View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
troy Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 4973
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:37 am Post subject: Has there ever been a Laker point guard that has played well with Kobe? |
|
|
Excluding D. Fish...
Lin is a decent player; it's not his fault that he's playing poorly. The problem with Lin is that he's too nice; too polite. I can't put my finger on it, but it sure seems that no Laker PG has ever flourished playing with Kobe, except D. Fish, and that's because Fisher was able to tell Kobe to go to hell when it was necessary.
I don't know if it's that Kobe screws up the flow of the game (that PGs should control, triangle or not), or if he gets in their heads and intimidates them so much their confidence and assertiveness goes haywire. I like Kobe as a player, but even he admits he's difficult to play with.
This, of course, begs the question if weather or not C. Paul would have done well with the Lakers, because he seems the type to be able to put Kobe in his place. But we can't change the past, so I'm really hoping that the Lakers do whatever they can to get Raja Rondo. He's strong willed, troublesome, and talented. Rondo's the perfect person to control Kobe and still play his style of game. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Don Draper Retired Number
Joined: 21 Feb 2008 Posts: 28422 Location: LA --> Bay Area
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
Derek Fisher, Lindsey Hunter, Mike Penberthy, Sasha Vujacic (technically a PG), Gary Payton was alright, Ron Harper, Jordan Farmar (thanks to ego), Steve Blake. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Don Draper Retired Number
Joined: 21 Feb 2008 Posts: 28422 Location: LA --> Bay Area
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
Lin just has some kind of mental issue. You can hear it in his voice after games. He gets way too down on himself, especially for a guy in the NBA making millions. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
pd24 Starting Rotation
Joined: 31 Oct 2014 Posts: 219
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
Sessions played well. Atkins did ok. They are about on the same level as Lin but played better when they were in LA. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Andre2K Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Oct 2004 Posts: 12199
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
Smush Parker played decent in his first year with the lakers. Chucky Atkins averaged 13 and 4 while playing next to Kobe too. So it can be done. _________________ My Dream Starting 5 next Season
Pg Lonzo
Sg Kawhi
Sf Ingram
Pf Lebron
C Dedmon
Bench: Caruso, Hart, Bullock, Kuzma, McGee etc |
|
Back to top |
|
|
jorkerjork Starting Rotation
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 Posts: 535
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 9:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
Lin just doesn't want to rock the boat, but deep down, I think he knows long-term, this sort of play just doesn't work. Look at Laker shot charts, and they are just awful. That's a coaching problem on top of a personnel problem, and there are way too many variables for a point guard to handle. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
I love the questions that exclude the correct answer. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Fadeaway_Jumper Starting Rotation
Joined: 25 Mar 2013 Posts: 105
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
What the point of this thread? Most if not all of the PG's Kobe played with have sucked, and were booted out of the league after they left the lakers.
Lin is the next garbage pg that is gona get the boot when his contract is up |
|
Back to top |
|
|
70sdude Star Player
Joined: 05 Feb 2009 Posts: 4567
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
Ron Harper, Brian Shaw, Derek Fisher. These are all guys who filled the lead guard role on Phil Jackson-coached Laker championship teams. Admittedly, each guy had slightly different responsibilities in that offense than in most styles. Even Lamar Odom played the lead guard role up top for Phil's offense here, quite often, in large fashion doing much of what Scottie Pippen did years earlier in the triangle, with Jordan. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LakersRGolden Star Player
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 7910 Location: Lake Forest
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
Zero. Several short shooting guards have survived well enough next to Kobe though. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Ossim Sixth Man
Joined: 09 Oct 2014 Posts: 42
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Are we comparing apples to oranges at this point though. Back then, the offense still ran through Kobe because he was in his prime. Right now, it sounds as if Scott is at least trying to make Lin run the offense. It kind of stops with Kobe on most plays but at least he has the keys to get the car started. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
silkwilkes Star Player
Joined: 15 Jul 2002 Posts: 6937 Location: searching for the mojo of Dr. Buss
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
All of them pretty much.
Fisher, Parker, Atkins, Sessions, etc. all posted career best or close to it while playing next to Kobe.
Don't believe the myths about Kobe. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
SDLakersFan Star Player
Joined: 01 Apr 2012 Posts: 2044
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
Kobe's never had a real pg. But he's made all of his backcourt running mates appear decent. Only one he ruined was Sessions (and that was partly Mike Brown's fault).
Kobe made Smush Parker look like a decent player for 2 seasons. How did he look the following seasons in Miami and with that other team? |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mege Starting Rotation
Joined: 11 Apr 2005 Posts: 522
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
Don't forget NVE. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
12 Star Player
Joined: 03 Sep 2010 Posts: 8617
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 10:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
SDLakersFan wrote: | Kobe's never had a real pg. But he's made all of his backcourt running mates appear decent. Only one he ruined was Sessions (and that was partly Mike Brown's fault).
Kobe made Smush Parker look like a decent player for 2 seasons. How did he look the following seasons in Miami and with that other team? |
It wasn't partly Mike Brown's fault... It was ALL Mike Brown's fault. Telling a quick guy who knows how to use his quickness to the advantage of the team to "slow down" was an idiotic move. Everyone on LG started going nuts when Sessions took off coast to coast for easy lay ups. Fans were screaming when he attacked the lane. Then Mike Brown said, "slow down" like a moron and everything went downhill. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
SGV-Laker fan Star Player
Joined: 23 May 2013 Posts: 8842
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:24 am Post subject: |
|
|
in b 4 they are scare of playing alongside of Kobe |
|
Back to top |
|
|
yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:28 am Post subject: |
|
|
Mudiay? Rjackson? _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
|
Back to top |
|
|
KobeRe-Loaded Franchise Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2003 Posts: 14944
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
The ideal PG for Kobe will be...
1. Balls out defender
2. Willing to spot up for 3 pointer and move w/o the ball
This was why Fisher worked well.
Two guys I can think of that would work well with Kobe
- Patrick Beverly
- Patty Mills _________________ #11/08/16 America became GREAT again
#Avatar-gate |
|
Back to top |
|
|
22 Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Apr 2013 Posts: 17063
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
silkwilkes wrote: | All of them pretty much.
Fisher, Parker, Atkins, Sessions, etc. all posted career best or close to it while playing next to Kobe.
Don't believe the myths about Kobe. |
Yup. As others have posted as well |
|
Back to top |
|
|
LakersMDGurl Franchise Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 18015
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hmmmm, the coach gotta figure this thing out. When Lin is there with the second unit things flow much better for him. He needs to speak up, be a voice out there, this is your ship MAN!!!!!!! _________________ New Beginings |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Ossim Sixth Man
Joined: 09 Oct 2014 Posts: 42
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
None of this explains why Lin was able to play effectively with Harden but has been a non-factor with Kobe. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:40 am Post subject: |
|
|
Ossim wrote: | None of this explains why Lin was able to play effectively with Harden but has been a non-factor with Kobe. |
He was hypnotized by the beard. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
troy Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2013 Posts: 4973
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:41 am Post subject: |
|
|
22 wrote: | silkwilkes wrote: | All of them pretty much.
Fisher, Parker, Atkins, Sessions, etc. all posted career best or close to it while playing next to Kobe.
Don't believe the myths about Kobe. |
Yup. As others have posted as well |
Fair enough...then how come none of them signed long term contracts with the Lakers (again, excluding Fisher)?
My point is, since Kobe came into the league, we have NEVER had stability at the PG position, other than Fisher. And even Fisher left, then came back. I don't count PGs that played for 1 or 2 seasons.
Smush and Atkins were routinely mocked by Laker fans when they played here (this I know for a fact). Sessions showed promise, but wasn't secured by Laker management. Harper, Hunter, and Shaw were short term Laker PGs who played before Kobe's domineering influence spread about (or maybe poisoned?) the Lakers. Mike Penberthy wasn't all that great. Sasha was cut loose (he's a 2 guard anyway). Payton was another short termer. Farmer was cut loose after only a few seasons, and Steve Blake was hot and cold (and then was cut loose).
Again, there has never been consistency at the Laker PG spot, either because of poor performance (for whatever reason), or because management has not secured them.
The only constant has been Kobe Bean Bryant playing the 2 guard...
Every player mentioned as having "good"seasons playing with Kobe have been booted out from the Lakers. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
evetssteve10 Star Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2004 Posts: 3099
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
Kobe has elevated just about every player he has ever played with - only Kobe could make smush Parker a PG on a playoff team. Dumb question _________________ "Bryant has been the second best player in the NBA for over a decade, but the number 1 player changes every other year. Somehow the number 1 player always seems to fall down the list but Kobe just never moves up. ". The Art of Hating Kobe Bryant |
|
Back to top |
|
|
evetssteve10 Star Player
Joined: 10 Nov 2004 Posts: 3099
|
Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 11:48 am Post subject: |
|
|
troy wrote: | 22 wrote: | silkwilkes wrote: | All of them pretty much.
Fisher, Parker, Atkins, Sessions, etc. all posted career best or close to it while playing next to Kobe.
Don't believe the myths about Kobe. |
Yup. As others have posted as well |
Fair enough...then how come none of them signed long term contracts with the Lakers (again, excluding Fisher)?
My point is, since Kobe came into the league, we have NEVER had stability at the PG position, other than Fisher. And even Fisher left, then came back. I don't count PGs that played for 1 or 2 seasons.
Smush and Atkins were routinely mocked by Laker fans when they played here (this I know for a fact). Sessions showed promise, but wasn't secured by Laker management. Harper, Hunter, and Shaw were short term Laker PGs who played before Kobe's domineering influence spread about (or maybe poisoned?) the Lakers. Mike Penberthy wasn't all that great. Sasha was cut loose (he's a 2 guard anyway). Payton was another short termer. Farmer was cut loose after only a few seasons, and Steve Blake was hot and cold (and then was cut loose).
Again, there has never been consistency at the Laker PG spot, either because of poor performance (for whatever reason), or because management has not secured them.
The only constant has been Kobe Bean Bryant playing the 2 guard...
Every player mentioned as having "good"seasons playing with Kobe have been booted out from the Lakers. |
Please name one player from your list of point guards that were worth giving a long term contract for the money they wanted. Maybe sessions? And that's a weak maybe _________________ "Bryant has been the second best player in the NBA for over a decade, but the number 1 player changes every other year. Somehow the number 1 player always seems to fall down the list but Kobe just never moves up. ". The Art of Hating Kobe Bryant |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|