It's not always easy nor desirable, I mean, I'm pretty sure no one on Team Tank WANTS to tank, they just feel that it is a necessary short-term sacrifice for an incrementally better long term benefit. |
At this point, your arguing with yourself because you misinterpreted my words.
I did not imply trading anyone let alone someone who should retire a laker.
I understand your passion and your desire to win another championship. But I think there is more than one way to skin a cat. Especially when the odds are stacked against us even with a high pick. I'm sure its been said ad nauseum that we only have 1/30 chance of winning every year; that includes each and every team that has a top 5 pick on their roster; having a lottery pick is not guaranteed a shot at the title let alone becoming an all star; injuries and fate will lay waste to the best laid plans. In other words the odds are overwhelming in favor of losing. With that said I would rather cheer for and watch an entertaining team that plays balls out, win or lose. Don't want to suck on purpose for an entire year just for a "chance" at improving. On top of that, how many years are you willing to tank? 3 maybe 4 years? What if at the end of the 4 years you are no better?
Does not compute for me either. |
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 6:07 am Post subject: |
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| jlinfan wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | | jlinfan wrote: | | Team of the 80's wrote: |
The next Lebron, the Bird, the next Magic, the next.......
If it was so easy to just tank and get the next great player all of these lottery teams that end up with the first pick would have one.
Equity is a funny thing these days. One day your house or business is worth millions, the next day its underwater. If the Lakers continue to lose just to get into the lotto it will turn off fans, casual fans for sure, and the franchise will lose equity.
Of course I have no facts to back any of this up. It's just my opinion. I'll leave the facts to the experts. |
Agreed. From a owner point of view, tanking makes sense. It gives them an excuse to suck year after year. From a fan point of view, I find it ridiculous to support a product that sucks on purpose. How can miracles happen if your tanking? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Here we are now, entertain us. |
Then you would have had to support the team trading Kobe last season when he couldn't play. $30M eating up lots of cap space, taking up roster space.
Why would you be ok with burning $30M of your cap space for something that doesn't contribute on the court unless you want to support a product that sucks on purpose? How can miracles happen when you have players eating up lots of salary cap space and they're not even playing? You won't live forever and not everyone wants to wait. Right? Or ... right?
See how silly that sounds? So you can't just always live in the now, sometimes you have to look ahead (both in life and basketball)
It's not always easy nor desirable, I mean, I'm pretty sure no one on Team Tank WANTS to tank, they just feel that it is a necessary short-term sacrifice for an incrementally better long term benefit. |
At this point, your arguing with yourself because you misinterpreted my words.
I did not imply trading anyone let alone someone who should retire a laker.
I understand your passion and your desire to win another championship. But I think there is more than one way to skin a cat. Especially when the odds are stacked against us even with a high pick. I'm sure its been said ad nauseum that we only have 1/30 chance of winning every year; that includes each and every team that has a top 5 pick on their roster; having a lottery pick is not guaranteed a shot at the title let alone becoming an all star; injuries and fate will lay waste to the best laid plans. In other words the odds are overwhelming in favor of losing. With that said I would rather cheer for and watch an entertaining team that plays balls out, win or lose. Don't want to suck on purpose for an entire year just for a "chance" at improving. On top of that, how many years are you willing to tank? 3 maybe 4 years? What if at the end of the 4 years you are no better?
Does not compute for me. |
Yes but you said support a product that sucks on purpose. If you have an injured player that is a key contributor (and I'd say Kobe is that) and he cannot play, and the team chooses to keep a player around that cannot play, then that is sucking on purpose so then you can't support that.
But that's the point. Just because a guy is hurt, and his replacement is not as good, doesn't mean it is better in the long run to get rid of that guy. In the short term, yes. It would have been better for last season to trade Kobe and get someone better than Meeks with that money.
Popovich sits his older players on certain games like back to backs. That's sucking on purpose too. He is intentionally putting a lesser product out there to pursue a longer term goal (playoffs). Sometimes it's the right thing to do. Doesn't mean tanking is ALWAYS the right move, there can be consequences to it, but there are situations where it makes sense. |
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BigBallerBrand
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:48 pm Post subject: It's ok to Tank it now |
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mods please don't lock. Everyone was excited this season to just watch randle develop, but that won't happen. I think top 5 pick is quite possible now. We might as well get a draft pick out of all this nightmare. Team tank!! 
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Suckmaki Walker
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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suns have our pick.
mods close this thread now. |
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55
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Joined: 04 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't think Randle would've helped us with a better record. He's still too raw and the expectations are too high. Next year he'll have an impact. |
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Kobe24MSU
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Suckmaki Walker wrote: | suns have our pick.
mods close this thread now. |
Not if it's top 5. |
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lakersken80
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Joined: 12 Aug 2009
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Too much burden on the young kid.....players need a couple of seasons to learn about playing with grown men. |
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pio2u
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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Dave20
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| We were in tank mode when they hired Byron as the coach, the Randle injury just confirmed it. The Lakers should consider trading Kobe to the Knicks for Amare and picks, that's one team he wouldn't mind going to with Phil and Fisher there. |
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magicdays
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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The Lakers will make a move for sure now with Randle hurt. It was obvious before the season started that we are too small inside and now it is critical we go after a big inside scorer and rebounder.
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MJST
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobe24MSU wrote: | | Suckmaki Walker wrote: | suns have our pick.
mods close this thread now. |
Not if it's top 5. |
you expect the Lakers who were a 7th pick last year with Farmar, Jodie Meeks and Nick Young as their main options to become 5th pick in a year when they have Jeremy Lin, Ed Davis, 2nd year Ryan Kelly, Carlos Boozer, Nick Young off the bench and Kobe Bryant in place of Jodie Meeks?
You're virtually gift wrapping Stanley Johnson for Phoenix if you try to lose this season.
I wonder if people forgot that we had Ryan Kelly. Julius' injury means Ryan gets his 2nd year and Ed Davis will play more minutes. Not doom and gloom as Julius wasn't going to be the main reason we made the playoffs or not, his development would have been nice to watch.
So focus on Julius and his recovery instead of trying to 'tank'. |
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lakersken80
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Dave20 wrote: | | We were in tank mode when they hired Byron as the coach, the Randle injury just confirmed it. The Lakers should consider trading Kobe to the Knicks for Amare and picks, that's one team he wouldn't mind going to with Phil and Fisher there. |
Thats probably the only team that can take Kobe's salary. I guess if we get Amare we'll have a pretty clean sheet to start the rebuild one year early. Of course nobody will show up for the games once Kobe is gone....  |
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Lakers95
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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| (bleep) Tanking. |
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Dave20
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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| magicdays wrote: | | The Lakers will make a move for sure now with Randle hurt. It was obvious before the season started that we are too small inside and now it is critical we go after a big inside scorer and rebounder. |
The only moves the Lakers will make is trading players and receiving picks. This is one of the worst rosters in the league, were not winning anything this year. |
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cheesysapien
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | | Kobe24MSU wrote: | | Suckmaki Walker wrote: | suns have our pick.
mods close this thread now. |
Not if it's top 5. |
you expect the Lakers who were a 7th pick last year with Farmar, Jodie Meeks and Nick Young as their main options to become 5th pick in a year when they have Jeremy Lin, Ed Davis, 2nd year Ryan Kelly, Carlos Boozer, Nick Young off the bench and Kobe Bryant in place of Jodie Meeks?
You're virtually gift wrapping Stanley Johnson for Phoenix if you try to lose this season.
I wonder if people forgot that we had Ryan Kelly. Julius' injury means Ryan gets his 2nd year and Ed Davis will play more minutes. Not doom and gloom as Julius wasn't going to be the main reason we made the playoffs or not, his development would have been nice to watch.
So focus on Julius and his recovery instead of trying to 'tank'. |
Exactly. It is of course a let down that Julius go down, but we have other guys, Ryan Kelly, Ed Davis ...
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tom
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Dave20 wrote: | | magicdays wrote: | | The Lakers will make a move for sure now with Randle hurt. It was obvious before the season started that we are too small inside and now it is critical we go after a big inside scorer and rebounder. |
The only moves the Lakers will make is trading players and receiving picks. This is one of the worst rosters in the league, were not winning anything this year. |
Agreed. This is a 20-25 win team before Randle injury. After ouch! Plus anyone that watched tonight saw Kobe was with a bunch of JV players. Shoot for 23 minutes into the game Lin had 4 point and 5 turnovers . |
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Dave20
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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| lakersken80 wrote: | | Dave20 wrote: | | We were in tank mode when they hired Byron as the coach, the Randle injury just confirmed it. The Lakers should consider trading Kobe to the Knicks for Amare and picks, that's one team he wouldn't mind going to with Phil and Fisher there. |
Thats probably the only team that can take Kobe's salary. I guess if we get Amare we'll have a pretty clean sheet to start the rebuild one year early. Of course nobody will show up for the games once Kobe is gone.... |
Lin will sell tickets. If we start off 1-9 or 3-20 which is possible, Kobe will probably demand to be traded. |
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dabask11
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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I've been calling Scott the perfect tank commander, but not at the expense of randle getting injured like this.
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Andre2K
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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I can't believe I'm saying this because I want to see Kobe retire a Laker, but I don't want Kobe to have to endure a rebuild like this. Maybe trading him to New York might be best for both sides
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lakersken80
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Dave20 wrote: | | lakersken80 wrote: | | Dave20 wrote: | | We were in tank mode when they hired Byron as the coach, the Randle injury just confirmed it. The Lakers should consider trading Kobe to the Knicks for Amare and picks, that's one team he wouldn't mind going to with Phil and Fisher there. |
Thats probably the only team that can take Kobe's salary. I guess if we get Amare we'll have a pretty clean sheet to start the rebuild one year early. Of course nobody will show up for the games once Kobe is gone.... |
Lin will sell tickets. If we start off 1-9 or 3-20 which is possible, Kobe will probably demand to be traded. |
If that happens, and Kobe is gone nobody is going to show up....it'll be like what we saw during the latter part of last year......lots of empty seats. There may be a decent contingent of Jeremy Lin fans, but are they willing to pay Laker ticket prices to watch a bad team?
Last edited by lakersken80 on Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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dao
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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| magicdays wrote: | | The Lakers will make a move for sure now with Randle hurt. It was obvious before the season started that we are too small inside and now it is critical we go after a big inside scorer and rebounder. |
The Lakers have nothing of value to trade away. Literally nothing. |
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lakersken80
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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| dao wrote: | | magicdays wrote: | | The Lakers will make a move for sure now with Randle hurt. It was obvious before the season started that we are too small inside and now it is critical we go after a big inside scorer and rebounder. |
The Lakers have nothing of value to trade away. Literally nothing. |
Pretty much....we picked up cast offs from other teams and paid them big bucks...and we don't have much draft picks to give away (which we shouldn't do anyways if we are rebuilding or acquiring in order to get a good player). |
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lukewaltonsdad
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Joined: 09 Jul 2014
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| With this roster, that top 5 pick might just be within our grasp. Intentionally tanking? Nope. We just suck. |
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dao
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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I agree wholeheartedly with the Kobe to the Knicks idea. Makes perfect basketball sense for both teams. Knicks get Kobe, Lakers get Kobe's contract off the books a year early while picking up a couple of future picks in the meantime.
Of course, trading Kobe to the Knicks would cost the organization millions in terms of attendance and tv ratings. Won't happen because of this. But it's going to be really sad to see such a great career end on such an irrelevant, train wreck of a team. |
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