I'm sorry but constant ISO plays is not basketball
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KobeDunk
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:14 pm    Post subject: I'm sorry but constant ISO plays is not basketball

Well it is but its not what wins games, obviously it doesn't work and kills any team concept that got you to the 4th quarter before the ISO madness takes over and everyone becomes a bystander. Obviously kobe has the green light to do whatever the hell he wants and obviously helping develop his team is not one of his objectives.

Somewhere Phil is shaking his head.. After so many years unless Phil is on the bench whistling at him Kobe still can't buy into a concept of team ball.
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Drifts
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:16 pm    Post subject:

iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.

Houston won back-to-back rings by running isos for Hakeem all night... but that team did chuck and made tons of 3s, so it freed up the paint for the Dream...
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:17 pm    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking
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Drifts
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:18 pm    Post subject:

KobeDunk wrote:
Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking


I know. I still don't get why Byron went away from what was working for him in the 1st 3 1/2 quarters
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ryan_c
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:18 pm    Post subject:

If you look at Raptors, they play lots of iso. But the difference with the Raptors they have talent for that. I don't mind Kobe iso, but if he is missing his shots a lot, he should have adjusted and try other plays.

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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:18 pm    Post subject:

Each year, a new set of teammates come in. And each year we happen to acquire the ones that just stand around. It's amazingly bad luck.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:20 pm    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking


I know. I still don't get why Byron went away from what was working for him in the 1st 3 1/2 quarters


That's what I'm saying and this isn't the 1st time, it's every close game. Kobe is smarter than that. Run something else!
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:22 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Each year, a new set of teammates come in. And each year we happen to acquire the ones that just stand around. It's amazingly bad luck.


Right? Poor Kobe. He should be threatening to break assist records too.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:22 pm    Post subject: Re: I'm sorry but constant ISO plays is not basketball

KobeDunk wrote:
Well it is but its not what wins games, obviously it doesn't work and kills any team concept that got you to the 4th quarter before the ISO madness takes over and everyone becomes a bystander. Obviously kobe has the green light to do whatever the hell he wants and obviously helping develop his team is not one of his objectives.

Somewhere Phil is shaking his head.. After so many years unless Phil is on the bench whistling at him Kobe still can't buy into a concept of team ball.


While I agree that ISO's are not what makes for winning basketball games, I think there's not much of any option at all anyway. Team ball looks ugly with this team because of the lack of talent. Kobe iso ball looks ugly with many misses off of insane shot attempts against 3-4 defenders while fading away and signing autographs at the same time in mid air. Its a pick your poison situation. Who would Kobe pass the ball to? Nick Young would be the only other legit offensive weapon on this team. Even at 36 Kobe is the best player on this team and they figure that they have no choice but to let him take shots because it won't matter if its teamball or iso a loss is still the result a great majority of the time.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:28 pm    Post subject:

Lin's a legit offensive option too, don't forget that.
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pd24
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:30 pm    Post subject:

trunkz08 wrote:
Lin's a legit offensive option too, don't forget that.


Lol
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:30 pm    Post subject: Re: I'm sorry but constant ISO plays is not basketball

ReaListik wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
Well it is but its not what wins games, obviously it doesn't work and kills any team concept that got you to the 4th quarter before the ISO madness takes over and everyone becomes a bystander. Obviously kobe has the green light to do whatever the hell he wants and obviously helping develop his team is not one of his objectives.

Somewhere Phil is shaking his head.. After so many years unless Phil is on the bench whistling at him Kobe still can't buy into a concept of team ball.


While I agree that ISO's are not what makes for winning basketball games, I think there's not much of any option at all anyway. Team ball looks ugly with this team because of the lack of talent. Kobe iso ball looks ugly with many misses off of insane shot attempts against 3-4 defenders while fading away and signing autographs at the same time in mid air. Its a pick your poison situation. Who would Kobe pass the ball to? Nick Young would be the only other legit offensive weapon on this team. Even at 36 Kobe is the best player on this team and they figure that they have no choice but to let him take shots because it won't matter if its teamball or iso a loss is still the result a great majority of the time.


Not really. Most of the Spurs plays for example, are not terribly complicated, and if you used them with these players, it would look a lot better than what we have now. Doesn't matter if the players are supposedly "selfish" or "unselfish" or not- the current sets just don't give them any options besides a long jump shot, or reset into a iso or pick and roll.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:33 pm    Post subject:

ISO ball was what separated pro from college with the old rules. It was great when the original illegal defense would be called. It allowed the best players to do their thing instead of watching the snooze feast Dean Smith and Bobby Knight offenses.

One issue now with that, is teams can play zone and all clogging of the paint does not allow space anymore.

This change killed 2 or 3 years off Shaq's prime too. So frustrating seeing it come full circle now, with Kobe missing 6 shots in a row while everyone else watches.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:34 pm    Post subject:

Drifts wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking


I know. I still don't get why Byron went away from what was working for him in the 1st 3 1/2 quarters


I don't think it was Byron's choice, this is who Kobe is. Same thing happened under MDA, Mike Brown, Bernie , Phil, Rudy T, and so on. They have all trusted Kobe to let the whole team ride him.
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trunkz08
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:35 pm    Post subject:

I think it falls on Byron...you know Kobe's going to take the shot, so why not call a different play to go away from him?
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:42 pm    Post subject:

Treble Clef wrote:
Drifts wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking


I know. I still don't get why Byron went away from what was working for him in the 1st 3 1/2 quarters


I don't think it was Byron's choice, this is who Kobe is. Same thing happened under MDA, Mike Brown, Bernie , Phil, Rudy T, and so on. They have all trusted Kobe to let the whole team ride him.


Maybe the reason is not only trust.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:44 pm    Post subject:

trunkz08 wrote:
I think it falls on Byron...you know Kobe's going to take the shot, so why not call a different play to go away from him?


When Kobe is off the ball and raises his hand up to receive a pass, WHO on this Laker team has the balls to NOT pass it to him?? It happens dozens of times in every game.

Teams like the Warriors are full of guys who can create points for themselves or others off isolation. But they move the ball fluidly and theres constant action... seeking that best available shot. How many times have we seen the Lakers scrambling around the perimeter trying to catch up with the ball as a wide open shooter buries a 3 in their face?

Opposing teams just stand in front of their man... wait for Kobe to dribble 10 times and chuck up a shot, then box out and get the rebound. Simple DEF for them.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:45 pm    Post subject:

Treble Clef wrote:
Drifts wrote:
KobeDunk wrote:
Drifts wrote:
iso basketball is old school basketball... back when the NBA still had the illegal defense in effect.


Sure. But not 20 times in a row down the stretch when you keep bricking


I know. I still don't get why Byron went away from what was working for him in the 1st 3 1/2 quarters


I don't think it was Byron's choice, this is who Kobe is. Same thing happened under MDA, Mike Brown, Bernie , Phil, Rudy T, and so on. They have all trusted Kobe to let the whole team ride him.


In this particular case BScott said this was the play.

It didn't help that no one moved. It would have been nice to have Davis on the floor in that moment.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:49 pm    Post subject:

PLATNUM wrote:
trunkz08 wrote:
I think it falls on Byron...you know Kobe's going to take the shot, so why not call a different play to go away from him?


When Kobe is off the ball and raises his hand up to receive a pass, WHO on this Laker team has the balls to NOT pass it to him?? It happens dozens of times in every game.

Teams like the Warriors are full of guys who can create points for themselves or others off isolation. But they move the ball fluidly and theres constant action... seeking that best available shot. How many times have we seen the Lakers scrambling around the perimeter trying to catch up with the ball as a wide open shooter buries a 3 in their face?

Opposing teams just stand in front of their man... wait for Kobe to dribble 10 times and chuck up a shot, then box out and get the rebound. Simple DEF for them.


When someone else has the ball and Kobe runs over to their side of the floor and posts up, they don't have much choice. The floor is clogged so they have to pass to him and then spread out.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:53 pm    Post subject:

PLATNUM wrote:
trunkz08 wrote:
I think it falls on Byron...you know Kobe's going to take the shot, so why not call a different play to go away from him?


When Kobe is off the ball and raises his hand up to receive a pass, WHO on this Laker team has the balls to NOT pass it to him?? It happens dozens of times in every game.

Teams like the Warriors are full of guys who can create points for themselves or others off isolation. But they move the ball fluidly and theres constant action... seeking that best available shot. How many times have we seen the Lakers scrambling around the perimeter trying to catch up with the ball as a wide open shooter buries a 3 in their face?

Opposing teams just stand in front of their man... wait for Kobe to dribble 10 times and chuck up a shot, then box out and get the rebound. Simple DEF for them.


I agree, but if you've ever played basketball with a dominant player you'll know when the best player calls for the ball it's hard not to give it to him. Either way, I agree with your GS assessment, they move the ball so well that they always get a wide open shot. Kobe needs to do a better job of attacking then passing, especially in the 4th when teams are just loading up on him.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:56 pm    Post subject:

Derek fisher would have taken the ball away from kobe. I Rather Lin OR Nick Step Up And Take iniative.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:57 pm    Post subject:

I hate when everyone is sanding around on offense
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trunkz08
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 11:00 pm    Post subject:

AllorNothing wrote:
Derek fisher would have taken the ball away from kobe. I Rather Lin OR Nick Step Up And Take iniative.


True, but Fish came in at the same time as Kobe, they were on equal footing so it was easier for Fish and they won championships together. Kobe's the veteran now, 5 time champion, 18-time all star, future hall of famer. It sounds so easy, but when you're the young guy and Kobe is asking for the ball, you give him the ball lol.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 11:03 pm    Post subject:

I imagine one of the selling points of paying $500 a seat for a Lakers game is that you may be there the night Kobe does the impossible and pulls off a miracle. Unless Byron doesn't care about his job, why would he try to change that?
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 11:07 pm    Post subject:

pd24 wrote:
trunkz08 wrote:
Lin's a legit offensive option too, don't forget that.


Lol

Weird bud, I must have missed the joke... Ohhh you're one of those guys lol
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