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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 11:38 am Post subject: |
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nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | nash wrote: | tox wrote: | MJST wrote: | tox wrote: | Outspoken wrote: | PICKnPOP wrote: | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | They probably put Clarksons defense lowww, and the low rating came from it |
Yup |
then I think d russ's rating wouldn't be 79. |
There's low, and then there's lowww |
lowwwww like leading all rookies in steals last season? |
I actually meant Russell's was low and Clarkson's was lowww (especially when you factor in rookie year @ 19 vs. soph year @ 22). Seems to be a lot of false equivalency going on but defense could easily be why Russell is higher than Clarkson, despite defense being a weakness of Russell.
Of course Clarkson has all the tools to prove me wrong, but so far he hasn't done so. |
Agreed.
I just don't understand why you have Russell higher for his defense, in this case I don't see a lot of tools against the quick PG of this league. I have Russell higher as scorer, but their D sucks. |
Well, he's also 4 years younger than JC. Usually with older rookies you'd assume their defense would be more up to par due to experience/age. |
That is true, but if Clarkson really started to play late he may have a chance to succeed too. Russell seems smarter than Clarkson anticipating plays, but they are both sub par defenders at this point. |
Sure, but it's dishonest not to mention the huge age difference. DLO at 24 will be a monster.
I think it's just hard to compare these two given their different trajectories. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:45 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | nash wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | nash wrote: | tox wrote: | MJST wrote: | tox wrote: | Outspoken wrote: | PICKnPOP wrote: | KeepItRealOrElse wrote: | They probably put Clarksons defense lowww, and the low rating came from it |
Yup |
then I think d russ's rating wouldn't be 79. |
There's low, and then there's lowww |
lowwwww like leading all rookies in steals last season? |
I actually meant Russell's was low and Clarkson's was lowww (especially when you factor in rookie year @ 19 vs. soph year @ 22). Seems to be a lot of false equivalency going on but defense could easily be why Russell is higher than Clarkson, despite defense being a weakness of Russell.
Of course Clarkson has all the tools to prove me wrong, but so far he hasn't done so. |
Agreed.
I just don't understand why you have Russell higher for his defense, in this case I don't see a lot of tools against the quick PG of this league. I have Russell higher as scorer, but their D sucks. |
Well, he's also 4 years younger than JC. Usually with older rookies you'd assume their defense would be more up to par due to experience/age. |
That is true, but if Clarkson really started to play late he may have a chance to succeed too. Russell seems smarter than Clarkson anticipating plays, but they are both sub par defenders at this point. |
Sure, but it's dishonest not to mention the huge age difference. DLO at 24 will be a monster.
I think it's just hard to compare these two given their different trajectories. |
Glad we have them both! It's a win-win situation.
NBA basketball is a meritocracy. Year by year, the best players out of our young core will become self evident. Don't mind at all if either player tries to establish himself as "the man" this year. As long as we get wins. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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pio2u Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012 Posts: 54519
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Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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The sky is the limit for Jordan Clarkson
Quote: | Although the circumstances in Clarkson’s second season were noticeably different, his play remained relatively consistent. Certain areas of his game fluctuated, but only marginally. Here is a look at his per game averages from the two seasons, along with his statistics on a per-36 minute basis. |
http://www.silverscreenandroll.com/2016/8/31/12713914/la-lakers-rank-analysis-jordan-clarkson |
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tox Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015 Posts: 17835
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Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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MJST wrote: |
Which is why people ask him to work on his defense or even just the defensive basics during the off-season. | Yep! With his quickness, all the potential is there. Up for JC to capitalize on it. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 10:54 am Post subject: |
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Kid Clarkson pissed he has to take a picture with Spurs players.
http://i.imgur.com/N9reg2A.jpg
He's been a Laker from birth. A1 since day 1. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: |
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Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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pio2u Retired Number
Joined: 26 Dec 2012 Posts: 54519
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. |
Yes, expectations will be higher but I believe that he is focused and will be up to the task.
I think the main reason he signed so fast was because he believes that he has something to prove to himself, the team and to the rest of the league.
His offensive game will be much improved I just hope that he steps up a notch or two one the defensive end. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Wed Sep 07, 2016 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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pio2u wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. |
Yes, expectations will be higher but I believe that he is focused and will be up to the task.
I think the main reason he signed so fast was because he believes that he has something to prove to himself, the team and to the rest of the league.
His offensive game will be much improved I just hope that he steps up a notch or two one the defensive end. |
He's shown the effort on the court and he has the athleticism to be at least be an average defender.
But he needs to gamble less. Less differential defense, more positional defense. On and off ball. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 11:17 am Post subject: |
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Grass Fed on Clarkson:
Quote: | JORDAN CLARKSON
DiFrancesco: Jordan is a guy I never have to worry about or babysit. He will come in and do his work. I put his workouts on the board for him, and he knows how to execute, because we’ve been working together for a while now. We made significant progress and quick gains in lean mass and strength from the day he stepped in after the Draft to the end of his rookie year, and now it’s about maintaining the gains we made. He plays a high-octane, violent and explosive game and needs to be able to have the stimulus of mechanical loading and resistance training so that the support structures in his body – the ligaments, tendons and bones – are strong enough to withstand slowing down, decelerating and landing from the high speeds and jumps. That’s where our focus on him is and has been. |
_________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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LakerDYnasty72 Star Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2006 Posts: 4562
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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tox wrote: | MJST wrote: |
Which is why people ask him to work on his defense or even just the defensive basics during the off-season. | Yep! With his quickness, all the potential is there. Up for JC to capitalize on it. |
What does "working on his defense mean in practical terms?" I've given it some thought. What applies for Jordan applies specifically for Julius as well, and the whole team in general. It's this:
Jordan has tremendous athletic ability. He knows how to use it for scoring because, until Luke teaches otherwise, scoring to him is an individually utilized skill. He needs coaching from the mental standpoint defensively. He'll be taught to move the ball on offense, to think in concert with his team mates, communicate effectively, etc.,
Hopefully Luke and staff will help him think the same way defensively;to be in concert with his team mates, play off each other, know whose on the floor, understand each other's strengths/weakness, communicate, minimize gambling, etc., |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29150 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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In terms of isolation defense, Clarkson needs to alter his technique. Like GT says, he jumps instead of slides. Also he needs to do his homework and realize which players he should bait into long 2s. He played everyone so tight last season. He needs to alter his approach based on his man's skillset.
Hopefully DLO can take the responsibility of guarding the bigger guard more often than not this season, since he has a bigger frame. I wouldn't put Clarkson on Klay. I'd put him on steph instead (for example).
In terms of on and off ball screens, the whole team needs to communicate. DLO and Clarkson got destroyed on screens last year because the big didn't tell them what direction the screen was set. Also, off ball the bigs need to be prepared to switch if Clarkson or DLO have to run through 2-3 off ball screens consecutively. Unrealistic to ask any player to dodge multiple screens 100% of the time. Again, communication between all 5 players on the floor will be key. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Thu Sep 22, 2016 2:00 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fastbreak32 Star Player
Joined: 11 Oct 2011 Posts: 4746
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Grass Fed on Clarkson:
Quote: | JORDAN CLARKSON
DiFrancesco: Jordan is a guy I never have to worry about or babysit. He will come in and do his work. I put his workouts on the board for him, and he knows how to execute, because we’ve been working together for a while now. We made significant progress and quick gains in lean mass and strength from the day he stepped in after the Draft to the end of his rookie year, and now it’s about maintaining the gains we made. He plays a high-octane, violent and explosive game and needs to be able to have the stimulus of mechanical loading and resistance training so that the support structures in his body – the ligaments, tendons and bones – are strong enough to withstand slowing down, decelerating and landing from the high speeds and jumps. That’s where our focus on him is and has been. |
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Well that's a highly sophisticated sounding training program. Way to go, JC! _________________ LeBron, AD, & _________. Stay tuned.
"...there was a time when the Israelites were wandering in the desert and all of a sudden, bread came down from heaven,” Pelinka said. “That’s kind of what today feels like for us to have KCP join.” |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. |
yeah, that 2nd round steal soundbite is over. When we play the Warriors, he needs to understand that the expectation is for him to perform on the level of Klay. I know some will roll their eyes, but he is now an NBA starter, and paid like an NBA starter....it was a lot of goodwill and bonus the last two years, but now that level of play is the floor at best. |
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Rivershow Star Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2011 Posts: 6731
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. |
Definitely. He's no longer the plucky 2nd round pick that outperformed expectations. Now expectations are redefined and he needs to have a certain consistency and getting better in other areas. Same will happen for all our young players that prove their worth and get big contracts. |
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tox Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015 Posts: 17835
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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kikanga wrote: | In terms of isolation defense, Clarkson needs to alter his technique. Like GT says, he jumps instead of slides. Also he needs to do his homework and realize which players he should bait into long 2s. He played everyone so tight last season. He needs to alter his approach based on his man's skillset.
Hopefully DLO can take the responsibility of guarding the bigger guard more often than not this season, since he has a bigger frame. I wouldn't put Clarkson on Klay. I'd put him on steph instead (for example).
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Manning up and conceding the long 2 cannot coexist.
...But seriously, I bet you this specific aspect was Byron's doing. |
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waterman40 Star Player
Joined: 17 Jun 2003 Posts: 6280 Location: Central Coast
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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Rivershow wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Does the fact that JC makes 12.5m/year (a very good deal for the Lakers) as opposed to his previous salary of under 1m change our expectations for him?
Kind of like when Chandler Parsons went from under 1m to 15-16m/year. |
Definitely. He's no longer the plucky 2nd round pick that outperformed expectations. Now expectations are redefined and he needs to have a certain consistency and getting better in other areas. Same will happen for all our young players that prove their worth and get big contracts. |
I think who I compare it to is Andrew Bynum. When Bynum was a first round pick and made just a couple of million a year while learning to play, and spotty numbers, it didn't bother me much at all. Once he started earning (I think it was) $14 million a year I expected him to play like he was worth that kind of money, and I really don't think he ever lived up to expectations. Partly because of injuries, but also lack of experience, focus, and everything else, Bynum looked like all he cared about was cashing a paycheck - that and being an all-star for doing jack squat.
Clarkson has already far exceeded expectations for a 2nd round pick and has produced solid numbers in his first couple of seasons. Even with the raise to $12 million a year if he produces similar numbers and continues his good attitude and works on his defense, I will be very happy.
Clarkson is probably our biggest late draft success since Nick Van Ex- There, I said it. _________________ LAKERS 2019-2020: NBA World Champions! |
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BigGameHames Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015 Posts: 7982
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Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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Clarksons interview today made me think for the first time that he is putting time in on the defensive end. He acknowledged he "sucked" last year but went on to mention specific things that he has been working on. Angles on close outs, and defensive positioning were the two he mentioned that stood out to me. If Clarkson can become an average defender then I think he solidifies himself as a starter for the Lakers. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 3:45 pm Post subject: |
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Let's go JC! _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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nash Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 Posts: 8194
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Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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BigGameHames wrote: | Clarksons interview today made me think for the first time that he is putting time in on the defensive end. He acknowledged he "sucked" last year but went on to mention specific things that he has been working on. Angles on close outs, and defensive positioning were the two he mentioned that stood out to me. If Clarkson can become an average defender then I think he solidifies himself as a starter for the Lakers. |
In the second half of his rookie season he was the best PG we had in a while. Last year he improved his shooting and hesitation moves, but regressed in another points. With a solidified role and an improved defense I believe it can be a great year for him. |
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tox Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Nov 2015 Posts: 17835
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Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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BigGameHames wrote: | Clarksons interview today made me think for the first time that he is putting time in on the defensive end. He acknowledged he "sucked" last year but went on to mention specific things that he has been working on. Angles on close outs, and defensive positioning were the two he mentioned that stood out to me. If Clarkson can become an average defender then I think he solidifies himself as a starter for the Lakers. |
Yeah I liked his response a lot. Can't wait to see him in action and see if it's for real. |
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Andre2K Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 Posts: 12199
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:18 am Post subject: |
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JC is finally getting paid what he deserves, he had been a bargain for us the past 2 yrs. I have a feeling he's gonna take his game up a notch this season _________________ My Dream Starting 5 next Season
Pg Lonzo
Sg Kawhi
Sf Ingram
Pf Lebron
C Dedmon
Bench: Caruso, Hart, Bullock, Kuzma, McGee etc |
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VegasLakerFan Star Player
Joined: 25 Dec 2011 Posts: 1835
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 3:02 am Post subject: |
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Like a zillion other posters have said, JC has the tools to become an at least average defender. I think since his issues are correctable he might actually wind up being a pretty good defender. Not a Klay Thompson lockdown guy (those are hard to find) but at least someone you wouldn't be afraid to throw at a scorer like Harden.
The video about Jordan hopping instead of sliding was really enlightening. That is so damn fixable. Hope it gets fixed! |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 5:30 am Post subject: |
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Andre2K wrote: | JC is finally getting paid what he deserves, he had been a bargain for us the past 2 yrs. I have a feeling he's gonna take his game up a notch this season |
Sure. But now he's what, the 3rd highest paid player on the team? This stuff matters to NBA players (ask John Wall how he feels about Bradley Beal's extension). I'm hoping JC will correct things like defense. He's no longer a less than 1m a year player so the team will look for him to be a steady influence now. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Andre2K Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 Posts: 12199
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:18 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Andre2K wrote: | JC is finally getting paid what he deserves, he had been a bargain for us the past 2 yrs. I have a feeling he's gonna take his game up a notch this season |
Sure. But now he's what, the 3rd highest paid player on the team? This stuff matters to NBA players (ask John Wall how he feels about Bradley Beal's extension). I'm hoping JC will correct things like defense. He's no longer a less than 1m a year player so the team will look for him to be a steady influence now. |
He is already a steady influence. Now he is one of the leaders of the team, getting paid what he deserves. _________________ My Dream Starting 5 next Season
Pg Lonzo
Sg Kawhi
Sf Ingram
Pf Lebron
C Dedmon
Bench: Caruso, Hart, Bullock, Kuzma, McGee etc |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:20 am Post subject: |
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Andre2K wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Andre2K wrote: | JC is finally getting paid what he deserves, he had been a bargain for us the past 2 yrs. I have a feeling he's gonna take his game up a notch this season |
Sure. But now he's what, the 3rd highest paid player on the team? This stuff matters to NBA players (ask John Wall how he feels about Bradley Beal's extension). I'm hoping JC will correct things like defense. He's no longer a less than 1m a year player so the team will look for him to be a steady influence now. |
He is already a steady influence. Now he is one of the leaders of the team, getting paid what he deserves. |
I don't think he's a "leader" type personality. I think DLO/Jules are more of that alpha personality. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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