One intangible as to why I would put prime Magic over Kobe and Jordan.
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activeverb
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 10:23 pm    Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:
Jordan, Russell, Kareem, Magic, and Bird are locks for the top 5. I don't think anyone will surpass those guys. 6- 10 is debatable with Wilt, Kobe, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar, Lebron and Olajuwon.


There's no official list, but my sense is:

-- Jordan and Magic are 1-2 overall for most people.
-- Kareem, Russell, and Bird are the top guys for most 3-5 spots, but there's a lot of individual variation.
-- Wilt and Russell are all over the place; some people rate them #1, some in the lower part of the top 10.
-- Shaq, Duncan and Kobe are one unit, all ranked closely together. And Kobe usually isn't the top guy in that unit.
-- Oscar is often in the top 10, but without enthusiasm, and he will soon drop out of it, if he hasn't already.
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fiendishoc
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:21 am    Post subject:

lar9149 wrote:
Is this even a consideration of comparing Magic's leadership to Jordans?

I agree with the OP that Magic was fun to play with, Jordan maybe not. We are talking about leadership not in terms of fun, but in terms of winning championships....one fact to consider 1991 finals Bulls vs Lakers. The Lakers had James Worthy and Magic and a good team with tons of finals experience. Bulls not so much in terms of finals experience. Results 4-1 Bulls champions.


I'd encourage you to go watch that series. Magic basically had to carry the entire team on his back.

Off topic, but the game right before that series had one of my favorite plays ever. Magic ran down the clock on the Blazers by throwing the ball over his shoulder and having it roll the length of the court. Who else in NBA history could have done that?
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Nightwalker
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:35 am    Post subject:

Dave20 wrote:
Jordan, Russell, Kareem, Magic, and Bird are locks for the top 5. I don't think anyone will surpass those guys. 6- 10 is debatable with Wilt, Kobe, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar, Lebron and Olajuwon.



Bird not above Wilt, Kobe, or Duncan for me. I think he has fallen few spots and will continue to due to Lebron also.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 8:02 am    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
lar9149 wrote:
Is this even a consideration of comparing Magic's leadership to Jordans?

I agree with the OP that Magic was fun to play with, Jordan maybe not. We are talking about leadership not in terms of fun, but in terms of winning championships....one fact to consider 1991 finals Bulls vs Lakers. The Lakers had James Worthy and Magic and a good team with tons of finals experience. Bulls not so much in terms of finals experience. Results 4-1 Bulls champions.


I'd encourage you to go watch that series. Magic basically had to carry the entire team on his back.

Off topic, but the game right before that series had one of my favorite plays ever. Magic ran down the clock on the Blazers by throwing the ball over his shoulder and having it roll the length of the court. Who else in NBA history could have done that?


Not only did Magic carry the team, it took prime Pippen just to contain him offensively. MJ couldn't do it. Magic kept shielding the ball from MJ. Pippen's length, energy, and position? Different ball game.
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moonriver24
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 6:02 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
lar9149 wrote:
Is this even a consideration of comparing Magic's leadership to Jordans?

I agree with the OP that Magic was fun to play with, Jordan maybe not. We are talking about leadership not in terms of fun, but in terms of winning championships....one fact to consider 1991 finals Bulls vs Lakers. The Lakers had James Worthy and Magic and a good team with tons of finals experience. Bulls not so much in terms of finals experience. Results 4-1 Bulls champions.


I'd encourage you to go watch that series. Magic basically had to carry the entire team on his back.

Off topic, but the game right before that series had one of my favorite plays ever. Magic ran down the clock on the Blazers by throwing the ball over his shoulder and having it roll the length of the court. Who else in NBA history could have done that?


Not only did Magic carry the team, it took prime Pippen just to contain him offensively. MJ couldn't do it. Magic kept shielding the ball from MJ. Pippen's length, energy, and position? Different ball game.
reminded me of 2004 finals when the pistons let big ben play shaq one on one while the remaining pistons concentrated on stopping kobe. Pippen solely defended magic but pistons defended kobe as a committee. Different scenarios but same results: lakers lost.
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Wilkes52
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:06 am    Post subject:

Proven leadership and chemistry counts for a lot, to me.

That's why I would represent the best all-time of pro basketball with Bill Russell, Magic, Jordan, Duncan, then LeBron. Hell, these five guys might also be as strong and smart and versatile a team as one could build, though that's a different criterion altogether.

Team leadership characteristics and coach-ability pushed Wilt, Kobe, Kareem and Shaq out of contention in my consideration of the top five all-time. Bird is top ten with them, narrowly edged out of top five by LeBron's versatility and more complete defensive game.
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