I think younger fans do not appreciate Magic. I understand why because athletes are much better today than in Magic's day. Also, Magic did not have an athletic bone in his body. That being said, Magic is still the greatest player to lace up sneakers. NO PLAYER has ever made his teammates better than Magic. Can we say the same thing about MJ and KB. No. Magic could DOMINATE a game and not score. Magic had intangibles that do not show up in a box score. I keep on reading how Magic was not a good defensive player and I say BS. He was GREAT at spacing, help D, and got a ton of steals (actually lead the league). No player was as versatile as Magic and that is not even close. Magic excelled immediately while MJ and KB needed some time. Also, today's NBA is more watered down than the NBA in the past. Todays league has more teams, less stars, less competition.
when u played with teammates of kareem, worthy, scoop, and scott's level, it is easy to play defense because of the defensive gene in your teammates' blood. You can also run n gun with roster you had been playing mostly since day one. Did a player kareem's calibre need a magic to be better? This guy won a ca ring before he joined magic and had been the most doninating center prior to being a laker. _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
The point I was making was Magic's D is vastly underrated. Picking one guy to say Magic did not make him play better is crazy, but I will play along. First of all, what about players that left. They were not close to the players they were when playing with Magic (Rambis, Green, etc.). I could even swing this the other way and say that Bob Mcadoo had an infusion of life when he came to the Lakers and played with Magic. As far as the Captain, he ALSO PLAYED BETTER with Magic (and has claimed this). His shooting % went up, scored just as much (do not forget Lakers had more options than the Bucks) in far less minutes. Anybody that says Magic did not make players around him better are just SILLY.
The point I was making was Magic's D is vastly underrated. Picking one guy to say Magic did not make him play better is crazy, but I will play along. First of all, what about players that left. They were not close to the players they were when playing with Magic (Rambis, Green, etc.). I could even swing this the other way and say that Bob Mcadoo had an infusion of life when he came to the Lakers and played with Magic. As far as the Captain, he ALSO PLAYED BETTER with Magic (and has claimed this). His shooting % went up, scored just as much (do not forget Lakers had more options than the Bucks) in far less minutes. Anybody that says Magic did not make players around him better are just SILLY.
where were smush, odom, kwame, sasha, etc when they were done with kobe? Did gasol have his best years with kobe? Did odom win rings with kobe? Did the average Fisher become relevant with kobe? They are all not in magic's team and teammates' calibre. Without kobe the 2005 roster would be D-leaguers. As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe
to playoffs. _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
The point I was making was Magic's D is vastly underrated. Picking one guy to say Magic did not make him play better is crazy, but I will play along. First of all, what about players that left. They were not close to the players they were when playing with Magic (Rambis, Green, etc.). I could even swing this the other way and say that Bob Mcadoo had an infusion of life when he came to the Lakers and played with Magic. As far as the Captain, he ALSO PLAYED BETTER with Magic (and has claimed this). His shooting % went up, scored just as much (do not forget Lakers had more options than the Bucks) in far less minutes. Anybody that says Magic did not make players around him better are just SILLY.
where were smush, odom, kwame, sasha, etc when they were done with kobe? Did gasol have his best years with kobe? Did odom win rings with kobe? Did the average Fisher become relevant with kobe? They are all not in magic's team and teammates' calibre. Without kobe the 2005 roster would be D-leaguers. As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe
to playoffs.
Your examples are silly. Those players you named were never any good before or after Kobe. _________________ Laker historian.
One-on-one, I think both MJ and Kobe would have a hell of a time trying to stop Magic. Heck, the 91 finals proved as much in the case of MJ. How do you stop a guy who has phenomenal handles, a fantastic post game and is bigger, taller and stronger than you. Of course, MJ/Kobe would destroy Magic on the other end as well. However, I'm positive that MJ/Kobe would find Magic a much tougher challenge to guard than Lebron.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
I just wanted to add that there was never a player to have an impact in the league at a younger age than Magic. Furthermore, there was never a player who was a better leader "on the court' than Magic. I think both of these statements are indisputable.
I think younger fans do not appreciate Magic. I understand why because athletes are much better today than in Magic's day. Also, Magic did not have an athletic bone in his body. That being said, Magic is still the greatest player to lace up sneakers. NO PLAYER has ever made his teammates better than Magic. Can we say the same thing about MJ and KB. No. Magic could DOMINATE a game and not score. Magic had intangibles that do not show up in a box score. I keep on reading how Magic was not a good defensive player and I say BS. He was GREAT at spacing, help D, and got a ton of steals (actually lead the league). No player was as versatile as Magic and that is not even close. Magic excelled immediately while MJ and KB needed some time. Also, today's NBA is more watered down than the NBA in the past. Todays league has more teams, less stars, less competition.
agree.
what people forget is that magic can and DID play all 5 positions in a game, in the NBA finals, against the sixers and WON. he knew the game so well that he knew how to play all 5 positions, and that was with kareem injured and couldn't play.
look at our current roster minus kobe - i'd venture to say that this team would have a better record at this point with magic on the team instead of kobe. everyone from lin to hill would've had a much better season with magic playing.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
A lot of the turnaround in the 2005-2006 season was Phil Jackson. The season prior we had a similar team and Kobe led the team to a 28-38 record before getting hurt.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
Yeah, what was I doing qualifying my statement with "I think"? Surely I'll be easily subdued by a well placed DEFINITELY or an opinion labelled as FACT.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
I respect your opinion. You assumed odom n butler had the bball IQ like those of hnson's teammates like kareem, worthy, cooper and then scott." _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
A lot of the turnaround in the 2005-2006 season was Phil Jackson. The season prior we had a similar team and Kobe led the team to a 28-38 record before getting hurt.
Uhh nice try, but I'm not gonna let you get away with your lies. Kobe severely sprained his ankle against the Cavs in January of 2005: The Lakers' record at that point was 18-15. They were well on their way to making the playoffs before Kobe got hurt.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
A lot of the turnaround in the 2005-2006 season was Phil Jackson. The season prior we had a similar team and Kobe led the team to a 28-38 record before getting hurt.
Uhh nice try, but I'm not gonna let you get away with your lies. Kobe severely sprained his ankle against the Cavs in January of 2005: The Lakers' record at that point was 18-15. They were well on their way to making the playoffs before Kobe got hurt.
Kobe played 66 games that season. In those 66 games, the team was 28-38.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
I respect your opinion. You assumed odom n butler had the bball IQ like those of hnson's teammates like kareem, worthy, cooper and then scott."
No such assumptions were necessary as I'm quite familiar with all of these players. All were very different players with different styles and different ability levels.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
A lot of the turnaround in the 2005-2006 season was Phil Jackson. The season prior we had a similar team and Kobe led the team to a 28-38 record before getting hurt.
Uhh nice try, but I'm not gonna let you get away with your lies. Kobe severely sprained his ankle against the Cavs in January of 2005: The Lakers' record at that point was 18-15. They were well on their way to making the playoffs before Kobe got hurt.
Kobe played 66 games that season. In those 66 games, the team was 28-38.
That has nothing to do with your post or the follow up. Are you trying to say that Kobe was hurt in game 67? The Lakers were in the 6th position before Kobe's injury. Then he went down and was never right again that season and then Rudy T imploded. So, do you just troll threads looking for ways to bag on Kobe? Do you own a Smushcalade? _________________ “It took many years of vomiting up all the filth I’d been taught about myself, and half-believed, before I was able to walk on the earth as though I had a right to be here.”
― James Baldwin, Collected Essays
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
This is where, depending on what story we want to tell, we say that player X could DEFINITELY have done Y. Or DEFINITELY NOT. Depending on what we're really trying to say of course.
A lot of the turnaround in the 2005-2006 season was Phil Jackson. The season prior we had a similar team and Kobe led the team to a 28-38 record before getting hurt.
Uhh nice try, but I'm not gonna let you get away with your lies. Kobe severely sprained his ankle against the Cavs in January of 2005: The Lakers' record at that point was 18-15. They were well on their way to making the playoffs before Kobe got hurt.
Kobe played 66 games that season. In those 66 games, the team was 28-38.
That has nothing to do with your post or the follow up. Are you trying to say that Kobe was hurt in game 67? The Lakers were in the 6th position before Kobe's injury. Then he went down and was never right again that season and then Rudy T imploded. So, do you just troll threads looking for ways to bag on Kobe? Do you own a Smushcalade?
Tell the story however you want. I'm just telling you what happened. People like to tell stories to suit their narrative. You get mad I have Kobe at 6th in my GOAT list. Not because of how I arrived there, but because Kobe is 6 and not 1, 2, or 3.
I think Kobe is a much better player under Phil Jackson.
Do you disagree?
Oh, and come on. Kobe doesn't need excuses made for him. He's played through injuries his entire career and been able to play at a high level just fine. I love how the mantra is that he plays through his injuries when the Lakers win, but he wasn't the same when they lose. Let's just be honest. The coaching sucked in 2004-2005. Coaching was much better in 2005-2006.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
I happen to agree, but that isn't a knock on Kobe. I just think that Magic would have meshed better with that group of players than Kobe did. Magic's style would have been much better suited to a team full of young players who could run.
As RF says, though, coaching was a issue that year. Injuries to the rest of the roster -- Divac, Grant, George, and finally Odom -- had a lot to do with it. If we had the team that Mitch envisioned for that year, Kobe would have had the cast he needed for his style.
As great as magic could be, i dont see how he could carry 2005 roster minus kobe to playoffs.
I think prime Magic would have carried the 04-05 roster to the playoffs as well as the 05-06 roster. Odom and Butler would have been all Magic needed to run a devastating break, and his leadership style would have been a better fit for much of that group.
I happen to agree, but that isn't a knock on Kobe. I just think that Magic would have meshed better with that group of players than Kobe did. Magic's style would have been much better suited to a team full of young players who could run.
As RF says, though, coaching was a issue that year. Injuries to the rest of the roster -- Divac, Grant, George, and finally Odom -- had a lot to do with it. If we had the team that Mitch envisioned for that year, Kobe would have had the cast he needed for his style.
with probably the worst roster on both ends, I just dont see how Magic could carry them offensively without him being the one providing most of the points (crazy numbers). I just don't buy the notion magic can suddenly turn those mediocre players into another showtimers. You basically have to have talents and high bball IQ to play like showtimers. The 2005 roster were no cooper, nor worthy or scotty. Further, you have to play a great team defense to create fast breaks. 2005 team? Lmao. They were relevant because of kobe's out-of-this-world performances. _________________ Kobe's Top 5 Dunks, 81 points, MJ last gm @Staples
Last edited by moonriver24 on Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:47 am; edited 2 times in total
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thats the point
