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Chronicle Retired Number
Joined: 21 Jul 2012 Posts: 31930 Location: Manhattan
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:22 am Post subject: |
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Gimme_the_rock wrote: | Well it's too early to start preparing that.
But not to early to ask how you like it.
Lakers like Kelly a LOT.
I did too but he's starting to frustrate me. |
Nah he'll be great again once he gets healthy. Farmar last year had the exact same injury at seemingly the exact same time. _________________ Kobe |
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fontana3d Star Player
Joined: 22 Mar 2013 Posts: 3794
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:24 am Post subject: |
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kentu_tiro wrote: | With Nick Young back, Ronnie Price has become expendable. Also makes Ellington expendable. Cut them both and then sign Quincy. Leave 1 roster spot for another "need" player. |
Not so fast because Clarkson is not ready to get minutes yet abd X is not if game shape yet. You know would be easier to do in the first place is we some had gotten rid of Nash in the first place. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:25 am Post subject: |
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I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:28 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. |
Well the last part of your post is just an assumption.
But to address why some are advocating it, simply because he does have some value but he also has some injury prone concerns. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:29 am Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. |
Well the last part of your post is just an assumption.
But to address why some are advocating it, simply because he does have some value but he also has some injury prone concerns. |
Of course it is, but unless you can show me where an injury prone player procured a TPE AND a 2nd rounder, I think my assumption may be historically correct. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Gimme_the_rock Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Apr 2001 Posts: 11882 Location: Looking outta the window, watching the asphalt grow ...
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:32 am Post subject: |
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I'm not saying to give up on the man ... but I have an eye on him suspecting he's injury prone. _________________ We back. |
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Jim99187 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2014 Posts: 22138
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:35 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | 22 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. |
Well the last part of your post is just an assumption.
But to address why some are advocating it, simply because he does have some value but he also has some injury prone concerns. |
Of course it is, but unless you can show me where an injury prone player procured a TPE AND a 2nd rounder, I think my assumption may be historically correct. |
every player is a different case. we are not dumping him. we are trading him. He brings value on the court.
he is not like thabeet who got traded for tpe and OKC had to give away a 2nd for him |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:38 am Post subject: |
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Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | 22 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. |
Well the last part of your post is just an assumption.
But to address why some are advocating it, simply because he does have some value but he also has some injury prone concerns. |
Of course it is, but unless you can show me where an injury prone player procured a TPE AND a 2nd rounder, I think my assumption may be historically correct. |
every player is a different case. we are not dumping him. we are trading him. He brings value on the court.
he is not like thabeet who got traded for tpe and OKC had to give away a 2nd for him |
I guess my (and others') question is why are we trading him if he has value as a player? I'd rather keep young (and cheap) players like him on the team. If it's to open up a roster space, plenty of other non-long term player candidates to choose from. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Jim99187 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2014 Posts: 22138
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:43 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | 22 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I really liked what Kelly had to offer. I'm just curious why people want to trade him, particularly when all we get back is a TPE and a roster space. |
Well the last part of your post is just an assumption.
But to address why some are advocating it, simply because he does have some value but he also has some injury prone concerns. |
Of course it is, but unless you can show me where an injury prone player procured a TPE AND a 2nd rounder, I think my assumption may be historically correct. |
every player is a different case. we are not dumping him. we are trading him. He brings value on the court.
he is not like thabeet who got traded for tpe and OKC had to give away a 2nd for him |
I guess my (and others') question is why are we trading him if he has value as a player? I'd rather keep young (and cheap) players like him on the team. If it's to open up a roster space, plenty of other non-long term player candidates to choose from. |
cause if jimmy butler says he wants 14 and not 12 then I dont want to waste that opportunity because we have kelly on roster and no 2mil cap space remaining |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:45 am Post subject: |
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If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Jim99187 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2014 Posts: 22138
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:48 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. |
when u wait that long and the world knows , u have to give a 2nd pick and not get it.
fyi: butler was an example.
Last edited by Jim99187 on Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:01 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 11:49 am Post subject: |
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Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. |
when u wait that long and the world know u have to give a 2nd pick and not get it.
fyi: butler was an example. |
I don't even understand what's going on here. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Jim99187 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2014 Posts: 22138
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. |
when u wait that long and the world know u have to give a 2nd pick and not get it.
fyi: butler was an example. |
I don't even understand what's going on here. |
Ok |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. |
when u wait that long and the world know u have to give a 2nd pick and not get it.
fyi: butler was an example. |
I don't even understand what's going on here. |
that's because you convoluted the hell out of something that was incredibly simple.
It's just differing opinions.
Kelly has some value to trade and thereby some value to keep as well.
But he can't both be worth keeping and have no value in a trade either Yinomes. You know that.
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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I just can't remember a recent and comparable scenario where it went down like that. Usually it would be just a TPE (at best) or the team needing to trade away the player surrendering a pick. That's all I was reflecting. Anyways a moot point imo. I think the team likes him and keeps him. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Gimme_the_rock Franchise Player
Joined: 13 Apr 2001 Posts: 11882 Location: Looking outta the window, watching the asphalt grow ...
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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22 wrote: |
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
Then again, the 2nd round pick used on Kelly was pretty golden considering the crap of a draft that 2013 has shaped up to be so far.
In other words, Lakers got pretty lucky with that pick as, if the draft were revisited, Ryan might be a 1st rounder. Yeah, I'm speaking hypothetically but he's essentially 1st round talent and, barring health issues, he's got potential to be a really solid player on such a cheap deal.
That's why I wouldn't be in a rush to move the man.
IMO, Butler's going nowhere. _________________ We back. |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Gimme_the_rock wrote: | 22 wrote: |
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
Then again, the 2nd round pick used on Kelly was pretty golden considering the crap of a draft that 2013 has shaped up to be so far.
In other words, Lakers got pretty lucky with that pick as, if the draft were revisited, Ryan might be a 1st rounder. Yeah, I'm speaking hypothetically but he's essentially 1st round talent and, barring health issues, he's got potential to be a really solid player on such a cheap deal.
That's why I wouldn't be in a rush to move the man.
IMO, Butler's going nowhere. |
I agree. He is 1st round talent. It was a good pick. However, I think he will be injury prone. I'd like to get something for him while we can.
My pipe is to package him for Gobert. I'd even consider him + Hou 1st for Gobert if we don't get a top 5 pick |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | Gimme_the_rock wrote: | 22 wrote: |
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
Then again, the 2nd round pick used on Kelly was pretty golden considering the crap of a draft that 2013 has shaped up to be so far.
In other words, Lakers got pretty lucky with that pick as, if the draft were revisited, Ryan might be a 1st rounder. Yeah, I'm speaking hypothetically but he's essentially 1st round talent and, barring health issues, he's got potential to be a really solid player on such a cheap deal.
That's why I wouldn't be in a rush to move the man.
IMO, Butler's going nowhere. |
I agree. He is 1st round talent. It was a good pick. However, I think he will be injury prone. I'd like to get something for him while we can.
My pipe is to package him for Gobert. I'd even consider him + Hou 1st for Gobert if we don't get a top 5 pick |
Now that's interesting! Not sure if Jazz would give up Gobert though. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | 22 wrote: | Gimme_the_rock wrote: | 22 wrote: |
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
Then again, the 2nd round pick used on Kelly was pretty golden considering the crap of a draft that 2013 has shaped up to be so far.
In other words, Lakers got pretty lucky with that pick as, if the draft were revisited, Ryan might be a 1st rounder. Yeah, I'm speaking hypothetically but he's essentially 1st round talent and, barring health issues, he's got potential to be a really solid player on such a cheap deal.
That's why I wouldn't be in a rush to move the man.
IMO, Butler's going nowhere. |
I agree. He is 1st round talent. It was a good pick. However, I think he will be injury prone. I'd like to get something for him while we can.
My pipe is to package him for Gobert. I'd even consider him + Hou 1st for Gobert if we don't get a top 5 pick |
Now that's interesting! Not sure if Jazz would give up Gobert though. |
Me either. I think they will likely move Kanter because Gobert has a higher ceiling and is cheap for a long time. |
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Bard207 Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013 Posts: 7713
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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There are several things working against Kelly having much trade value at the deadline in February.
1. Currently injured and might not play until January.
2. He needs to stay healthy because getting injured again is likely to kill whatever trade interest there would be for him.
3. He needs to get enough minutes, shots and shoot fairly well to prove that he can stay on the court and contribute.
A possible obstacle to Kelly getting enough shots is that Kobe and Nick are sometimes prone to playing Iso ball and freezing out their teammates.
An edict from the FO for Kobe and Nick to defer some to Kelly on offense because he is being showcased might be ignored. |
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TheElectronica Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2010 Posts: 1392
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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Ehh....I don't see too much value in trading Kelly. If a team wants a stretch four, they are better off just signing or drafting someone that won't cost them anything. Kelly hasn't proved enough to justify any value in trade, but he's valuable enough given his contract and his age to keep around. |
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LAKERMIKE2 Star Player
Joined: 26 Oct 2005 Posts: 2076 Location: Jack's Crib
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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One of the reasons such players are getting a chance to play or join this team is because we are snake bitten by the dreaded "built like leggo players syndrone", but what's Wes Johnson's excuse?
It's become a bit ridiculous!
Can we go a month with a healthy roster?
Welcome to season "rent a player"... _________________ My Laker squad.
Mr. Clutch, Nixon, Eddie, Nick, Magic, Kareem,
Silk, Cooper, AC, Worthy, Horry, Shaq, Kobe.
HC: Riley |
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Jim99187 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2014 Posts: 22138
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Jim99187 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | If you want Butler,
1. you're going to have to offer the max. Chicago will keep him for offers below that. They have other contracts that are moveable (Taj, Pau, even McBuckets).
2. if Butler is the target, then the FO will make the offer first and the other FAs will be adjusted, not the other way around. Your scenario presupposes that Butler is the last move in free agency. |
when u wait that long and the world know u have to give a 2nd pick and not get it.
fyi: butler was an example. |
I don't even understand what's going on here. |
that's because you convoluted the hell out of something that was incredibly simple.
It's just differing opinions.
Kelly has some value to trade and thereby some value to keep as well.
But he can't both be worth keeping and have no value in a trade either Yinomes. You know that.
You might not agree with our strategy but it isn't ridiculous to expect to get a future 2nd for Kelly. Completely plausible |
This. This is what the guy goes. In summer he kept going in circles about sessions and even admitted at 1 point that he doesnt like him personally.
He will keep on chewing the topic till u just stop responding |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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Oh I love you guys. I have no idea what you're talking about with Sessions, but who the heck cares. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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K0BEE 2.0 Franchise Player
Joined: 17 May 2013 Posts: 10949 Location: I wish I knew
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2014 2:16 pm Post subject: |
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I simply do not understand the Roscoe Smith work out... this must be some sort of sick joke that the Lakers are trying to throw at the media/fans.... we already have a D-League big-man on our FC rotation and don't need to add another one.....
if this isn't a smokescreen... then the Lakers are trying to tank games. |
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