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back2backlakers2010
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Joined: 31 Jul 2014
Posts: 112
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 Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | bws94 wrote: | | Dwight+Harden wrote: | My observations
Lin is scared to shoot,teams just have to Trap him or switch because he won't shoot the jumper(problem he had in Houston)
Boozer isn't good anymore and packs the paint, which makes it harder for Kobe and Lin (reason he lost time to Gibson last year)
Kobe is fine offensively, but Defensively over purses and gets beat on isos, Kobes doing to much offensively (that will probably get him hurt again)
Only decent defender is Davis
To many scrubs getting alot of min.
Only way this team has a chance is if Lin plays like he did in NY(to spell kobe) and the team plays better perimeter defense
Hope you guyz turn it around |
Kobe is doing too much offensively.
Lin had 3 point shooter in NY (Novak), guys in motion like Fields and Shumpert, a great PnR center in Chandler, a solid defensive back court mate in Shumpert, a system built around his strengths. With the starters, Lin has no PnR man, little motion, and a veteran calling for the ball. Plus, tonight his brain was on Mars.
. |
Kobe is doing too much?? LOL. He's the ONLY ONE on this team right now that can even make a bucket. He has no choice but to keep shooting. Without Kobe, this team is beyond trash.
And Lin has been in this league for what, 4 seasons? Stop making excuses for the guy, he needs to step up and help carry the team. He's not in NY anymore, he can't expect the team to cater to his needs. Learn to adjust. |
And you wonder why the Knicks keep on losing? If everyone has to adapt to Melo, they will continue to lose while he goes ISO crazy. It's a team sharing the ball that wins in this league nowadays.
Last edited by back2backlakers2010 on Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:24 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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DaveAtCFansCanSMD
Sixth Man
Joined: 15 Jul 2014
Posts: 73
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Honeybadger81 wrote: | | I don't care how many points Kobe scores, this is not the way to play, you fight as a team, get your guys on the same page. He blew up too many defense assignments, forced the offense too much, at this point of his career, he can not dominate any more, it's time to get his teammates involved and they can help him... hopefully Kobe can figure it out... |
Tell me about it. Are we just gonna ignore the fact that Kobe gambled on defense for a steal multiple times which lead to EASY buckets for Morris. Then he comes down on the other end of the court and jacks up the most contended jump shot ever. Kobe was a little cry baby tonight. Team ball wins. Not taking 20 contended jumpers. |
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Jeggs
Star Player
Joined: 14 Oct 2013
Posts: 1659
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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Kobe needs to continue to shoot a high volume. But I also think he needs to get more shots coming off of screens so he doesn't have to work so hard. Seems like Kobe made every shot coming off of a screen.
Otherwise I think the team can improve. They had a couple of nice runs actually in this game....they just need to do it for 48 minutes next game.
Turnovers really made the game ugly. Boozer had a huge brain fart. I hope it was just a bad game for him. He played great in the last game.
I think Ellington is showing great confidence. Once thing Scott needs to teach is to stay home on your man. The open threes are killing us. |
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Honeybadger81
Star Player
Joined: 25 Oct 2014
Posts: 1253
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | bws94 wrote: | | Dwight+Harden wrote: | My observations
Lin is scared to shoot,teams just have to Trap him or switch because he won't shoot the jumper(problem he had in Houston)
Boozer isn't good anymore and packs the paint, which makes it harder for Kobe and Lin (reason he lost time to Gibson last year)
Kobe is fine offensively, but Defensively over purses and gets beat on isos, Kobes doing to much offensively (that will probably get him hurt again)
Only decent defender is Davis
To many scrubs getting alot of min.
Only way this team has a chance is if Lin plays like he did in NY(to spell kobe) and the team plays better perimeter defense
Hope you guyz turn it around |
Kobe is doing too much offensively.
Lin had 3 point shooter in NY (Novak), guys in motion like Fields and Shumpert, a great PnR center in Chandler, a solid defensive back court mate in Shumpert, a system built around his strengths. With the starters, Lin has no PnR man, little motion, and a veteran calling for the ball. Plus, tonight his brain was on Mars.
. |
Kobe is doing too much?? LOL. He's the ONLY ONE on this team right now that can even make a bucket. He has no choice but to keep shooting. Without Kobe, this team is beyond trash.
And Lin has been in this league for what, 4 seasons? Stop making excuses for the guy, he needs to step up and help carry the team. He's not in NY anymore, he can't expect the team to cater to his needs. Learn to adjust. |
Lin has to play better, period. He is totally out of sync.
Kobe has to change too, if he still things himself alone can dominate the game, he is living 2005...
Bottomline, it is coach's job, and players have to buy in. It is not working. The way they are losing is so ugly. |
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autoprt
Starting Rotation
Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 821
Location: SLO
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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| DaveAtCFansCanSMD wrote: | | Honeybadger81 wrote: | | I don't care how many points Kobe scores, this is not the way to play, you fight as a team, get your guys on the same page. He blew up too many defense assignments, forced the offense too much, at this point of his career, he can not dominate any more, it's time to get his teammates involved and they can help him... hopefully Kobe can figure it out... |
Tell me about it. Are we just gonna ignore the fact that Kobe gambled on defense for a steal multiple times which lead to EASY buckets for Morris. Then he comes down on the other end of the court and jacks up the most contended jump shot ever. Kobe was a little cry baby tonight. Team ball wins. Not taking 20 contended jumpers. |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
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bws94
Star Player
Joined: 28 Oct 2014
Posts: 1563
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | bws94 wrote: | | Dwight+Harden wrote: | My observations
Lin is scared to shoot,teams just have to Trap him or switch because he won't shoot the jumper(problem he had in Houston)
Boozer isn't good anymore and packs the paint, which makes it harder for Kobe and Lin (reason he lost time to Gibson last year)
Kobe is fine offensively, but Defensively over purses and gets beat on isos, Kobes doing to much offensively (that will probably get him hurt again)
Only decent defender is Davis
To many scrubs getting alot of min.
Only way this team has a chance is if Lin plays like he did in NY(to spell kobe) and the team plays better perimeter defense
Hope you guyz turn it around |
Kobe is doing too much offensively.
Lin had 3 point shooter in NY (Novak), guys in motion like Fields and Shumpert, a great PnR center in Chandler, a solid defensive back court mate in Shumpert, a system built around his strengths. With the starters, Lin has no PnR man, little motion, and a veteran calling for the ball. Plus, tonight his brain was on Mars.
. |
Kobe is doing too much?? LOL. He's the ONLY ONE on this team right now that can even make a bucket. He has no choice but to keep shooting. Without Kobe, this team is beyond trash.
And Lin has been in this league for what, 4 seasons? Stop making excuses for the guy, he needs to step up and help carry the team. He's not in NY anymore, he can't expect the team to cater to his needs. Learn to adjust. |
Kobe is doing too much when he has guys wide open and doesn't pass to them, when he is having guys watch him and others aren't getting touches (Robert Horry made that point in the post-game), and also he's going to wear down at the rate he's going.
Lin's surrounding players were different in NY so he has different types of options to figure out how to use than he did in NY. I don't know where you read me making excuses for him. I haven't made any. He needs to step it up and he said in his post-game interview he has to figure out how to contribute better (paraphrasing) |
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autoprt
Starting Rotation
Joined: 18 Apr 2010
Posts: 821
Location: SLO
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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| scott sat and watched the game and should be able to figure out what they did tonight ain't gonna work. look to see some changes by next game (i hope) |
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butterfingerz10
Rookie
Joined: 29 Oct 2014
Posts: 15
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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| autoprt wrote: |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
This.
As of now, there is only one good player on this team and it's Kobe. There is no 2nd best player.
Also Lin was doing pretty swell in the preseason, so idk wtf happened to him, but he's playing like a legit scrub. |
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purple.23
Starting Rotation
Joined: 11 Oct 2014
Posts: 592
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| I can see why Kobe took so many shots. The thing is that others need to step up, specially Lin. The defense of the team is what it is, and it aint gonna be better, so you do what you can. BUT, you have to score - you can't suck on both ends. |
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swoosh-it
Sixth Man
Joined: 08 Sep 2014
Posts: 94
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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My goodness, two nights of awful.  Kobe being Kobe can't do it all. Where's the defense they've been drilled all preseason.  Offence, forget it. Where is the second option. Why not bring Davis on with Lin.  They seem to have something. Boozer was horrible tonight. Clank! Ok, next time. |
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dxdx
Sixth Man
Joined: 28 Oct 2014
Posts: 70
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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| autoprt wrote: | | scott sat and watched the game and should be able to figure out what they did tonight ain't gonna work. look to see some changes by next game (i hope) |
lol.
if Scott still stands by his limited 3 offense, then clearly he has not figure out what didnt work. |
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tirebiter
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Joined: 31 Jul 2014
Posts: 401
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | autoprt wrote: |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
This.
As of now, there is only one good player on this team and it's Kobe. There is no 2nd best player.
Also Lin was doing pretty swell in the preseason, so idk what the heck happened to him, but he's playing like a legit scrub. |
it seems like in the preseason lin was running a totally different system with high pnr after high pnr with davis. now he's trying to figure how his niche with he starting unit while we're already underway in regular season. |
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chrisca91
Star Player
Joined: 06 Jan 2013
Posts: 3468
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Kobe did pass, the Lakers failed in converting. That is not his fault. |
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MJST
Retired Number
Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26409
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | autoprt wrote: |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
This.
As of now, there is only one good player on this team and it's Kobe. There is no 2nd best player.
Also Lin was doing pretty swell in the preseason, so idk what the heck happened to him, but he's playing like a legit scrub. |
Playing with the bench. Everyone on the bench needed Lin to get going so he was able to be aggressive. In the starting lineup it's not as pick and roll heavy because Hill isn't as good a pick and roller as Davis and Kobe isn't going to hover at the three point line or run many fast breaks like Ellington/Clarkson/Kelly would. So Lin's greatest strengths aren't utilized with them. |
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Honeybadger81
Star Player
Joined: 25 Oct 2014
Posts: 1253
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | | butterfingerz10 wrote: | | autoprt wrote: |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
This.
As of now, there is only one good player on this team and it's Kobe. There is no 2nd best player.
Also Lin was doing pretty swell in the preseason, so idk what the heck happened to him, but he's playing like a legit scrub. |
Playing with the bench. Everyone on the bench needed Lin to get going so he was able to be aggressive. In the starting lineup it's not as pick and roll heavy because Hill isn't as good a pick and roller as Davis and Kobe isn't going to hover at the three point line or run many fast breaks like Ellington/Clarkson/Kelly would. So Lin's greatest strengths aren't utilized with them. |
no matter lin or price in the starting unit, the lakers was blown out in the first quarter with no transition defense...remember the preseason game against Warriors and Jazz? Ronnie was in the starting unit, no difference...
The starters collectively have to play better, period. |
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MJST
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Joined: 06 Jul 2014
Posts: 26409
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Honeybadger81 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | | butterfingerz10 wrote: | | autoprt wrote: |
johnson and lin who were supposed to help with scoring didn't help when the opportunities came and missed a lot of shots then got scared to shoot. someone has to take them that had a chance to make them. kobe had no choice tonight |
This.
As of now, there is only one good player on this team and it's Kobe. There is no 2nd best player.
Also Lin was doing pretty swell in the preseason, so idk what the heck happened to him, but he's playing like a legit scrub. |
Playing with the bench. Everyone on the bench needed Lin to get going so he was able to be aggressive. In the starting lineup it's not as pick and roll heavy because Hill isn't as good a pick and roller as Davis and Kobe isn't going to hover at the three point line or run many fast breaks like Ellington/Clarkson/Kelly would. So Lin's greatest strengths aren't utilized with them. |
no matter lin or price in the starting unit, the lakers was blown out in the first quarter with no transition defense...remember the preseason game against Warriors and Jazz? Ronnie was in the starting unit, no difference...
The starters collectively have to play better, period. |
Starters need to be more consistent and move off ball more, but Lin isn't going to help them with that as his best offense comes out of the pick and roll. And neither Boozer nor Hill is inspiring anyone with their pick and "roll" skills.
Also Lin didn't play vs the Jazz and The 2nd Warriors game the Lakers had dead legs from being run in practice that day, and Lin also didn't play.
Lin running our bench was our most efficient offense and rightfully so as he made the guys a heck of a lot more efficient that by the time him and Kobe were finishing games both had high confidence and both were on. And it allowed Scott to run Lin through the high pick and roll sets he used with CP and Kyrie, and Lin runs those sets best when he has teammates amiable to pick and roll style offense. Boozer and Hill are not sadly.
The ending to that first Suns game was fantastic, Lin, full of confidence scores the first 13 points of the 4th and Kobe finishes it off with the next 10 as the Lakers look like they're headed to a win. That's what it looks like when Lin is at full confidence and he got that confidence cause he was able to get going and control the pace with the bench  So that when he was out there with Kobe he had no hesitation and Kobe came in when he was needed while Lin did what he did early on and Kobe closed it.
That's the perfect microcosm what needs to be imo. |
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times
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Joined: 05 Dec 2004
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| A lot of Lin fans |
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iaargg
Rookie
Joined: 29 Oct 2014
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:28 am Post subject: |
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Forget what BS told the media, from what I saw in the first 2 matches, he has no idea how the offense should be done other than giving Kobe the green light to shoot whenever he wants.
Don't get me wrong, Kobe is a super star and the best player in this team, he can shoot whenever he wants especially when he has his hands hot like today. The problem is BS didn't tell the players what to do otherwise. If Kobe is on the floor, things are easier for them, because they need to find where Kobe is and try best to give the ball to him and then watch till he shoots. And if Kobe is not, no one has a clue what to do to set a play. What they can do is to pass the ball a few times with no real use and then someone shoots the ball praying it can go in. No open shot created, no pick-and-roll, no successful lay up, no nothing. We have a roster of average talented players except for Kobe, and we still don't want to play team basketball, then it's no surprise we will be crushed time and time again.
BS once said he likes Jeremy, but it seems he distrusts him even more than what McHale did. And this distrust obviously has been felt by the other players and Lin himself. Most of the time, our big guys (esp. Boozer and Hill) are not willing to set a pick for Lin, just stand there looking at him no matter how long he is waiting. And eventually, he has to give the ball out to Kobe or someone else. And once the ball leaves Lin's hand, very unlikely it will be back again. And for Lin, because he knows the coach and some teammates don't trust him, so he is afraid of turning the ball over, afraid of shooting without scoring, afraid of to be regarded as a ball hogging guy by others. With these many scary thoughts in his mind, he cannot play his best and this in turn will makes BS distrust him more and bench him more, at the same time Lin starts to lose faith in himself as well.
So no matter how Kobe tells him to run the offense, when no player sets pick for you, no player wants to play under your command, when you don't even believe in yourself, there is no way this PG can perform well. What Dragic can do to Lakers today, Lin did it better 2.5 years ago in New York against a better Lakers, but today they are like 2 players from NBA and High School respectively. |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:34 am Post subject: spacing |
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| MJST wrote: | | nickuku wrote: | | You need a distributor like cp3 to play this kind of offense. Unfortunately We don't even have anything close to that. |
Lin's a distributor. The problem is, Scott runs the triangle/princeton with the starting lineup which utilizes the point guard off ball, similar to what Phil did with Fisher. The problem is that doesn't utilize what he can do. The difference with CP3 is he has a gear for offense and facilitating and can click it either or. Lin's the type that gets going by helping his teammates out and that's when he starts creating holes in the defense he can take advantage of and score through. Even he has said this.
.... |
Good points. Somehow I feel much of this must fall on the coach. We rarely get fast break points. On occasion Randle would coast to coast as well as Lin, however in absence of that when in transition there isn't enough movement, players cutting in and around the basket for easier baskets. The half court offense is the worst. Perhaps LA has no 3 point shooters though Lin and Kobe are league average and slightly better but the open looks are almost never there. On account of that the defense clogs up the middle so Lin has no place to go in to score or go in to kick out. Nothing, no one seems to move in the half court sets. |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:39 am Post subject: For sure |
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| shark-lin wrote: | | If Lakers are not shooting 3s...then teams will just hog the paint & dare them to drive in. Not saying anything..but Byron Scott doesn't exactly have a great record as a coach |
The Lakers may not be, need to be even near the league leaders in 3 point attempts but they need to take more. A team in 2014 cannot with without it. The half court spacing is horrendous. Never any open looks from 3 of which Lin and Kobe can shoot well enough if allowed to take more than one or two to get in a rhythm. Kobe even at 36 is still great at O, D not as much so but its early on. Still he and Scott must realize that the Lakers don't stand a chance even if he takes so many mid-range to long fallaway jumpers. |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:43 am Post subject: Horrible spacing |
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| Who Takes The Blame wrote: | | Quote: | Box Score:
Boozer 2-6
Hill 2-7
W. Johnson 2-7
Lin 2-5
Bryant 11-25
E. Davis 4-8
W. Ellington 3-4 |
something aint right |
Without any 3 game the D clogs up the middle. No place to drive, no ball movement around the perimeter either. Take out Lin desperation chuck at the buzzer he's 2-4. He is definitely the type player that needs to get into a rhythm. Some of his best playing happens in the 3rd and 4th quarters and OT. With these blowouts he's been sitting in the 4th. |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:47 am Post subject: Freelancing |
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| brunel wrote: | | autoprt wrote: | | i looked at the stat line compared to suns.. kobe is only one that really scored, davis got his but that is considered gravy. we were hoping lin to become the 2nd scorer and get about 15-18 a game which isn't impossible but at this rate i don't see it. boozer can't do it. we just don't have the scorers at this point. i think management is just ready to tie up the driver and let the bus run off the cliff at this point. |
I'm watching Lin and he thinks they're actually running some actually sets out there. He's gotta take Kobe's lead and start freelancing. Though, that turned kind of ugly last night ... |
Kobe's freelancing last night was holding the ball too long and/r mid- to long-range fallaway jumpers. A terrible strategy. Scott, the team has to try some offensive sets in which the ball moves around the perimeter. |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:52 am Post subject: Insane but |
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| Jonathan1212 wrote: | You guys think scott is going to keep the no threes thing?
It just seems insane at this point. A total failed experiment.
If bet if we start shooting threes n bring Lin off the bench with Davis at least we can lose in a respectable manner. |
I totally agree, thought so when I first heard about BS's new "strategy". Problem is the Lakers are rarely getting decent open looks. The ball has to move around, touch more hands before the final shot. Lin shot league average 36 on 3s and can get hot if allowed to get into a rhythm. If Kobe insists on trying to win the game by himself it is hopeless, just take everyone else out of the game, i.e. in the following Vine Lin is so wide open for so long for a corner 3 but Kobe doing the Carmelo bounce bounce bouce the clock out.
https://vine.co/v/OMF2OjKnIqm/embed |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:54 am Post subject: Everyone sees it |
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| Honeybadger81 wrote: | | I don't care how many points Kobe scores, this is not the way to play, you fight as a team, get your guys on the same page. He blew up too many defense assignments, forced the offense too much, at this point of his career, he can not dominate any more, it's time to get his teammates involved and they can help him... hopefully Kobe can figure it out... |
EVERYONE sees it except Kobe and Scott, WTF? |
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catman2u
Starting Rotation
Joined: 07 Oct 2014
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:57 am Post subject: Adjust? |
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| butterfingerz10 wrote: | | bws94 wrote: | | Dwight+Harden wrote: | My observations
Lin is scared to shoot,teams just have to Trap him or switch because he won't shoot the jumper(problem he had in Houston)
Boozer isn't good anymore and packs the paint, which makes it harder for Kobe and Lin (reason he lost time to Gibson last year)
Kobe is fine offensively, but Defensively over purses and gets beat on isos, Kobes doing to much offensively (that will probably get him hurt again)
Only decent defender is Davis
To many scrubs getting alot of min.
Only way this team has a chance is if Lin plays like he did in NY(to spell kobe) and the team plays better perimeter defense
Hope you guyz turn it around |
Kobe is doing too much offensively.
Lin had 3 point shooter in NY (Novak), guys in motion like Fields and Shumpert, a great PnR center in Chandler, a solid defensive back court mate in Shumpert, a system built around his strengths. With the starters, Lin has no PnR man, little motion, and a veteran calling for the ball. Plus, tonight his brain was on Mars.
. |
Kobe is doing too much?? LOL. He's the ONLY ONE on this team right now that can even make a bucket. He has no choice but to keep shooting. Without Kobe, this team is beyond trash.
And Lin has been in this league for what, 4 seasons? Stop making excuses for the guy, he needs to step up and help carry the team. He's not in NY anymore, he can't expect the team to cater to his needs. Learn to adjust. |
I agree Lin needs to adjust but no amount of adjusting will work if Kobe doesn't also adjust. I heard an interview with Nash re when he joined the Lakers. He was saying it was a big adjustment to not have the ball in his hands, running the offense since so much goes thru Kobe. Its a failing strategy at this point. Hello coach, what are you going to do? |
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