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Rawr Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2007 Posts: 1186
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:14 am Post subject: |
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RCS926 wrote: | Dave20 wrote: | There's too many ball hogs on the team. Going to be difficult for Clarkson and Randle to get enough touches. Those two should lead the team in shot attempts most games. Not Young, Lou, or even Kobe. |
I like the shot distribution so far between Kobe, Randle and Clarkson. If the offense is balanced, they should all get around the same number of shots. I'm not worried about Young and Lou shooting too much since they've been playing with random lineups thus far. |
Lou and Young need to play a lot less minutes in the regular season. Everytime Williams is in he holds onto the ball for at least half the shot clock and gets torched on defense. Clarkson should be the guard getting by far the most minutes this year. He moves the ball and is very efficient. _________________ You are either in or on your way to the NBA Finals. |
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2019 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 10786
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:15 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:17 am Post subject: |
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Rawr wrote: | RCS926 wrote: | Dave20 wrote: | There's too many ball hogs on the team. Going to be difficult for Clarkson and Randle to get enough touches. Those two should lead the team in shot attempts most games. Not Young, Lou, or even Kobe. |
I like the shot distribution so far between Kobe, Randle and Clarkson. If the offense is balanced, they should all get around the same number of shots. I'm not worried about Young and Lou shooting too much since they've been playing with random lineups thus far. |
Lou and Young need to play a lot less minutes in the regular season. Everytime Williams is in he holds onto the ball for at least half the shot clock and gets torched on defense. Clarkson should be the guard getting by far the most minutes this year. He moves the ball and is very efficient. |
Lou has been asked to carry the offense alongside some gimmicky lineups. I think he's going to look better once the rotations are established, and Lou gets some time playing next to either Russell or JC. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:19 am Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
I think it will be best to stagger them down the road. A lot of creators (which is fine) but I see a lot of guys vying to be the lead creator with DLO. A good problem tO have IMO. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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LakerDYnasty72 Star Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2006 Posts: 4562
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:22 am Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
We'll see. I doubt it. I believe one of the reasons, among many, why the Lakers chose Russell is the belief that he can play well with anyone. Okafor, otoh, would have required a marked focused on obtaining snipers with which to surround him. Russell & Randle are already making progress in their chemistry class. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:29 am Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
I think it will be best to stagger them down the road. A lot of creators (which is fine) but I see a lot of guys vying to be the lead creator with DLO. A good problem tO have IMO. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:48 am Post subject: |
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Really important for DLO to play this preseason to gel with these guys. Hope he is back soon. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:49 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
I think it will be best to stagger them down the road. A lot of creators (which is fine) but I see a lot of guys vying to be the lead creator with DLO. A good problem tO have IMO. |
Gotta love the fact that Kobe recognizes how many playmakers are on this squad and doesn't feel the need to do that job anymore. That's going to be huge going forward in terms of allowing Kobe to remain efficient on offense while allowing our young guns to have the freedom to create plays for themselves and others. |
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lukewaltonsdad Star Player
Joined: 09 Jul 2014 Posts: 2983
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:51 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Really important for DLO to play this preseason to gel with these guys. Hope he is back soon. |
I think he'll play on Sunday. We still have 5 more preseason games plus practices/scrimmages. I think they'll be fine, but it might take awhile for them to develop that cohesion and chemistry for a bit. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:51 am Post subject: |
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RCS926 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
I think it will be best to stagger them down the road. A lot of creators (which is fine) but I see a lot of guys vying to be the lead creator with DLO. A good problem tO have IMO. |
Gotta love the fact that Kobe recognizes how many playmakers are on this squad and doesn't feel the need to do that job anymore. That's going to be huge going forward in terms of allowing Kobe to remain efficient on offense while allowing our young guns to have the freedom to create plays for themselves and others. |
Yeah. Thankfully Hibbert doesn't require touches. However our first two guys off the bench are gunners. I think Young is gone for sure by next year. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:54 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | RCS926 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
I think it will be best to stagger them down the road. A lot of creators (which is fine) but I see a lot of guys vying to be the lead creator with DLO. A good problem tO have IMO. |
Gotta love the fact that Kobe recognizes how many playmakers are on this squad and doesn't feel the need to do that job anymore. That's going to be huge going forward in terms of allowing Kobe to remain efficient on offense while allowing our young guns to have the freedom to create plays for themselves and others. |
Yeah. Thankfully Hibbert doesn't require touches. However our first two guys off the bench are gunners. I think Young is gone for sure by next year. |
I agree. I prefer Lou over Nick simply because Lou mixes his offense up more with regards to shooting, driving and passing. |
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ZenMaster4President Starting Rotation
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 966
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:32 am Post subject: |
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Nick, however, is vastly superior defensive player. |
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dood23 Franchise Player
Joined: 16 Jun 2010 Posts: 12084
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:41 am Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
Yea I think it's just coincidence that Randle woke up in the same game Russell got hurt.
Russell is one of the few guys on this team who can space the floor once he finds his shot, they are going to need him in a bad way. _________________ "There's only 2 dudes better than me, and I'm BOTH OF THEM." |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:46 am Post subject: |
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ZenMaster4President wrote: | Nick, however, is vastly superior defensive player. |
This may be the first time I've ever seen defense and Nick Young in the same sentence. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:47 am Post subject: |
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dood23 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
Yea I think it's just coincidence that Randle woke up in the same game Russell got hurt.
Russell is one of the few guys on this team who can space the floor once he finds his shot, they are going to need him in a bad way. |
I'd like to see Russell grow into the role of PG more, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Lakers end up putting the ball in Clarkson and Randle's hands more with Russell acting as a spacer and secondary playmaker. Those who have studied Russell extensively have pointed out that he isn't really a traditional PG even though he has great court vision. He excels at making great passes when the defense is compromised.
Since he's not great at creating those defensive holes himself, it might make more sense to allow others to create those holes for him. When the defense has to adjust to Jordan or Julius attacking the paint, they can kick it to Russell who can burn them with his shooting or his passing should they close out hard on him. |
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Rivershow Star Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2011 Posts: 6731
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 9:54 am Post subject: |
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RCS926 wrote: | dood23 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
Yea I think it's just coincidence that Randle woke up in the same game Russell got hurt.
Russell is one of the few guys on this team who can space the floor once he finds his shot, they are going to need him in a bad way. |
I'd like to see Russell grow into the role of PG more, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Lakers end up putting the ball in Clarkson and Randle's hands more with Russell acting as a spacer and secondary playmaker. Those who have studied Russell extensively have pointed out that he isn't really a traditional PG even though he has great court vision. He excels at making great passes when the defense is compromised.
Since he's not great at creating those defensive holes himself, it might make more sense to allow others to create those holes for him. When the defense has to adjust to Jordan or Julius attacking the paint, they can kick it to Russell who can burn them with his shooting or his passing should they close out hard on him. |
Totally agree with this. |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:14 am Post subject: |
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Rivershow wrote: | RCS926 wrote: | dood23 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
Yea I think it's just coincidence that Randle woke up in the same game Russell got hurt.
Russell is one of the few guys on this team who can space the floor once he finds his shot, they are going to need him in a bad way. |
I'd like to see Russell grow into the role of PG more, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Lakers end up putting the ball in Clarkson and Randle's hands more with Russell acting as a spacer and secondary playmaker. Those who have studied Russell extensively have pointed out that he isn't really a traditional PG even though he has great court vision. He excels at making great passes when the defense is compromised.
Since he's not great at creating those defensive holes himself, it might make more sense to allow others to create those holes for him. When the defense has to adjust to Jordan or Julius attacking the paint, they can kick it to Russell who can burn them with his shooting or his passing should they close out hard on him. |
Totally agree with this. |
100% with you guys. Russell is a playmaking 2 IMO. Clarkson is a scoring 1. I'd like to see JC be the initiator with Russell playing off him and making killer reads when he gets it |
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PhoenixForce Star Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2014 Posts: 1780
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:34 am Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | Rivershow wrote: | RCS926 wrote: | dood23 wrote: | 2019 wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | I wonder if Randle and clarkson play better without DLO. |
Clarkson and Randle will play just fine with Russell. They have yet to get enough mins to figure out how 3 how them can work together.
Honestly, Clarkson/Russ/Julius need to take over this team. Kobe seems amenable to it and everyone else can shove it. |
Yea I think it's just coincidence that Randle woke up in the same game Russell got hurt.
Russell is one of the few guys on this team who can space the floor once he finds his shot, they are going to need him in a bad way. |
I'd like to see Russell grow into the role of PG more, but it wouldn't surprise me if the Lakers end up putting the ball in Clarkson and Randle's hands more with Russell acting as a spacer and secondary playmaker. Those who have studied Russell extensively have pointed out that he isn't really a traditional PG even though he has great court vision. He excels at making great passes when the defense is compromised.
Since he's not great at creating those defensive holes himself, it might make more sense to allow others to create those holes for him. When the defense has to adjust to Jordan or Julius attacking the paint, they can kick it to Russell who can burn them with his shooting or his passing should they close out hard on him. |
Totally agree with this. |
100% with you guys. Russell is a playmaking 2 IMO. Clarkson is a scoring 1. I'd like to see JC be the initiator with Russell playing off him and making killer reads when he gets it |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
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Chronicle Retired Number
Joined: 21 Jul 2012 Posts: 31930 Location: Manhattan
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:21 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | ZenMaster4President wrote: | Nick, however, is vastly superior defensive player. |
This may be the first time I've ever seen defense and Nick Young in the same sentence. |
Nick Young has always been capable of good defense. He showed it late 2 seasons ago and he showed it early last season. But it has always been a question of effort and consistency with him.
Nick Young thrives if the team thrives. And when he does, it makes him a very valuable player. It is important that he buys into the team system and that we establish a winning identity were players are held responsible. When Nick Young buys in, he plays good defense. Always has. _________________ Kobe |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:27 am Post subject: |
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Chronicle wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | ZenMaster4President wrote: | Nick, however, is vastly superior defensive player. |
This may be the first time I've ever seen defense and Nick Young in the same sentence. |
Nick Young has always been capable of good defense. He showed it late 2 seasons ago and he showed it early last season. But it has always been a question of effort and consistency with him.
Nick Young thrives if the team thrives. And when he does, it makes him a very valuable player. It is important that he buys into the team system and that we establish a winning identity were players are held responsible. When Nick Young buys in, he plays good defense. Always has. |
So he only plays hard when the team is trying? Precisely the kind of guy you want to dump if possible. You got young guys who grind in the gym and then you have Swaggy who is a "conditional" player. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:31 am Post subject: |
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PhoenixForce wrote: |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
I think Clarkson's athleticism gives him the advantage when it comes to initiating. I think we have 4 players capable of initiating in our starting lineup. I'd like to see it mixed up a bit where they all get turns to prevent predictability, but my bread & butter would be JC probing with a high P&R with Julius. DLO on the strong side and Kobe in the weakside corner. If JC gets the step he can attack right away. Kobe can come weak to strong, Jules can get looks, it can be swung to DLO who can then shoot or start another PnR action from there. So many possibilities
TL/DR; JC:Parker::DLO:Ginobli IMO. I can they can be successful sharing responsibilities like that |
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PhoenixForce Star Player
Joined: 07 Oct 2014 Posts: 1780
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:33 am Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | PhoenixForce wrote: |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
I think Clarkson's athleticism gives him the advantage when it comes to initiating. I think we have 4 players capable of initiating in our starting lineup. I'd like to see it mixed up a bit where they all get turns to prevent predictability, but my bread & butter would be JC probing with a high P&R with Julius. DLO on the strong side and Kobe in the weakside corner. If JC gets the step he can attack right away. Kobe can come weak to strong, Jules can get looks, it can be swung to DLO who can then shoot or start another PnR action from there. So many possibilities
TL/DR; JC:Parker::DLO:Ginobli IMO. I can they can be successful sharing responsibilities like that |
Clarkson's athletic but Dlo has way better ball handling and gets through pressure better. Clarkson should be left at the 2 to start the game. |
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RCS926 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2003 Posts: 16824
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:45 am Post subject: |
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22 wrote: | PhoenixForce wrote: |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
I think Clarkson's athleticism gives him the advantage when it comes to initiating. I think we have 4 players capable of initiating in our starting lineup. I'd like to see it mixed up a bit where they all get turns to prevent predictability, but my bread & butter would be JC probing with a high P&R with Julius. DLO on the strong side and Kobe in the weakside corner. If JC gets the step he can attack right away. Kobe can come weak to strong, Jules can get looks, it can be swung to DLO who can then shoot or start another PnR action from there. So many possibilities
TL/DR; JC:Parker::DLO:Ginobli IMO. I can they can be successful sharing responsibilities like that |
I agree especially when you consider the roles that Russell and Jordan are being asked to play as the 1 and 2, respectively, versus what they actually excel at. Ideally, we'd like our PG to be able to consistently break the defense down and make smart plays off the dribble. That's Clarkson's strength right there. He has the ability to get to any spot on the floor that he wants with his speed and athleticism. Some people cling to the idea that Jordan is more of a natural scorer, but I think he showed us last season that he knows how to balance his playmaking duties with his desire to score. Russell, on the other hand, hasn't really looked all that comfortable creating offense for others off the dribble. It really isn't the strength of his game.
In terms of the SG position, we need that player to be able to knock down open shots without being relegated to just a one-dimensional shooter. Russell fits the bill perfectly with his ability to space the floor and make great passes when the defense is compromised. JC worked on his spot-up game over the summer, but it still doesn't come naturally to him. The same can't be said of Russell.
Ultimately, I don't think we should pigeonhole Russell and Clarkson into their assigned roles as 1 and 2. I just think that we need to mix it up more and allow them to switch roles more often. Hopefully, their chemistry continues to develop, and we see a situation where the defense is always on their heels because they have to be worried about both of them scoring and creating plays for others.
Last edited by RCS926 on Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:46 am; edited 1 time in total |
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22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:45 am Post subject: |
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PhoenixForce wrote: | 22 wrote: | PhoenixForce wrote: |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
I think Clarkson's athleticism gives him the advantage when it comes to initiating. I think we have 4 players capable of initiating in our starting lineup. I'd like to see it mixed up a bit where they all get turns to prevent predictability, but my bread & butter would be JC probing with a high P&R with Julius. DLO on the strong side and Kobe in the weakside corner. If JC gets the step he can attack right away. Kobe can come weak to strong, Jules can get looks, it can be swung to DLO who can then shoot or start another PnR action from there. So many possibilities
TL/DR; JC:Parker::DLO:Ginobli IMO. I can they can be successful sharing responsibilities like that |
Clarkson's athletic but Dlo has way better ball handling and gets through pressure better. Clarkson should be left at the 2 to start the game. |
I was actually thinking the opposite since JC has more experience. That's why I prefer JC bringing the ball up. It'll allow Russell to ease into the NBA with less pressure.
But we're not far off. Both can play both guard positions |
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Omar Little Moderator
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90299 Location: Formerly Known As 24
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Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 11:50 am Post subject: |
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RCS926 wrote: | 22 wrote: | PhoenixForce wrote: |
Completely disagree. Russell is a natural point guard and Clarkson is a natural scorer. Dlo initiates the offense much better than Clarkson. |
I think Clarkson's athleticism gives him the advantage when it comes to initiating. I think we have 4 players capable of initiating in our starting lineup. I'd like to see it mixed up a bit where they all get turns to prevent predictability, but my bread & butter would be JC probing with a high P&R with Julius. DLO on the strong side and Kobe in the weakside corner. If JC gets the step he can attack right away. Kobe can come weak to strong, Jules can get looks, it can be swung to DLO who can then shoot or start another PnR action from there. So many possibilities
TL/DR; JC:Parker::DLO:Ginobli IMO. I can they can be successful sharing responsibilities like that |
I agree especially when you consider the roles that Russell and Jordan are being asked to play as the 1 and 2, respectively, versus what they actually excel at. Ideally, we'd like our PG to be able to consistently break the defense down and make smart plays off the dribble. That's Clarkson's strength right there. He has the ability to get to any spot on the floor that he wants with his speed and athleticism. Some people cling to the idea that Jordan is more of a natural scorer, but I think he showed us last season that he knows how to balance his playmaking duties with his desire to score. Russell, on the other hand, hasn't really looked all that comfortable creating offense for others off the dribble. It really isn't the strength of his game.
In terms of the SG position, we need that player to be able to knock down open shots without being relegated to just a one-dimensional shooter. Russell fits the bill perfectly with his ability to space the floor and make great passes when the defense is compromised. JC worked on his spot-up game over the summer, but it still doesn't come naturally to him. The same can't be said of Russell.
Ultimately, I don't think we should pigeonhole Russell and Clarkson into their assigned roles as 1 and 2. I just think that we need to mix it up more and allow them to switch roles more often. Hopefully, their chemistry continues to develop, and we see a situation where the defense is always on their heels because they have to be worried about both of them scoring and creating plays for others. |
One mistake IMO is to equate the fact that Russell is probably a better shooter and Clarkson a better attacker off the dribble with SG and PG roles. Russell has better natural vision, instincts, and skill as a passer, and is wired to think about the entire floor and the play as it develops. Thus, he is more of a natural PG.
More important is the fact that both guys can swing seamlessly between roles. While Russell will be the primary organizer, it doesn't preclude both guys from operating on and off ball in a hybrid fashion. |
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