Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 10:54 am Post subject: OFFICIAL Front Office and General Ongoing P&M Thread
Hello folks, I know we love to bash ol' Jimmy Buss on this site but I think its time to start looking at a new General Manager for our great Los Angeles Lakers. Hear my arguments before you jump on me for this one, but if the Lakers don't make the playoffs in 2015, its time to "Trash Can Mitch".
Here are my top 5 reasons:
1) Free Agency- Mitch is absolute garbage in this aspect. Passing on Lance Stephenson for Jordan Hill? Isiah Thomas? Darren Collinson?
With the most cap in probably Lakers history we end up with the great collection of Nick Young, Jordan Hill, Jeremy Lin, Carlos Boozer, and Ed Davis. This is the most laughable thing Ive ever seen.
2) Contract negotiations- 2/18 for Hill? 2/48 for Kobe? Walton contract? First Bynum contract? I could go on here. Mitch overpays.
3) Presence- Mitch will convince nobody in the NBA to come to the Lakers. We know Jim Buss has no "flare". he needs a side kick with some mojo and some popularity. A the very least he needs a sidekick the appears more alive than he does. This combo does not work.
4) Trades - Outside of Gasol which was a pretty fair trade IMO, Mitch has been fleeced in every trade since 2008. From Ramon Sessions to Steve Nash, The Kups track record is not pretty.
5) Draft picks - Mitch has been so careless with draft picks its amazing. The Lakers literally have no young talent because Mitch has given away every pick until 2045.
So start the slogan now... "Trash Can Mitch", make the chants heard in Staples if the record goes south. And it will... Mitch is out of date and should needs to move on from his position as GM of the Lakers.
Mitch is a great GM. If anything, he is floating this organization. _________________ "I don’t give a [expletive] what you say. If I go out there and miss game winners, and people say, 'Kobe choked, or Kobe is seven for whatever in pressure situations.' Well, [expletive] you. Because I don’t play for your [expletive] approval."
Not worth a response hardly, except to note that I personally think that Mitch is making zero Laker personnel and trade decisions. He's the admin for the family's basketball business, nothing more. He's not the root cause of Laker misfortunes, not by any analysis.
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Pretty much sums it up . We went all in with Chris Paul and Howard and lost.
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Try longer. That Veto affected a serious of chain events for both the Lakers and Clipper organization.
For the Clippers.. without Chris Paul:
-no lob city
-They wouldn't be work 2 billion $$$ and possibly no Steve Ballmer
-7th or 8th seed fodder
-no Doc Rivers
-no new practice facility
-Blake Griffin probably wouldn't sign an extension.. maybe head over to the Lakers.
-Deandre Jordan would probably not be the same player
-would have a hard time fielding quality free agents
For the Lakers with Chris Paul:
-Phil Jackson would probably be our coach
-Dwight Howard would probably have stayed and got a constant dose of ally-oops
-Lakers would be among the top 3 teams in the league competing for a title
-Attract more free agents
-Melo would probably be a Laker now. A team would have been Kobe, Chris Paul, Melo, Gasol and Dwight.
-we would possibly keep some of our own draft picks that was wasted away on Steve Nash.
Current Lakers org (post the Chris Pau veto)
-traded a serious of future draft picks for Nash.
-Lack of young blue chip talent to add to our aging roster
-Lakers brand taking a hit via Free Agency (the Laker Organization is still very lucrative now but think how much more if we had Chris Pau.)
-The Lakers are now out of the playoff race in most of the NBA analyst predictions.
Please feel free to add.
Last edited by LakerLand247 on Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
-Melo would probably be a Laker now. At team would have been Kobe, Chris Paul, Melo, Gasol and Dwight.
Curious to know how these players all fit under the salary cap. In this lineup, they'd all have to make like $10m/each. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Pretty much sums it up . We went all in with Chris Paul and Howard and lost.
Not worth a response hardly, except to note that I personally think that Mitch is making zero Laker personnel and trade decisions. He's the admin for the family's basketball business, nothing more. He's not the root cause of Laker misfortunes, not by any analysis.
So I ask, Why have a GM if he makes zero personnel or trade decisions. Obviously he does or there is no need for his position. I would actually venture to say 90% of Laker moves are his idea and Jim either approves or does not approve them.
I love the 5 ring argument.
Championship 1-3 are all Jerry West built teams. Mitch did nothing.
2008-2009 I will give Mitch for bringing in the pieces (Odom, Gasol, Bynum) but Kobe (finals MVP) is not his draft pick. And if Anything the Shaq for Odom trade is another knock aginst Mitch. How does this guy have so many defenders. What has he proven? Who has he drafted? Besides Gasol, what has this guy done?
-Melo would probably be a Laker now. At team would have been Kobe, Chris Paul, Melo, Gasol and Dwight.
Curious to know how these players all fit under the salary cap. In this lineup, they'd all have to make like $10m/each.
If Chris Pau was a Laker, I seriously doubt Kobe gets the max especially if he knows they can acquire Melo. Kobe, Pau, Melo, Gasol and Dwight
CP3 was a max.
Dwight was already a max.
Pau was at $20m (and how do you have Pau when he was traded for CP3)????
Good luck telling Kobe to take a paycut, since $24m/year was his paycut.
Then you have Melo who refused to take a substantial paycut.
I agree with the overall sentiment, but at best, you could only afford CP3, Kobe, and Dwight. (and that's cutting it close). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Pretty much sums it up . We went all in with Chris Paul and Howard and lost.
This. Mitch is a good GM. #1 IMO
Better than the Spurs? Heat? OKC? There are probably 20+ better GMs around the league. Mitch has literally done nothing but ride Shaq/Kobe and then Kobe to a lifetime career in the Lakers front office. His cap management sucks, his contract negotiations are not good... the Gasol trade is the only thing I can give him. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut..
I find it laughable that Jim Buss gets all blame but Mitch gets nothing but praise as a top GM in the league. This just cannot be possible when your team has sucked now for 4 straight years and still has no building block.
Lets look at the other teams that have sucked since 2011 and see who they have.
Phili - Promising young roster, tons of picks
Minn- Promising young roster, tons of picks
PHX- Promising young roster
Kings- They suck but much more promising talent than the Lakers
Bobcats- Promising young talent
Bucks - Truly suck but have Jabari, Giannis and JKidd
Jazz- Promising young talent and tons of picks
Lakers- Julius Randle, and complete garbage roster..
Hawks- Only team comparable to Lakers in roster trash
Joined: 10 Jul 2009 Posts: 611 Location: Los Angeles
Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:21 pm Post subject:
LakerLand247 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Quote:
-Melo would probably be a Laker now. At team would have been Kobe, Chris Paul, Melo, Gasol and Dwight.
Curious to know how these players all fit under the salary cap. In this lineup, they'd all have to make like $10m/each.
If Chris Pau was a Laker, I seriously doubt Kobe gets the max especially if he knows they can acquire Melo. Kobe, Pau, Melo, Gasol and Dwight
If Chris Paul was a Laker, Pau wouldnt be first of all. He was part of the trade. Second, there is no possible way all 5 of those guys' salaries could work with the cap, unless Kobe took the veterans minimum and Melo signed for 10 mil.
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Pretty much sums it up . We went all in with Chris Paul and Howard and lost.
This. Mitch is a good GM. #1 IMO
Better than the Spurs? Heat? OKC? There are probably 20+ better GMs around the league. Mitch has literally done nothing but ride Shaq/Kobe and then Kobe to a lifetime career in the Lakers front office. His cap management sucks, his contract negotiations are not good... the Gasol trade is the only thing I can give him. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut..
I find it laughable that Jim Buss gets all blame but Mitch gets nothing but praise as a top GM in the league. This just cannot be possible when your team has sucked now for 4 straight years and still has no building block.
Lets look at the other teams that have sucked since 2011 and see who they have.
Phili - Promising young roster, tons of picks
Minn- Promising young roster, tons of picks
PHX- Promising young roster
Kings- They suck but much more promising talent than the Lakers
Bobcats- Promising young talent
Bucks - Truly suck but have Jabari, Giannis and JKidd
Jazz- Promising young talent and tons of picks
Lakers- Julius Randle, and complete garbage roster..
Hawks- Only team comparable to Lakers in roster trash
Have you noticed that no one has joined you in the Mitch bashing yet?
4. Got steve Nash coming off a veryyyy productive season for picks
That's a lot of great moves in a 5 year span. Nobody else can touch that. How all those trades ended up falling apart (except for gasol, that brought us 2 championships), is not his fault at all. He did his job and he got unlucky. _________________ Maybe you think it's completely innocent. Maybe you don't. But there's no denying that what the rule book says means a lot less than what the NBA wants at any given moment. -Tim Donaghy
much as it is beating a dead horse, the root cause of the Lakers misfortunes is David Stern's veto of the Chris Paul trade. That veto set our franchise back about 5 or 6 years.
Pretty much sums it up . We went all in with Chris Paul and Howard and lost.
This. Mitch is a good GM. #1 IMO
Better than the Spurs? Heat? OKC? There are probably 20+ better GMs around the league. Mitch has literally done nothing but ride Shaq/Kobe and then Kobe to a lifetime career in the Lakers front office. His cap management sucks, his contract negotiations are not good... the Gasol trade is the only thing I can give him. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut..
I find it laughable that Jim Buss gets all blame but Mitch gets nothing but praise as a top GM in the league. This just cannot be possible when your team has sucked now for 4 straight years and still has no building block.
Lets look at the other teams that have sucked since 2011 and see who they have.
Phili - Promising young roster, tons of picks
Minn- Promising young roster, tons of picks
PHX- Promising young roster
Kings- They suck but much more promising talent than the Lakers
Bobcats- Promising young talent
Bucks - Truly suck but have Jabari, Giannis and JKidd
Jazz- Promising young talent and tons of picks
Lakers- Julius Randle, and complete garbage roster..
Hawks- Only team comparable to Lakers in roster trash
So by this logic, Pat Riley did nothing too since it was the Big 3 that colluded? Mitch has indeed been graced with Kobe, but Spurs were graced by Duncan too. It's not entirely coincidental that these great players are also part of great teams.
I admire the Spurs FO a lot, but this is a results-driven league. How have they outperformed the Lakers in terms of championship rings? Are we going to count division banners? _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals
LeBron would be a Laker _________________ Maybe you think it's completely innocent. Maybe you don't. But there's no denying that what the rule book says means a lot less than what the NBA wants at any given moment. -Tim Donaghy
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