| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ronnyjeremy
Star Player
Joined: 06 Aug 2012
Posts: 1182
|
 Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:59 am Post subject: Stephen A. Smith's offensive rant about Ray Rice and domestic violence |
|
|
| Quote: | In a Friday discussion on First Take about Ray Rice’s controversial two-game suspension, Stephen A. Smith went off the rails, delivering a rant that implied some women are to blame for domestic violence.
Smith started off his discussion with Skip Bayless by saying men “have no business putting [their] hands on a woman.” It was everything First Take isn’t: concise, definitive and unequivocal.
But Smith didn’t stop there. He continued, going on a rambling, circuitous rant that seemed to suggest violence is sometimes warranted if it’s provoked. Even for the unrefined First Take, with its bluster, manufactured controversy and complete lack of nuance, this was over the line. |
http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/07/stephen-a-smith-ray-rice-domestic-violence-women
Michelle Beadle Blasts Stephen A. Smith on twitter.
| Quote: | Michelle Beadle @MichelleDBeadle
So I was just forced to watch this morning's First Take. A) I'll never feel clean again B) I'm now aware that I can provoke my own beating. |
| Quote: | Michelle Beadle @MichelleDBeadle ·
I'm thinking about wearing a miniskirt this weekend...I'd hate to think what I'd be asking for by doing so @stephenasmith. #dontprovoke. |
Stephen A 16 apology tweets: https://twitter.com/stephenasmith |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67742
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
I agree with most of what SA said. The gist of his rant was he wanted females to take onus when they are the provoker.
I also agree, men should not put their hands on women but acknowledge they may, in some instances, have no choice. I'd not let a woman hurt me because she's a woman. I've never hit one, have held on for dear life.
Chris beat the hell out of Rihanna but how much was her fault. I don't think he should have beaten her as badly as he did, I think that was over the line.
I don't agree Rice should do more than the two games suspension because I don't know all the details.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:19 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Basketball Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 24766
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
| jodeke wrote: | I agree with most of what SA said. The gist of his rant was he wanted females to take onus when they are the provoker.
I also agree, men should not put their hands on women but acknowledge they may, in some instances, have no choice. I'd not let a woman hurt me because she's a woman. I've never hit one, have held on for dear life.
Chris beat the hell out of Rihanna but how much was her fault. I don't think he should have beaten her as badly as he did, I think that was over the line.
I don't agree Rice should do more than the two years suspension because I don't know all the details. |
2 games and I agree he also said the same thing with Chad Johnson and his wife at the time especially given her history of beating up people herself.
This chick had an out when that tape went viral she could've left him and taken their kid with her. Instead she did the total opposite. Its her life but sadly I could see this being another Javon Belcher scenario |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakersken80
Retired Number
Joined: 12 Aug 2009
Posts: 38803
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Way to take it out of context. If you listen to the entire conversation he never justified a man hitting a woman. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67742
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| lakersken80 wrote: | | Way to take it out of context. If you listen to the entire conversation he never justified a man hitting a woman. |
Who justified a man hitting a woman?
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ronnyjeremy
Star Player
Joined: 06 Aug 2012
Posts: 1182
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:50 am Post subject: |
|
|
| lakersken80 wrote: | | Way to take it out of context. If you listen to the entire conversation he never justified a man hitting a woman. |
This is what he said...
| Quote: | | "But what I've tried to employ the female members of my family, some of who you all met and talked to and what have you, is that again, and this what, I've done this all my life, let's make sure we don't do anything to provoke wrong actions, because if I come, or somebody else come, whether it's law enforcement officials, your brother or the fellas that you know, if we come after somebody has put their hands on you, it doesn't negate the fact that they already put their hands on you. So let's try to make sure that we can do our part in making sure that that doesn't happen. " |
Basically what he is saying, even though he back track a little on twitter, is its your fault that you got beaten or abused because you put yourself in that position in the first place. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Wilt
LG Contributor
Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 13731
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| ronnyjeremy wrote: | | lakersken80 wrote: | | Way to take it out of context. If you listen to the entire conversation he never justified a man hitting a woman. |
This is what he said...
| Quote: | | "But what I've tried to employ the female members of my family, some of who you all met and talked to and what have you, is that again, and this what, I've done this all my life, let's make sure we don't do anything to provoke wrong actions, because if I come, or somebody else come, whether it's law enforcement officials, your brother or the fellas that you know, if we come after somebody has put their hands on you, it doesn't negate the fact that they already put their hands on you. So let's try to make sure that we can do our part in making sure that that doesn't happen!!!!!!!! " |
Basically what he is saying, even though he back track a little on twitter, is its your fault that you got beaten or abused because you put yourself in that position in the first place. |
Corrected.
_________________
¡Hala Madrid! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kobeskillz
Star Player
Joined: 12 Nov 2008
Posts: 1069
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 12:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Guys shouldn't hit girls but guys should use self defense and if that includes punching a girl if it comes down to that then so be it. Again SELF DEFENSE. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
lakers0505
Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 10701
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
He had a 10 minute segment on Mike and Mike this morning.
I thought what he said was fair on that segment. The gist of it was, don't let females of the hook by automatically assuming it is always the males fault, without seeing the evidence (additional video tape in the elevator). He was actually calm and collected and made valid points, he wasn't Screamin A for once.
The NFL punishment process is an entire another matter, who knows what they are doing, should have been more than 2 games. '
I can't see how 2 games is good on any level, in comparison to previous punishments or for business or even based on perception of the incident. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
K28
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Nov 2012
Posts: 10038
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:32 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Sometimes my wife really pushes my buttons. Doesn't mean I lay a hand on her. The terrible thing is she knows I can't...and uses it to her advantage.
Let me just say that men don't appreciate the double standard.
Why SAS brings this up in relation to Ray Rice confuses me though? Ray crossed the line...there's no excuses for provocation.
The NFL has suspended players for entire seasons for smoking weed...but gives two games to Rice? Pathetic. Way to send a message there Goodell. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ContagiousInspiration
Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014
Posts: 13823
Location: Boulder ;)
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I feel for him to be getting all this backlash
Tony Dungy is guilty of being against gays having the same rights he himself does. His words about gays will then be suspect
Has Steven A ever been accused or arrested for domestic violence?
Steven A said REEEEEPEATEDLY
Nothing excuses putting your hands on a woman...
Over and over etc
YET anyone remember Melvin Udall? When asked how he writes so well about women.. "Take away reason and accountability..."
Sure they are going to be upset at Steven A when he asks them to please not do things that take advantage of the fact 99.9% of men don't hit women.
SA did put himself in a conundrum..
What are things women might do that would/could provoke that type of behavior from men? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Moses
Star Player
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 8274
Location: London
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've taught men, women and children self defense, and I would share a message with anyone: Don't provoke anyone to hit you, no matter who they are.
I'm not suggesting for one second that if you did then the other person has some kind of right to hit you, but the safest form of self defense is to walk away and not engage in those types of situations wherever possible.
The sad part is, that some of the women I teach have experienced domestic violence where their partners are simply bullies who don't need to be provoked, there are some cowardly people out there so I hope what I'm teaching them helps.
Bottom line though, Ray Rice was wrong to do what he did, whether he was provoked or not. As much as I believe it is important not to provoke people, it is every bit as important to have the self control to not let your anger get the best of you if someone does provoke you.
_________________
Lakers, Chargers, Dodgers, Arsenal FC.
Mamba Forever
The Marathon Continues
Still I Rise |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52659
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
There's only one thing that justifies responding with physicality - someone physically attacking you.
Anything outside of that doesn't count, no matter how much one feels, "provoked" |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Basketball Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Posts: 24766
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| kray28_ wrote: | Sometimes my wife really pushes my buttons. Doesn't mean I lay a hand on her. The terrible thing is she knows I can't...and uses it to her advantage.
Let me just say that men don't appreciate the double standard.
Why SAS brings this up in relation to Ray Rice confuses me though? Ray crossed the line...there's no excuses for provocation.
The NFL has suspended players for entire seasons for smoking weed...but gives two games to Rice? Pathetic. Way to send a message there Goodell. |
But despite all that she married him nobody seems to ask why? Also a large part of why he only got 2 games.
I mean many think she's just part of a tragic cycle of abuse and that may be so or its possible they both get off on violence in their relationship people ignore she was also charged right along with him at one point.
It kind of ties into SAS's point how women need to have an awareness of this sort of thing I mean that video gave her an out to leave him and take their kid with her she didn't take that option. Why didn't she? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jodeke
Retired Number
Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 67742
Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
What happened in the elevator? No one knows. Were there any bruises on her? I don't know the whole story. Until all is known I'm not going to judge Rice.
I don't know what caused Brown to beat Rihanna the way he did. I don't excuse him because that was a real beat down. She may have attacked him and as DMR said, that's a reason to defend ones self. If Rihanna attacked Brown he went to far.
In the case of a man hitting a woman the man should use judgment as to how far to take the altercation.
_________________
Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Last edited by jodeke on Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
kcxiv
Star Player
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
Posts: 3911
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| I dont hit women, never have, dont believe in it! i grew up with a mom and 2 sisters, but if a women is coming at me with a knife or something, im going to knock her ass out! lol Act like a man, get treated like one, but then again, i would never give a women a reason to get THAT mad at me, so i dont have to worry about it. lol I have seen some crazy chicks out there that snap easy though. Same with Males as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ChefLinda
Moderator
Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 24166
Location: Boston
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| DaMuleRules wrote: | There's only one thing that justifies responding with physicality - someone physically attacking you.
Anything outside of that doesn't count, no matter how much one feels, "provoked" |
Thank you. Some of the responses in this thread are just as offensive to me as many of racist and bigoted comments we've seen on this board. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
frijolero01
Franchise Player
Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 13324
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Kobeskillz wrote: | | Guys shouldn't hit girls but guys should use self defense and if that includes punching a girl if it comes down to that then so be it. Again SELF DEFENSE. |
You don't have to hit. A shove will do or grab them. Most men I would like to think, are bigger than their gf/wives. I'm not tall by any means but, I still have about 6 inches and 30 lbs. on my wife. I don't need to hit her even in defense.
_________________
Thank you, Kobe. We love you. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shansen008
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 3568
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 4:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ContagiousInspiration wrote: | I feel for him to be getting all this backlash
Tony Dungy is guilty of being against gays having the same rights he himself does. His words about gays will then be suspect
Has Steven A ever been accused or arrested for domestic violence?
Steven A said REEEEEPEATEDLY
Nothing excuses putting your hands on a woman...
Over and over etc
YET anyone remember Melvin Udall? When asked how he writes so well about women.. "Take away reason and accountability..."
Sure they are going to be upset at Steven A when he asks them to please not do things that take advantage of the fact 99.9% of men don't hit women.
SA did put himself in a conundrum..
What are things women might do that would/could provoke that type of behavior from men? |
Pretty much has to be assault in my book. Lets be real here. Women are way better communicators and more intuitive on average than men. Sometimes they know more about us than we do ourselves. Because of this they know exactly which buttons to push to make a man crazy. If a man loses his cool over words and beats a woman, he isnt a man imo. No violence necessary. We have the trump card of all trump cards fellas. Just call her a fat (bleep) and laugh and walk away. Fight over.
That is unless she gets physical. Personally id like to see men hit women less. In the case where you are defending yourself from a physical attack, most of the time the man is going to be the larger of the two. You can subdue her without doing much physical harm. Rear naked choke comes to mind. Bonus....she might not remember the fight!
Now keep in mind, some women can straight scrap. Out here in the islands some of these Samoan/Tongan women can get nuts. They are big as men and damn near as strong. I seen a woman knock some dudes out before....no joke.
SAS is basically saying that women put themselves in the position of being "over the line" knowingly, because they know rules about men hitting women. Hes not excusing men so much as hes excoriating irresponsible behaviour on the womans part. Hes saying dont tempt fate. Dont take a leisurely stroll through the jungle carrying a side of beef and then get pissed when a leopard falls out of a tree and kills you. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Theseus
Franchise Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 14228
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
shansen008
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 3568
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thank you so much for that.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
dont_be_a_wuss
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Mar 2012
Posts: 21506
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think I may see his point. There are some evil spirited men out there. You can't be naive and think society has placed some sort of shield in front of you that makes it impossible for them to hurt you because they will go to jail, or get beaten up by uncle Stephen. When you encounter a bad person like that sometimes you have to keep quiet and get out, not piss them off.
When you get robbed at gun point, sometimes its best to just give your stuff up rather than fight for it. Not that you provoke your own death and its your fault, but you have to be aware of the reality, that in private encounters you have NOTHING physically protecting you. Not wise to act otherwise, because there are bad people out there. And steroids... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ContagiousInspiration
Franchise Player
Joined: 07 May 2014
Posts: 13823
Location: Boulder ;)
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| dont_be_a_wuss wrote: | I think I may see his point. There are some evil spirited men out there. You can't be naive and think society has placed some sort of shield in front of you that makes it impossible for them to hurt you because they will go to jail, or get beaten up by uncle Stephen. When you encounter a bad person like that sometimes you have to keep quiet and get out, not piss them off.
When you get robbed at gun point, sometimes its best to just give your stuff up rather than fight for it. Not that you provoke your own death and its your fault, but you have to be aware of the reality, that in private encounters you have NOTHING physically protecting you. Not wise to act otherwise, because there are bad people out there. And steroids... |
QFT
nailed it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Drifts
Retired Number
Joined: 22 Nov 2004
Posts: 28401
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
what I get from SAS comments is that you can't control other people's actions... however, you can control yours - protect yourself at all times... having said that, men should never lay hands on women and children. that's what I got from his statement, and it's a pretty fair assessment.
_________________
"Now, if life is coffee, then the jobs, money & position in society are the cups. They are just tools to hold & contain life, but the quality of life doesn't change. Sometimes, by concentrating only on the cup, we fail to enjoy the coffee in it." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52659
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
|
| Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It's stunning that so many people are willing to give SAS a pass on this.
His message was that women need to be careful what they say and do, because they might get beaten. And if they do, it's on them.
That doesn't speak well of his views of women in general and the men he knows. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
