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| Do you feel better or worse about the Lakers franchise moving forward after reading the Buss kids' interview? |
| Better. Reserve a spot in Figueroa for me in the next few years. |
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13% |
[ 13 ] |
| Worse. Thinking of following "football," I mean soccer. |
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37% |
[ 36 ] |
| Still the same. |
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48% |
[ 46 ] |
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| Total Votes : 95 |
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clutchkobe
Star Player
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 1982
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 Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | Tark the Shark wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Tark the Shark wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | Tark the Shark wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | clutchkobe wrote: | | Voices wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | We don't have to read his mind, we just need to pay attention to what happened and what didn't happen. What didn't happen was Dr. Buss asking Magic to be involved in the FO. I guess logical thought is a thing of the past. And Magic has no idea how to run a FO, you probably said that about Phil too. |
Magic ability to run businesses is exceeded by few, he is a brilliant businessman, running the Lakers would not be that difficult for a skilled businessman and great x player like Magic. |
at least on his resume he has shown competence. That he can be successful in something.....Jims resume is what? |
Over a decade in the Laker FO with Jerry West and Mitch with 5 titles during that time. |
Even if you learn under someone that's highly skilled and qualified at a job, that doesn't mean you're competent to take over. |
I was just stating Jim's resume as it was asked. |
And the only reason he was on the staff and had a title to grab those highlights on his resume is that he was the son of the owner. Outside of career highlights that he might have leeched off of someone else's work, has Jim accomplished anything? |
Yes, the Buss children were/are employed by the Lakers because they are all Jerry Buss's children. Do you think that is some new revelation? |
It's not, but you continue to include Jim in a group with his father, West, and Mitch and give him credit for the Lakers success. Yet, you and all others fail to find any individual career accomplishments that can be attributed to him.
Is he a lifelong loser that leeched onto the success of others because of his bloodline or will he be a great successor? Time will tell, but most seem to think the former is the truth. |
No one knows how the decisions were made, including yourself. While I tend to credit the group who were involved, you choose to play to your bias and discredit Jim, despite being entirely ignorant about what really went on. That is why your opinion isn't worth evaluating. Try some objectivity and then what you post might be worth reading. |
how can you call somebody ignorant on this site and get away with it! You don't know that poster and just because you don't agree...you shouldn't be allowed to talk to people like that. You do it all the time. As for what you said......I think the poster has a lot of objectivity and value of what he said.
I know you don't agree with anything I say....you have talked to me like this several times. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144474
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2014 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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I know none of us know how the Laker FO works, that we are all ignorant of their decision making process. It is a total unknown, so for any of us to imply that Jim or Mitch or Jerry or anyone else did one thing and that another did something else is plain wrong. That is why I assign blame or credit to the FO and not individuals, since I do not know how they reach the decisions they make. Those that place blame on the individuals are making their opinions off of assumptions or bias, and we know what happen when one assumes something.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Lakers2001
Starting Rotation
Joined: 11 Dec 2012
Posts: 745
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 10:26 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | clutchkobe wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | Lakers2001 wrote: | | Jeane should fire both Jim and Mitch. |
Mitch is a really good negotiator and has his Magic Wand. I wouldn't fire him.
Jim is the problem. Three more years of him though. |
I even think mitch's time has come and gone. I don't think he is a good gm under this new cba.....we need a top notch gm. |
Yeah, it isn't like he made a deal for CP3 while saving millions on the cap before the ink was dry on this CBA. |
I don't understand how people here fault jim for all wrongs and want to credit Mitch for all success? Yet he's the Gm and last I I checked. I don't honestly think jim buss puts together all the trades and negotiate with free agents that much. I think he sets a ideal or vision and it's on mitch to see it through. |
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clutchkobe
Star Player
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 1982
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 11:00 am Post subject: |
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| the comments mitch kupchek made about kobe are troubling to me. Basically he is gone after next year. Now I know kobe is not the number one option or the number two option anymore...even this year. But he still has some game to offer. Looking at the past of jim and mitch, when they make statements like...if kobe is still playing at a high level...maybe he can come back...you know they are done after next year and they only used him to fill the seats. When you look at teams like the Celtics. They have determined their path....they are accruing draft picks and getting rid of high salaries. They have shown their direction.....what direction has our front office shown. Nothing...we have no players that people want. We have some expiring contracts but that's it. Are they going all out for kobes last year....are they just going to get one free agent and use kobe again to fill the seats. Due to our roster why would anyone choose Los angeles. There is not even a good foundation to say come over here. If we strike out again on the free agents....which seems likely...what then? Not building our roster again with some talent and just getting one year players....this is crazy. The buss family needs to get a direction and let the past go before they do anything else. You cant sell the banners on the wall anymore, You don't have the best talent to play alongside anymore.....You also don't have the best salespeople in the front office pitching the new talent. this I think hurts them more than anything...jim and mitch as salespeople. As we can see we are 0 for 3 on that. I just hope the buss family stops the family unity and have one person run this thing...because this is not going well. |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144474
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Lakers2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | clutchkobe wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | Lakers2001 wrote: | | Jeane should fire both Jim and Mitch. |
Mitch is a really good negotiator and has his Magic Wand. I wouldn't fire him.
Jim is the problem. Three more years of him though. |
I even think mitch's time has come and gone. I don't think he is a good gm under this new cba.....we need a top notch gm. |
Yeah, it isn't like he made a deal for CP3 while saving millions on the cap before the ink was dry on this CBA. |
I don't understand how people here fault jim for all wrongs and want to credit Mitch for all success? Yet he's the Gm and last I I checked. I don't honestly think jim buss puts together all the trades and negotiate with free agents that much. I think he sets a ideal or vision and it's on mitch to see it through. |
It was Mitch and Ross meeting with FAs last season.
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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MickMgl
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | | Jim is still in denial about his mistakes. We need to ride out three more years of his incompetence...and then hopefully he keeps his word and steps aside. |
This. He hides behind others when things don't work out. |
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MickMgl
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| J.C. Smith wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | You can sense the tension between the two. Hope they work things out quickly or this will be a difficult place to lure free agents IMO if it looks like there is dissension. |
You can get that sense, but it's always coming from Jeanie. She needs to stop wearing her emotions on her sleeve in public. |
She didn't sound emotional at all. Certainly not on the Kobe question, for example. But she's a woman, so let's just continue with that premise, anyway. |
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MickMgl
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | That flexibility that Jim is talking about...it's what is holding us back right now.
There will always be flexibility to fall back on when the rentals that sign up for the one year deals turn out to be not that great.
All Jim can talk about is max deals and name players....he still thinks that having the cap space (and little else) is all it will take to make them come.
When it comes down to it though..he has no idea how to build a team from the ground up. How to find good role players to complement the stars.
Like I said, he's in denial...mainly of his sheer level of incompetence. |
Two philosophies:
Jim Buss, on why he thinks scouting is overrated:
"Evaluating basketball talent is not too difficult. If you grabbed 10 fans out of a bar and asked them to rate prospects, their opinions would be pretty much identical to those of the pro scouts."
A Dodger insider, explaining how Andrew Friedman got the team's attention during trade talks last season:
“They always asked for the right prospects. Not just the guys everybody knows, either.”
More recently, Friedman described how all his team's recent moves were "us doing everything we could to mold our roster into the most highly-functioning baseball team, as opposed to a collection of talent."
Jim Buss, who I believe is a fan, who is not a basketball guy, who is not a college graduate, who in general has no qualification except his bloodline, only understands "talent" (and I question how well he understands that).
Ironically, while he waits year after year for a talented player to choose his team, his team has almost completely run out of talented players. If and when they are able to get a magic ping pong ball in the coming years (because they'll probably be seeing a few lotteries), he's going to be shocked that it doesn't solve everything, because he knows nothing about team-building.
Sometimes less is more. The Lakers need more than one Top 5 player. They need to have one of those draft days where a team trades down several times and winds up with three or four solid guys, one or two of whom could blossom into something more. But those moves are conducted by Basketball Ops guys with vision, who understand the difference between a talented player and a highly-functioning team, and the Lakers don't have one of those guys. |
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MickMgl
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Gimme_the_rock wrote: | Found it interesting that when discussing Kobe's extension, Jim spoke about it as a draw for potential free agents (of course, that WAS how the question was framed) while Jeannie seemed to talk about it from a more personal vantage point.
But when it came to discussing Kobe being potentially traded, Jim seemed resigned to the fact that Kobe is too important to move while Jeannie seemed to consider it within the realm of possibility. |
Jeannie sounds like Jerry. He seems to have always balanced a personal affection and loyalty for his players with a rational business sense. |
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MickMgl
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jan 2013
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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| silkwilkes wrote: | | The big thing is that these interviews aren't doing any good... in fact, they show some tension between siblings and, frankly, lack of knowledge on both their parts. |
If a wheel needs grease, I would prefer that it squeaks loudly. |
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clutchkobe
Star Player
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 1982
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | clutchkobe wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | Lakers2001 wrote: | | Jeane should fire both Jim and Mitch. |
Mitch is a really good negotiator and has his Magic Wand. I wouldn't fire him.
Jim is the problem. Three more years of him though. |
I even think mitch's time has come and gone. I don't think he is a good gm under this new cba.....we need a top notch gm. |
Yeah, it isn't like he made a deal for CP3 while saving millions on the cap before the ink was dry on this CBA. |
dude....this did not happen!.... CP3 is a clipper. From what I heard on the radio....if he had just waited a week or two....he would be a laker. So yeah good going mitch. But if I hear this one more time of a trade that did not happen. |
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activeverb
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Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 37470
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 9:58 pm Post subject: |
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| kray28_ wrote: | | Lakers2001 wrote: | | Jeane should fire both Jim and Mitch. |
Mitch is a really good negotiator and has his Magic Wand. I wouldn't fire him.
Jim is the problem. Three more years of him though. |
I think Jeanie and Jim are locked at the hip. Maybe she can technically fire him; but practically I doubt she can or will. As long as the Buss family owns the Lakers, both of them will be around. |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144474
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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| clutchkobe wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | clutchkobe wrote: | | kray28_ wrote: | | Lakers2001 wrote: | | Jeane should fire both Jim and Mitch. |
Mitch is a really good negotiator and has his Magic Wand. I wouldn't fire him.
Jim is the problem. Three more years of him though. |
I even think mitch's time has come and gone. I don't think he is a good gm under this new cba.....we need a top notch gm. |
Yeah, it isn't like he made a deal for CP3 while saving millions on the cap before the ink was dry on this CBA. |
dude....this did not happen!.... CP3 is a clipper. From what I heard on the radio....if he had just waited a week or two....he would be a laker. So yeah good going mitch. But if I hear this one more time of a trade that did not happen. |
Actually it did happen, he put together a deal using this CBA that not only got them CP3 but cut millions off the cap number and left them with a huge TPE. If that doesn't prove that he is a good GM under this CBA then I am guessing one doesn't understand what a good GM does. He did it before most GMs had a minimal understanding of what was in the CBA. He was the CBA guy for Jerry West all those years as well. So the concept that this CBA is beyond Mitch is laughable.
_________________
RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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