Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 8:35 pm Post subject:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Voices wrote:
The Lakers having a significant amount of talent over anyone is a reach. Sure Tibs is a a fine coach but he has done nothing without Rose. You have to have talent to win in the NBA then coaching and coaching is a distant second. And what about Noah, his bio say's he has played in 12 games?
I guess the new Cle coach really sucks, a coach that many on this site wanted, he can't win with 2 superstars and a potential 3rd plus a few others on that team are very good players. Many think that Cle will get it together and have a great season, I think that their talent will eventually take over and they will be a factor in the east.
The Lakers absolutely have a significant talent advantage over Roy Hibbert, Luis Scola, Donald Sloan, Solomon Hill, and Chris Copeland. lol
Thibodeau has gotten teams to the playoffs with Joakim Noah and journeymen.
Not sure what Cleveland struggling has to do with the price of tea in China, but this argumentation is painfully bad.
In a court you would bring in arguments that support your position. Comparing coaches is what this blog is all about. The new Cle coach has great talent and his team has failed so far to meet expectations, in some way's he has failed much worst than Scott, although I would not at this point and time call either coach a failure. Scott has almost zero talent, has taken over a team that returns 5 players and the team has been devastated by injuries. The Cle coach challenge is blending great talent or letting great talent blend, that clearly has not happened yet. Two totally different coaching situations one coach working with great talent the other working with terrible talent but they have similar outcomes so far and both coaches can still have positives outcomes given time.
To give coaches 15% of the season to prove their ability to coach a team is ridiculous, especially in Scotts case, very little talent and devastating injuries.
The tea in China statements is one of my favorites. _________________ .....
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ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20.
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 8:48 pm Post subject:
Jim99187 wrote:
Voices wrote:
fan4life wrote:
Voices wrote:
The Lakers having a significant amount of talent over anyone is a reach. Sure Tibs is a a fine coach but he has done nothing without Rose. You have to have talent to win in the NBA then coaching and coaching is a distant second. And what about Noah, his bio say's he has played in 12 games?
I guess the new Cle coach really sucks, a coach that many on this site wanted, he can't win with 2 superstars and a potential 3rd plus a few others on that team are very good players. Many think that Cle will get it together and have a great season, I think that their talent will eventually take over and they will be a factor in the east.
It's been pointed out already that Thibs took a team, minus Rose, to the playoffs and won a playoff series that year (2013). He implemented a sound defensive system and got guys to buy in, despite minimal offensive output.
No one is saying that you can win big with mediocre talent. We are saying that Scott could being doing a lot better if he was half the coach that Thibs or Vogel are.
To judge a new coach after 12 games with a team returning 5 players with a depleted lineup because of injuries is wrong and unfair.
did u not see where steve clifford took Charlotte last season?
You are not comparing the weak East to the West are you? _________________ .....
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ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20.
In a court you would bring in arguments that support your position. Comparing coaches is what this blog is all about. The new Cle coach has great talent and his team has failed so far to meet expectations, in some way's he has failed much worst than Scott, although I would not at this point and time call either coach a failure. Scott has almost zero talent, has taken over a team that returns 5 players and the team has been devastated by injuries. The Cle coach challenge is blending great talent or letting great talent blend, that clearly has not happened yet. Two totally different coaching situations one coach working with great talent the other working with terrible talent but they have similar outcomes so far and both coaches can still have positives outcomes given time.
To give coaches 15% of the season to prove their ability to coach a team is ridiculous, especially in Scotts case, very little talent and devastating injuries.
The tea in China statements is one of my favorites.
I get all of that, I just don't understand how pointing to another situation where a team is struggling relative to their talent level disproves the point that Byron Scott is doing a poor job with the talent that he has. Can't it be both?
Tonight is a perfect example of Scott's ineptitude. I let out an audible "yes!" when Boozer picked up his 2nd foul early in the 1st quarter, forcing him to have to deviate from the worst group of 5 in the NBA, from a +/- standpoint, and play his best big man with his starters instead.
Shockingly, our oh-so-talent-bereft roster, with a little help from Kobe not excessively shooting the ball, did not crap their pants. Then, in the 2nd quarter, Boozer fit in well with a unit that needs someone who can put the ball in the basket.
Of course, our lead disappeared once we went back to playing the statistically worst group of 5 in the NBA in the 3rd quarter. And we end the game with Wesley Johnson & Jordan Hill as our PF/C as Beno Udrih waltzes into the lane and Ed Davis watches.
Oh, and double teaming Marc Gasol in the post so the ball can be reversed to a wide open shooter twice in the 3rd was freaking brilliant as well.
But no...Scott needs more time. Or maybe Allen Crabbe, Mark Lyons, Dwight Powell, or some other All-Pac 12 1st Team honoree in 2012-13.
Tonight is a perfect example of Scott's ineptitude. I let out an audible "yes!" when Boozer picked up his 2nd foul early in the 1st quarter, forcing him to have to deviate from the worst group of 5 in the NBA, from a +/- standpoint, and play his best big man with his starters instead.
Shockingly, our oh-so-talent-bereft roster, with a little help from Kobe not excessively shooting the ball, did not crap their pants. Then, in the 2nd quarter, Boozer fit in well with a unit that needs someone who can put the ball in the basket.
Of course, our lead disappeared once we went back to playing the statistically worst group of 5 in the NBA in the 3rd quarter. And we end the game with Wesley Johnson & Jordan Hill as our PF/C as Beno Udrih waltzes into the lane and Ed Davis watches.
Oh, and double teaming Marc Gasol in the post so the ball can be reversed to a wide open shooter twice in the 3rd was freaking brilliant as well.
But no...Scott needs more time. Or maybe Allen Crabbe, Mark Lyons, Dwight Powell, or some other All-Pac 12 1st Team honoree in 2012-13.
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 10:24 am Post subject:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Voices wrote:
In a court you would bring in arguments that support your position. Comparing coaches is what this blog is all about. The new Cle coach has great talent and his team has failed so far to meet expectations, in some way's he has failed much worst than Scott, although I would not at this point and time call either coach a failure. Scott has almost zero talent, has taken over a team that returns 5 players and the team has been devastated by injuries. The Cle coach challenge is blending great talent or letting great talent blend, that clearly has not happened yet. Two totally different coaching situations one coach working with great talent the other working with terrible talent but they have similar outcomes so far and both coaches can still have positives outcomes given time.
To give coaches 15% of the season to prove their ability to coach a team is ridiculous, especially in Scotts case, very little talent and devastating injuries.
The tea in China statements is one of my favorites.
I get all of that, I just don't understand how pointing to another situation where a team is struggling relative to their talent level disproves the point that Byron Scott is doing a poor job with the talent that he has. Can't it be both?
We will not agree about Scott, I believe Scott is a decent coach that has the credentials that has been put into an impossible situation, you think Scott is an outdated coach and others could do a substantially better job under the same circumstances. I respect your opinion that is shared by many on this site. What makes sports so interesting is opinions vary from subject to subject just like this one. _________________ .....
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ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20.
*He has a certain number of minutes in mind that Kobe will play and no matter how bad Kobe plays or no matter how the team is flowing without him, Scott will still give Kobe those minutes as that seems to be one of the central things he is focusing on.
*For most of the first part of the season, Boozer was the 2nd guy on his must-give minutes list, despite his travails at defending the pick and roll. the last 2 games though, he has started to ease on this.
*For all the others, Davis, Lin, Hill,etc., he will take them out even if they are playing well, moreover, he will take them out earlier if they aren't playing well.
He does not seem to have a concept of game flow and lineups that have the best chemistry. I think the stat that showed the Lakers to have the first unit having the most on court time together by far in the league is the manifestation of his rigid and inflexible ways. Facing different teams every single night should make a coach adjust and mix and match. He simply doesn't.
Byron only knows how to coach basic fundamental basketball... Hustle, hands up, rotate, run, sub players in foul trouble, etc. this works great too... If you are playing a bunch of third graders... We need a coach with a real playbook. Pushover Byron will not do.
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 8488 Location: The (real) short corner
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 8:02 pm Post subject:
nashftw wrote:
Scott seems very stubborn and rigid.
*He has a certain number of minutes in mind that Kobe will play and no matter how bad Kobe plays or no matter how the team is flowing without him, Scott will still give Kobe those minutes as that seems to be one of the central things he is focusing on.
*For most of the first part of the season, Boozer was the 2nd guy on his must-give minutes list, despite his travails at defending the pick and roll. the last 2 games though, he has started to ease on this.
*For all the others, Davis, Lin, Hill,etc., he will take them out even if they are playing well, moreover, he will take them out earlier if they aren't playing well.
He does not seem to have a concept of game flow and lineups that have the best chemistry. I think the stat that showed the Lakers to have the first unit having the most on court time together by far in the league is the manifestation of his rigid and inflexible ways. Facing different teams every single night should make a coach adjust and mix and match. He simply doesn't.
Hornets fans were saying this five years ago:
Quote:
And that ego may also be Byron Scott’s downfall when it comes to gameplanning.
That ego allows Byron to be certain his way is best. It makes him certain that what he is doing is right. That may allow him to sleep well at night and control the team, but it also makes him stubborn and inflexible. That inflexibility shows up in his gameplanning – and has in every year he’s been with the Hornets. Byron installs a gameplan during training camp, and from that moment on, it will not change.
Injuries be damned. Personnel be damned.
How else can you explain the force-feeding of Desmond Mason in the post two years ago, when Mason couldn’t post a comment on a blog. How else do the Hornets insist on using the high pick and roll with Tyson out and Hilton Armstrong in, when Hilton sets crappy screens, can’t finish an alley-oop, and has stone hands? How else do the Hornets continue to use a hedging perimeter defense that funnels players into the big men when Hilton Armstrong and Sean Marks pick up fouls like Captain Kirk picks up green women?
Despite the decline in results, there really was no difference between the systems our team ran last year and this one. The difference was the personnel trying to execute it due to injuries. Despite the fall from the third most efficient offense to the twelth, I saw no meaningful adjustments to what the Hornets were trying to do as the season went on. Defensively, other than a few games where Byron was willing to give a zone a try, there weren’t any changes. Granted, I’m not sure the backups were capable of all that much – but shouldn’t Scott at least try something new for a time?
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29354 Location: La La Land
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2014 8:18 pm Post subject:
Voices wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Voices wrote:
The Lakers having a significant amount of talent over anyone is a reach. Sure Tibs is a a fine coach but he has done nothing without Rose. You have to have talent to win in the NBA then coaching and coaching is a distant second. And what about Noah, his bio say's he has played in 12 games?
I guess the new Cle coach really sucks, a coach that many on this site wanted, he can't win with 2 superstars and a potential 3rd plus a few others on that team are very good players. Many think that Cle will get it together and have a great season, I think that their talent will eventually take over and they will be a factor in the east.
The Lakers absolutely have a significant talent advantage over Roy Hibbert, Luis Scola, Donald Sloan, Solomon Hill, and Chris Copeland. lol
Thibodeau has gotten teams to the playoffs with Joakim Noah and journeymen.
Not sure what Cleveland struggling has to do with the price of tea in China, but this argumentation is painfully bad.
In a court you would bring in arguments that support your position. Comparing coaches is what this blog is all about. The new Cle coach has great talent and his team has failed so far to meet expectations, in some way's he has failed much worst than Scott, although I would not at this point and time call either coach a failure. Scott has almost zero talent, has taken over a team that returns 5 players and the team has been devastated by injuries. The Cle coach challenge is blending great talent or letting great talent blend, that clearly has not happened yet. Two totally different coaching situations one coach working with great talent the other working with terrible talent but they have similar outcomes so far and both coaches can still have positives outcomes given time.
To give coaches 15% of the season to prove their ability to coach a team is ridiculous, especially in Scotts case, very little talent and devastating injuries.
The tea in China statements is one of my favorites.
Posts like these 2 are why you are my favorite poster.
Couldn't have said it better myself. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 Posts: 8287 Location: Oxnard, Ca.
Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 9:51 am Post subject:
kikanga wrote:
Voices wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Voices wrote:
The Lakers having a significant amount of talent over anyone is a reach. Sure Tibs is a a fine coach but he has done nothing without Rose. You have to have talent to win in the NBA then coaching and coaching is a distant second. And what about Noah, his bio say's he has played in 12 games?
I guess the new Cle coach really sucks, a coach that many on this site wanted, he can't win with 2 superstars and a potential 3rd plus a few others on that team are very good players. Many think that Cle will get it together and have a great season, I think that their talent will eventually take over and they will be a factor in the east.
The Lakers absolutely have a significant talent advantage over Roy Hibbert, Luis Scola, Donald Sloan, Solomon Hill, and Chris Copeland. lol
Thibodeau has gotten teams to the playoffs with Joakim Noah and journeymen.
Not sure what Cleveland struggling has to do with the price of tea in China, but this argumentation is painfully bad.
In a court you would bring in arguments that support your position. Comparing coaches is what this blog is all about. The new Cle coach has great talent and his team has failed so far to meet expectations, in some way's he has failed much worst than Scott, although I would not at this point and time call either coach a failure. Scott has almost zero talent, has taken over a team that returns 5 players and the team has been devastated by injuries. The Cle coach challenge is blending great talent or letting great talent blend, that clearly has not happened yet. Two totally different coaching situations one coach working with great talent the other working with terrible talent but they have similar outcomes so far and both coaches can still have positives outcomes given time.
To give coaches 15% of the season to prove their ability to coach a team is ridiculous, especially in Scotts case, very little talent and devastating injuries.
The tea in China statements is one of my favorites.
Posts like these 2 are why you are my favorite poster.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Thanks for your kind words, I try to be honest and fair, like you.
This is a great Lakers Blog site, it is run honestly by the Mods, sometimes, and it is not surprise debating the Mods directly is more difficult, it's just they way it is, however it's not any fault of the Mods that there positions get more support.
It takes time to learn how to converse honestly without getting into trouble on blog sites. If we all understand how difficult it is to moderate a sports blog site, especially a Laker blog we would make the Mods job easier, that ain't happening anytime soon Lakers passion get's in the way. _________________ .....
.....
ALTHOUGH HE STANDS 6 FEET 2 INCHES, JIM BUSS ATTENDED JOCKEY SCHOOL WHEN HE WAS 20.
Joined: 24 Dec 2007 Posts: 35857 Location: Santa Clarita, CA (Hell) ->>>>>Ithaca, NY -≥≥≥≥≥Berkeley, CA
Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 11:56 am Post subject:
fiendishoc wrote:
Who Takes The Blame wrote:
Byron never ran any Iso when he was coaching CP3 and Kyrie. The only plays Scott knows Iso Kobe
Not sure if serious.
Quote:
@mcten
Kyrie was asked about running elements of the Princeton offense under B.Scott: "I don’t even remember. I just remember my isolation plays"
Did Scott even run the Princeton offense with the Hornets? I thought it centered around pick and roll with Chris Paul and David West. _________________ Damian Lillard shatters Dwight Coward's championship dreams:
*He has a certain number of minutes in mind that Kobe will play and no matter how bad Kobe plays or no matter how the team is flowing without him, Scott will still give Kobe those minutes as that seems to be one of the central things he is focusing on.
*For most of the first part of the season, Boozer was the 2nd guy on his must-give minutes list, despite his travails at defending the pick and roll. the last 2 games though, he has started to ease on this.
*For all the others, Davis, Lin, Hill,etc., he will take them out even if they are playing well, moreover, he will take them out earlier if they aren't playing well.
He does not seem to have a concept of game flow and lineups that have the best chemistry. I think the stat that showed the Lakers to have the first unit having the most on court time together by far in the league is the manifestation of his rigid and inflexible ways. Facing different teams every single night should make a coach adjust and mix and match. He simply doesn't.
I could not have said it any better, Byron for some reason has a minutes restriction on his players except for Kobe. No matter who's playing well they always come out at the same time, which to me is bizarre, you should ride the hot hand. I thought Ronnie should've stayed in the game against the Grizzlies, yet he took him out. I also thought he should've left Lin longer in the first, yet he took him out at the same time every game...
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 8488 Location: The (real) short corner
Posted: Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:46 pm Post subject:
CandyCanes wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
Who Takes The Blame wrote:
Byron never ran any Iso when he was coaching CP3 and Kyrie. The only plays Scott knows Iso Kobe
Not sure if serious.
Quote:
@mcten
Kyrie was asked about running elements of the Princeton offense under B.Scott: "I don’t even remember. I just remember my isolation plays"
Did Scott even run the Princeton offense with the Hornets? I thought it centered around pick and roll with Chris Paul and David West.
Both he and Dave Miller said that it was all Princeton, but I can't see any evidence of that whatsoever from Youtube clips. My guess is that they ran pretty much what they are running now, with a lot more PnR replacing the isolations.
can't byron call a timeout and set plays??? this guy just blows my mind... he's (bleep) terrible. _________________ "Now, if life is coffee, then the jobs, money & position in society are the cups. They are just tools to hold & contain life, but the quality of life doesn't change. Sometimes, by concentrating only on the cup, we fail to enjoy the coffee in it."
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I didn't know we had a Byron Scott emoticon. Can we get one for the main players as well?
